Australian gov at it again

[Handloader109]

https://www.nraila.org/articles/20160415/never-enough-australias-gun-controllers-aim-for-more-restrictions

I feel sorry for you guys down under, and it proves once more, it is truly never enough....
We cannot give an inch. The gun banners want them ALL!

Any of you guys potentially affected? (that want to admit you are a horder)

[Bob65]

It is worse than what you think down here.

The antis want our lever guns and they wont stop there.

They are using the 20th anniversary of the Port Arthur Massacre as an excuse, and they are filling the public with fear and lies, and the media is helping them. All of our legally owned guns are registered, and now the anti gunners have made an interactive website telling everyone how many guns are in all cities and suburbs by post code (zipcode?). This effectively gives criminals a shopping list for them to go around stealing guns, which will play into the antis hands if legal guns are stolen.

None of these idiots can explain how making the laws tougher will stop criminals using illegal guns.

The media is trying to paint all gun owners as homicidal maniacs just waiting for the right time to go on a shooting spree.


edited to add: The Adler shotgun in the NRA story that we can get here (for now anyway) has a 5 shot magazine, not 4. The antis and the media are calling it a "rapid fire lever action semi auto killing machine"

[Went2kck]

I am betting all the gun grabbers have a body guard with a gun. Maybe even full auto. if you don't want to think so just ask Hillary Clinton the want to be gun grabber traitor of the USA.

[Freightman]

Read and heed what they are going through, elect the Hildabeast and hang on JMHO.

[Geezer in NH]

Read and heed what they are going through, elect the Hildabeast and hang on JMHO.Truth there friend!

[robg]

Feel so sorry for you guys ,the antis cannot see the future police state etc. Wish the UK constitution had been written down as in the USA ,wouldn't be in this mess now.

[xs11jack]

I have this fantasy in which I am walking down a street and there is a famous gun grabber getting robbed and beaten. The graber knows you are carrying a gun and screams at you to save her. My response is something like this:"I wouldn't want you to have to compromise you ethics on gun control". An I turn and walk away.
Ole Jack

[Handloader109]

No, I'd read/seen lately that everything is registered. That is the first step guys and universal background checks is just that,,. It is so insidious that I had to take 15minutes to explain to my gun loving wife why it was a very bad idea. Anybody but Clinton! Heck I'd take crazy Bernie over her!

[Bob65]

No, I'd read/seen lately that everything is registered. That is the first step guys and universal background checks is just that,,. It is so insidious that I had to take 15minutes to explain to my gun loving wife why it was a very bad idea. Anybody but Clinton! Heck I'd take crazy Bernie over her!

True, everything is registered. And you need to be licensed, with the appropriate category of license before you can apply for a "permit to acquire" to buy any gun, even private sales, which have to go through a dealer to transfer registration.

[JeffinNZ]

The single biggest issue is most shooters in NZ and AU and ZERO spine and will not stand up for themselves. When my licence was renewed last year the arms officer wanted to record how many firearms I had. NZ law does not require that so I told him so, refused to open my safe and held my ground. End result, I got my licence and he never got his list.

[Bob65]

The laws in NZ can not be compared to the laws in Australia, 2 completely different things.

One of the major hurdles we face in Australia is disunity within the shooting community.

The people who shoot only one discipline exclusively say "it won't affect me, so what do I care".

They can't see that if it is not stopped now it will not stop there. The antis and gun grabbers wont stop until there are no guns left.

[MtGun44]

"lever action semi-auto" an impossibility, but then again lying doesn't
bother them in the slightest.

Good luck, but hanging together is important. Sad that people can't see that there
is strength in numbers and the WILL NOT stop until there are none left.

[JeffinNZ]

The laws in NZ can not be compared to the laws in Australia, 2 completely different things.

One of the major hurdles we face in Australia is disunity within the shooting community.

The people who shoot only one discipline exclusively say "it won't affect me, so what do I care".

They can't see that if it is not stopped now it will not stop there. The antis and gun grabbers wont stop until there are no guns left.

Not true. We have the same thing here. Found the cure for apathy but no one was interested.

[Bob65]

Not true. We have the same thing here. Found the cure for apathy but no one was interested.

I beg to differ.

Take the example you cited.

You said that NZ law does not require that they know how many guns you have.

Australian law requires that not only do they know how many, but what types of guns, the serial numbers of those guns, where they are stored, and that you have a registration certificate for them.

Non compliance means you are breaking the law, resulting in fines, possible jail terms, loss of license and loss of guns.

This is a huge difference.

