RCBS Pro 2000 primer tube conversion

[Fluxed]

Tired of the APS monkey motion, hitches and interruptions, I bought the tube primer feed kit for my RCBS Pro 2000, installed it, and loaded a few hundred rounds. It is much easier, better and simpler to use. The tubes hold enough primers to get a rhythm going and its always easy to see, with just a glance, that you have primers in the machine. I can even see the machine feed a primer mid-stroke while loading.

I know some praise the APS system, and I'm glad it works for those who love it. But I'm not one of them. I'll also note that the new RCBS progressive presses use tube feeds, and I am pretty sure I know why now (and suspected from the get-go).

Installing the kit took a little bending, fitting and tweaking, but soon enough it was adjusted and working 100%. They should have used tubes in the first place. No more funky warped molded plastic primer strip pieces to deal with. The conversion is mostly made of steel and aluminum that matches the feel of rest of the machine.

The included instructions are weak, omit details about removing some of the APS guts and could (should) have much larger and better pictures. This seems to be the new normal for RCBS instructions. Some tools are so simple that detailed instructions may not be needed, but a progressive press is not one of them. I suggest that RCBS re-think their instruction manuals and bring them up to the standard of their tools, which are almost universally excellent (with a few exceptions). Its mostly a matter of a few more sheets of paper to provide a legible set of instructions with photos large enough to be useful.

If you are considering the conversion, just go ahead and do it.

[.36navy]

Do you have pictures to share. I am trying to complete the conversion

Thanks

[Taterhead]

This is a 5 year old thread, so hopefully the OP sees your post.

The post surprised me since my Pro 2000 with APS priming has dreamy reliability. Like anything, it does need to he cleaned now and then ir debris can interfere with indexing. Once it is configured properly it is set it and forget it.

In fact if I bought a Pro 2000 with the tube priming conversion, I would swap back to APS without hesitation.

[GWS]

I'm with you Taterhead. I have a Pro 2000 AND a Pro Chucker 7. I was hoping an easy mod would change the new one to the effortless and reliable APS, but they are too different. I do like both presses....I use the Pro 2000 for pistol and the Pro Chucker 7 for rifle.

Only down side was that I had to make bullet and case feeders for both. Since with rifle cases, I require case prep off press anyway, (including wet tumbling), especially with military LC brass, I size/deprime on an R.C. press, tumble for bling, then prime using an APS bench primer. From there I still manage to use seven stations ; 1- auto-feed brass, 2- "M" neck expand, 3- charge, 4- power check, 5- auto-feed bullets, 6- seat, 7- taper crimp. What's not to like....

[Taterhead]

I'm with you Taterhead. I have a Pro 2000 AND a Pro Chucker 7. I was hoping an easy mod would change the new one to the effortless and reliable APS, but they are too different. I do like both presses....I use the Pro 2000 for pistol and the Pro Chucker 7 for rifle.

Only down side was that I had to make bullet and case feeders for both. Since with rifle cases, I require case prep off press anyway, (including wet tumbling), especially with military LC brass, I size/deprime on an R.C. press, tumble for bling, then prime using an APS bench primer. From there I still manage to use seven stations ; 1- auto-feed brass, 2- "M" neck expand, 3- charge, 4- power check, 5- auto-feed bullets, 6- seat, 7- taper crimp. What's not to like....

For rifle, I too size/de-cap on the RC. I love the extremely consistent shoulder bump on the RC. Then load on the Pro 2000 for 223. With an RCBS Gold Medal seater, a bullet can be "placed" while the ram is traveling down. A new case is placed while priming. Almost as quick as a case or bullet feeder. It is amazing how much time that seating die saves with little 223 bullets. I wouldn't live without one for 223.

Regarding the Pro Chucker. Did they fix the issue with the transfer bars for real, or is that still a bug? Otherwise the press looks like it has very smooth indexing.

[GWS]

For rifle, I too size/de-cap on the RC. I love the extremely consistent shoulder bump on the RC. Then load on the Pro 2000 for 223. With an RCBS Gold Medal seater, a bullet can be "placed" while the ram is traveling down. A new case is placed while priming. Almost as quick as a case or bullet feeder. It is amazing how much time that seating die saves with little 223 bullets. I wouldn't live without one for 223.

