1917 Revolver Horror Stories...

[Der Gebirgsjager]

......or maybe just entertainment. Thought you might enjoy seeing these and hearing (reading?) a bit about them:

First, a Colt 1917 as it should be:
167840
The story: A customer (now about 30 years ago) asked me to obtain a 1917 Colt for his collection. It surprised me that he wasn't too interested in the cosmetic appearance, just so that it was in unmodified as-issued condition. Well, as such things go, at the time there were very few on the used gun market. I did find one that had just about zero finish remaining, an overall silver appearance, and again to my surprise he found that fully acceptable. Then he "dropped the other shoe" as so often happens, and said that he had a "cutdown 1917" that he wanted me to take in partial trade. Here it is:
167844
No, it didn't look this good (?) when I got it. The barrel and the hammer were bobbed. I turned it into a round butt and fitted some rosewood grips and reblued it. Strangely, it is highly inaccurate with anything but 230 gr. hardball, which it shoots very well.

Next: A Smith & Wesson 1917 as it should look:
167845
Actually, this one is post WW I, 1920s vintage. Same thing. So when I was in gunsmithing school a fellow student expressed his desire to own a Ruger Mini-14, and carried on at length about how none were to be had. As I had a couple I offered to sell him one. When home from the school for a couple of weeks break I shipped it to him, and when I got back to the school he couldn't praise it highly enough. The only immediate problem seemed to be that he was short of cash (probably a pre-existing problem!) and offered me a modified S&W 1917 in trade. So the story went, his uncle had put in a career as a Brinks Armored Truck Guard and this had been his duty revolver. At the time I wasn't hot to make the trade, but it seemed like the best way out.
167846
I replaced the grips with these Pachmayrs and reblued it. Now, like Paul Harvey used to say, "The rest of the story". About 10 years after "the deal" I found myself working in the armored truck industry, usually as a driver. Although the sidearm of popular choice seemed to be the Glock it occurred to me that should I have to fire out of one of the truck's portholes the slide might rub on the sides of the hole and cause a jam. Then I remembered this modified 1917 and began to consider the utility of it. Big caliber, rapid reload, no slide, very accurate. I carried it with no complaints for most of 10 years (not exclusively, but much of the time) and at every annual qualification event enjoyed having the qualification/training officer place me at the extreme left end of the firing line as being the only one shooting a revolver. Why? So I wouldn't get hit with the hot brass being ejected from the Glocks, and because I was to be allowed and additional 15 seconds for reloads in the discharging of 15 rounds. When I finished there were usually two or three "Glock guys" still finishing up their remaining rounds and I had fired 18. The questionable deal of 10 years earlier turned out to have been a very good one, and this remains just about my favorite revolver.

I'm hoping that you'll put the bricks and bats back down before jumping on me about altering historic artifacts. Both had been "chopped" before I got them, and I only made them better. What's in your gun safe?

[EMC45]

I like the chopped Smith.

[Nueces]

I think chopped '17s make ideal quail hunting sidearms. Loaded with cylinder length shot loads, they're good for popping running birds and snakes. And they just look like something a South Texas brush cowboy ought to carry when without his SAA.

[Char-Gar]

Here is my Colt 1917, all original except for replacement grips. If you like chopped Smiths here is my 1955 Target Model with a 4" bbl.

[DuaneH]

Here is a much modified Colt 1917 that is now a .22LR. The chambers have been sleeved, cylinder shortened, hammer nose replaced, rebarreled, and sights installed. The front sight is elevation adjustable. I bought it because I am a sucker for abused orphans such as this, and for the Sanderson grips.

167862

[EMC45]

Nice one Char.

[alamogunr]

My horror story has nothing to do with modifications. In 1963 I bought a S&W 1917 for about $35. I didn't shoot it much. Took it with me when I worked a summer job in Nebraska. Traded it for a Remington Rand 1911 that had been refinished from the original parkerizing. Sold it for $50 when I graduated from college because I couldn't afford ammunition. I've regretted both even though there was no way I could have ended up with both.

[PaulG67]

I once had S&W 1917 that I really liked, so did my friend. He kept asking me to sell it, flashing money at me every time we went to the range. He wanted it bad, and one day in a weak moment I sold it to him. BIG MISTAKE. This happened about 25 years ago, I tried many times to get it back but it was not to be. In time my friend developed Alzheimer's and did not recognize me or anyone anymore and a few years after that he died. One of his sons now has my 1917.

