Grips for Mod 19 Smith

[WRideout]

I have a Mod 19 Smith with the original wood factory grips which fit me quite well. Last year I bought speed loaders for it, and found that I can't get them past the grips, with the cylinder fully out. Also, I generally shoot my own cast WC with light loads of Red Dot, and no problem. But when I shoot full-house .357 mags, it rotates the gun in my hand and I end up with a cut on the web where my thumb and first finger meet.

Would aftermarket grips solve these problems, and if so, does anyone have a recommendation? Thanks.

Wayne

[shooting on a shoestring]

Grips are like shoes. You need to get what fits you.
The later Model 19s came with Hogue grips. They're about $25-$30 at your LGS. Try on a pair.

Also I often find speed loaders will work just fine even if they don't completely clear the grips. If just the front end of the cartridges gets in the chambers, I release the speed loader and let them fall.

Another thought, keep that wonderful K-Frame for your Red Dot loads and get a GP-100 for full throttle loads and speedloaders.

[tazman]

I agree with shoestring. I would add that a 686 would work as well for the full power magnum loads.
That Model 19 is a real gem. Take care of it.

[WRideout]

Grips are like shoes. You need to get what fits you.

Another thought, keep that wonderful K-Frame for your Red Dot loads and get a GP-100 for full throttle loads and speedloaders.

I have a relationship with Miss Smith, and I wouldn't want to be unfaithful to her.

Wayne

[WRideout]

I agree with shoestring. I would add that a 686 would work as well for the full power magnum loads.
That Model 19 is a real gem. Take care of it.

I agree on the assessment of the Mod 19. I have never shot a Mod 29 or equivalent, but the K frame is so handy, I have not felt the need to get anything else.

I only shoot about two boxes a year of magnums. Usually the Lyman 358477 over Blue Dot. I may back off on my max load, just because I am only killing paper. In PA one can legally hunt deer with a revolver, so I might try that sometime; I can scare them just as well with a pistol as a rifle.

Wayne

[Petrol & Powder]

I agree with the above comments.
Grips are individual things and what works for one person will often not work for another. Speedloaders can be a problem with some target grips, even factory target grips.

I don't know if you wish to stay with wood or go to some rubber grip but the good news is there are LOTS of options available in either camp.

For an All-around, service grip that fits a lot of folks; I would suggest the Pachmayr "Gripper".
Another option, IF the finger grooves work for you, is the Houge mono grip. The Houge is a bit longer so if concealment is part of the plan it may not be a good choice.

In the wooden grip camp there are more choices than we can possibly cover but the factory magna grips with the addition of a Tyler T-grip adaptor is both old school and functional.
I've had good experience with Eagle grips over the years and one of their combat style grip sets will certainly work. There are hunderds of options available so don't take that as royal edict.

As for Speedloaders, look for the speedloader cutout in the top of the left grip panel when selecting grips. Remember that with some of the woods such as Rosewood, the color goes all the way through the grip. With a smooth Rosewood grip you can alter the grip with a rasp, dremel tool, sand paper, etc. and then re-oil the grip for a like new appearance. I've made speedloader cuts in Rosewood grips when the grip needed them.

Good luck !

[376Steyr]

The S&W "Factory Target" grips are relics from the days of one-handed shooting at paper using .38 wadcutter loads. As you have found, they are fine in that role, but don't work so well as more and more power is stuffed into a 19th-century design. When I get a S&W, the first thing I do is pull off the factory stocks, stick them in a storage box for later, and put on a set of Pachmayr "Gripper" stocks.

[WRideout]

Thanks, everybody. I will explore the universe of after-market grips. I always generally liked Pachmayr stuff, but probably just because the name is unforgettable.

Wayne

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Here's a S&W 66 (same as 19 but stainless) with Pachmayr "Professional Grippper" rubber grips. They work better for smaller hands because the backstrap is open instead of covered as with the regular Gripper version. Note the easy access for speedloader line up in the third photo.

