April 9, 1942 Today in History WWII American Surrender

[Nose Dive]

Gents... Today, some years ago, my Dad was taken prisoner at the fall of the Philippines. The surrender was official today, in 1942.

75,000 Philippinos, Americans, Australians and allies were rounded up on the Bataan Peninsula and marched 65 miles up the peninsula with no food or water. Many died.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Bataan

http://www.history.com/topics/world-war-ii/bataan-death-march

Out of these 75K internees, only 25k were ever repatriated after Japan's surrender. Out of the those 25K heros, 25% died in hospital after the surrender.

My Mom escaped Luzon to Corregidor. She was 'flight nurse' in the 13th Wing of the US Army Air Corps. She then escaped Corregidor on a submarine, SS-190, the Spearfish, to Australia. All other ally personnel spent the next 43 months as 'guests of the Imperial Empire'.

I have written a few articles on Dad's and Mom's experience in the Philippines. I will past a small piece of one of those articles below.

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I will refer you to books on Billibid Prison, Cabanatuan Prison, Camp O’Donnell Prison, Japanese Hell Ships, Angels of the Philippines, Corregidor and Bataan Death March and the ship’s logs of USS Spearfish and the Oryoku Maru. My mom and dad are listed as credits in many of these texts as dad was in all of these prisons and ships, he was in the Bataan Death March and mom was a nurse on the Bataan peninsula and on the island of Corregidor during the conflict.

Here is the web link to the USS SPEARFISH Captain’s Log. Mom’s name is listed on page 73 of 489 of the microfilm reel, in the third War Patrol. [Original page number -17- of War Patrol 3] I can’t remember, but I believe, in one report in this microfilm reel from the Pacific Theater operations center that was sent back down the chain of command, a rubber stamped signature caught my attention. It was remarkable feed back to the submarine commanders from their commander and it startled me at its stark, clear, aggressive tone. It was stamped W.F. Halsey. [note: W. F. “Bull” Halsey was later to be named Fleet Commander, South Pacific]
http://issuu.com/hnsa/docs/ss-190_spearfish?mode=a_p
One last note on Dad’s experience aboard the Oryoku Maru (sunk by American forces as he described in a post war letter to Mom) which I believe shows the brilliance of my mother’s mother, Granny Wilson and my Dad. Soon after Mom had gotten word to Granny the she was not ‘MISSING IN ACTION, PRESUMED DEAD’ as the US Army had reported to Granny, Mom told Granny about Dad and asked if there was any word state side about the internees. Certainly, there had been none, but Granny now had a contact to write to in a vain attempt at obtaining any information about Dad to be passed along to Mom. Mom was still in Australia. My Grandmother (Agnes XXXXX) had indeed gotten word via the RED CROSS that Dad was alive and ‘Well’ in Billibid Prison in the Philippines. (Internees were dying at a rate of 500 aday at Billibid) Granny “Ag” had sent information to Granny Wilson as to how best to get ‘Christmas Gifts’ to the internees. I cannot understand the dilemma both women shared. What do you send to men who are Japanese Prisoners of War? Granny Wilson’s answer was as swift and as shrewd as the east Texas farm girl she was. The gift was to be a bottle of vitamins. Unbelievably, at Billibid Prison in the Philippines the bottle of vitamins made it to him. Dad took ½ of one tablet, shared the other ½ with his buddy GAMBLE, (also from New Mexico) and the rest of the vitamins went quickly to the camp hospital. Dad however, saved the bottle and amazingly, this little bottle would later help save his life. Dad’s buddy, Gamble, John D., didn’t make it back to US soil. You can see his name engraved in stone, along with Dad’s, on the Bataan Memorial in Santa Fe, New Mexico.