[Scharfschuetze]

That's a sad story Paul. I hope that you find a replacement 1917 soon.

No horror story on my part. I have kept and shot my 1917s for quite a few years. They still shoot well yet are only a year or two from the century mark. The photo below is something like 40 shots off hand at 15 yards. Back in the day I shot a bit better.

My 1917s. I'll pass them down to my son when the time comes.

[StrawHat]

I like the 1917 and short barrels, preferring mine to be 4" so to fit the holsters I already have on hand.

167883

Here are a couple of mine and a shot with my favorite holsters.

167884


Kevin

[Bigslug]

My 1917 "horror story" is more about righting an old wrong. My great grandpa was in the thick of things at the Meuse-Argonne, and when my dad was a little kid, the Smith 1917 with the blown up barrel was "Grandpa's war pistol". No, we don't know how the barrel got blown up, but from the things G.G.P. did talk about, I got the impression he saw a lot of really nasty stuff that he didn't talk about. I think the family generally thought it was better not to ask. At any rate, there was some understanding that my dad was supposed to get the thing, but G.G.P. died when dad was still pretty young. As far as anyone knows G.G.M. consigned it to the local landfill, never to be seen again.

Fast forward to about 2003. I'm a counter drone at the local gun shop and a middle aged couple brings in departed dad's sizable collection, including an FN 1910/22 and a Smith 1917 with an INTACT barrel. The job did have some perks. A double "yoink" later, my dad finally got his revolver.

I've made my peace with altered guns of that period. It's not the kind of thing I'd condone anyone doing today (no reason to, with all the various options), and they're kind of fascinating as they show the various individual owner's ways of getting what they wanted in the days of more limited factory options or limited cashflow. My recent weakness is 1914/17 Enfield rifle actions that have already been chopped - how can you say no to one of the burliest military actions ever - especially when they can be had for about the same price as one of today's entry-level robot-builds?

DuaneH's .22 Colt in post #5. . .that thing is SLICK!

[Der Gebirgsjager]

You fellows have some nice handguns! Nice target, Scharf! You are certainly deserving of your awards. Do you recall what ammo you were shooting? The ragged edge holes make me think hardball. Char Gar--nice, but a 1950 target with adjustable sights and custom grips is a definite step up from a 1917! DuaneH-that is an amazing conversion. I've never seen one before. I would think that because of the size and weight it must be very accurate. StrawHat, did you buy yours that way or convert them yourself? The one in the holster looks like it might be a Brazilian from the seal visible on the side. Very attractive holster. Bigslug-I do like1917 Enfields also. Like you, I would not chop one myself. I just happen to have a couple out of storage right now that I'll photograph and post. Like you, I can't pass up a good buy on one, and have a Winchester with a chopped barrel and a fancy walnut stock waiting to come together as a great sporter. I've procrastinated for a long time on doing the job because the original stock is such nice light colored honest walnut wood that I can't see it just kicking around in the corner of my already cluttered shop. Anyway, thanks guys for your contribution to the thread. There are some amazing guns out there.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

A blown up barrel, without blowing up some of the rest, would almost certainly be a substantial bore obstruction - either a lodged bullet or after plunging into the earth in the heat of action. It might still have got your great grandfather a lot of good decades of life.

I've resisted the temptation to do anything non-original with my pretty beaten-up straight-pull Navy Lee, but it would take a pretty good original condition to stop me doing it with something common. I imagine a rough SMLE turning into the sort of Lee-Speed sporting rifle that were made in small numbers, and I think Mr. Lee and Mr. Speed would be gratified to see it. I've done it with a P14 Enfield which was externally rough and would just about get useful hunting accuracy with some jacketed bullets, but not others.

It seems a great pity to see an M1917 with the hammer bobbed - although while not as good as a 1950 target model, it would have a better double action pull than many more recent versions. It can be fixed with the original hammer, if the perpetrator hasn't been tidy enough minded to remove the double action sear and the part of the hammer it fits onto. Here is a hammer I silver soldered for my Belgian Spirlet, probably saving it from being parted out for its ivory grips. You need to pin it, to stay in place during rehardening, but the spur can be made from steel you can still checker after that.

167894

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I picked up one at a gunshow about 6 years ago...I had the table, the seller was just walking around with it...since lots of other vendors didn't buy it before me, I suspect I paid too high a price at that time...700. It was in real nice shape, with a little blue flaking on the side not shown, rifling in the barrel looked pretty good.

