Now loading for 45 Colt..Questions

[lablover]

First, looking for an in expensive staring mold for my 45 Colt loading. Then again I would consider others as well. What's a good bullet design for the 45 Colt Looks like the rnfp?

Also, powders, any suggestions? I use the following powders now for pistol. Titegroup and Bullsyse. I've read unique is pretty good. I have a New Uberti 1873 single action cowboy so 14000 cup is max.

Looking for any advice you all can give me. I've held off on dies as well because I hear the carbide can be rough on the brass???

I also use a dillon 650 but plan on single stage loading at first

Joe

[Outpost75]

If you don't plan to load black powder, then you want a bullet with a crimp groove.

If your gun has fixed sights, you want a bullet close to the weight of those in factory ammo 240-260 grains.

If you might hunt with it, then you want a meplat not less than 0.6 and not more than 0.7 of bullet diameter.

If you might use the ammo in a lever-action rifle, then you probably don't want a Keith type unless you know that your rifle will feed them.

For the Uberti clones of the Colt and for lever-action rifles you want a bullet of a nose length which does not exceed the overall cartridge length of factory ammo.

The RNFP cowboy bullets work well. If you don't plan on loading jacketed bullets, the RCBS Cowboy Dies do not work the brass excessively and come with two expander plugs for either .452 or .454 bullets.

This is a traditional bullet based on the 1920 Elmer Keith design from Modern Bond, as produced by Accurate Molds which I use in my .45 Colts, I cast them from 1:30 alloy from Roto Metals and load with 6.5 grains of Bullseye. This bullet also has adequate lubricant capacity to prevent foul-out in rifles with black powder using SPG lube, if that is attractive to you.

165379

[bedbugbilly]

I use the traditional 250 ish grain RNFP from the Lyman/Ideal 454-190 mold. Personally, I use Red Dot usually with that boolit and it shoots well out of my Uberti 7 1/2" SAA Cattleman. I've been buying my Red Dot by the 8lb jug to keep the cost down and I use that in other cartridges as well.

For loading date and cast - check any of the four editions of the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook. If you don't have a copy of one of them, you need to add it to you library as they provide a wide variety of loading data for cast bullets in various design/weights for the commonly available powders.

Carbide dies are fine and they are no harder on 45 Colt than they are on any straight walled pistol casing. I have two sets of dies - a hodgepodge set - Lyman FL carbide, Lyman Expander, RCBS seating and a CH 45 ACP taper crimp if I decide to use a taper crimp - depends on what boolit I'm loading. I also have a set of the RCBS "Cowboy Dies" for the 45 which are designed for using cast. Although they will put a roll crimp on, I like to use my Lyman 310 tong tool and die to do that as I can "feel" the crimp better - enough to hole the boolit from jumping but not put a lot of stress on the case mouth.

The chambers in my Uberti Cattleman are quite generous so after the first FL sizing, I only only neck size after that - usually a tad more than the seating depth of the boolit. I started out with Star Line brass and prefer that although I do have some "range brass" of various head stamps - it all works well.

While I like the 250 gr RNFP boolit best, I also have an old Ideal mold that casts a 200 gr SWC and they work well out of the Cattleman too. I'm going to be trying some other weights - 230 gr. etc. but will probably stick to 200 gr or above for the shooting that I do.

Out of all of the pistol cartridges I re-load, the 45 Colt is by far my favorite. I don't load anywhere near max. as I don't see the need nor do I want to in the Cattleman. If I decided that I wanted to load hotter, I'd be looking at a BH. All I do is tumble lube my boolits in alox/paste wax for smokeless loads. For BP, I use the same BP lube I've been using for 50 + years and just smear it in the lube grooves before I seat the boolit.

The 45 Colt will also chamber and shoot the 45 Schofield which is a shorter casing. I have several hundred Star Line casings to play with just for the "history" of that cartridge.

There has been much written on here about 45 Colt. Do a search "45 Colt" and you should find quite a few threads/posts - some with "pet loads". You should be able to find quite a bit on the 45 Colt.

Good luck and have fun!

[lablover]

Awesome info, I may get the RCBS Carbide then. I'm used to taper crimping my pistol ammo but I only load 9mm and 45 acp right now. Is the 45 colt usually use a Roll Crimp?