Regarding the Pro Chucker. Did they fix the issue with the transfer bars for real, or is that still a bug? Otherwise the press looks like it has very smooth indexing.

They improved the transfer bar design before I bought mine. Actually my prerequisite for buying one was making the die plates available without powder measures....that was dumb and expensive and unnecessary, and I told them so. They were concerned about the spacing between stations and some bozo convinced them that the P.M. included was necessary (maybe a Dillon inspiration) because changing them was less than handy from die plate to die plate. I told them that was nuts. All they needed to do was supply powder dies separately like Hornady does. (The engineer I was talking to said, "Oh") So then when they started selling powder dies separately I bought one.;) And yes they index smooth as glass.

So have I broke a transfer bar in over 2 years? Nope. Can you break one? Yep. Easy.....just force stroke when something doesn't feel right...there's a lot of torque available with little effort.....but then you break something on any press when you do that. I learned a long time ago, that if it isn't smooth (and the ProChucker is smoother than most...even Dillons) stop.....and find out what you did or didn't so to make it suddenly not smooth, even a spongy feel is a warning. Don't ever force it. Then nothing ever breaks.

The most common source of grief would be not keeping moving parts clean and lubed. Advice good for any brand's press. Test for that before a loading session ..... especially the case feeder.....and primer feeder and there are no problems. That said, I don't prime every time on press because by the time my rifle cases reach the press they are usually sized/deprimed, tumbled, trimmed, chamfered, deburred, LC is swaged......just how I prefer to so things.....but when I do, I make sure it is clean and lubed.

If the PC7 has a weak spot it's the accessory case feeder. As it comes, it isn't perfect..... but it's easily and cheaply fixed to perfection!:) With thumb screws and a 25 cent 3d print. Prettier too....

[Taterhead]

They improved the transfer bar design before I bought mine. Actually my prerequisite for buying one was making the die plates available without powder measures....that was dumb and expensive and unnecessary, and I told them so. They were concerned about the spacing between stations and some bozo convinced them that the P.M. included was necessary (maybe a Dillon inspiration) because changing them was less than handy from die plate to die plate. I told them that was nuts. All they needed to do was supply powder dies separately like Hornady does. (The engineer I was talking to said, "Oh") So then when they started selling powder dies separately I bought one.;) And yes they index smooth as glass.

So have I broke a transfer bar in over 2 years? Nope. Can you break one? Yep. Easy.....just force stroke when something doesn't feel right...there's a lot of torque available with little effort.....but then you break something on any press when you do that. I learned a long time ago, that if it isn't smooth (and the ProChucker is smoother than most...even Dillons) stop.....and find out what you did or didn't so to make it suddenly not smooth, even a spongy feel is a warning. Don't ever force it. Then nothing ever breaks.

The most common source of grief would be not keeping moving parts clean and lubed. Advice good for any brand's press. Test for that before a loading session ..... especially the case feeder.....and primer feeder and there are no problems. That said, I don't prime every time on press because by the time my rifle cases reach the press they are usually sized/deprimed, tumbled, trimmed, chamfered, deburred, LC is swaged......just how I prefer to so things.....but when I do, I make sure it is clean and lubed.

If the PC7 has a weak spot it's the accessory case feeder. As it comes, it isn't perfect..... but it's easily and cheaply fixed to perfection!:) With thumb screws and a 25 cent 3d print. Prettier too....

Great stuff! Yeah, from day 1 I thought that it would be better to sell the powder die à la carte and the die plates too. With the micrometer adjustment, really only two measures are needed. One with a standard cylinder and another with the small cylinder. Glad to see that powder dies and die plates are now sold separately.

So I wasn't aware that they released a case feeder for the Pro Chuckers. The things holding the PChucker 7 back from being competitive with the 650/750s were priming and case feeders. If both those are lined out, it might be in business.

[GWS]

Great stuff! Yeah, from day 1 I thought that it would be better to sell the powder die à la carte and the die plates too. With the micrometer adjustment, really only two measures are needed. One with a standard cylinder and another with the small cylinder. Glad to see that powder dies and die plates are now sold separately.