Once aboard the Oryoku Maru and at anchor in Manila Bay, (see Dad’s explanation of the ship), Dad positioned himself close to the hold in an attempt to get air. The ship had been used to transport horses and was not cleaned. This was a precarious place to be as the Japanese soldiers would remove the cover and fire their weapons down into the hold of the ship to quiet the men screaming for water and air. Once quieted down and at anchor, he looked down in the hold and saw the bamboo container, two decks down where the water was kept. He removed shoe strings from dead comrades and fashioned a fishing line. At the end of the line, he tied the empty little vitamin bottle and sat by the hold all night dipping water out of the tub and fished it back to his lap where he had a canteen cup. In 8 hours he dipped enough water to fill the canteen cup ½ full of the brackish water and this he shared with this buddy, Gamble, from New Mexico. That night was a rather rough night in Manila bay. As both men attempted to sleep on the hot, horse manure covered steel floor of the deck, his buddy kept rolling with the waves onto Dad and Dad would gently roll him off. The next morning, when the Japanese opened the cover of the hold and Dad’s eyes adjusted to the light, he realized his buddy (Gamble) was dead. Each morning aboard the ship, before the day’s rations were sent down via the ship’s crane, they would lower a flat platform at the end of the crane’s cable. It went to the bottom hold cargo way then would come up to the next stopping at each deck for a few minutes so the living prisoners could fill the platform with the dead so they could be removed from the hold. When the platform was full or it made its way to the top deck, the platform was raised above the ship’s side rail, swung out over board and dumped into the sea. A Japanese style ‘burial at sea’ for the deceased Americans. At first light, when the platform came to the deck where Dad had sat dipping water the previous night, Dad loaded John D. Gamble, onto the platform and said goodbye to his friend of over 20 years and then watched as the platform was lifted up and out of the ships hold. Once the ship was moved to Subic Bay and while on the voyage to Japan, the Japanese no longer allowed the removal of the dead Americans. Simply, they had no means of disposal other than dumping them in the sea. And, they thought this dangerous as an astute allied submarine captain could merely follow the trail of dead bodies to the ship. (see Dad’s explanation of this.) So, during the entire voyage, they had to pile the bodies up in the hold while they decomposed. Also, please note the day’s rations for the men in the hold was a handful of uncooked rice and a handful of brown sugar. No water was rationed.
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I wish to ask all on the forum to remember this November to vote for the candidate of your choice. Don't forget.

Our nation is facing many serious problems and I believe, by your vote, we can elect a team of leaders who believe America's defense should be more than a soliloquy of harsh language, rude innuendos and some stern finger pointing.

God bless all who have suffered and died, God Bless all who have served, God bless all of you and God Bless America.

Nose Dive.

Cheap, Fast, Good. Kindly pick two.

[DougGuy]

Great account of their time spent in the late great hate. I had an uncle who was a death march survivor.

Is it is the movie "Empire Of The Sun" that shows a lot of these camps as well? I know I watched a good movie about this and I think that was it, could be mistaken.

[WILCO]

Thanks Nose Dive. Sobering report.

USS Spearfish:

http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/ships/img/SS/SS-190_Spearfish.gif

http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/USN/ships/SS/SS-190_Spearfish.html

[WILCO]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/USS_Spearfish_(SS-190)

[Artful]

Thanks for post - both of you.

[Bamban]

Thank you for the write up. A friend sent me the link, after reading thread I thought I would register and add a comment.

My Dad was with the 26th Cavalry. The 26th along with the Light Tank Battalion from OH-PA area were tasked to meet the Japanese head on after they landed in Lingayen Gulf. As the rest of the US-Fil forces consolidated their forces on Bataan and Corregidor, the heavily outnumbered 26th and the Light Tank Units engaged the Japanese in a holding pattern pitch battles along the way till they finally made it to Bataan. They blew up every bridges along the way to further delay the advancing Japanese forces . The 26th was pretty decimated when they made it, only to be directed to give up their horses to the Quartermaster. My Dad said they came very close in a shoot out when ordered to give up their horses to be slaughtered. The Cavalrymen minus their horses fought till the fall of Bataan.