I did like shooting it, but last year, when I made the big decision to sell most of my gun collection (which was just too large for me to manage), the 1917 didn't make the short list of guns I really wanted to keep. But it almost made the list...it was between a 625 and the 1917...I figured I only needed one 45acp revolver.





http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/100_2115croppedandreduced.jpg


http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/100_2107croppedwithSNlast2digitspixalized.jpg

[reddog81]

Attached are the pics of a 1917 i recently picked up. It looks like it was made within a few days of the one JonB_in_Glencoe just posted. The trigger had a crack in it where the hand attaches, but thankfully the seller also had an extra trigger and hammer available.

[Pine Baron]

Dang it! Now I HAVE to find a 1917.:wink:
Seriously some real fine shootin' irons here.

[Mk42gunner]

All I can say is the people that had 1917's snub nosed must have had awful big pockets. I can see cutting the barrel to 3½ or 4 inches, but not shorter.

I regret not buying the Brazilian contract gun I saw in San Diego for $235, with ivory grips no less.

Robert

[Der Gebirgsjager]

BIS-pretty neat! Nice workmanship. Well, the bobbed hammer 1917 was an idea that was fashionable during a certain time period that dictated removing anything that could snag on clothing when drawing the weapon. I just decided to leave it as-is, but a replacement hammer could probably be found. Best explanation I can give--some concepts are just kind of nebulous.

DG

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Wow! Considering the type and history of these revolvers, those notches on the grips are probably significant--something other than ground squirrels. I can understand your choice though, Jon--those 625s just about have it all. I've got the 4" Mountain Gun stainless version.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

All I can say is the people that had 1917's snub nosed must have had awful big pockets. I can see cutting the barrel to 3½ or 4 inches, but not shorter.

I regret not buying the Brazilian contract gun I saw in San Diego for $235, with ivory grips no less.

Robert

Robert--I can share in your agony. An incredible deal missed!

DG

[mtnman31]

The 1917 has been on my bucket list of must haves for while. I need to get more pro-active in finding one.

Great thread.

[Bent Ramrod]

Where's the horror? I don't see a single example where somebody cut the front of the trigger guard off:kidding:.

[EMC45]

Where's the horror? I don't see a single example where somebody cut the front of the trigger guard off:kidding:.

That would leave me in Fitz........

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Where's the horror? I don't see a single example where somebody cut the front of the trigger guard off:kidding:.

Ooooooh.......now THAT would really be bad! The Fitz modification.

DG

[flint45]

1917's are great revolvers wish I still had my colt someone put target sights on it and it was so accurate but needed a new hand couldnt find anyone to work on it back then now Iknow better.But my two Smiths more then make up for it they work like butterd silk!

[StrawHat]

...StrawHat, did you buy yours that way or convert them yourself? The one in the holster looks like it might be a Brazilian from the seal visible on the side...

When I bought them, they had 5 1/2" barrels, numbered to the frames. I always have some spare barrels around and these two had previously been cut to 4". I simply spun out the old and spun in the new! And maybe a little action work, the long actions are pretty smooth without work. The sights are set for 235 grain boolits.

The holstered revolver is indeed a 1917 from the Brazilian contract. It is one of my favorites and that is why I have the carved holster for it and my other 4" 45s.

Kevin

[Outpost75]

Here are some "before and after" pictures of my 1917 "Sewer Pipe" gun, which has since been recylindered and rebarreled to .45 Colt by John Taylor.

167970167971167972167973

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Very nice, Outpost75, and certainly some lessons to be learned there. The old barrel didn't shoot badly at all with hardball. I have a 1911 that had a barrel at least as bad as the one you show, but it would just about always hit a 2 lb. coffee can at 25 yards. But I eventually changed it out for a new one just because I couldn't stand to look at it. Seems to me that the Army did a test one time and found that for combat accuracy worn and pitted 1911 barrels were still useable. Looking at the last photo I would say that John Taylor is an accomplished pistolsmith! Can't ask for better than that.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

BIS-pretty neat! Nice workmanship. Well, the bobbed hammer 1917 was an idea that was fashionable during a certain time period that dictated removing anything that could snag on clothing when drawing the weapon. I just decided to leave it as-is, but a replacement hammer could probably be found. Best explanation I can give--some concepts are just kind of nebulous.