[Handloader109]

See guys, first step registration, second step tracking what you have, by type and quantity. Third step is how do you store, and where., next why do you have these, and restrictions on having any., next step is that you now have too many, you can't buy more. After that what difference does it make, they'll restrict and eliminate...... One small step at a time. Slow cancer got to cut them out now!

[Bob65]

What you say is all true Handloader109.

In Australia it will not be as easy for them to enforce harsher restrictions this time around.

I am not talking any sort of civil disobedience or any thing like that. This time around we are much better organised, with much better representation in government. There are more shooters now than there was in '96, and more people willing to stand up and call out the lies and scare mongering from the antis.

For what it is worth, there are more legally owned guns now than there was before the first lot of restrictions and the gun buy back of '96.

I myself and most of the people I know bought 2 or more guns for every gun they stole back from me.

[Artful]

When my licence was renewed last year the arms officer wanted to record how many firearms I had.

But did you write out a complaint against him? Notify his supervisor?

[Char-Gar]

People have the governments they choose or deserve. If they don't like their government, it is because others chose and those who don't like it, allowed it to happen. In the last case, they choose by default and deserve what they get.

When governments become oppressive to enough of it's citizens, there will be a revolution. We are about due one here in the US, I should think. All governments and leaders are corrupt and will over time gather more and more power for itself and grant less and less to the people.

Bottom line is I don't feel sorry for the Ozzies as they put themselves in this condition and only they can get themselves out. Whining about it serves no go purpose.

[ole 5 hole group]

That is an interesting point of view, you have there, Char-Gar. Just who put osama in the white house and just who went along and allowed it? Now, if the FBI rolls over and doesn't recommend charges be brought against the beast, just who will stop that? and if the beast wins the election, nominates 2 or more activist SCOTUS judges with senate approval - just who is going to allow this to happen, which in effect will alter our Constitution and it's Bill of Rights with their activist views?

The socialists are in firm control "down under" and they have almost total control in the USA right now, as it started with our education system, then the media and just who in the hell have we elected in the house & senate to stop this madness and what have they done???? I guess we are doing it to ourselves too - but I sure as hell will resist the tide that's coming but I don't expect much help.

[Char-Gar]

That is an interesting point of view, you have there, Char-Gar. Just who put osama in the white house and just who went along and allowed it? Now, if the FBI rolls over and doesn't recommend charges be brought against the beast, just who will stop that? and if the beast wins the election, nominates 2 or more activist SCOTUS judges with senate approval - just who is going to allow this to happen, which in effect will alter our Constitution and it's Bill of Rights with their activist views?

The socialists are in firm control "down under" and they have almost total control in the USA right now, as it started with our education system, then the media and just who in the hell have we elected in the house & senate to stop this madness and what have they done???? I guess we are doing it to ourselves too - but I sure as hell will resist the tide that's coming but I don't expect much help.

Please re-read the 2nd. sentence of the 2nd. paragraph in my post. The jist of the whole thing, is that while we may not have voted for the government or approve of it, if all we do is whine, then we deserve what we have. Whining is not an effective strategy for change.

[JeffinNZ]

But did you write out a complaint against him? Notify his supervisor?

I did one better. Wrote to the editor of the shooting magazine a write for and laid it out. The national arms officer responded with the usual BS all of which I shot down with quotes from seminars he had given in the past. He did not respond.

[Geezer in NH]

Keep up the fight JinNZ. We will be fighting the same here in less than 2 years. Ours may not be in the courts I am afraid.

Communism must be stopped no matter how many Democrats think it is better.

[victorfox]

The the guys in OZ and NZ. my condolences. We are living this in Brazil. Here have caliber restrictions anything more powerful than .38, .380 or 44-40 in a rifle needs a special and expensive army permit. As well as reloading. The registration is obligatory and must be renewed every 3 years. The law is tight and unjust but every "system" has flaws that can be worked around and we do the most we can while technically respecting the law. The communist regime started at about 1994 but the deep roots came in 2002. At this very moment the congressmen are voting the impeachment of the beast president she who was a criminal guerilla and was elected in a fraudulent election with electronic ballot box. We are fighting as we can there are pro-gun congressmen to who we talk either by internet phone or personally in some cases and two pro-gun NGOs but the battle is very hard against us. Socialist indoctrination is in the school and even the police says for example "don't react" in case of attack. We go tru hardships to acquire and have guns for defense, fun and maybe hunting (because hunting here is illegal in most cases, only wild board and buffalo allowed with army and environment agency permits). We just can't shut up the shooting community here is mostly of fat old guys with a lot of money badly or well earned who don't care about freedom and some are even pro gun control to my astonishment.