The old man endured the Bataan Death March and concentration despite his only brother-in-law, who was wounded, was slung on his shoulder. He didn't dare let his BIL drop to the ground. The consequence was a bayonet to the back. OP, just like your Dad, mine nursed his BIL in the camp, only to see him die on his arm and went on the burial detail. Though Dad was in excellent shape before the war, the Camp O'Donnell concentration camp took its toll on him. He recovered from Malaria, dysentery, and other ailments, and joined the liberation army soon after they landed in Lingayen Gulf. Along with his surviving buddies they were offered direct enlistment in the US Army and eventually their US citizenship after passing the tests. He came to US in 48 only to see himself back in Asia to fight another war. He came home the Winter of 51. I am a Korean War baby, born in 52.

FYI, little known facts; the last Cavalry charge in the US Army was by the 26th Cavalry, the 26th had M1 Garand when the war broke out. Dad mentioned that they had a few months to familiarize with their new weapons and qualify with them.

The trusty M1 Garand served him well in 2 Wars.

[Handloader109]

Thank you Nosedive. Great post, my dad was in Europe late in the war, my uncle was in the Pacific theater for a number of invasions.... Philippines was one. Yes, vote for the right candidate this fall, what we now have has been a disgrace the the office. God bless the few that at remain from the war.

[OS OK]

Great post! Read a book years back about one of the Lieutenants in that Cavalry group that refused to surrender. Instead he headed for the mountain ridge to fight as a guerrilla, held out until McArthur returned and joined with him. Incredible effort and local support, he really gummed up the Japs plans over and over. Japs made a huge effort to track him and his band. Heroes one and all. Fascinating read, wish I could remember the title.

Also…didn't R.E.Lee surrender on April 9'th also?

OS OK

[MrWolf]

Wow, great posts. Thanks, it was very interesting and extremely important we all vote if we are going to make any changes.

[w5pv]

This for my HEROES "Thanks for all.If it wasn't for them we would be speaking Japanese or German today.

[Bamban]

ON OK,

That LT was LT Ramsey from OK, he was the one who led the last Cavalry charge. He did head to the mountains along with Captain Barker, my Dad's CO. Capt. Barker was on an intelligence gathering mission in Manila disguised as a European priest when he was outed by some Filipino traitors. He was captured, tortured, and eventually beheaded by the Japanese, but never gave them any information about the guerrilla infrastructure and operations.

The only thing I heard from Dad, after the war him and his buddies went hunting for the traitors and he said, Captain Barker would have been proud. Dad said, after fighting the Japanese and in Korea, he honestly believe that Captain Barker was one of the bravest man he ever fought with.

[dogmower]

and people 2nd guess and criticize Truman's decision to drop the Bombs. he saved an estimated 250 THOUSAND American casualties by avoiding the invasion of mainland Japan.
would have taken me about 30 seconds to decide, too.
kids aren't being taught history anymore, but revisionist drivel created by liberal idiots who want to re-write history to suit their own political gains.
anyone who is a parent, especially whose kids attend public schools, needs to teach them what REALLY happened. the average American today has NO idea what sacrifice our soldiers went through, what sacrifices this entire country made so that others could be free. it's sad, really, because WE are at fault. WE have failed to tell our progeny what actually occurred.
as Orwell noted, history can be written anyway needed, if memory and legacy are allowed to lapse.

[OS OK]

OS OK,

That LT was LT Ramsey from OK, he was the one who led the last Cavalry charge. He did head to the mountains along with Captain Barker, my Dad's CO. Capt. Barker was on an intelligence gathering mission in Manila disguised as a European priest when he was outed by some Filipino traitors. He was captured, tortured, and eventually beheaded by the Japanese, but never gave them any information about the guerrilla infrastructure and operations.

The only thing I heard from Dad, after the war him and his buddies went hunting for the traitors and he said, Captain Barker would have been proud. Dad said, after fighting the Japanese and in Korea, he honestly believe that Captain Barker was one of the bravest man he ever fought with.

Thanks I knew it was a common name but couldn't remember. That book was a corker…just couldn't put it down.

