Loads for .38Special Midrange and .38 Auto

[Gazz]

I have been doing a clean up and loading marathon in the reloading room and came across a bunch of 148 wadcutter bullets and since I do own a S&W Model 52 and a Colt .38 Midrange National Match pistol, I thought I would put some loads together that would be suitable for either pistol. I can find lots of load data for the .38 wadcutter but am not sure what would be the minimum load for proper operation of the pistols. I am thinking many of the light loads listed would be fine for revolvers but will they cycle the semi autos? The pistols will probably not be shot much but I would like to have some ammunition for them when I get the urge.
Also, I do have a 1903 Colt pocket hammer pistol and some .38 Super brass (and dies) that I would like to load up for it. It seems that my newer reloading manuals do not give any data for that cartridge being that is obsolete. I have a bunch of 9mm (.355") 125gr bullets that I thought would be good to use. I'm not interested in a super performance round, just one that will cycle the pistol and will be kind to it being that it is over 100 years old.
Thanks for any replies!

[boatbum101]

For your 38 special autos you'll want to load towards the upper end of HBWC data . I use 3.2grs W231 or 2.7 - 2.9grs WST in my 52 . Generally the 1911 can shoot softer loads with lighter recoil & mainsprings . If you use Bullseye don't exceed 3.0grs . Just about any of the faster shotgun / pistol powders will give you usable loads . Don't go too hot or you'll blow a skirt off & possibly bulge your barrel if you fire a second round on top of the blown skirt .

[Hardcast416taylor]

When my older Brother was in the Army reserves after active duty he was on his company`s shooting team. He had an S&W Model 52 in .38 spcl WC. Over about 6 years he was on the team I loaded untold thousands of Lyman #358429 WC boolets out of 50/50 alloy and used Hodgon bullet lube. The powder was Win. 231 and 3.3 gr. using Win. SPP in nickled cases that were not reloaded over 4 times. He won a few matches and had a few medals out of his shooting time. When he turned that 52 back in I thought he felt like he was losing a best friend.Robert

[rintinglen]

38 Auto--as opposed to 38 Super--Data, is pretty thin on the ground. In their 44th Edition Manual, Lyman suggests 2.7 to 3.3 grains of Bullseye under a 121 rain 358-242. Using the same boolit, they suggest 3.0 to 3.5 grains of Red Dot, 4.5 to 5.0 grains of Unique, or 5.0 to 5.5 grains of Unique. I'd also try 3.5 grains of 231 with the same boolit.

[country gent]

The old stand-by load the bullseye shooters used in the 52 and 1911s was 2.7 grns bullseye under a 148 grn hollow based wadcutter. This load was one that seemed to shoot well out of almost all guns revolver and pistols. My 1911 wadcutter gun loves this load with hornady swaged HBWC.

[Gazz]

Thanks for all the responses. It turns out that the bullets I had are 148 gr but with a solid base and crimp groove that leaves about .060" of bullet in front of the case mouth. I tried one in the Colt and it would not chamber. I am thinking that I can just set them a bit deeper so that the entire bullet is inside the case and then they would work okay. The press (Dillon 550B) was set up to throw 4.5gr of unique so I thought I would go with that for starters. I do have a good amount of Bullseye though and will switch if you guys think my plan to seat the bullets deeper is okay. I don't have any 231 and would like to not have to buy any. I haven't reloaded in years and I have quite a bit of components and powder and would like to use it up turning it into ammo that I can use. I also have quite a few swaged 158 gr bullets (I think that is the weight) that have a knurled type of exterior and are lubed. I was wondering if I loaded them backwards if that would work.

[Le Loup Solitaire]

I have been shooting an M52 for many years using H&G #251 which is a DE flat faced 148 grain WC. Sized .357 and lubed in one groove. It is seated flush with the case mouth and loaded with 2.5-2.6 grains of 700X. When using mil-spec brass which is thicker I sized to .356. It has always grouped well for me. LLS

[country gent]

Yes the colts ( especially Bar-Sto barrels) like the bullet flush with the case mouth. Sometimes .010 below and a roll crimp helps also. Mine functions flawlessly with this set up.

[georgerkahn]

The old stand-by load the bullseye shooters used in the 52 and 1911s was 2.7 grns bullseye under a 148 grn hollow based wadcutter. This load was one that seemed to shoot well out of almost all guns revolver and pistols. My 1911 wadcutter gun loves this load with hornady swaged HBWC.
A+ with country gent! Through 30+ years of ever trying to shrink group size with my S&W 52, using different powders, primers, bullets, and loads -- I always seem to resort back to 2,7 grns of Bullseye under a 148 gr wadcutter. I have two H&G moulds I use (#527 and #527bb) and performance with either is pretty much identical.
BEST!
geo

[Gazz]

Thanks for all the suggestions!
Tonight, I thought I would start on this project after loading up a bunch of .38 Special and .45 ACP. Since I am only going to load up a few of the .38ACPs, I am going to use a single stage press. I put the die in which is marked .38ACP and ran one case in (.38 Super), it went rather tightly and when I withdrew it, it had left a very noticeable step where it swaged the case smaller in diameter. I screwed the die in a bit more to see if I could minimize the step and ran the case in again which is now stuck in the die. I know how to get them out but I always thought the .38ACP and .38 Super used the same case so I wonder why the serious swaging occurred.
Also, I thought I had bought the right shell holder but it seems I did not and that is probably why the case is stuck.

[georgerkahn]

I have but a S&W Model 52, and have been loading/shooting (lots!) 148gn wad-cutters since the mid 1970s. I had read, "The old stand-by load the bullseye shooters used in the 52 and 1911s was 2.7 grns bullseye under a 148 grn hollow based wadcutter. This load was one that seemed to shoot well out of almost all guns revolver and pistols." And, I too did some experimenting seeing how light I could go without sacrificing accuracy or ending up with a stuck bullet in my pistol.
To cut right to the chase... I ended up with... guess what? 2.7 grains of Bullseye. Vis the bullets, I've shot several H&G designs -- 50, 50bb, and 527 - plus, during a feared-lead-bullet ban in the early 1980's, I bought a pile of Hornady's 148gr lead wad-cutters at a lower cost than my making them. All, again, propelled with 2.7 grains of Bullseye. No more, and no less. What I do :)
geo

[lotech]

I've experimented with different charge weights of Bullseye and the H&G #50 flat base WC in my 52. Best accuracy has been with 2.5 grs. and the ww alloy bullet sized to .358" and seated to an OAL of 1.16". I don't know the minimum recommended powder weight in the books, but I wouldn't go below 2.5 grs. Bullseye. This load chronographs around 750 fps.

[Ben]

Hardcast416taylor

I loaded untold thousands of Lyman #358429 WC boolets out of 50/50 alloy and used Hodgon bullet lube.

The 358429 is not a true wadcutter bullet ? Could this be a " typo " ?

[smkummer]

Hornady publishes data for the 38 acp. I am away from home right now but I too have a pocket hammer colt that I reload for. Sweet shooting gun perfectly sized for the cartridge.