Revolver for wife with lighter trigger pull

[arthury]

My wife and I were just discussing about her carry gun and she just realized that she cannot complete the DA pull of a Ruger SP-101.

Is the DA trigger pull of a S&W M60 snubby by or a 642 lighter than the SP-101?
Can anyone verify that for me, please?

[Artful]

You can have your SP101 adjusted by a gunsmith to a lighter double action pull.

As to other guns, it will depend upon each individual gun.

Often times it is just a change of springs.
http://www.brownells.com/handgun-parts/trigger-group-parts/performance-enhancing-kits/17113-ruger-sp-101-kit-prod16531.aspx

Gives Smoother, Lighter Trigger PullContains (1) 9 lb., (1) 10 lb., and (1) 12 lb. reduced power hammer spring for tailoring trigger pull.Includes (1) 8 lb. reduced power trigger return spring. Does not fit SP101 .22 manufacturered during & after 2011

[dubber123]

The spring change will be the easiest and cheapest route. I'm sure you know you will need to do a lot of shooting after to verify reliability, as lighter mainsprings are notorious for causing light primer strikes and misfires. If you run into trouble, you may get reliability back by switching to Federal primers, which are the easiest to ignite. There are a lot of competition tuned revolvers that will only function with Federals, I had one. Good luck.

[Virginia John]

Just shoot single action. I don't like the DA pull either, so I shoot single action. Cock it first,

[Rustyleee]

Have her try a Ruger LCR.

[leftiye]

Rule of thumb - if a gun will fire 20 consecutive primed cases, it is probably good to go. There are several spring kits out there for S&W revolters which have reduced springs, both a lightened hammer spring and several lightened trigger return springs. These can be relied upon to not be too light weight. If the triggers that come with Rugers came on smiths, there wouldn't be any Smiths anymore. Many Smith people don't own any Rugers (maybe a single action).

[Walkingwolf]

My wife and I were just discussing about her carry gun and she just realized that she cannot complete the DA pull of a Ruger SP-101.

Is the DA trigger pull of a S&W M60 snubby by or a 642 lighter than the SP-101?
Can anyone verify that for me, please?

What do you mean by complete? The pull on a quality gun does not get significant heavier as the trigger is pulled. In some cases the pull actually gets lighter. It sounds like medical issues in the hand, at some point you may have to revisit a revolver as a choice. Maybe switching to a compact SA semi auto might be the move to make.

[shooting on a shoestring]

I've been in the same spot. My wife couldn't run SP101 nor Model 60. The first answer was a Police Positve Special. It felt like a harder pull to me, but she could run it fine. Maybe it's the different grip geometry that worked for her. Then she found her favorite was an old I-Frame. It's not my choice but she shoots it well and loaded with 6 wadcutters that run nearly 800 fps, the 32 S&W is her best answer.

I think it's a combination of trigger pull weight, length and geometry. its like shoes. Got to find what fits.

[Petrol & Powder]

Rugers are notorious for excessively heavy springs. You can drop the spring weights on the hammer spring and the trigger returned a bit on the SP101 and still have a gun that functions 100%. That is the cheapest route. If my memory serves (and sometimes it doesn't) 10 pounds is the floor for the hammer spring and below that you will get failures to fire. The trigger return spring can be reduced a bit as well. I think your choices are 8# (reduced power) and 10# (factory).

Ruger DA revolvers also respond very well to some careful polishing of parts and the addition of shims. Again, don't go crazy but a little bit of judicious polishing will allow a lower weight mainspring to reliably function. Cleaning up the action, shims and reduced weight springs all work together.

If she is familiar and comfortable with the SP101 (an excellent gun by the way) I would try to make that gun work for her instead of starting all over again.

TriggerShims.com are good folks to deal with.
http://triggershims.com/ruger_double_action.html

Good Luck

[nitrohog]

You might look into a 642 performance center and have her try that. My little lady can handle it fine, and it's a sharp looking gun for a j-frame.

Sent from my HTC6525LVW using Tapatalk

[str8wal]

Have her try a Ruger LCR.

I used to have an SP101, then I got an LCRx. No comparison, even with lighter springs in the SP. The only drawback is felt recoil due to the lighter weight.