166402166403166404

[Scharfschuetze]

The original S&W target grips were, as you surmise, not all that speed loader friendly. Speed loaders largely replaced cartridge loops on an officer's belt in the mid to late 70s and S&W grips prior to this didn't have to take the speed loaders into account. Later wood target grips had much more wood under the cylinder latch removed for speed loader use.

By all means, don't modify or throw those grips out. The old ones are now bringing a premium on the market for such things. Guys want to restore their revolvers to original condition and they are much sought after.

Back in the day, I often modified the S&W grips for double action shooting by cutting much of the base off and reducing the diameter at the base. The target grips were made for single action shooting as 376 Styer notes. Wide at the base... not good for DA shooting and thus possibly the cause for you injury when shooting them.

Gebrigsjaeger also makes a good point by noting that the original Pachmayr grips had too much rubber behind the revolver's frame and thus made good DA shooting by people with small to medium hands difficult. The "Professional" grips that he posts are best for DA shooting as they allow the trigger finger more leverage over the trigger, but not for recoil attenuation like the versions with the rubber back strap.

Here is what I did with the S&W target grips for DA shooting. I did this for many of the officers on my department and to a man they preferred this size. Also is a photo of my Model 19 with the later wood grips before S&W went to the rubber grips. You can see the large cutout for speed loaders with this design.

[Char-Gar]

Handgun grips in general and revolver grips in particular are very important. They are our only contact with the handgun and must be a good fit for us to do well with the handgun, as you found out.

Here are the grips on my Model 19..they fit me very well.

[Char-Gar]

The original S&W target grips were, as you surmise, not all that speed loader friendly. Speed loaders largely replaced cartridge loops on an officer's belt in the mid to late 70s and S&W grips prior to this didn't have to take the speed loaders into account. Later wood target grips had much more wood under the cylinder latch removed for speed loader use.

By all means, don't modify or throw those grips out. The old ones are now bringing a premium on the market for such things. Guys want to restore their revolvers to original condition and they are much sought after.

Back in the day, I often modified the S&W grips for double action shooting by cutting much of the base off and reducing the diameter at the base. The target grips were made for single action shooting as 376 Styer notes. Wide at the base... not good for DA shooting and thus possibly the cause for you injury when shooting them.

Gebrigsjaeger also makes a good point by noting that the original Pachmayr grips had too much rubber behind the revolver's frame and thus made good DA shooting by people with small to medium hands difficult. The "Professional" grips that he posts are best for DA shooting as they allow the trigger finger more leverage over the trigger, but not for recoil attenuation like the versions with the rubber back strap.

Here is what I did with the S&W target grips for DA shooting. I did this for many of the officers on my department and to a man they preferred this size. Also is a photo of my Model 19 with the later wood grips before S&W went to the rubber grips. You can see the large cutout for speed loaders with this design.

I shortened the butt, rounded it and took off the trombone bell at the bottom of many a pair of Smith and Wesson Target grips and they were a big improvement. Today with the skyrocketing prices of these grips, it would be a sacrilege. However I still have a few on my N frames.

[Mtnfolk75]

I agree with the assessment of the Pachmayr Pro Gripper, I have medium sized hands and run the Pro on my K-Frames.

[Petrol & Powder]

When I mentioned the Pachmayr Gripper earlier in this thread I was referring to the "Professional Gripper" model but forgot to include that designation. Thank you for reminding me that the Gripper comes in different configurations. And yes, the Pro Gripper model is a very good all-around service grip. As mentioned , the exposed backstrap allows for a better trigger reach.

[FergusonTO35]

You can get the Pachmayr Presrntation grip in excellent condition for around $10.00 on Fleabay. It's pretty much a rubber version of the S&W target grip with less of a flare on the bottom.