So I wasn't aware that they released a case feeder for the Pro Chuckers. The things holding the PChucker 7 back from being competitive with the 650/750s were priming and case feeders. If both those are lined out, it might be in business.

Yes they have a case feeder, and if the parent company doesn't shoot the product out of the water, they will improve it soon. But I didn't wait, mines already improved. Mind you, RCBS isn't convinced to build an electric collator for it....and that's wise considering the sales were slow out of the gate, and not likely such an investment will pay. So you have two choices, buy a Dillon Collator for it or make a 3d printed collator for it. I bought a printer since with the money spent for a factory Dillon collator I could build 2 case collators and a bullet feeder/collator spending that money on a printer instead of on a collator.

So now I have this so far:

https://i.postimg.cc/d0nWddLq/Feeder_mount_2.jpg

Above, .308 bullet feeder plate mirrored and .308 case feeder on the left....

https://i.postimg.cc/x14dX6tS/IMG_3845.jpg

Above, .223 bullet feeder plate.....

Case Collator Video dropping .223 cases:

https://youtu.be/OEnDlvP7HeM

Bullet Collator: (showing off the built in clutch before I loaded .308 bullets):

https://youtu.be/45UuAHejov8

They also have "Tube" rifle bullet feeders for .223 and .308 that are awesome performers....using my H.M. collators for those too.

A more efficient use of my money ...... and still building stuff for reloading. You can print two collator base buckets with a single $19 spool of plastic.

[Taterhead]

Yes they have a case feeder, and if the parent company doesn't shoot the product out of the water, they will improve it soon. But I didn't wait, mines already improved. Mind you, RCBS isn't convinced to build an electric collator for it....and that's wise considering the sales were slow out of the gate, and not likely such an investment will pay. So you have two choices, buy a Dillon Collator for it or make a 3d printed collator for it. I bought a printer since with the money spent for a factory Dillon collator I could build 2 case collators and a bullet feeder/collator spending that money on a printer instead of on a collator.

So now I have this so far:

https://i.postimg.cc/d0nWddLq/Feeder_mount_2.jpg

Above, .308 bullet feeder plate mirrored and .308 case feeder on the left....

https://i.postimg.cc/x14dX6tS/IMG_3845.jpg

Above, .223 bullet feeder plate.....

Case Collator Video dropping .223 cases:

https://youtu.be/OEnDlvP7HeM

Bullet Collator: (showing off the built in clutch before I loaded .308 bullets):

https://youtu.be/45UuAHejov8

They also have "Tube" rifle bullet feeders for .223 and .308 that are awesome performers....using my H.M. collators for those too.

A more efficient use of my money ...... and still building stuff for reloading. You can print two collator base buckets with a single $19 spool of plastic.

Man, VERY nice work. That helps me to understand a few things. Thank you. I didn't realize that RCBS did not contemplate a collator for the CF. Interesting. You created a very nice workaround. Hat tipped to you.

I appreciate the show and tell! If priming bugs have been worked out, you have a noce productive setup.

[GWS]

Oh, they contemplated one, but they were waiting for acceptance and popularity, first. Trouble was their very vocal early adopters weren't as tolerant, or as mechanically inclined as they could have been. Hind sight shows that they should have offered the product first to hand picked early trial volunteers to find the weaknesses, like most manufacturers do....outside the engineering group, outside the company. But they didn't. Don't know if that was an RCBS decision or a Vista Outdoors decision.

So when the offering was blighted by those early adopters, spooking new buyers, they didn't want to add an expensive option at that point. It might still happen, but only if Vista Outdoors gives them the money to finish developing this still new product. And Vista isn't known for that. They were soooo close. I saw the potential, I love having 7 stations, and I love my slightly modified case feeder, that made it sing. I must be a minority. If I am, I'm a very happy one.:)

[Taterhead]

Oh, they contemplated one, but they were waiting for acceptance and popularity, first. Trouble was their very vocal early adopters weren't as tolerant, or as mechanically inclined as they could have been. Hind sight shows that they should have offered the product first to hand picked early trial volunteers to find the weaknesses, like most manufacturers do....outside the engineering group, outside the company. But they didn't. Don't know if that was an RCBS decision or a Vista Outdoors decision.

