A little advice please

[uncle guns]

1st.. How do you read the numbers on Lyman molds?? ie.311240... is it bullit
diam. and weight or what?????

2nd.. can 30-06 brass be reformed to 8mm? whats involved, just size & trim or is it to much trouble???

3rd.. Looking for a good C/B load for 8mm.. M-48A Yugo.,,bullit is a lee180gr powder is imr 4895 or 3031 ( at least this is what I prefer ) but will look at all other data.

[9.3X62AL]

1) Lyman mold nomenclature, as I understand it--e.g., "#358430"--the first three digits are nominal diameter, the remaining digits are design or cherry number (I think). There is usually only one design per five- or six-digit identifier these days, but this is not always the case--and in the past the cherries were used at varying depths in a block more frequently. As an example, Lyman #358242 has two "weights" available--92 grains and 121 grains, enabled by deleting or adding a drive band via insertion depth of the cutter/cherry.

2) I suppose 8 x 57 brass could be made by first expanding the 30-06 case mouth, then re-setting the shoulder, then trimming. With 8 x 57 brass available, I'd think long and hard about the time involved to produce these cases vs. whatever cost savings you realize by using the 30-06 brass in this way. I've done similar things (9mm Win Mag into 30 Mauser/7.62 x 25), but only because no commercially-available brass could be had. Reforming cases is an arduous task, and it's not something I would do if reasonably affordable brass was available. I'd pay Norma prices before doing it again.

3) I use the Lee 32-175 boolit A LOT in my G98/40, and it shoots very well with a variety of loads. I like 16.0-18.0 grains of 2400 myself, boolits sized to .325".

[felix]

Reforming brass can be a real hassle in most situations. There is an exception in those situations where the go-to chamber is larger than engineering specs. This happens in most as-issued military guns. The war time 8mm's fit this latter situation in most instances. So, converting 30-06 cases tg 8mm mauser cases can be accomplished quite easily. Procedure is to do one case, and make a dummy load, and see if it fits the chamber with absolutely no hangups. Use magic marker to paint the dummy load and most especially around the entire neck area. If no marks on this paint after a careful insert, lockdown, and withdraw, consider the operation a success. Make sure all cases that are reformed are the same thickness. ... felix

[StarMetal]

I'm made brass for my 8x57 out of 30-06 and I got away with just one pass thru my 8mm sizer die and trimming. Now I'll tell you what to watch for. You would think that just sizing 7x57 up to 8x57 would be simple, just run it through your 8x57 sizer die...NOPE. If you notice the 7x57 has a longer neck. If you size up the 7x57 it will have alot of headspace cause the shoulder won't contact the chamber shoulder. One solution is load your cast bullet out to engrave the rifle and this will headspace the round. Once you fire it, the shoulder will blow out to proper size if your load was hot enough.

Deputy Al

8x57 brass is availiable but it's like double the price of everything else and they only make short runs of it.

Joe

[9.3X62AL]

Joe--

Yer right, sir. Twice the cost, and I'll still pay it. :-)

[kywoodwrkr]

Uncle Guns,
Were I to form 8mm from 30-06 cases, I'd proceed in the following manner.
Obtain an 8x57mm trim die from Grafs(or other vendor) and a set of 8x57mm FL dies.
I'd then form and trim the cases using the trim die, hack saw and file.
Single step if good lube(Imperial wax) is used.
I would try the formed case first to see if by chance it will fit with out the need of the FL sizing die.
If not then FL size using the FL sizing die set.
Test fit a formed case in the rifle it is to be used in.
Fireform case using mild to regular load for the rifle.
At this juncture you can either FL resize the cases or sort of neck size only using the FL die set(back die out somewhat), or RCBS told me one time that the trim die is in essence a neck sizing die with no expander capability and a hardened trim surface. I do not know this to be a fact as I haven't tried it myself.
You will need a die for expanding the neck in this case, which I do for cast bulets anyway.
As stated 8mm brass is about $24.60/100 versus $21.65/100 for 30-06.(Rem brass) Just a little bit more. These prices do require a minimum order of $50 I believe.(Black Hills Shooters Supply) 800-289-2506
I use to make most of my 8mm and 7,65mm brass all the time from USGI brass.
It may be time consuming but that's a part of the hobby from my view point.
If you have a questions you think I might answer, post here or feel free to drop me an e-mail through the boards here-or a private message(PM).
Good luck.
DaveP

