Doing the impossible...

[shredder]

Good day all. Just returning from the range where I have done the so called impossible with a Marlin .35 rem.
To qualify this statement I should elaborate on "impossible".

I am shooting a Remington made early run Marlin in .35 rem bought 3 years ago. I have been told repeatedly that they are lousy rifles that don't cycle and for sure they will never shoot cast boolits because of the terrible micro groove rifling. I am shooting an NOE copy of the RCBS 200 FN that heavily engraves the rifling if I use the crimp groove. This of course is another recipe for disaster as the round will de boolit if extracted without firing and cause mayhem in that crappy action. I am shooting a load that involves W748 at 2000 fps. I am lubing with a mixture of beeswax and 2 cycle engine oil. Well, that can't be done either because of the unsuitable powder and of course that velocity is way over the threshold for micro groove(1600fps or below) rifling. I am shooting for groups at 200 yards. According to the local gunsmith this is lunacy! Don't I know this old cartridge is obsolete for a reason? Why at 200 yards you may as well just throw the rifle as you will never hit anything at that range with a lead flat nose.

Well, I must be some kind of idiot because I just wanted to know for myself if any of this was true. The results: When sighted in at 100 yards the rifle will print 1.5 inches with boring regularity. I can sometimes shoot 1 inch or less but not all the time. I believe the rifle is better than I can hold. At 200 my first group was 1.25 inches! A fluke for sure, and confirmed when all the other shots this morning stayed inside 2.5 inches. This was a 50 round string so I think I proved something to myself. Not a hitch in feeding or extraction of loaded rounds or empty brass. Just for fun I also seated another 20 rounds so they would not contact the rifling at all. This put the base of the boolit below the neck into the powder. (Gasp) All those rounds also landed in the group at 200. The recovered slugs show no sign of any gas cutting to the lower portion.

I am feeling just a little smug right now. While I will not try to change any minds at the gun shop, I thought some of you might get a chuckle reading what you already know to be true!

[Hickok]

Good to hear. I am a fan of the .35 Remington.

[Pine Baron]

My first deer was taken with a Marlin 336 in .35 Remington about 100 yds uphill, one shot drop. Oddly enough, Hickok, in the mountains of WV.

[Ed in North Texas]

Being able to show that it isn't necessarily true is often the case with "everybody knows" information. Remington admitted they had problems, but that doesn't mean not one of the early production "Remlins" could measure up. As for the Microgroove barrel, we've known for a long time that they can shoot cast just fine if you make sure to use the right diameter boolits. Thanks for the report.

[Hickok]

My first deer was taken with a Marlin 336 in .35 Remington about 100 yds uphill, one shot drop. Oddly enough, Hickok, in the mountains of WV.Friend, you are always welcome to come to WV!:grin:

[northmn]

I have used the 35 for 4 deer and shot one with a 303 British load and a 208 grain softpoint cast at about 2000 fps chronographed whcih is about the same thing. The cartridge has been effective with less meat waste than with the higher velocity offerings. I sold my 270 a few years ago and don't miss it. I process my own meat and can appreciate the punkin slingers. The 270 is a good cartridge at longer ranges for which it is desined but too much up close unless loaded down. I had thrown away too many front shoulders and meat with one when shot up close whcih is more common in the wooded area of North MN. The 35 as mentioned is very effective on deer. No advantage to using a HV instead. While cases and ammo was tough to get a couple of years ago they are becoming more available again. Due to the fact that Hornady made their ammo available when Remington did not I now tend to buy the Hornady. The LE's are very effective, shoot well out of my Ballard barrel and give a little more range. Also Hornadys cost about $28 where Remingtons are closer to $35 a box. I now have enough brass to make reloading practical.
I also have a 357 but the 35 Remington is really a more practical rifle in that it can be loaded with 357 bullets and is considerably more powerful with full loads.

DP

[shredder]

Yes. The .35 Rem is a real killer! I guess I just get a bit of a kick out of the average gun crank who has never cast a boolit let alone shot any and they profess to tell me "how it is". I say real world experience trumps hot talk from unknowing folks. I have been told by a guy behind a gun counter that the 30/06 can not shoot cast. Never going to work, the boolits will just melt at those velocities! Oh the humanity!