DG

Ah yes, the days of a photo of Jeff Cooper which probably made him shudder, in the gunfighter's crouch with gun leveled at hip level. The British went over to a bobbed hammer on late versions of the .38 Enfield revolver, which was carried in a closed holster. The explanation given was that it wouldn't catch on the inside of a tank or other vehicle, but I suspect that the real reason was the inability of wartime contractors more used to cars and sewing machines, to time a good double action trigger pull. Nobody won a war with pistols by that time, and those with experience of arms work were more urgently needed for other things.

Ed McGivern did his revolver shooting feats with Smith and Wessons just the way they came out of the box, in the days of the long-action S&W trigger, and held that modifications couldn't improve on them. He thought the Fitz conversion was harmful, and only had any point if you were doing things wrong. But he admitted that if you really wanted, removing the right-hand half of the trigger-guard front was pretty harmless.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Cutting down the right hand side of the trigger guard is a modification I have read about a number of times, but never seen. On the other hand, I've seen the front end cut away a la Fitz a number of times and it's something I'd never do or own. Seems like an accidental discharge waiting to happen, and is not pleasing in appearance either. There's "fast" and there's "safe", and I'll always choose No. 2.

Just kicking this around a bit more, Col. Rex Applegate taught a crouched shooting stance during WW II, which was also called the FBI crouch or stance. I guess that perhaps it was still in vogue when Cooper entered the scene.

[MakeMineLead]

I regret not buying the Brazilian contract gun I saw in San Diego for $235, with ivory grips no less.
Robert

i saw one, beautiful condition, nice & clean on a table @ a show. It was a private seller, no tax or paperwork. I picked it up. The price was right. Then this other guy stands right next to me. I mean, so close, I was about to tell him, "Sorry, I'm straight."

Then I see his eyes are in the Brazilian. I pretended like I was going to put it down, he leans in. I play with it some more, I pretend to put it down again. He leans in. I told the seller, "I'll take it."

The other guy vanishes. Gee, I was hoping he might buy me lunch.... ;)

BTW, the 1937 is an AWSOME shooter!

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Cutting down the right hand side of the trigger guard is a modification I have read about a number of times, but never seen. On the other hand, I've seen the front end cut away a la Fitz a number of times and it's something I'd never do or own. Seems like an accidental discharge waiting to happen, and is not pleasing in appearance either. There's "fast" and there's "safe", and I'll always choose No. 2.

Just kicking this around a bit more, Col. Rex Applegate taught a crouched shooting stance during WW II, which was also called the FBI crouch or stance. I guess that perhaps it was still in vogue when Cooper entered the scene.

I think an accidental discharge would only happen if the revolver was cocked, or the user's habits were excessively idiosyncratic. But a one-legged trigger-guard can easily be bent enough to trap the trigger.

I'm sure you are right about fashions changing, but not looking at the sights is well out of favour nowadays. Not many people nowadays have heard of Michael Bentine the comedian, whom I remember for his own TV shows, but who was one of the founder members of the Goons on the radio, with Sellars, Milligan and Secombe. Just before the Second World War he tried to join the Royal Air Force, who said "Go away, you're a Peruvian." (Like my favourite aunt, incidentally, who drove an ambulance during the bombing.) Then later they conscripted him into the RAF and arrested him on stage in Hyde Park, because he had been on tour and hadn't received the notice. Giving him vaccinations they gave him a live culture by mistake, making him severely myopic and unfit for flying, although as an intelligence officer he was one of the first into Belsen.

He was nevertheless an expert recreational pistol shot, and when the Special Air Service, hitherto just soldiers with relatively little use for pistols, were told to form an antiterrorist unit he became their instructor in the "kill room" hostage rescue mock-up, which often involves smoke and darkness. Clearly myopia has its uses.

[bob208]

if you read skeeter or elmer you will see the 1917 was modified a lot back in the 50's.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

i saw one, beautiful condition, nice & clean on a table @ a show. It was a private seller, no tax or paperwork. I picked it up. The price was right. Then this other guy stands right next to me. I mean, so close, I was about to tell him, "Sorry, I'm straight."

Then I see his eyes are in the Brazilian. I pretended like I was going to put it down, he leans in. I play with it some more, I pretend to put it down again. He leans in. I told the seller, "I'll take it."

The other guy vanishes. Gee, I was hoping he might buy me lunch.... ;)

BTW, the 1937 is an AWSOME shooter!