[bedbugbilly]

As far as just shooting in single action - that's fine for plinking and range work - but not for a DA revolver that is carried for SD purposes. You might think you can do it . . . but put yourself under extreme stress of having to defend yourself and cocking each time, you will be lucky to get one shot off before you are toast. SD situations begin and end in seconds.

OP - you say you and your wife were discussing her carry gun and she just realized she can't complete the trigger pull in DA? I'm not being critical as perhaps you have not stated all the facts around it, but, how did she "just realize" this? Did she not try it before purchasing? And, how much has she practiced with it? If a person is going to carry then they need to practice, practice and then practice some more so that they are proficient in shooting it if the need arises without doing "collateral damage" because of not knowing their handgun and being able to use it.

A good gunsmith should be able to take a look at it and make recommendations of what can be done to lighten the DA pull. If she still has problems shooting in DA, then I'd be looking at a different handgun for her to carry for SD that she can operate and shoot well with. Many ranges have rentals that a person can try to see if they like them and can shoot them.

To carry a handgun for SD that you can't operate is useless. Pulling a handgun in SD that you can't pull the trigger on is inviting disaster as in a split second, a perp (or perps) could take it away and use it on you. I hope that you can get the hand gun so that she can operate it in DA of find one that she can operate - whether ti be a revolver or a semi-auto (which racking may be an issue for her). And when she does, routine practice with it should be a "must".

[Kraschenbirn]

...I think it's a combination of trigger pull weight, length and geometry. its like shoes. Got to find what fits.

In a DA revolver, probably more 'geometry' and balance than anything else. My wife can shoot my 3" SP101 (trigger job and Hogue grips) with no problems but prefers her '60s-vintage 4" Colt Diamondback because "it feels better".

[johniv]

Try to have the pull on the 101 adjusted, that is the (in my opinion) best way to go. Good gun, good weight, etc. The new Rugers seem to me to have better DA trigger pulls than the J frame Smiths.(ordinary 642's and 442's, not guns that have been worked on) I have both the 642 and 442 and the newer gun, the 642 has a trigger pull that I think is too heavy for a beginner or small person to manage easily.
FWIW

[Beerd]

My wife already has a hair trigger. She sure don't need anything to set her off easier. ;)
..

[Edster]

Wolfe spring kit. Did the wifes SP101 and she loves it. What a difference. I am pretty sure I ended up with the 10lb hammer spring. They also make an 11lb hammer spring, which is available as a single purchase. I get my kits thru http://triggershims.com/

[rking22]

It sounds as if you may be in the "shopping" mode, If so try an LCR, trigger is much better/lighter on those than on my SP101. LCR was designed as a DAO and most people I know who feel a J frame trigger is "too much" find the LCR "just right" . If you already hace the SP101 then look into the trigger work, forget single action on a CCW firearm, not a good plan. The SP101 triggers can be made quite good. Mine stacks notably, just haven't got roun-to-it as it's more kit gun than CCW and I don't have time to work on it, but gonna get to it soon!
Also consider the grips, if she has long fingers a bigger grip could give the geometry change needed to finish the stroke.

[gwpercle]

Factory double action triggers are not going to be great , good action jobs require hand fitting , have a pro do it. Spring swap jobs are not something I would bet my life on. A place like Clark Custom Guns charges $145.00 to do a action job on a SP101...that's not a lot considering .
They did a trigger job on a Ruger for me that is nothing short of wonderful, I sleep good knowing it was done right.
They DO NOT just swap out some springs , they do some kind of magic !
Shooting a gun with a nice action job puts a song in your heart and a smile on your face, every one should have at least one .
Gary

[Petrol & Powder]

I'm going to politely disagree with Gary just a little.
Not everyone is mechanically inclined and if you're one of those folks that isn't comfortable working on guns, by all means hire someone who is skilled. However if you are comfortable and skilled, there's no reason to be fearful. If you are skilled, paying someone else to perform the same work you can do; doesn't guarantee better results.
I sent a S&W K-frame to a very experienced gunsmith to correct a timing issue and obtain an action job. He corrected the timing problem but the action job wasn't all that special and the gun was not 100% reliable. I ended up having to rework the action to make it right. This was a well known and highly respected gunsmith.