[Scrounger]

Another solution: Run the 7X57 brass through the 8X57 die; then neck the brass up to .35 caliber, then back down to 8X57. This creates a secondary shoulder on the neck which will locate the headspace. Fire with a medium load and your case should form perfectly. Do-able, but more trouble than it's worth if you can buy the brass ready to go. A couple of hundred rounds should be a lifetime supply unless you plan to re-enact all of WWII. Bonus: buy the new brass and your headstamp is correct which might save your hunt or your a** somewhere down the road...

[floodgate]

uncleguns:

Al has stated the meaning of the Lyman mould numbers correctly: the first three digits being the "size-to" diameter - which has changed over the years and fashions in sizing vs. groove diameter change - but as-cast size will also vary between moulds with the same numbers as the cherry cutter wears, and with bullet alloy and casting technique for a given mould.

The remaining one, two or three numbers give the "cherry number"; this sequence started with the old Ideal Mfg. Co. around 1896 with #308-1, and runs in chronological sequence up into the high -600's today. BUT, some cherry numbers were re-used as older mould designs wrere dropped, so we have an old #3089 and a more recent #3589, later changed to #358009 to keep Lyman's computers happy; that one has also been discontinued, so maybe we can expect another #xxx009 someday. Usually, these will have different caliber numbers, but there is one odd case: #429215 can be either an old .44 Russian gallery round-nose, or a .44 Magnum semi-wadcutter with gas-check.

You will also see a matching pair of one-, two- or three-digit numbers on BOTH blocks; that is a match number to keep the two halves of the mould (cut together in one machine) together through the fitting, finishing and packaging process. There are miscellaneous letters scatered around the blocks; these seem mostly to be machine, operator or inspection marks, but a "U-" prefix means a mould made undersized for its nominal caliber, an "-S" suffix for "small" usually means the same, but not always. And for the past two or three years, Lyman has also been stamping moulds with month / year production numbers, which will at least help future collectors.

Once you have digested all this, you have to know that they seem pretty casual about details of bullet nose, grease groove, etc., shape as worn cherries are replaced - it looks like the cherries are finished by eye - so moulds that are SUPPOSED to me the same, can actually vary a lot over the years. It sometimes seems Lyman runs their mould operation like a small 19th century job-shop, which is actually how the "Ideal" line started out in 1885.

Sorry if I have swamped you with info you don't reallly need (though you may someday), but these questions recur every few months here, and I thought I'd take a shot, again, at answering them all at once.

Doug

[bubblehead]

You guys might find this useful.

http://www.castpics.net/RandD/Lyman_moulds/Lyman_moulds.htm

[Buckshot]

...............Hey Bubblehead. :hijack: You go to the range today? I went and hung around for awile. There was only one other shooter there and Ray said he was going to close as soon as that one guy was done. El Pistolero called me and said he got there just after I left, but all the rest of the Burrito shooters pussied out again :D

BTW, the Castpics site you reference was started by a bunch of the old Shooters. com guys maybe 7-8 years ago. That mould stuff is from FLoodgate and Sundog is the webmaster.

...............Buckshot

[Wayne Smith]

Uncle Guns

If it's a shooter, not a collector, have someone run a 30-06 reamer into it. Not only do you get a better cartridge, you get a new throat. Then just size 30-06 up to 8mm in a 8mm-06 sizing die and off you go. I did 40 of them last weekend. It does go easier if you anneal the neck/shoulder just a tad. I do this in my lead pot.

[uncle guns]

Thanks to all, I now understand a little better, the .06 brass idea was just that, as I do seem to have a lot of that brass but I will just order some from Grafs in 8mm.

One last question.... I do not have a copy of the Lyman cast boolit handbook is it worth buying?......I have been casting for some time now but only for handguns, and only for plinking, and just last year started casting for rifles, I dont hunt anymore and my shooting is mostly Mil. bolt benchrest and I seem to be getting obsessed with small groups and am always looking for good C/B loads, are there any in the book?

[Bret4207]

Yes, yes, yes. Get the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook. It's the basic bible for the hobby. Scads of information and most of it true.