MakeMineLead--you're just a really mean guy, aren't you. An inborn streak of cruelty! :wink:

[ATCDoktor]

Here's a Brazilian I picked up about 8 years ago for 300 bucks.

At at some point the previous owner had it parkerized and did a little filing on the front sight.

Shoots a skosh high with 200 grain swc's and 4.3 grains of Winchester 231.

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c307/ATCDoctor/100_0819.jpg (http://s30.photobucket.com/user/ATCDoctor/media/100_0819.jpg.html)

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Nice! I guess I could give you your $300 back if you want out from under it. After 8 years you're probably tired of it! :wink:

[MakeMineLead]

MakeMineLead--you're just a really mean guy, aren't you. An inborn streak of cruelty! :wink:

Ain't I just! :wink:

Brazilian on top, 1917 on bottom. I have the wood grips for both. I picked the Goodyear's out of a box on a table @ a gun show for $5.00 a pair. I ground the insides of the Goodyear's so the lanyard rings could stay attached to the gun. All #'s match on the Brazilian. Interesting story on the parked 1917. After WWI, any guns which needed repair were simply greased, and put in storage, because the House Committee cut repair funds. After pearl harbor, they voted funds, because they needed every gun they could get. The 1917 was sent to Aniston Arsenal (it has an 'AA' stamp) and a new barrel was installed (no serial # on the flat on the bottom of the barrel) it was parked, then went back into storage and was not ever issued!

Both guns are great shooters w/ 200 or 230 TC cast bullets over 5.5 of Herco.

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q228/ultramag44/37%20and%2017%20wheelguns/3717a_zpsca435d42.jpg
http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q228/ultramag44/37%20and%2017%20wheelguns/3717c_zpsc9201af8.jpg
http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q228/ultramag44/37%20and%2017%20wheelguns/3717b_zps3f4b7306.jpg
http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q228/ultramag44/37%20and%2017%20wheelguns/3717d_zpsb92d097b.jpg

[Der Gebirgsjager]

That's a nice pair you have. Interesting story about the 1917 re-parkerization project. I used to have an absolutely pristine 1917 US Enfield rifle that looked like it had left the arsenal just yesterday. Problem was that it was parked instead of blued as were the originals. Eventually I sold it, and the buyer claimed almost the very same story about WW I rifles having languished until WW II and then being refinished, but never issued because by then they were obsolete.

[Char-Gar]

Well then, if this turn to Brazilians, here are mine.

[MakeMineLead]

That's a nice pair you have. Interesting story about the 1917 re-parkerization project. I used to have an absolutely pristine 1917 US Enfield rifle that looked like it had left the arsenal just yesterday. Problem was that it was parked instead of blued as were the originals. Eventually I sold it, and the buyer claimed almost the very same story about WW I rifles having languished until WW II and then being refinished, but never issued because by then they were obsolete.

Thanks Der,

I happen to have a K38 (1951 vintage) w/ the right side of the guard somewhat ground down. The grip frame has also been made into a round butt. The barrel was cut from 6 to 4" and the front sight reinstalled. I bought it for a song from a pawn shop 7 or 8 years ago. It was messy looking. It cleaned up fine and shoots great. I'll post a pic of it later.

Yes. The repair program called for repaired arms to be parked prior to being sent to arsonel storage for possible re-issue. The original finish specification wasn't considered. If it was repaired, it got parked!

Lots of these 'obsolete' arms were issued to guards at stateside depots, arsenals, gate guards @ bases & forts during WWII. Many more like mine, and your Enfield, simply sat in storage and were never re-issued. The mind set was, "If things get bad enough, these older arms are can be issued as 'substitute-standard"'

Eventually, these arms were sold off. If you had known to look for it, the repair arsenal stamp was on that Enfield somewhere. The AA stamp is on the lower left side of my 1917's frame.

The arsenals didn't stamp new serial #'s on the replaced part(s). As I say, the flat on the bottom I'm my 1917's barrel is unmarked, and the barrel is virtually new.

I gave $500.00 for it 10 years ago. If anything, it's appreciated in value. :)

Char-Gar,

The 1937 called for a Flat-Top frame, and Square Notch rear sight, vs the 1917's Round-Top frame an U notch. The first batch of 1937's used new production frames. My 1937 is one of these.