[Blackwater]

Thank you, Nose Dive, for a moving account of your Mom and Dad's experiences. I can't help but wonder today how many people could or would even WANT to survive what so many in that war did. That they went on to become the great people they were is a testament to their bravery, courage, determination and faith. Those folks will always be my heroes. They became my heroes when I was about 3, and they will remain so for all eternity. I miss those folks so very, very much! I don't think I know a single WWII vet now. All I know have joined their comrads in arms who fell and never got to make it back home to see their families and friends. Truly, an awesome and spectacular generation of Americans!

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Thank you, Nose Dive, for your work to preserve this time in history. As a high school student in the late 1950s I was introduced to a Bataan Death March Survivor named Henry Bohn. He related that he was shipped to Japan as forced labor in one of the ships you have described. A handful of rice per day was what he described the diet as being, and said that the ship was carrying a load of maraschino cherries, and stealing a few every now and then was all that kept many on that boat alive. After the war he couldn't look at a maraschino cherry, whether in a cocktail or on a desert. He was one of those who was extremely emaciated when the war ended, and was still pretty skinny when I met him. He died in the early 1960s.

[Nose Dive]

Bamban...sir...I am in San Antonio...nest time in Austin...let's connect. Dad was in 111th Coast Artillery.... Units from New Mexico..

Let me see...give me a few minutes....let me see if I can find some prose I wrote about Dad's input on his liberation after the Japan surrender....

They were 'farming' cockroaches from latrines to boil in sea water to make 'porridge' in North Korea when he was liberated..... Dandilions, snakes, frogs, snails...anything from work details to put in the pot to eat....

I wrote this below for the San Antonio paper.... it was not published.... but...this was after the Fort Hood attack....

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As you will read in the letter, Dad was wounded when the US airplanes sunk the Oryoku Maru. He and about 2,000 US prisoners were aboard. In his letter he will tell you how many of them actually completed the trip to Japan. During this attack he had bomb and deck fragments go through his left hand and lodge in his left cheek just under his left eye. He died with American bullet shrapnel in his face. Thus wounded he had to swim in the sea back to the beach while dodging rifle rounds being shot at them from the Japanese soldiers on the beach. The Japanese thought the men were trying to escape capture instead of trying to escape a sinking ship. I can remember years later while Dad would drive his 4 offspring to sporting events or church, he would grip the car’s steering wheel with his left hand. And, you could clearly see the outline of the three knuckles remaining as the forth knuckle had been blown away by American war planes. These injuries almost cost him his life. Once in Japan, with the arm fully infected and full of puss, he could not bend his elbow or move his fingers. The arm merely stuck out as ‘stiff branch’ at a 30 degree angle form his body. Still, being in this condition, everyday he would volunteer for tree cutting duty outside the camp’s walls. He did so as the tree cutting detail would get back to camp and report for head counts later than any other prison work detail. This was very important. This meant that the soup that was prepared from ‘food items’ (see above) as gathered by the men in the camp would be almost gone and the soup portions saved for the tree cutters was ‘the bottom of the pot’ and this contained more of the ‘solids’ from the soup. Also, the tree cutters brought back more snakes, bugs, leaves and grass to put in the pot. To be ‘approved’ for the detail, the soldiers had to march in front of a Japanese Lieutenant and the American doctor. Either men could force a volunteer to fall out of line and not be allowed to go outside the wire. The Japanese Captain could care less who went. The American doctor was a bit more selective and one day seeing Dad walk with his arm stuck out, told Dad to fall out. Undeterred, Dad simply went to the end of the line and started out again. Again, as he passed in front of the American doctor, the Doctor once again told Dad to fall out and report to the “dispensary”. Dad did so.