[Char-Gar]

Here's a S&W 66 (same as 19 but stainless) with Pachmayr "Professional Grippper" rubber grips. They work better for smaller hands because the backstrap is open instead of covered as with the regular Gripper version. Note the easy access for speedloader line up in the third photo.

166402166403166404

A pair of those came on my Model 19 in my post above. I took them off and put on the Bear Hug Skeeter Skelton grips. You post caused me to dig them out and put them on a good mid-60's Model 10. They are not near as spongy as other Pachy rubber grips. I think I may like them.

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Petrol & Powder--you weren't off at all, some folks do have larger hands and prefer the regular "Gripper", and the O.P. didn't give us a hand size.

Good luck with those grips, Char-Gar, I think you'll grow to be very fond of them. I thought those on the 19 were probably Bear Hugs. Very nice.

DG

[tazman]

Char Gar--If you consider Pachmayr grips to be spongy, I don't think I want to shake hands with you. You would crush my hand. I can't say I have ever noticed Pachmayr grips being spongy or soft.

[Blackwater]

You've gotten good advice above, and the only thing I can add is that if the gun is twisting in your hand with full loads, you're not gripping it firmly enough. Back when bullseye shooting was the game of the day, light loads and loose hands on the grip were the rule. Today, with much more powerful loads and more recoil, it takes a much firmer grip to master a handgun. Imagine a grip much like a good, really firm (but not "tight") handshake. That's about the right grip for any magnum revolver. Lesser, lighter recoil loads will let you get away with lighter grips, but full loads call for a firmer grip. Try it and see if it doesn't tame the gun significantly. Might take some time to re-learn and adjust to a firmer grip, but you only have to grip it that firmly just before you fire it. That firm grip inhibits quick, smooth handling, so if you can learn to handle it loosely right up until you're leveling it off, I think you'll have gone a long way towards becoming a sho' 'nuff shootist. In shooting handguns, everything matters, and there's an effect for every variation you induce into the process of shooting them. Get used to that, and just learn what works for you, exactly, and it'll really improve your shooting all around.

[leftiye]

Ah luvz them Decelerators on mine (19).

[salvadore]

If I had any friends I'd be afraid they might see the pachs. Million dollar body, ten cent face. That's just me tho.

[ironhead7544]

If you shoot a lot of DA, the the Pro Gripper is best. If recoil bothers you and you shoot mostly SA, then the regular Grippers will help.

You will have to try it for yourself. Grip fit can make a big difference for you.

[Hickok]

I realize the Colt Python is a fine revolver, and I have shot a few, but when it come down to it, I like my Model 19 best. I know the money values are way different, but my Model 19 is still tops. JUst my opinion.

[leftiye]

Nuthin' nowhere in production revolters like a Smith! Years and years ago they achieved perfection. Should be translated any time now.

[Ilwil]

I wish those Pachmayers were available when I was a cop. Everybody got the big sized grips on their Model 65s, and for years I could not qualify expert; I had to shift my medium sized hands too much, lost time on reloads. It was demoralizing until we were allowed to carry a chosen private gun too. I could do expert with my Hi-Power with no problem, and finally the importance of having your gun fit your hand.

[WRideout]

Thanks, Gebirgsjager. I do have rather small hands for a guy. Sounds like a joke in this political age, doesn't it? I like the looks of those Pro Gripper, and may look into getting a pair. As was suggested elsewhere, I will keep the original grips for when I pass the revolver along to my kids.

[WRideout]

You've gotten good advice above, and the only thing I can add is that if the gun is twisting in your hand with full loads, you're not gripping it firmly enough. Back when bullseye shooting was the game of the day, light loads and loose hands on the grip were the rule. Today, with much more powerful loads and more recoil, it takes a much firmer grip to master a handgun. Imagine a grip much like a good, really firm (but not "tight") handshake. That's about the right grip for any magnum revolver. Lesser, lighter recoil loads will let you get away with lighter grips, but full loads call for a firmer grip. Try it and see if it doesn't tame the gun significantly. Might take some time to re-learn and adjust to a firmer grip, but you only have to grip it that firmly just before you fire it. That firm grip inhibits quick, smooth handling, so if you can learn to handle it loosely right up until you're leveling it off, I think you'll have gone a long way towards becoming a sho' 'nuff shootist. In shooting handguns, everything matters, and there's an effect for every variation you induce into the process of shooting them. Get used to that, and just learn what works for you, exactly, and it'll really improve your shooting all around.