I found 200 pcs of Starline brass so I better go snatch it up. I will also read up on "neck Sizing" for the 45 colt. Got some 45-45-10 on the way from white label lube as well.

I cast 45 acp 200 gr SWC now so I may give them a try as well..From what I understand some do that.

Time to tear up the search feature again :)

[Outpost75]

The standard RCBS carbide dies work the brass too much and size cases enough to hold a jacketed bullet, and cases will not last as long. The COWBOY die sets do not work the brass as much. The Cowboy dies come in a BROWN box, not in a green box.

If you want a lighter bullet this one will do the job for you and fits within standard overall length in .45 Colt brass.

165386

Most of the 200-gr. SWCs for .45 ACP have too long a nose and must be deep seated and crimped over the shoulder.

[BoolitBill]

If you want inexpensive, then look at this one:http://www.midwayusa.com/product/775664/lee-2-cavity-bullet-mold-452-255-rf-45-acp-45-auto-rim-45-colt-long-colt-452-diameter-255-grain-flat-nose

[Flinchrock]

Lyman 452664 is an outstanding boolit for std. to med. loads in my Henry and Winchester '92.
It also has a generous lube groove, and SPG works well for me.

[lablover]

Lyman 452664 is an outstanding boolit for std. to med. loads in my Henry and Winchester '92.
It also has a generous lube groove, and SPG works well for me.

I need to get that ordered, I broke the cardinal rule and bought some Hornady XTP 250's to load up so I could shoot this beast!

Does anyone know if the NOE handles will work on this mold?

[Wolfer]

I think most people like me find the Lee 452-255 RF to be a very accurate boolit in 45 colt. I get a little better performance on game with the 452-424 and small HP but the end result as distance traveled after the shot is about the same.

I just got the NOE version of that mold. In the two guns I've shot them in they're more accurate than the Lyman but no more accurate than the Lee. Possibly not as accurate. I wanted the cup type HP that comes with the RG molds.

[lablover]

I think most people like me find the Lee 452-255 RF to be a very accurate boolit in 45 colt. I get a little better performance on game with the 452-424 and small HP but the end result as distance traveled after the shot is about the same.

I just got the NOE version of that mold. In the two guns I've shot them in they're more accurate than the Lyman but no more accurate than the Lee. Possibly not as accurate. I wanted the cup type HP that comes with the RG molds.

The NOE is not in stock and he's not taking back orders...Drats. so the 452-255rf is accurate as the noe?

[Wolfer]

I believe it's as or more accurate. But I may not have over 50 to 100 down range.

My accuracy testing is a method I learned from Elmer Keith. I pick out a rock on yonder hillside and trying my best to take the same sight setting I see how close my shots all land to each other. We can blame it on my old eyes but the fact is Im not a very good long range pistol shot. However if one boolit lands all of them in a 2' circle while another needs a 10' circle I consider the first to be more accurate.
The Lee 255 RF is the most accurate 45 cal boolit I have in my guns. I'm not sure how many 45 cal molds I have but its a good selection.

[NC_JEFF]

I use Unique in my 45 Colt loads and have been very pleased with accuracy, I don't load very far past starting pressures. Unique gives me a better fill in the case than the faster powders

[spfd1903]

I started with the 2 cavity 452-255-RF and cast and shot hundreds of boolits of normal pressure loads through a Ruger NM Vaquero, and used the same boolit for higher pressure loads in the Blackhawk. Been happy with the accuracy after finding the right powder/load combination. I have had a six cavity for a few years now.

[Blammer]

this one looks like a decent one. :)

http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/product_info.php?cPath=41_161&products_id=747

[lablover]

this one looks like a decent one. :)

http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/product_info.php?cPath=41_161&products_id=747

.454 dia. Looking for more of the .452 mold I think. I need to slug the barrel to make sure. Loading the Unique pretty lite I think right now. 7.1 gr of unique with 255 gr bullet. I will say the Unique sure throws a flame ball out the front and sides.

I guess I could buy the .454 and size down with my .452 die

[hornetguy]

I've never heard of carbide dies being harder on the brass than regular steel dies... Where did you get the data on that?