[Artful]

I did one better. Wrote to the editor of the shooting magazine a write for and laid it out. The national arms officer responded with the usual BS all of which I shot down with quotes from seminars he had given in the past. He did not respond.

The problem with shooting magazine is your preaching to the choir, I would be writing letters to political elected officials letting them them know that the organizations that they are supposed to be overseeing, the civil servants of the people where overstepping the bounds of law.

And get that printed in local newpapers and facebook/social media. Get some heat applied so they withdraw into their den and don't show their face until they learn what is allowed by law and adhere to it.

[gilgsn]

France isn't much better. I just came back after a 22 years absence. Gun ownership is more controlled now. It will take me nine months to buy a revolver.. A lever action rifle can be bought if you are a member of the French shooting federation ($100). Semi autos are still allowed, but I am not holding my breath.. All firearms now must be declared, all sales are recorded. Only BP guns can be bought without paperwork and thus are quite popular. Socialism here has attained a level hard to imagine. I feel like I am walking around a bunch of weird brainwashed cult members.. Europe is doomed. I see no turning around from here and now. People have been "educated" here for too long. I try to explain libertarianism to them, and it's like talking to a chicken..
Gil

[victorfox]

Gil, I feel the same in Brazil. People seem to want a big govt to give them all they want and take from them all it wants. We have a big violence problem here mostly with fireams. Instead of attacking criminals they want to take our guns.Seems ae share some uncultural heritage from France as the procedures you describe fits our laws regarding guns. It took about one year to get my permits for my revolver and shotgun. We can't have anything more powerful than .38/380 in handguns or 44-40 in rifle and need a plethora of requisites to get army permit for more powerful stuff like a .45 or .308. Then the guns cost is prohibitive for most people. I paid a lot of cash for the guns I own if they were the restricted type I would have to shell out 5x what I paid. At least we can almost freely reload shotshells that's why I got the judge. About 38std performance at close range with less than .22lr cost per round (since I reload). Sometimes I think there no hope to Brazil either but we can't give up the fight. And I'm only concerning about firearms not to mention other stuff... Another French trait we have here I find annoying is that rifles are called "fuzil" (fusil) and any long bolt action rifles are called "mosquetao" (musketoon).Best to you. We all need a lot of patience and strength. The fight ahead is hard.

[thxmrgarand]

This can happen in the US if we are not politically active at every level. If you live in one of the many states that could go either way in the 2016 presidential election please make ready to go door to door, stuff envelopes for the pro-gun side, write letters to editors in statewide newspapers, and maybe even hold a fundraiser for pro-gun candidates at your home, farm or gun club. Democracy is not majority rule; it is rule by the majority of those who show up.

[gilgsn]

You guys in the US are the last bastion of freedom in the world, and I don't say this lightly. The US government unfortunately has also been turned into a tax collecting entity, like in so many other countries. And what threatens thieves more than guns? You guys never give an inch!

I hear you Victor. Gun laws here are made by ignorant puppets. For instance, .44 mag ammo can be bought with just your shooting license, but you need special authorization for .45 Colt.. Because .44 mag is considered a rifle round, lol. It never ends.

Gil

[Markbo]

.... Democracy is not majority rule; it is rule by the majority of those who show up....

Amen. Unfortunately as the current POTUS campaign clearly shows there is a sharp divide in the U.S. today and it seem to me the far left have a clear majority. You can blame the caree politicians or the media or whomever but if most of the populace leans that way, that is the way we are headed. And we clearly are. Is that alone reason for a revolution? No.

But we must be aware what this means for us and our country. While they celebrate we cry for our lost Repiblic. "Hell in a handbasket". We are headed that way, like a freight train. What are YOU doing about it?

[victorfox]

Gil that's exactly what we get... No 44-40 handguns but in a rifle allowed... 45 Colt 44 mag all restricted... You can't handload metallic without a permit can't buy components whatever...I second you on the thought of America being the last bastion of freedom. It's great responsibility it carries in its shoulders. If not for American help we would be already be communists since 1964 what the left calls the"coupe d'¨¦tat" till this day. Yesterday comrade dilma had her impeachment voted and we won. Needs the senate now.

[MtGun44]

Best wishes to Brazil and France. I hope you are able to hold on to your rights. In Kansas we have been
steadily rolling back gun restrictions. In 1980, machine guns, short barreled rifles, short barreled shotguns
and silencers were absolutely illegal. Now zero state restrictions, although much paperwork and delay with
federal paperwork. Also, no new machineguns made since '86 has driven prices to insane levels, so I will
not buy one. Good news is ANY semiauto rifle is fine, any handguns, unlimited quantities, zero state restrictions on
gun purchases now, only federal instant background check, and that is bypassed if you have a concealed carry permit.