I don't shoot in competition, but generally always use light WC loads, which seemed to do better with a light grip, as you suggested. I load a few boxes of 357 mag, just because I can, and it seems like I should be able to shoot anything the gun can handle. At the range, I sometimes alternate between WC 38's and mags; it does seem to give me trouble adjusting between them. Even with a very firm grip, the mag loads are still hard to control. I am hoping that a new set of grips will help with that.

Wayne

[tazman]

I have a tendency to try and jerk the trigger when the sights line up. I know this is bad form and am working on the problem. What I have found is if I hold the revolver lightly and squeeze properly, I can hit what I aim at. When I hold the gun firmly and squeeze properly I can also hit what I aim at.
The problem comes when I jerk a little. With the light hold, if I jerk slightly, I have no idea where the boolits will end up. With the firm grip, if I jerk slightly, the boolits are close to point of aim because the gun doesn't move as much. I think it is with the firm grip my whole arm becomes a single unit and doesn't flex. With the light grip, my wrist will flex allowing the gun to point wherever it wishes instead of at the target.
The firm grip allows me to use the same grip for both light target and magnum loads. A consistent grip is easier to maintain rather than changing your grip for the loads you are using. If your grip varies, the reactions of your gun will vary as well. You will also naturally use the grip you practice with the most at least for the first shot or two.
The firm grip is necessary to get proper function and control with my semi-auto pistols. I can use the firm grip with both styles of gun and not need to change the the strength of my grip, making me more consistent.
Just my thoughts and they only apply to me. If this would work for you, great. I am not saying this is the only way to do it or even the proper way to do it. It just works for me.

[FergusonTO35]

For an S&W with the round butt the Pachmayr Compac is an outstanding grip. Keeps the slim profile but still very comfortable, I have 'em on my 637.

[Scharfschuetze]

I have a tendency to try and jerk the trigger when the sights line up. I know this is bad form and am working on the problem.

Not an uncommon problem Taz. We used to call that "ambushing" the target. Sounds like you are on the track to fix it. As noted in many posts, dry firing is a good way to ID such issues and to fix them. Be sure to "follow through" and hold on target after the hammer falls for a second or two while dry firing. After it becomes habit or muscle memory, you ought to be good to go.

After my personally modified target grips (posted in an early post) my next favorite grips are the Hoag wood grips. Here they are on my Model 65. Note the large cut out for speed loaders. The only modification I might make to these is to get rid of the finger groove ridges as they tend to disrupt my grip a bit.

[roundgun]

Hogue for working guns. Check out the Jerry Miculek grips. My 625's wear them.

[Lloyd Smale]

I'm with char char. I detest rubber grips. There UGLY, never fit perfectly, will twist and flex in my hand when shooting and the bigger the gun the worse it is. Had some on a 475 once that would peel the skin off my hand. A 357 isn't a hard kicker. A good set of wood grips that fit your hand is what you want. Finger grooved wood are usually my choice on 357s and 41s. On 44s I like smooth grips. I detest the coke bottle grips that come on smiths. Its why some of you think wood grips don't work as good as rubbers. Get a set of bear hugs or the style bob michlec designed and youll never use rubber again.
A pair of those came on my Model 19 in my post above. I took them off and put on the Bear Hug Skeeter Skelton grips. You post caused me to dig them out and put them on a good mid-60's Model 10. They are not near as spongy as other Pachy rubber grips. I think I may like them.