The 1937's called for checkered grips w/ the S&W roundel. But, many first batch guns had 1917 grips instead. My 1937 has 1917 grips.

Many of the second batch 1937's used left-over 1917 frames! Second batch guns will be see With either type grips also.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Whoever did the blue job on that Brazilian knew what they were doing. Very nice.

[Char-Gar]

Whoever did the blue job on that Brazilian knew what they were doing. Very nice.

That was done by the Smith and Wesson factory 20 years ago. I got a phone call from the shop manager and he told me they didn't want to blue the gun as it had collectors value. He had it on his desk and I told him to look at the muzzle. It had a badly dinged muzzle when I got it and it was shoot one foot off at 25 yards. I recrowned the muzzle before I shipped it to them. I told him some fool had recrowned the muzzle and destroyed the collectors value. He then agreed to blue the revolver. It shoots just fine now.

Here is another pic of the same revolver with different grips.

[Char-Gar]

Char-Gar,

The 1937 called for a Flat-Top frame, and Square Notch rear sight, vs the 1917's Round-Top frame an U notch. The first batch of 1937's used new production frames. My 1937 is one of these.

The 1937's called for checkered grips w/ the S&W roundel. But, many first batch guns had 1917 grips instead. My 1937 has 1917 grips.

Many of the second batch 1937's used left-over 1917 frames! Second batch guns will be see With either type grips also.

Correct the 1st. contract of 25K were all new production. The 2nd. Contract was just after WWII and was also 25K and has a mishmsh of left over 1917 parts and newer parts. The first 25K was numbered 1 - 25000 on the backstrap, but the second 25 K were not numbered.

My parked Brazilian is from the first contract and my factory blued is from the second. The second one (blued) has a 1917 barrel and frame and a newer (1937) cylinder and yoke. There is no telling about the hammer, trigger and various other internals.

[MakeMineLead]

here's that K38 W/ the relieved triggerguard it came w/ the grip adapter. I put on goodyears

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q228/ultramag44/100_0144.jpg
http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q228/ultramag44/100_0145.jpg
http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q228/ultramag44/100_0146.jpg
http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q228/ultramag44/100_0141.jpg

15 yards off hand. 5 grains Herco, a 150 cast, 10 rounds SWC Bless my shaky old hands! :lol:

http://i137.photobucket.com/albums/q228/ultramag44/100_0148.jpg

[Der Gebirgsjager]

MakeMineLead-- that's the first one I've ever actually seen. Interesting that the modification to the trigger guard is in combination with a wide tartet trigger. It doesn't detract from the overall appearance of the weapon. Last photo of it, very nice looking piece. Thanks for posting these photos.

[MakeMineLead]

You're most welcome! It's the first one I had ever seen either.

[beagle]

Nice guns guys. Here's my 1917 story. I was raised in NC and we had fairly strict handgun laws as to purchases in the 60s. I went to college in Raleigh and was in school with a fellow from Alexandria, VA. After talking, it came to light that he had worked for "Ye Olde Hunter" in Alexandria in the in processing room. One thing led to another and when he went home at Christmas, he took $25 (a lot of money in those days) and came back with a Smith M1917. He had selected it out of a fiberboard barrel of them they had on the display floor up there. I kept that old Smith for years and it digested untold thousands of rounds of Lyman 452460s and Lyman 452423s over the years. Wish I still had it./beagle

[leebuilder]

No horror just goodness. Bought a S&W 2cd variation for 125.00 out of frustration for finding .455 a converted to 45ACP. I use standard or low velocity ammo, because of all the horror storys. Anywho it is very accurate for a beat up WW1 relic. I can cut down a fair sized christmas tree with three or four rounds at 12 paces.
be safe
168186

[Outpost75]

No horror just goodness. Bought a S&W 2cd variation for 125.00 out of frustration for finding .455 a converted to 45ACP. I use standard or low velocity ammo, because of all the horror storys. Anywho it is very accurate for a beat up WW1 relic. I can cut down a fair sized christmas tree with three or four rounds at 12 paces.
be safe
168186

Your counterbored cylinder to accept .45 AR is a far more elegant conversion than the usual "shaved" job. Nice gun!

[OldManMontgomery]

These are three I have.

A 1917, cut down into a 'belly gun'. When I got it, it was devoid of much in the way of finish and the stocks looked like forty miles of bad road. The stocks on it now are pretty sad looking, but fit my hand very well.