[smokeywolf]

I've never found a better bullet than the Ideal/Lyman 454190 or a better powder to propel that bullet (sorry boolit) than Unique for 45 LC.

[Wolfer]

My NOE 454-255-RF drops at .455x.4555 in both cavities. I size to .452 very easly.

[lablover]

Got two lee molds on the way the 452-255-RF as well as the 452-200-RF. Heck, at that price I had to

[Ken in Iowa]

I've never heard of carbide dies being harder on the brass than regular steel dies... Where did you get the data on that?
Outpost has a lot of experience with 45 Colt. I have learned a lot from him on this caliber.

The issues affecting case life in the 45 colt center on the rather generous SAAMI specs for chambers. The steel dies have a slight taper so the brass does not get worked as much as a standard carbide die.

After much study and experimentation, I settled on a Redding dual ring sizer. They aren't cheap, but work beautifully. I believe my rate of case splits reduced more than 50%. ymmv

Another factor to consider is boolit diameter. Those generous chambers have fat throats in our family's rifles and pistols, so I standardized on .454 boolits. An NOE M type expander for the fatter boolits works fine.

[retread]

I use a RCBS 200 gr. SWC for plinking and the Lee 452-255 RF for serious things. Both work well with a range of powders.

[DougGuy]

Figure out if a .452" bullet will slide into your cylinder throats from the front. If not, then plan on getting the cylinder throats reamed & lapped to .4525" so you can size to .452." Some Ubertis have modern throats and some have old style which are much larger.

Either way you want a light drag fit in the throats so learning what size throats you have would be one of the first things you want to know, even before you order your first mold because if you have the larger throats, you will need a mold that drops large enough for a good fit in the throats and hopefully large enough that you can size the boolit because they come through the sizing die a LOT more round than "as dropped" and would probably shoot better as well.

[lablover]

Sized some up and they take a little nudge and go thru the throats.....Awesome! .452 BTW

[rexherring]

I have carbide dies and have reloaded my brass over 30 times with no problems. Unless you have an exceptionally over sized chamber on your gun, there shouldn't be a problem. Starline brass is pretty tough as well as Federal brass in .45 Colt, stronger and heavier than Win. or Rem. brass in my loadings. If the mouth starts to crack on older brass, I anneal it because it can start getting brittle.

[DougGuy]

200gr in any style is pretty light for the .45 Colt, although it can be done. Lee 255 RF is a good one, and the 454190 is a really good rounded nose style. For most shooting, the common mistake is to use too hard an alloy and I used to get leading from this and too hard a lube will really make things a mess. I found from experience that the Ruger rifling and twist rate really takes to 50/50+2% and soft lube like Felix. If you can scratch it with a thumbnail, and your lube is soft, you have perfect alloy for 900 ~ 1200fps from a Ruger revolver. It's just a good combo that the barrel likes and you won't even have to clean it.

Carbide dies damaging cases? Really? That would be a new one on me and I have been at this quite some years and never used anything but carbide sizers.

Another near perfect match that you can accomplish with the Ruger SA, is to have the forcing cone cut and cleaned up on 11° since many barrels leave the factory with nothing more than a random collection of tool marks arranged in an orbital fashion in front of the cylinder. Bleh... After this is done, you will have the perfect setup for using RF boolits, boolits with a smooth rounded ojive that goes from the meplat into the bearing surface of the sides without a driving band like a LSWC or Keith type boolit. Keith boolits are accurate, but when that driving band hits the forcing cone half the front of the boolit can be wiped away and slumped down the sides when it entes the bore. With the RF boolit design, there is less converging angle and the surfaces of the boolit and forcing cone are much more parallel and the transition is much smoother resulting in a lot less wiping of the boolit. This is a perfect match IMO... I use the RF style boolits 80% of the time. LSWC has it's place, I just found RF works much better in my Rugers so I use that style.

[cherokeetracker]

ON the powders try Winchester Super Target WST 6.0 grains with your 200 grain bullet is a nice, usually accurate, load. As you mentioned in the first post, Unique has always been pretty good in the 45 Colt. With it I suggest 8.5 grains, and the 255 grain bullet. Good Luck