I agree about the moderate velocity being more effective and less catastrophic to the dinner portions of deer. Muzzle loading taught me a lot about killing power.

I never realized how many gun nuts are totally ignorant and or misinformed with old wives tales about cast.

[Tatume]

You're right, lots of things that people claim to be gospel are simply not true. That applies to here, the printed, glossy gun magazines, and many other venues.

[TXGunNut]

I generally don't invest a lot of time educating "experts". If more people knew what we do about Remlins we'd be paying more for them. I'm glad more people aren't competing with us for lead, I'll just smile and keep shooting while they tell me why cast bullets don't work.

[35 shooter]

I generally don't invest a lot of time educating "experts". If more people knew what we do about Remlins we'd be paying more for them. I'm glad more people aren't competing with us for lead, I'll just smile and keep shooting while they tell me why cast bullets don't work.
EXACTLY! :smile:

[357Mag]

.35 Rem -

Shredder -

Howdy !

" I'm a believer " !

Many don't relize it, but .35 Rem has basically " ideal case capacity " for .358" calibre.

It's case capacity allows for choice of potential powders from within the "benchrest powder " burn rate range.

My CT-made .35 Rem XLR was able to produce 5/8" 5-shot 100yd groups shooting 150PSPs over IMR4759.
Best group so far was 5 shots into 7/16", including a 3-shot sub-group of .250" @ 100.

Now we know why Marlin had to sell-off to Remington. They ran their self toth epoor house, makin; .35 cal " benchrest " rifles !


With regards,
357Mag

[stubbicatt]

I don't think I could hold 50 shots as tightly as you have done. I would become fatigued I expect.

[shredder]

I don't think I could hold 50 shots as tightly as you have done. I would become fatigued I expect.

There is a point for sure. It was a long leisurely morning shoot. I was there for just a bit over 2 hours. Lots of walking back and forth enjoying the sunshine. I was absolutely tickled that I could hit the paper every time at 200 let alone have the great group I got. It was the first time I have shot that load at 200 yards.

357MAG I am a believer now too! That old small oddball case just seems to be tailor made for cast!

[TXGunNut]

That old small oddball case just seems to be tailor made for cast! -shredder


I concur. 358 Winchester may be a better CB hunting cartridge but my sentimental favorite is the 35 Rem. I killed one of my first deer with a T/C Contender pistol firing j-words over 20 years ago. A few years back I discovered CB's and had the good fortune to stumble across a 336 in 35 Rem. I fell in love with that cartridge all over again.

[Buckshot]

http://www.fototime.com/89E2F2C1A9E4DC7/standard.jpghttp://www.fototime.com/AEC40C4BAA66E93/standard.jpg

http://www.fototime.com/8A4CCD7559D0176/standard.jpghttp://www.fototime.com/04C877028F41F97/standard.jpg

I built a Small Ring Mauser (1894 Brazilian) chambered to 35 Remington. It's in a Ramline plastic stock that was on sale for $39.00 when I bought it years back. The boolit is the Saeco #356, 200gr FNGC. Target is at 50 yards. I know it isn't a levergun, but it just goes to show ya there isn't any flies on the old 35 Rem for most any light big game at reasonable distances.

I've also used it for fun gunning on ground squirrels (or cans, water filled plastic bottles, etc) with the Lee 140gr SWC and 7.0grs of Unique. That's about .02¢ for the powder and with WLRP @ .03¢, you're shooting for about today's 22RF costs.

..................Buckshot

[fordwannabe]

I don't know if you would consider me a fan or not because I only have 4 ' of the Marlins in 35 remington. A 336A deluxe, a mid 50's RC , a S/C, and what started out as a very rusted mid 80's 336 that we have had cut to 16 inch barrel with a modified mag to resemble a mini S/C. Ok I guess I am a fan after all. Good report.

[shredder]

I don't know if you would consider me a fan or not because I only have 4 ' of the Marlins in 35 remington..

Ha Ha! You are even farther gone than I am! It sure is nice to shoot a lever gun that has the big boolit thump without the shoulder pounding of the 45/70.