Concealed carry is legal in Kansas and 6 other states now with NO permit, if you can legally own the gun, you may
carry it concealed. Steadily improving at state levels here, with the exceptions of California and the crazy Northeast,
Massachusetts, New Jersey, New York, Maryland and most of those states. Pennsylvania is OK, as is Maine, and
I think Vermont is still OK, the one state which never outlawed concealed carry, always legal, no permit required.

It is possible to reverse things, but not easy, takes a lot of committed folks, working hard. If nobody cares, then
it becomes impossible.

Sad about no handloading without a permit. They want to be SURE only the government will
be armed when they need to "apply pressure".

Bill

[shoot-n-lead]

I am betting all the gun grabbers have a body guard with a gun. Maybe even full auto. if you don't want to think so just ask Hillary Clinton the want to be gun grabber traitor of the USA.

Of course she does. she has Secret Service protection, just like all of the wives of former Presidents...not to mention, Presidential candidates.

[victorfox]

Mtgun44, amen brother. We have a more or less good law project being voted which will simplify a lot the gun purchases and possession as well as issuing of cc permits which now are forbidden. Only LEO, judges, prosecutors and criminals can carry. Sometimes civilians carry unlawfully risking going to prison if caught but crime rate here is so high I'd bet one could find a criminal before a policeman that will take his gun... Sadly it still keeps the ammo quantity restrictions and never touches the reloading subject which is regulated by the red army. It wasn't always this way. Until 1997 there was limited freedom that was much better and carrying was not a felony you were just fined and told to get a permit which was issued at the very police district if you wanted. That happened to my father... Now you can buy a gun but its a lengthy process and you can only buy if the officer is in good mood and agrees. Since it is under the ministry of (in)justice a moron nominated by the commie govt you know what the decisions usually are. NOT ALLOWED. By the grace of the providence, my permits to buy were all granted, and now I have 4 firearms being 6 the maximum you can get without the army permit. All this is a great mass of BS societal control... I wish we could get at least half the freedom you show us and wish the best to people who live in Kommifornia and other states of America who don't respect the Constitution and its citizens rights.

[victorfox]

I'm sorry for all these "cut" posts, I'm on the phone and its windows and messes my visualization and typing (therefore many errors). You know our president is under impeachment process and her minions are menacing the people if she falls. It's the so called lack land workers movement with their machetes billhooks and axes that never seen work but are willing to shed blood, the so called workers unions, and they talk about bringing foreign armies like from Venezuela, Bolivia and even Cuba if she gets out of the office. They threaten us and nothing is done because the president is a terrorist involved in attacks and she confirms all the deeds these criminal pack do, like invading farms, destroying crops, killing cattle, stopping highways with fire barricades and such. We first need to take all these criminals from power then establish a decent society. The president too has an obscure nationality. Seems she's from Bulgaria no one ever showed her documents (looks like a known gun grabber president?), she gave money to dictators in Cuba and Venezuela as well as Bolivia and keeps very close relations to Iran and Russia. By the time America set an embargo to Russia almost all the meat vanished and prices skyrocketed. Reason? With high dollar-real rate the production was sent to Russia to support Putin. This all is just the tip of the iceberg, I don't know if you get this kind of information out of here because guess what the press supports the govt...

[Artful]

JeffinNZ (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/member.php?829-JeffinNZ), re-reading my post above I think I should tell you, that if you think I came across a little strong I apologize it's just that .gov employees taking liberties with their authority is one of my hot buttons. Liberal/Progressives are not the only ones who can go overboard in reaction to hot buttons.

[MtGun44]

victorfox,

I had no idea that there were threats of foreign intervention. Would the Army permit this sort of outside influence?
And she has no original citizenship in Brazil? Is there any national police or army forces who are loyal to the \
people to keep the peace properly?

I know little about Brazil, but it sounds worse than I have ever guessed.

Good luck, sir, stay safe and all your family and friends, too. I hope your government
is able to sort out the problems and get back on track to doing the right things.

It sounds like there is a good gun law in the process, I hope that it passes and makes things
fair and sane again, or maybe fair, if they never really were before.