The dispensary was a grass enclosure where what medical equipment the men made was kept. Scalpels were sharp bamboo shards that were dipped in hot sea water prior to use. Upon reporting, the doctor asked three corps men to hold Dad. He objected and told the doctor he would not fight or pull back from treatment. The doctor told Dad that it was not to restrain him from flinching from pain but to hold him up so when he fainted so he would not fall and injure himself even more. Now agreeing, the three men held Dad by the underarms. The physician took the bamboo scalpel, ‘sterilized’ it in hot sea water and took Dad’s hand in his. He told him that he should remove the middle finger but would leave the final decision on the finger for later. He incised Dad’s wrist and made a cut that went down the back of his hand, around the missing knuckle, up through and around the middle of the palm on the other side of the hand and back up to the wrist. Being thus opened, the doctor clasped Dad’s arm with both his hands under his armpit and squeezed it tightly, then he ‘milked’ the poison out of Dad’s arm down and out through the incision. The doctor did this several times. Yes, Dad fainted and was taken to the infirmary and laid down on one of the grass mats. When he came to, he could move his arm and hand. This saved Dad’s arm, hand, middle finger and assuredly, his life. This physician saved many men’s life’s and limbs over his three and one half year term as a Prison Camp Doctor. He died of malaria 4 months before the 90 year old Japanese Commandant of the camp turned over his sword and surrendered the camp to the ranking allied officer after Japan’s surrender. The Japanese Commandant, as ordered, told the ranking allied officer where he could find the white paint needed to paint the letters “POW” on the roofs of the buildings of the camp, then retired to his office and committed hari-kari. The white letters were to assist allied pilots in locating the POW camps so as to accelerate the relief efforts to the ex-prisoners. The pilots would air drop food stuffs to the men as really, there were none to be obtained outside the confines of the camp, save that one old caribou.

I forget how I learned of this incident from Dad. I really can’t remember. But, after the surrender the men started to receive radio messages and then ‘fly by’s’ from US airplanes. Basically they were told to stay put and make do until relief forces could make it to them. Shortly after painting the white “POW” letters on the roofs of their huts, they began to see US planes do low fly bys and ‘wiggle’ their wings at the men in acknowledgement of their being located by allied forces. Dad remembered the glee in seeing the first us airplane in 4 years. The prisoners were amazed at their designs and speed. The final camp he was in was in North Korea by the sea. They were mining coal for the Japanese plants in Japan and they would dig and load the coal onto rail road carts and then push them down to the beach where the coal ships would pick up the coal and take it to Japan. Upon liberation, and seeing US relief planes, the men made larger POW letters on the beach. This was to enhance the fly bys and the dropping of food to the men. Their first drop of food was almost fatal. The men were on the beach fishing when a large US plane flew over and banked. It turned and made a lower pass over the beach and wagged its wings, banked again and made another pass over the men on the beach. They looked up and saw relief packages floating down to them. Chaos erupted on the beach as each man began to trail a package down through the sky in an attempt to be the first to catch one and enjoy its contents. The little dots in the sky became larger and larger as they descended. Finally, upon seeing what was going on, Dad yelled for the men to take cover immediately. They all dove under the coal rail cars just in time to have the “packages’ hit the beach. The ‘packages’ were 55 gallon drums full of peaches. Twenty of them. It would have been a sad testament to live through 42 months of Japanese captivity only to be killed by 55 gallon drum of fruit dropped from the sky. The men ate until they could not walk, literally. That night, they slept on the beach to guard the drums from being stolen as they were too weak to move them. All the men had to sleep standing up as when they laid down, they could not breathe.

Today, as I pen this note to you all, we have thirteen new, male and female, heroic soldiers that have given their lives for our freedom at Fort Hood, Texas. Thirteen new heroes resting deep in the loving soil of our Mother State of Texas.

Please remember these fallen heroes, and when you can, assist and support those who remain alive in service to us and to our freedom as we know it in American today.

May God bless and protect each of them.
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OK guys.... have more stuff to offer but... will do so on May 1 when Mom escaped on the SPEARFISH... Once liberated...Dad spent 5 years in hospital in San Francisco. He went AWOL many times chasing my Mom around the USA. He was still protected under standing orders from General MacArthur that no disciplinary action will be executed to any soldier under his command without his personal approval to proceed.