A year or two ago, it started getting 'iffy' about setting off rounds. I thought perhaps it was dirty enough inside to slow the hammer fall. I cleaned it, but haven't shot it since. Maybe it needs a mainspring. Soon...

A 1955 Target Model. Before I got it, someone had put a telescopic sight on it and put some wear where the mount fits. The front sight was buggered as well. It looks like somehow the red insert was broken out. It's still the 6.5 inch barrel length. It shoots rather well, but I can't wear a six inch holster very well. (I look like a chubby, short-legged Paladin when I try.)

The solo 1955 Target Model was just like this when I got it. It was cut back to four inches and the front sight altered and remounted. The muzzle was re-crowned and it looks like a professional job. I changed the target grips for the ones on it now.

I bought 500 rounds of .45 Auto Rim from Starline; some time ago I purchased four or five HKS speedloaders (#25 if anyone cares) which fit .45 Auto Rim and oddly enough, the 1917 and the N Frame S&W revolvers.

My 'standard' load is essentially a .45 ACP duplication load for hardball. The gun shoots them to the sights out to twenty-five yards, as far as I can tell. And a lead 255 grain SWC (usually for .45 Colt) works very well, also. (The one on the far right.)

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Thanks for sharing those photos with us, Monty--some unusual items. The grips on No.3 look like they might be Herretts? Nice looking gun. Better get that mainspring replaced in the snubby in case you need it for a serious social engagement.

[Frank46]

Have to admit for a fondness for the 1917 S&W. I've a 1 st contract for the Brazilian military and fun to shoot. One thing back in the 60's these revolvers were cheap and subject to a lot of gunsmithing good or bad take your choice. While the barrel on mine is in nice shape I got lucky and found a 1917 Smith barrel in mint condition as a spare. Frank

[OldManMontgomery]

The grips on No.3 look like they might be Herretts? Nice looking gun.Thanks. The stocks aren't Herrett's, although I tend in that direction as much as possible. I think they might be Fitz (not to be confused with J. H. FitzGerald) products, but they are marked 'Made in Philippines' with a sticker on the inside. They fit me well and they have just a bit of 'rock' on the revolver. I may need a couple drops of bedding compound.


Better get that mainspring replaced in the snubby in case you need it for a serious social engagement.Yes, probably so. However, I don't carry that snubby so much anymore. (Not at all recently.) But it is too good a revolver to leave lay around doing nothing.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

I hear you on those Philippine grips. They are a mixed bag. Several times I've ordered some on e-bay. They look good, and aren't priced too bad, but the fit can be problematical. They're always pretty close, but often not quite right, and that's odd because they must have sample guns to work from. Maybe just a lack of craftsmanship. Sending the ones that aren't right back to the Philippines is a pain, so I try to make them work. Here's the latest example. Note the daylight around the top of the grip.
168357

[Char-Gar]

MakeMineLead-- that's the first one I've ever actually seen. Interesting that the modification to the trigger guard is in combination with a wide tartet trigger. It doesn't detract from the overall appearance of the weapon. Last photo of it, very nice looking piece. Thanks for posting these photos.

Bill Jordan modified the trigger guard of his Smiths and wrote about it in popular guns magazines back in the late 50s and early 60s. About 1965, I did that to a Chief Special and later to A 3" Model 65, as well as bobbing the hammer on both. It does shave a smidge of time off getting your finger on the trigger. Is that smidge worth the modification, probably not, unless a fellow thinks it does.

[MakeMineLead]

Bill Jordan modified the trigger guard of his Smiths and wrote about it in popular guns magazines back in the late 50s and early 60s. About 1965, I did that to a Chief Special and later to A 3" Model 65, as well as bobbing the hammer on both. It does shave a smidge of time off getting your finger on the trigger. Is that smidge worth the modification, probably not, unless a fellow thinks it does.

The barrel on mine was cut from 6 to 4", and the front sight refitted. The crown & sight fitting look professional. The guard cutting and rounding of the grip frame look Bubba-Ized. The gun is an early 50's vintage and the dates you give of late 50's early 60's fit well.

when I saw it in the pawn shop, it was filthy! the finish looked terrible. I did the old trick of cocking it very s-lo-w-l-y. I could feel old, Dried up oil in the action. Of course it didn't come into battery correctly. ;) The pawn shop knocked off enough so I got OTD for $160.00.

A good cleaning, the finish is fine and the action works perfect! :)