So when the offering was blighted by those early adopters, spooking new buyers, they didn't want to add an expensive option at that point. It might still happen, but only if Vista Outdoors gives them the money to finish developing this still new product. And Vista isn't known for that. They were soooo close. I saw the potential, I love having 7 stations, and I love my slightly modified case feeder, that made it sing. I must be a minority. If I am, I'm a very happy one.:)

Well, I think they knocked it out of the park with the Pro 2000, but it never did take hold on the market place. The 550 B/C is a fine press, but I would not consider it an upgrade to the Pro 2000, and that is the space it competed.

There is literally nothing that I've had trouble with the Pro 2000 except that the location of station 4 makes it tough to get a visual on the powder level on tall revolver cases. Mirrors or cameras are the workaround.

I could rattle off (I bet you could too) the many design features that set it apart, but it never gained market acceptance. It's reliable, and it leads the league in cost, speed and ease of cartridge changeovers. Esp priming.


I think you're right about early product release. It would do them well to be more aligned with the practical shooting community. Those guys will set you straight. Blue has that market dominated.

To release a 7 stage progressive that doesn't have a fully functional case feeder and collator means that they have no prayer to function in the space occupied by the Dillon 750. Head scratcher. I love RCBS but wonder about their merchandising and marketing functions sometimes.

[GWS]

It did not help when Huntingtons decided to sell the company to a sporting goods conglomerate.....and then was resold again. Means the company has little say about marketing. The best feature of the Pro 2000 is that it doesn't go out of alignment just by use, forcing you to readjust everything over and over like other progressives. But that story was never told.....or believed, if is was told.

I'm really enjoying both presses, but I'm not pushing or recommending them to anyone who isn't into modding them.....the Pro2k they quit on, so no point, and the Pro Chucker seems to be at the back burner.

They either need to get serious and finish a really good press, or get out of the progressive business. Not sure what it'll be, and I hope the past isn't an indicator, but it probably is. But as for me, I'm totally enjoying both, since I don't have to wait for someone else to make them sing. Buy extra parts that wear that you can't make while you can.

BTW, this is what I did to feed the Pro 2000.......Hornady Pistol Bullet feeder modified to flip bullets...... 1 plate feeds 9mm,357,40sw,45acp only changing down tube and Hornady feed die caliber:

https://youtu.be/KFw3joreC54

and home made case feeder with a 3d printed collator......feeds both pistol and rifle cases with individual inserts at the drop


https://youtu.be/IGj-L8l0mn4

[Taterhead]

It did not help when Huntingtons decided to sell the company to a sporting goods conglomerate.....and then was resold again. Means the company has little say about marketing. The best feature of the Pro 2000 is that it doesn't go out of alignment just by use, forcing you to readjust everything over and over like other progressives. But that story was never told.....or believed, if is was told.

I'm really enjoying both presses, but I'm not pushing or recommending them to anyone who isn't into modding them.....the Pro2k they quit on, so no point, and the Pro Chucker seems to be at the back burner.

They either need to get serious and finish a really good press, or get out of the progressive business. Not sure what it'll be, and I hope the past isn't an indicator, but it probably is. But as for me, I'm totally enjoying both, since I don't have to wait for someone else to make them sing. Buy extra parts that wear that you can't make while you can.

BTW, this is what I did to feed the Pro 2000.......Hornady Pistol Bullet feeder modified to flip bullets...... 1 plate feeds 9mm,357,40sw,45acp only changing down tube and Hornady feed die caliber:

https://youtu.be/KFw3joreC54

and home made case feeder with a 3d printed collator......feeds both pistol and rifle cases with individual inserts at the drop


https://youtu.be/IGj-L8l0mn4

Great advice on spare parts. I have spares for just about everything, including the whole top end (shell plate holder assembly with APS) and all of the various auto-indexing and APS small parts. The only thing I've replaced is the return spring plate. About the only non-redundant parts are the frame and handle.

RCBS sent it all to me for free.

You are so right about adjustments. It is set it and forget it. It just doesn't go out of adjustment. Beautiful simplicity.

Your feeders are awesome. That case feeder is remarkable! Very well done,sir!