Looking for experience with the Lee 35-115TL boolit in 9mmLuger

[Shuz]

I'm looking for anyone who would care to share their experience with the Lee 35-115TL boolit in the 9mm Luger.
I am new to the semi-auto pistol arena and don't have much experience with the 9mm Luger.
I loaded some of this boolit with 4.0g of Bullseye and 4.5g of Bullseye. The 4.0g load chrono'd at 996fps with an sd of 10, and the 4.5g load chrono'd at 1034fps, sd 6 both from a Taurus 709 slim.

The 4.5g load chrono'd 1059,sd 8, from my Kahr CM9. The boolits were not sized but measured .358 and were tumble lubed as designed. The problem is....both loadings shot boolits that keyholed the target at 7 yds from both guns!
Is this boolit just not stable in the 9mm Luger? I've noticed that Lee no longer lists it as an available design!

[Garyshome]

You need to check the bore size of your 9mm [Note: slug the bore]. Check the diameter of the boolit which should be around .002 larger then the bore size of your barrel.

[Shuz]

Further update--Yesterday I fired the same two pistols with 4.5g of Bullseye and an MP-35-93HP and an MP-35-93 solid. The HP weighs 93g, and the solid 100g. Both were sized to .356 and loaded to an OAL of 1.000. Both rounds were very accurate at 7 yds from both guns and neither boolit showed any evidence of key-holing or "going into the target sideways"!
Based on these results, I'd say that for whatever reason, this 115g TL lee 9mm boolit won't stabilize. At least not in my guns!

[Low Budget Shooter]

Interesting.

[tazman]

It seems that about half the people who try Lee tumble lube boolits in 9mm have issues with tumbling. It has to be something in the design that fails to grip the rifling.
I won't use that design in my 9mm guns. I do use it and with excellent results in my 38 special guns. It may be the extra pressure of the 9mm cartridge causing the difficulty.

[Shuz]

OK...based on tazman's post, anybody have experience with another design of Lee tumble lube boolit in 9mm?

[tazman]

Do a search on this site for Lee tl in 9mm
You will get a lot of threads with both success stories and horror stories.

[jcren]

Pull one of those assembled rounds. You will probably find the base of the tl bullet swedged down to .355 or smaller. The tl grooves are much more easily squeezed by the 9mm tapered brass. Proper expanding of the brass or a traditional solid bullet tumble lubed should fix it.

[Shuz]

Pull one of those assembled rounds. You will probably find the base of the tl bullet swedged down to .355 or smaller. The tl grooves are much more easily squeezed by the 9mm tapered brass. Proper expanding of the brass or a traditional solid bullet tumble lubed should fix it.

I did that and the boolits were only "sized down" by the FCD to .357 from the original .358 as cast.
As a reminder, 9mm boolits cast and sized to .356 from an MP-35-95HP shot thru these guns did not tumble or go into the targets sideways!
The number on the back of this Lee 6C mould is: 90465 Was this agroup buy some time ago or?

[tazman]

That number is for a Lee 356-124-2R 6 cavity mold. It is still in current production. This information is available on the Lee web site.

[Shuz]

That number is for a Lee 356-124-2R 6 cavity mold. It is still in current production. This information is available on the Lee web site.
I just looked at the Lee website and saw the same thing! How does one explain that mine only weigh between 116 to 117g when cast from 10 parts ww and 1 part lino?

[tazman]

Many molds and Lee molds in particular can often be off by several grains. Sometimes this is due to the particular alloy used and others due to the mold being a over or undersized. 117grains is only 7 grains off. Not really that much difference. Up to 10 grains one way or the other is not uncommon.
I had a Lyman 147 grain mold that dropped at 158 grains consistently(356637).

[FergusonTO35]

I have a Lee 356-124-TL and a pile of boolits from it. They all weigh 124-125 grains and have a thick coat of LLA applied without sizing. I'm going to try them in the Storm Lake barrel for my Glock 19 and see how they do. If they get along with the Storm Lake tube I'll try them in the OEM barrel.

[Shuz]

I have a Lee 356-124-TL and a pile of boolits from it. They all weigh 124-125 grains and have a thick coat of LLA applied without sizing. I'm going to try them in the Storm Lake barrel for my Glock 19 and see how they do. If they get along with the Storm Lake tube I'll try them in the OEM barrel.
What boolit alloy are you using to obtain the 124g weight?
10 parts ww to 1 part lino gets me only 116 to 117 g with my mould.

[tazman]

What boolit alloy are you using to obtain the 124g weight?
10 parts ww to 1 part lino gets me only 116 to 117 g with my mould.

That is a very hard alloy you are describing. It would weigh light in almost any mold. I would mix nearly half and half, soft lead and wheel weights or 4 to 1 soft lead and lino.
You are using a harder alloy than you really need for 9mm anyway. Although you will need to make sure the boolits with the softer alloy are not getting squeezed down in size by the case.
I question if an alloy change will cure your keyholing problem

[Shuz]

Guys--Today I cast a pile of boolits from pure lead, with only 2% tin added to aid fillout, from my Lee 6c mould marked as 90465.
The average weight was only 118.4g and of course the size dropped down to .356-357, but I haven't loaded any up yet to see if they still go into the target sideways. Methinks that this mould may NOT be similar to current 90465's but rather an older design that didn't shoot well and was morphed into the current design. I'm thinking this mould of mine is Lee's "answer" to Lyman's 429360!?

[tazman]

It sounds like you got one that is undersize in one or more dimensions. There should be no way the mixture you just quoted should come out light.

[Shuz]

It sounds like you got one that is undersize in one or more dimensions. There should be no way the mixture you just quoted should come out light.
Actually when using my original alloy of 10 parts ww to 1 part lino, the as cast size was .358. Methinks the nose is the problem child with this mould. The length of the nose to the first driving band is .337", while the driving bands are only a total of .250" long. Just ahead of the first TL driving band measures only .323". How do these measurements compare with others who have this 90465 numbered mould. By the way, the OAL of the boolit is .587".

[tazman]

That driving band measurement works fine with standard lube groove boolits. I have a couple of mold that measure that size on the bands.
I think the tumble lube bands won't properly support/grip the rifling.

[Shuz]

I'm gonna heat treat some of those as cast 10:1 boolits to see if that makes any difference.

[tazman]

I'm gonna heat treat some of those as cast 10:1 boolits to see if that makes any difference.

Worth a try. Not certain how well that alloy will heat treat. If you have some antimony in the mix it will harden.

[Shuz]

There should be plenty of antimony in my mix because it is both ww(10)and lino(1); and both have antimony. Previously this mix hardened to Bhn 22 when casting for my .250 Savage.
I heat treated some yesterday, tumble lubed most, and resized a few down to .356 before heat treating to see what that does.
We'll lettem sit for a few days and then test for hardness and loadem up.

[GooseGestapo]

I've had same problem from that, as well as 124gr RNTL, and .401" SWCTL, .410" TLSWC. and .429" 240gr TLSWC.
TWO THINGS;
1. Base driving band is too short. Too small diameter in the grooves.
2. Small bands are easily distorted and swaged undersized upon seating in brass.

Solution is to use HARD alloy to include 2-3% antimony and tin, and two, powder coat.
Even then, some guns still won't shoot them accurately.

I find the 105gr .358" SWC, 120gr TC .356", and 125gr .358 RFN to be far superior to all the TL design molds.

Suggestion: "Beagle" the molds with one thickness of aluminum tape. Size to .357" after powder coating.
Or, order different molds.