I will openly concede there is more to an action job than a spring swap. A spring swap alone can result in big improvements but it should be done in conjunction with an action job. If done properly, the gun will be 100% reliable and it should always be thoroughly tested to verify that reliability.

If you prefer to pay for professional work then that is what you should do but paying for professional work doesn't necessarily result in better outcomes.

[foxtrotter]

I bought a Ruger LCR because The trigger pull was so nice! The 38 SPL was my choice.

[arthury]

Have her try a Ruger LCR.

Anyone know how many pounds is the trigger pull for the LCR 38sp ?

[oger]

I;m going to agree on the I frame Smith. The better half really likes them and shoots them much better, if you get the older long hammer fall and play with the action the trigger can be made extremely lite and smooth. The frame is smaller and fits most women's hands better than a J frame.

[rintinglen]

I am definitely of the opinion that a trigger job is the way to go. Most modern double action revolvers have DA trigger pulls in the 12-14 pound range. I have worked over many a Smith and a fair few Colts and find that it is almost always easy to lower the DA trigger pull by 10 - 20 percent without losing reliability. But more importantly, when done right, the action becomes smoother and less herky-jerky. A polish job, a set of shims, and a slight reduction in spring weight can make a world of difference. That is the route I would take.

[arthury]

Bought the LCRx 38SPL and the wife has no problem pulling the trigger.
In fact, she can repeatedly pull the trigger many times in a row.
Something about that frictionless cam must be working well for her.

Thanks for all of your help, folks.

[flyingrhino]

I have a 642 hammerless that I got from a lady because she couldn't pull the trigger after the 2nd or third time. It measured over 11.5#, the max I could read. I put a kit in it that reduced it to just under 9#. She still wasn't comfortable so I traded a Ruger LC9S pro for it. Granddaughter has 642 with hammer. Same issue. I got it down to about 10#. She can shoot it now. They shoot really nice, easy to conceal but they need some work to smooth them and lighten them a bit.

[robertbank]

Rugers are notorious for excessively heavy springs. You can drop the spring weights on the hammer spring and the trigger returned a bit on the SP101 and still have a gun that functions 100%. That is the cheapest route. If my memory serves (and sometimes it doesn't) 10 pounds is the floor for the hammer spring and below that you will get failures to fire. The trigger return spring can be reduced a bit as well. I think your choices are 8# (reduced power) and 10# (factory).

Ruger DA revolvers also respond very well to some careful polishing of parts and the addition of shims. Again, don't go crazy but a little bit of judicious polishing will allow a lower weight mainspring to reliably function. Cleaning up the action, shims and reduced weight springs all work together.

If she is familiar and comfortable with the SP101 (an excellent gun by the way) I would try to make that gun work for her instead of starting all over again.

TriggerShims.com are good folks to deal with.
http://triggershims.com/ruger_double_action.html

Good Luck

Good advice this.

Bob

[SweetMk]

A nice 2# trigger pull in SA,,,

http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h332/sweetmk22/guns/Dec%202013/629-3Inch_zps7373e9be.jpg

If your wife does not like it,,, you can enjoy it!! :bigsmyl2:

[arthury]

A nice 2# trigger pull in SA,,,

http://i1104.photobucket.com/albums/h332/sweetmk22/guns/Dec%202013/629-3Inch_zps7373e9be.jpg

If your wife does not like it,,, you can enjoy it!! :bigsmyl2:

beautiful gun.
i have quite a number of 44mag revolvers already.
Sometimes, I wished my sw500 4" can be my ccw gun.��

[Blackwater]

I'm with gwperkle. Get a 'smith to do it. If you've asked this question, it seems unlikely you have the skills to do a good trigger job on the gun. However, if you try it, do it the way I learned to do it, and go slow and use very fine sandpaper or stones or whatever to do the work. All you're trying to do is remover burrs and roughness, and that doesn't take anything coarser than 400 grit at the roughest. When you're learning, just reconcile yourself that it's going to take several sessions at it, and let them be your learning experience. Taking longer makes you learn more and learn better, and prevents screw-ups, which is very important on your first try. I use popsickle sticks and cut them to fit fairly snugly, and then cover with wet or dry sandpaper, and gently but firmly run them in the recesses. For the stuff you can take out of the gun, I use sandpaper on plate glass to ensure the surfaces stay smooth and flat, and again, gently rub the part over the surface, smoothing and deburring the sides. Then, on the surfaces that are perpindicular to the sides, I just gently and carefully rub the surfaces over that paper covered plate glass, and when I have all the bearing surfaces done, I polish out the holes and pins - again gently - just enough to minimize any friction that might be in play. When it gleams like that plate glass, and looks just about as smooth and flat, and you've polished the raceways inside the gun to a like finish, clean it all out very well. Carb cleaner used outside works good for this. Let it dry, and lube it well. Most like good, synthetic lubes since they don't generally tend to gum up over time like oil based lube/protectants can do, but if you clean with carb or brake cleaner regularly, oil is fine.