Nose Dive

Cheap, Fast, Good. Kindly pick two.


PS: If you wish to see the class of submarine my Mom escaped from the Japanese...You can! One is on display and you can tour it at SEAWOLF PARK in Galveston Texas. It too is a SARGO class sub as was the SPEARFISH.... ND

[gunoil]

Dad will be 90 December, he served in the Philipines. Army.

[Nose Dive]

gunoil.... God bless the 90 year old hero. Dad died in 1976. Rickets, beriberi, yellow fever, jaundice, amoebic dysentery, malaria, chronic bowl degeneration, decalsified bones....it all took its toll. And this is all before the US ARMY recognized post traumatic stress. He stayed in the Army...thank God... General MacArthur's standing orders protected him through out the rest of his tenure.

Nose Dive

Cheap, Fast, Good. Kindly pick two.

[Nose Dive]

Guys...BADWATER BILL asked if any of my Mom's compatriot nurses who did not escape survive the Philippine ordeal after capture... here is my answer...

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yes...the women did survive too.
Badwater... Oh YES!!! Mom's unit was ordered off and many others who were nurses who were inturned survived. Verna Ivley comes to my mind...now deceased....she was one of Mom's friends who didn't make it to the beach with Mom and her unit at Bataan when Mom decided it was too 'hot' on the Luzon and she took all down to the peninsula. When the soldiers saw them walking down the dirt road, the grabbed them and put them on a truck and ran them to the beach. Mom 'ordered' the guys to take the truck back and leave them. Two protested and Mom 'pulled rank' and made them leave. Mom got the 13 nurses on a 'raft' on a stream near the beach, while under fire, and it 'flowed' out into the bay.....no oars...just floating in the bay...'girls kicking in the water'.....could have just floated out into the Pacific and all hands lost...but GOD intervened and a Philippine 'junk' saw them...tied on to the 'raft' and towed them to the Island 'Fortress' of Corregidor, where MacArthur was, and they worked there in the Mylattan tunnel until May 1. May 1, she was 'ordered' to gather her nurses and one 'hand bag' per person and report to the mouth of the tunnel. She objected but the ranking Doctor reinforced the order and she complied. All 13 and one corpsman got in a 'jeep'..truck thing...and drove down a ditch to the dock..got on a wooden boat and motored out into the bay....no lights...in the bay...'frogmen' gave a lighted signal...they responded...again came under fire from the Japanese on Bataan...all transfered safely to a 'flat'....and the 'frogmen' took them to a point in the bay....the SPEARFISH surfaced, under fire....took on all from the flat, and re-submerged. Captain went right to the bottom of the bay...ordered 'silence' and stayed there for 23 hours...the old Upshur County 'POSSUM' trick....after that...he came to transport/periscope depth, looked around a bit and then motored out of the bay unscathed. They 'stayed' over the diesel engines,,,had one 5 gallon bucket of water per day for all 13, (to drink, clean, bath, wash, survive..for 3 or 4 weeks while moving through enemy held waters) and made it back to Australia. They ran submerged during the day...surface at night to recharge batteries. No...no one allowed on deck while running hot at night. And...once at Australia... "AUSSIE WOMEN" provided 'all' clothing to all of them. They had nothing other than mirrors, hankies and .38 S&W revolvers Mom made the carry in their bags. I now have Mom's 38. One of my prize possessions.

In Galveston, you can tour the SEAWOLF submarine. It is the same SARGO class submarine as the SPEARFISH. Mom, before she died...took us on a tour of the SEAWOLF. Poor ole seamen on board were bewildered by Mom's tour.

I knew Verna very well. She lived here in SA while Mom and Dad did before they died. She 'showed' wear of her ordeal.

Nose Dive.

Cheap, Fast, Good. Kindly pick two.