Bill

[victorfox]

Amen again. Yes this country looks nice in the pics but you kill a lion bare handed every day you live here. Dilma is a former member of the so called revolutionary guerrilas... She is said to be born in minas gerais br but there are rumors of she being born in Bulgaria and came to here as a child which would invalidate her mandate. Also the election by electronic means is suspect of fraud. The army is under the command of communist party member so they don't do anything for now. If ever the threats concretize I believe there will be some dissidents in the army offices who wouldn't let things loose. Hope this never happens but from this gang we can expect the worst... Thanks for your concern I became a so called prepper to learn how to cope with thing and be prepared for them. Best regards.

[perotter]

While teaching English in Prague one of my nieces met a guy from Brazil who she married a few years latter. He, of course, isn't from a poor family(dozens of aunts, uncles, cousins fly to Wisconsin every winter to visit him).

One of the very 1st things he did here with my brother-in-law was take up shooting shotgun and turkey hunting. He said it is one of better things about living here and said it is hard to do such things in Brazil even when the family has money. I've never had much time to talk to him about it as there is a bit of a family feud that I'm trying to avoid, but hope to talk to him at length this summer/fall.

FWIW. Strangely he says his favorite thing about living here is shoveling snow and only goes back to Brazil when it's summer here.

[Gun-adian]

Canadian perspective....we had mandatory registration for all firearms until the Conservative gov't trashed the long gun registry in 2011-2012. Handguns and certain scary looking (to a liberal in 1995) rifles still have to registered but regular hunting rifles and shotguns do not. That still gives us some pretty cool stuff to play with that the gov't doesn't keep track of, like Rossi Ranch Hands, Bushmasters, Tavors, CZ858's, really short pump shotguns.......

With the election of liberal prince Justin Wonderhair by all the hipster idiots that want legal weed (which hasn't happened...HA HA, SUCKERS!!!), we're not sure what's going to happen next. He's an elitist little snot living on his family's money so I doubt he has a regular joe's best interests at heart.

A lot of Canadian gun owners fell for the previous liberal gov'ts gun control B$ back in the 90's. I hope they all learned something because it looks like it's starting to show up again......

[victorfox]

Perotter like the Bible says money solves everything. You "usually" can get some good shooting if you had lots of money... Sorry have to correct myself. Last year 2015, red army made shooting harder even if you get the money. It has a lot of idiotic stuff now like gradations of shooters hunters etc in levels like I II III, meaning if you're in certain level like I you can't buy this amount of ammo or that gun etc. No semi auto rifles here (save for .30m1 and .40 sw carbines and well .22lr). You know I'd rather work in a dumpster in America than have a good middle class life here... You could get some money yes but what about your freedom to do what you want? Unfortunately for me, guns are my passion, I don't care about sports, forgot how to play the guitar, hate traveling (an exception would be 3 places I must go before I die -- America, Israel and the CZ factory at Czech republic - I have a strong weak spot for their guns...).

[victorfox]

Gunadian a lot of ducks here fell to the voluntary confiscations that started in 1997 then came full size in 2002. I regret selling my shotgun (old Rossi 32ga) at that time to the same guy that sold her to me (because the papers were in his name), but I kept the other stuff and bought more. Here the talk is "don't react" (in case of being attacked) and "disarm yourself so the life goes on". Yeah all right. Canada seems ok if it is like you say, not perfect but gives you much more than we ever had. I think it's a cultural problem here. In times of monarchy the King of Portugal had laws with death penalty for those engaged in the firearm making. Then until about 1932 the people could import whatever they pleased like 7mm mauser, lugers 9mm, Remingtons, winchesters, colt and s&w in whatever caliber they wanted as well as having their reloading stuff (have no official account of this). But then again a fascist regime was fought against by the armed people and since then the govt gave all the powers to the army to regulate firearms here so we never can theoretically fight back.

[MT Chambers]

Everyone from elsewhere like myself in Kanada, can watch what folks do in the USA after November, maybe it'll spread and we'll find our cahonnies.

[victorfox]

MT, Next year we'll have presidential elections with or without the impeachment of the current terrori... Mean prez. There is a congressman named Jair Bolsonaro we expect him to win though it's a hard battle against the leftists. He's all against gun control he also has three son who are involved in politics. Some days ago one of them who got a cc permit was involved in a defensive shooting and that was even better for the work against gun control. They are the few politicians who travelled all the country on meetings for th approval of the new permissive law and Bolsonaro promised to try his best to let us have rifles and all the means of self defense. His style is kind of trump s but he's not that crazy. Once he said "buy your guns. You ask me how since the law doesn't allow? I say buy your guns your family is worth a lot more than a leftist piece of paper". He's also all against these communists and I also one of the few who has the guts to fight them in discourses I the congress and we see him trying the best against the worst deeds and laws they want to pass. I think he deserves a chance to prove himself worth of our trust.