[shredder]

Buckshot: That is one sweet little bolt gun. Even with the ram line stock. [smilie=l: I like the ability to shoot the lightweights, I have a Lee 140 grain(I think) RN mould as well. I have tried some in my Marlin but of course there are feeding issues from the tube, has to be single shot. Maybe some day I will try them again, but with the 200 grain FN shooting so well for me I can't imagine why!

[357Mag]

Shredder -

Howdy, again !

My best effort thus far..... 150gr "J"-words over 18.6gr IMR4759 ( see pics ).

5-shots @ 100yd.
I was using a windflag, and held off of the tight 3-shot sub group for the final 2 shots.... based on what I thought the windflag was showing me.
Those last 2 shots went right where I was pointing, and not into the nice group I had going ! Aackk !


With regards,
357Mag

[357Mag]

Shredder -

Howdy, again !

And yes.... I do try to shoot some lead in my XLR; too.

Pics show my on-going " .35 Remington Neckless " project. " Dead Center " 195 SPBTs patched w/ DYMO label maker tape.

I started range trials w/ IMR4759, but am thinking about going w/ IMR4198 instead.

" Film @ 11:00 "....


With regards,
357Mag

[shredder]

Shredder -

Howdy, again !

And yes.... I do try to shoot some lead in my XLR; too.

Pics show my on-going " .35 Remington Neckless " project. " Dead Center " 195 SPBTs patched w/ DYMO label maker tape.

I started range trials w/ IMR4759, but am thinking about going w/ IMR4198 instead.

" Film @ 11:00 "....


With regards,
357Mag

Interesting. I shoot those in my muzzleloader! Very accurate boolits. The fellow that makes them has so many good products.

So school me on the neckless thing. Why? What is the advantage?

[merlin101]

My only .35 is a TC Contender super 16, I haven't gotten around to trying any lead in it because I only use two rounds a year in it. One to confirm the scope is where it should be and one for the deer.I have it sighted in at 200yds using Hornady 180 gr SSP I loaded up about 60 rounds ten years ago so it will be awhile before I run out. Maybe I should but a remlin to help burn it up?

[357Mag]

Shredder -

Howdy !

Just saw your recent post addition.

The " Neckless " itterration of the .35 Rem case could allow a " patched boollit shooter to use a thicker patch.
In my example..... DYMO label maker tape in-lieu of paper for the patch.

It has also allowed me to go w/ a pointy, polymer-capped, rebated boat tail. Hard to find all that, in a .358" cal boolit !

Neck sizing fer sher is elliminated ! I haven't even had to FL size my cases. This sure cuts down on die count !

In-theroy.... the " Neckless " could be used to meet " Indiana Deer " cartridge specs.
Most shooting .35 Rem for this, would opt to go w/ a partially-shortened neck lg.

For me, it's an experiment, a learning lesson.


With regards,
357Mag

[shredder]

Shredder -

Howdy !

Just saw your recent post addition.


The " Neckless " itterration of the .35 Rem case could allow a " patched boollit shooter to use a thicker patch.
In my example..... DYMO label maker tape in-lieu of paper for the patch.

It has also allowed me to go w/ a pointy, polymer-capped, rebated boat tail. Hard to find all that, in a .358" cal boolit !

Neck sizing fer sher is elliminated ! I haven't even had to FL size my cases. This sure cuts down on die count !

In-theroy.... the " Neckless " could be used to meet " Indiana Deer " cartridge specs.
Most shooting .35 Rem for this, would opt to go w/ a partially-shortened neck lg.

For me, it's an experiment, a learning lesson.


With regards,
357Mag

Well, Ill be! I thought I had seen about everything but you actually showed me something new. So you are trying to get around a cartridge restriction for hunting? Crazy why game departments would be more interested in regulating hunters and their firearms than regulating game animals.

[Fishman]

Label maker tape? Very interesting. What I found on the net is pretty inexpensive, adhesive, and plastic. Is this what you are using? I couldn't find how thick it is either. Have you compared it to paper patch? Again a very interesting idea.

[blikseme300]

There are far too many Internet experts that keep collecting and showing off the facts that micro groove rifles can't shoot worth a lake. To my mind these people are like dung beetles collecting, you guessed it, more dung. No matter the size of the ball it is still dung.