[Bamban]

Nose Dive,

Absolutely, we can connect. We go down to SA often, the last time was Monday, Dad's death anniversary. We went to Fort Sam cemetery to lay some flowers. Mom share the same grave with him.

[OS OK]

Thank you Nose Dive…As I read the account it triggers something 'primal' inside, don't know any better way to describe it. Dad was on an LST in the Pacific Theatre, would never discuss anything about the war other than he drove the landing craft in the beach invasions or he ran a pom pom gun during kamikaze attacks. My buddies Dads were infantry Marine and Army and would share with us kids after we were at some magical age that they determined worthy. We listened, but at that age couldn't really visualize exactly the intricacies in what their stories told. Mostly we kids wanted to know how many of those blankety blanks they shot. No Dad ever had that answer for us…
They were truly Americas 'Greatest Generation' and it has been to my advantage to have been raised by and morally shaped by this generation. They liken to the American Pioneers, they had that something that when mixed with the Human race…really makes special individuals.

charlie

[Nose Dive]

OS OK...yea... Dad never really 'talked and reminisced' about his 4 years as a 'guest of the Imperial Army'.

It wasn't until '70 when I was at university, that i really learned anything I am now sharing with you all. Mom spoke abit, Dad was 100% silent.

When I read 'Corrigedor, Saga of a Fortress' for a Post Civil War history class did i learn their involvement. Both Mom and Dad were listed as credits for the book. I never knew. They never talked about hauling 500 Americans a day for 10 months, 7 days a week, 24 hours a day.... to a ditch to be 'buried'. Mom didn't tell me about the Spearfish,,,,about 'surturing' Americans together with communications wire....no real sutures were available. I had to 'drag' all of this out of her. I was pissed. My parents, to me, were war heros and they never told us. Mom won a DFC and 8 bronze stars. I have the DD214 to prove it.

I can count on one hand when Dad ever opened up about the war. He was usually with a few POW buddies and were drinking coffee together. Many were 'chemical dependent'...aka alcoholics. Dad was one. He managed it enough to stay dry and raise 4 'helluns'.

As to the estimates of LIVES SAVED by the bombs... "historians" and experts put the range from 250K to one million. I push on the ONE MILLION casualty number and refer all to the casualty counts at Booganville, Iwo Jima, Guadlecanal, and any other 'beach landing' where the Allies faced the Japanese. Dad said when the war ended... 'they had about 8 to ten weeks to live. His 'team' was down to 80lbs per man and mining coal in North Korea.

Again...I hate to bore you all...but here is abit I wrote for the SA papers, that too, was not published....
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My dad, of Ft. Sumner, New Mexico, earned a business degree from a college in San Diego, California and joined the New Mexico National Guard because his buddy, and soon to be brother- in-law, had joined. Plus, the extra $3 dollars a month added a tidy sum to the duos beer budget. Dad had a college degree and was able to take a correspondence school, a mail order course, to earn his commission as an officer in the US Army. His soon to be brother in-law, my Uncle Bill Carr had no such degree. Three weeks after receiving his commission, the US Army cancelled this program which was never reinstated. He beat a deadline that unknown to him at the time, played a small role in saving his life. When the clouds of war were darkening over the USA, President Roosevelt called all reservists, National Guard Units and furloughed soldiers back to active duty. My grandfather knew one of the US Army Generals in Albuquerque where Dad had been called to active duty. My grandfather was a tailor and made the generals clothes. This general, as a favor to my Granddad, hired my Dad to be his aide as Dad could take short hand dictation and use a type writer. (in another post, I will tell you all of Dad's JOB INTERVIEW with the General that won him this job) When his unit, the 200th Coast Artillery, (my memory here may be weak..211th sticks in my mind) was given orders to go to the Philippines, my Dad objected to the general that he had not received the same orders to go overseas with his buddies. The general questioned my Dad hard on this issue as the General knew the Philippines were in dire danger. If war did break out, there was no way to resupply or remove any expeditionary force that far away from American soil as the USA did not have a suitable naval task force to accomplish such a large and lengthy task. And, President Roosevelt had committed all available war stuffs to the war in Europe. The US Navy, as well as the US Army, was not ready for war. Once deployed and hostilities began, they would be completely cut off and on their own. However, my Dad won his orders to go. So, instead of spending the Second World War in the US drinking beer and training other men to be artillery soldiers, he would fall to the Japanese and be a POW 4 months later. He reported to Luzon at 220 pounds. He was weighed 4 years later in Seoul, South Korea at 85 pounds, but he claimed this was inaccurate because they had been eating peaches dropped to them in 55 gallon drums by US bombers. And, for the first time in 42 months, they had been consuming a food stuff denied to them for 42 months. They had been eating meat. Close to the prison camp was a rice field where as prisoners, the men watched an old North Korean farmer plow his rice field with the help of what my Dad called a Caribou. The starved men dreamed of barbequing the old caribou and eating it. (they had been 'farming cockroaches from latrines to boil in sea water to make 'porridge') Once liberated, and the 75 year old Japanese Camp Commandant surrendered his sword and committed Hari Kari, they immediately dispatched a detail to capture the old work horse and bring it into camp for the feast. They were still staying inside the camp as they were order to stay there as this was the safest place for the men so as to avoid any Japanese Army or Korean civilian reprisals. Unfortunately, after bringing the old caribou into the camp...no man or group of men had the strength to take an ax, strike it and kill the animal. They had to cut the animal’s jugular and let it bleed to death. Once expired, it was butchered, roasted and eaten.