Then and only then do you go with the lighter springs. And the key to these is that when you lighten the trigger return spring, you ALSO need to lighten the cylinder lock or "bolt" spring," lest the lighter trigger return spring not let the trigger return fully against a too strong cylinder lock spring.

Do this, or have a good, competent 'smith do it, and you should be pleased, but there's one other thing that often affects the ladies, and that's the grips. Grips play a MUCH bigger part in our ability to use a DA revolver well than most of us want to think, but the effect is still there whether we want to deal with it or not. If she has small hands, like my daughter in law does, she'll need some smaller grips. Pachmyr probably makes some Compac grips for it, I'd think, but maybe someone can comment on that, that with the S&W's are significantly smaller, and let ladies with small hands handle it more easily and naturally. Any grip for a DA revolver needs the filler behind the trigger guard that lets the trigger finger lay naturally and effortlessly in position to make a good, straight-back trigger pull, which is so essential in any self defense revolver. Only hits count in a tight! And anything that helps us make those crucial shots is WELL worth the usually small, and almost always, one-time prices.

A well set up revolver she can really shoot, and LIKES to shoot, is a great asset, and like some of the better ladies have been described as being, are a true "pearl of great price." Luckily, the guns are MUCH cheaper than the ladies? ;^)

[olafhardt]

Some unconvential stuff I tried and it seems to work and costs nothing. Most people can coordinate their index fingers pretty well, so take a two handed grip and use both index fingers, seems to work with my guns. I have been storing my Nagant revolver with the hammer back in the cocked position. These guns are notorious for impossible da trigger pulls. After a couple of months mine seems to dropped into the usable range. On hammer guns you can often smooth the trigger by cocking it, mashing the hammer hard against a table top and pulling the trigger. Both of these methods have worked for me in the past on hammered guns.

[swmass]

I've spent some time with a few snubbies. I could never say anything bad about the j frame with a straight face.. But the LCR is just a step above in my opinion. The trigger is noticeably easier to pull than a j frame. That's compared to my 642, 442, and pin barrel model 36. It is also an easier pull than my stainless gp100. Although it's about the same as my blued GP... Can't really explain that but either way, it's worth a shot next time you're in the shop to have her try it out. The rubber grip soaks up a lot of recoil and it's the softest shooting 38 snubbie I've owned.

Edit- missed your most recent post. Glad to see you found a solution!

[arthury]

Some unconvential stuff I tried and it seems to work and costs nothing. Most people can coordinate their index fingers pretty well, so take a two handed grip and use both index fingers, seems to work with my guns. I have been storing my Nagant revolver with the hammer back in the cocked position. These guns are notorious for impossible da trigger pulls. After a couple of months mine seems to dropped into the usable range. On hammer guns you can often smooth the trigger by cocking it, mashing the hammer hard against a table top and pulling the trigger. Both of these methods have worked for me in the past on hammered guns.

That sounds simple enough.
The question is will it overly stress the spring and lower its reliability?

[arthury]

