Copper in my alloy

[triggerhappy243]

I took one of my big ingots back into the melting pot last night. 40 pounder. remelted and did the saw dust thing 3 more times and skimmed off whatever was floating. dropped some wax in and gave it a good stirring, skimmed again. I then let it sit for an hour undisturbed. This is from an indoor range that uses a steel decelerator trap system. Anyway, I took the ingots for another xray test this afternoon. and lost 50% of the copper content that was in the lead. It dropped from 1.49 down to .84 %. 1.46 % antimony, no tin.... the balance is all pure lead. If the rest of the 775 pounds is all the same content, I think I'm set. Next would be to add just enough tin and antimony to get me some good quality alloy that is zinc free for my pistols. Shoot, I may even give rifle casting a squirt.

[jcren]

Curious why you are removing copper?

[edp2k]

Was the 1.49% copper plugging your bottom pour pot spout?

[triggerhappy243]

I ladle pour. I wanted to see if I could remove the copper and whatever else would come out. I will use it in my muzzleloader for conicals if it will be soft enough. Right now, I know straight wheel weights is too hard for muzzleloader. Guessing too much antimony.

[jcren]

Got ya. Just curious because of all the talk of copper increasing plasticity of hunting bullets.

[popper]

What was the temp of your melt? Cu combines with Pb to 0.3% when cooled - you can't get rid of it. Interesting that range scrap has any Cu in it, other than trapped minute particles - which you probably did skim off. Cu shouldn't make any difference in ML (low velocity/pressure) - it actually makes a more malleable alloy. At low temp it won't alloy with the Sb. Normally produces Cu2Sb or Cu3Sb.

[triggerhappy243]

popper, I dont have a thermometer. I do know the melt was hot enough that it gave me excellent mold fill out from the git go. Getting the copper out was more of a "can I do it" kinda thing. And yes, the copper particles are microscopic small.

[typz2slo]

I have analyzed around 100 samples from members here and have noticed that the copper is not normally evenly distributed thru the sample. I can get different copper percentages from one side of an ingot to the other. Try doing your XRF analysis in several different spots when copper shows up.

[popper]

Guess I need to send some of my boolits to you for XRF testing. I think I have 2,1,0.5% in the alloy. Haven't found a place locally that will do testing.

[badgeredd]

I have analyzed around 100 samples from members here and have noticed that the copper is not normally evenly distributed thru the sample. I can get different copper percentages from one side of an ingot to the other. Try doing your XRF analysis in several different spots when copper shows up.

I stir my alloy regularly when it contains copper. I also have found one MUST cast at a higher temperature to keep the melt as uniform as possible when copper is involved. Many years ago, Felix added copper to some alloys and mentioned he found one must stir regularly to keep the copper in full suspension. Felix also told me when I first started working with babbitt containing copper, that he felt the added tin was the missing ingredient when he was experimenting with the addition of copper to a bullet alloy. The last tidbit is argued by some individuals, but I trust Felix's comments far more than others because of his care in any and all of his experiments.

In my experience, one can get uniform bullets with a melt temperature of 725-750* and with stirring the melt with each ladle pour. I tried using the bottom pour pots and had reasonable success, but in my opinion the results were more consistent pouring with a ladle.

Another thing I have found is when one melts HIGH copper babbitt, he must stir the melt as he breaks the babbitt down into smaller ingots or the copper WILL separate from the mix giving inconsistent results ingot to ingot.

One added comment here...it is my opinion that copper added to alloys above the 1/2% level causes more trouble than one will benefit from when casting. One is best served with a copper content of 0.25% or less. YMMV.

[typz2slo]

Popper if you need any analysis done pm me and I give you all the details.

[triggerhappy243]

Well I poured 20 of each 50 and 54 cal. maxi-balls with this copper tinted alloy .89%. still tested 1.46 % antimony. Will take to the range soon to see if I can load these as easy as pure lead.