It is clear to me, without the atomic bombs being dropped in Japan, the men in this camp would not have survived if the planned, conventional amphibious invasion of Japan by the allies had taken place. Simply, without the two atom bombs being dropped over Japan and the war brought to a swift end, you would not be reading this as I would not be here. Yes the bombs were horrific. ‘WAR IS HELL’. However, the lives saved by these two bombs were mostly American. Never in my life will I believe the use of the atomic bombs was ‘overkill’ of an already defeated foe. One merely needs to review the accounts of the fanaticism of the Japanese Army and civilians during the Guadalcanal, Iwo Jima and Bougainville campaigns to gain a full appreciation of how this foe could delay the liberation of the prison camps. Dad often mentioned he believed all of the POW’s had about 6 more weeks to live at best. They were given no rations, none. They were given no medical care, none. Many men lost their lives and eyes to conjunctivitis, simple pink eye. 42 months of starvation, lack of water, exposure and heavy labor had taken their toll. Well over eighty per cent of their original task force was dead and of those repatriated, 25% of those men later died in hospital. In contrast, once captured and interred by Hitler’s German Army, the WEHRMACHT, only 3% perished. You can do the math here. Dad was interred with over 40,000 US soldiers and this was a portion of the 75K total interned on Luzon.

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OK guys...enough is enough for now. Don't forget in November to vote. And never believe that 'harsh language, rude innuendo and stern finger pointing' will deter foes of the USA to rethink their conquests. Grown men, with 'bombs' in public places, killing innocent civilians is what we are facing and 'complaining and crying' about the problem will not solve it.

Nose Dive

Cheap, Fast, Good.

Kindly pick two.

[Alstep]

Thank you NoseDive & Bamban for bringing to light the horrors endured by your parents. Sacrifices like that should never be forgotten.

[woody290]

Thank You for the history. Those men and women of the "Greatest Generation" deserve much more honor than the present day folks seem to be willing to give. They preserved and protected our nation, and we need to get that nation back. Vote!

[popper]

MacArthur kept his promise even through all the carp from above.

[mexicanjoe]

Guys, my older half-brother served with the 200th Coast Artillery when it fell at Bataan.. He survived but it affected him for the rest of his life... He spoke of people like Charlie James , and Chino Ybaben from New Mexico, who were with him in that pacific hell hole. He never spoke freely of his actions, but proudly flew Old Glory every day! I hope he and Daddy are keeping up with the rest of the 'crew', just beyond the East Gate.