I'm with gwperkle. Get a 'smith to do it. If you've asked this question, it seems unlikely you have the skills to do a good trigger job on the gun. However, if you try it, do it the way I learned to do it, and go slow and use very fine sandpaper or stones or whatever to do the work. All you're trying to do is remover burrs and roughness, and that doesn't take anything coarser than 400 grit at the roughest. When you're learning, just reconcile yourself that it's going to take several sessions at it, and let them be your learning experience. Taking longer makes you learn more and learn better, and prevents screw-ups, which is very important on your first try. I use popsickle sticks and cut them to fit fairly snugly, and then cover with wet or dry sandpaper, and gently but firmly run them in the recesses. For the stuff you can take out of the gun, I use sandpaper on plate glass to ensure the surfaces stay smooth and flat, and again, gently rub the part over the surface, smoothing and deburring the sides. Then, on the surfaces that are perpindicular to the sides, I just gently and carefully rub the surfaces over that paper covered plate glass, and when I have all the bearing surfaces done, I polish out the holes and pins - again gently - just enough to minimize any friction that might be in play. When it gleams like that plate glass, and looks just about as smooth and flat, and you've polished the raceways inside the gun to a like finish, clean it all out very well. Carb cleaner used outside works good for this. Let it dry, and lube it well. Most like good, synthetic lubes since they don't generally tend to gum up over time like oil based lube/protectants can do, but if you clean with carb or brake cleaner regularly, oil is fine.

Then and only then do you go with the lighter springs. And the key to these is that when you lighten the trigger return spring, you ALSO need to lighten the cylinder lock or "bolt" spring," lest the lighter trigger return spring not let the trigger return fully against a too strong cylinder lock spring.

Do this, or have a good, competent 'smith do it, and you should be pleased, but there's one other thing that often affects the ladies, and that's the grips. Grips play a MUCH bigger part in our ability to use a DA revolver well than most of us want to think, but the effect is still there whether we want to deal with it or not. If she has small hands, like my daughter in law does, she'll need some smaller grips. Pachmyr probably makes some Compac grips for it, I'd think, but maybe someone can comment on that, that with the S&W's are significantly smaller, and let ladies with small hands handle it more easily and naturally. Any grip for a DA revolver needs the filler behind the trigger guard that lets the trigger finger lay naturally and effortlessly in position to make a good, straight-back trigger pull, which is so essential in any self defense revolver. Only hits count in a tight! And anything that helps us make those crucial shots is WELL worth the usually small, and almost always, one-time prices.

A well set up revolver she can really shoot, and LIKES to shoot, is a great asset, and like some of the better ladies have been described as being, are a true "pearl of great price." Luckily, the guns are MUCH cheaper than the ladies? ;^)

Thanks for the writeup. I may take this up this summer.

[MGD]

I have done mainspring replacements on 4 of my SP101s over the years. All were reliable with factory ammo and cci primers. I used Wolff spring kits. I recommend working on the mainspring strut, it is a stamped part and usually has two edges that are very rough that the spring slides over. File the edges, then stone smooth. You can't hurt anything and the factory springs can always go back in.

[rbuck351]

My wife tried every revolver SW had on their wall and the Ruger LCR was the only one she could pull without straining badly. It's trigger was noticeably lighter than any thing else we tried. I don't like it but she does and shoots it fairly well so that's her purse gun.

[Shiloh]

My wife and I were just discussing about her carry gun and she just realized that she cannot complete the DA pull of a Ruger SP-101.

Is the DA trigger pull of a S&W M60 snubby by or a 642 lighter than the SP-101?
Can anyone verify that for me, please?

There are aftermarket springs available. Got a competent gunsmith in your area?? You can change the springs or carefully stone the surfaces.
If not comfortable doing this yourself, find a smith.

This is a condition that is remedial.

SHiloh

[Scharfschuetze]

Small and concealable handguns are often the most difficult to use due to a number of factors. Perhaps some reconsideration is due regarding weapons choice for your better half if she is unable to shoot one due to strength issues. If a person does not have the strength to safely operate a particular weapon, then it is probably unsafe in their hands, particularly under times of stress. Double action shooting requires some innate strength to get right and to accurately place rounds where you want them to go. A struggle with the trigger is only an invitation to misses and poor hits.

I'd offer the option of a 380 ACP semi auto with a SA trigger, although I've read a thread or two here stating that the poster's wife couldn't pull back the slide on those due to the strong op spring required on them. Still, that's something you might try. I'm sure that the wife is worth the investment or at least a trial with one to see if she can handle it or shoot it with authority and accuracy. I recently looked at the S&W DA only semi-auto in 380 and it had a very usable DA trigger pull.

What to do? I'm not sure; but placing a weapon in someone's hand who is unable to operate it safely or reliably at all times, including a gun fight, is pretty much akin to me trying to drive a Formula One race car at the Monaco F1 race. Probably not a good idea.