Reichsrevolver for Dad-in-law

[rtracy2001]

My father-in-law showed me a relic that he inherited from his uncle and asked me to identify it. It appears to be an 1883 Reichsrevolver. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M1879_Reichsrevolver (identical to the 1879, except for the shorter barrel and the lack of the band or flair at the end of the barrel)

Dad's version is not in "collector's condition" so he would like to shoot it. 10.6x25 isn't really available, so this will be a make your own proposition. I have read a couple of threads about this and one suggested using the 445 super brass in a configuration similar to the Nagant revolver (bullet completely inside the brass, these revolvers have NO forcing cone at all). I am not completely clear on what this entails and could use some advice on where to start (maybe if someone has a couple of 445 super brass that they could spare for a couple bucks, I could see what it will take to make them work?)

Another issue is the fact that this particular revolver has one oversized cylinder, I may need to enlist the help of a machinist friend to sleeve it. Otherwise, that cylinder will just be the safety cylinder (the firing pin is integrated into the hammer and there really isn't a true half cock.

I recognize that despite the beefy nature of this revolver, it will be strictly a black powder proposition, but I would appreciate any help you all could offer. (other brass suggestions, etc.)

[mac60]

I read a little on the interwebs about using .44 mag. or spl. brass. Trimmed to length using .429 dia. bullets. Also, Donnelly's book on cartridge conversions says as much. With the availability of .44 mag./spl. brass and dies for .44 Russian it might be worth you looking into. Donnelly also gives some loading data that he lists as coming from Cartridges of the world - 5.5 gr. of bullseye. Now, COW is NOT a reloading manual, so I'd take that 5.5 gr. charge with a grain of salt. If it were me, I'd be sorely tempted to try a light charge of smokeless before dealing with all that black powder entails. You know - not even a suggestion, just food for thought. I'm quite interested in seeing what track you take and how it all turns out for you.

edit: Here's a video you might find interesting.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UYDsJIgT27Q

[Tatume]

Watching the young lady shoot the revolver certainly made my hair stand on end. I think I looked down the bore of that loaded revolver 20 times!

[Dan Cash]

Personally, I would load black as there is much less chance of error leading to disaster. The revolver is well made and was engineered according to handgun fighting techniques of the time in the German Reich, The gun must have served adequately or it would not have been so long in service. Once you get some cases made and bullets cast, put in all the 3Fg the case will hold with a bullet seated, seat the bullets and go have fun.

[btreanor]

I have a Reichrevolver and have had good luck with .44 Russian brass and 180 grain swaged Hornady bullets (made for Cowboy Action). I use a light charge of Bullseye and a standard LP primer.

[WaPruf2]

rtyracy: If you provide me with the maker (sideplate left side lower), date (if marked, same location) and unit markings (along backstrap, sometimes on underside of frame ahead of triggerguard) I may be able to supply a little history for the piece.

[pietro]

.

If you can't avoid enabling his fantasy, for safe firing of a 130 year old BP revolver, I'd have a machinist turn a half-dozen (presuming it's a 6-shot revolver) brass or steel cylinders that fit the chamber(s), boring them for a .22LR seated deep enough to slide in 6 little steel firing pins behind the chambered LR cartridges.

.

[Wayne Smith]

Loading black powder for revolvers is easy. Fill the case to beyond the base of the bullet so the bullet compresses the powder when it is seated. Use 3FG and you don't even need a wad - I load my 44-40's this way. If you want to put in the maximum amount you will have to make or get a compression die - I use a seat die with the seat pin filled with hot glue and the seat pin fits perfectly in my case. Using this die compress the powder to a point where the bottom of the boolit will fit leaving no airspace. Seat the boolit. You are done.

[rtracy2001]

rtyracy: If you provide me with the maker (sideplate left side lower), date (if marked, same location) and unit markings (along backstrap, sometimes on underside of frame ahead of triggerguard) I may be able to supply a little history for the piece.

It is an F. V. Dreyse (sp?) And the unit mark starts with "JMI". I have a photo, but can't get it to upload from my tablet.

[WaPruf2]

Dreyse is one of the main civilian contractors for the M83. I suspect your unit mark is for a light ammunition column supplying artillery ammunition. Production (for military purposes) by Dreyse ended in 1892. If you look on the left barrel flat and/or rear of the cylinder you should find an indication of what kingdom in the German Empire accepted it. Marks are: Eagle = Prussia, GF=Bavaria, AR under crown = Saxony, deer antler = Württemberg.
BTW, decent quality reproduction holsters for these can be found on US and German Ebay.

[Crank]

rtracy,
I have been neglecting to update my the thread I started about this very topic. If you mike the charge holes (technically not chambers) at the cylinder mouth and then slug the bore, you may find as much of a transition as I did. My cylinders were 0.455" dia. and my bore slugged at 0.433"-ish. I bought some .445 SuperMag brass and trimmed it to the length of the cylinder. I still need to ream the brass so that I can seat a boolit without swelling the case, so it will wind up looking like a Nagant round. Your comment about one oversized chamber does strike me as a cause for concern, why would it be oversized? (previous smokeless load?) It would pose its own issues if you fired a round in it, at minimum, that piece of brass would have to be worked more for re-sizing. I am not trying to dissuade you from tinkering, but realize that the effort would have to be worth it for you. As for the thoughts of sleeving a chamber, I would feel the wall thickness would be less than ideal and I would not recommend that option. These are very nicely made revolvers, but do have a very dated design. I neglected to mention that my rationale for using the long brass was to avoid having the boolit in free-fall from the end of the case until it finally decided to get to the forcing cone, just to try and get some accuracy. I never tried the .44 SPL idea, since I have been preoccupied with many other project and this one has sat dormant. It, like many others, is still waiting to be taken out for the first time to the range. I have a bad habit of working on things far more than I shoot them. If you want, PM me and I can send you my number if you want to ping ideas around.

Mark

[rtracy2001]

Thanks Mark,

The project is on a temporary hold right now since I am trying to move in a couple weeks.

As for the one oversize cylinder bore, I was wondering if someone tried to fire a 44 out of it. No real history except that a relation of my FIL brought it home after the war along with a box of other souveneers.

Ray

[texasloader]

anyone have a suggetion for how much bp to load for these things? I acquired one a couple years ago and it still gathers dust next to my martini henry over the fireplace.

[country gent]

Measure and if the chamber is oversized instead of sleeving have a machinist turn a brass slug up with a light press fit and install it or size for size and locktite it in place. This way a round cant be loaded into that chamber.

[MT Chambers]

anyone have a suggetion for how much bp to load for these things? I acquired one a couple years ago and it still gathers dust next to my martini henry over the fireplace.

Most BP reloading does not call for a certain charge, you must measure your cases for Bp powder quantity leaving only enough empty case to seat the bullet down firmly on the BP. Of course you must make sure that you have the right OAL figured out. Dif. brands of cases and powders will change your carefully measured charges.

[vagrantviking]

I have an 1883 and a 1879. Both are very easy to load for and shoot well with 44 Russian cases.
A 200gr RNFP 20-1 and a case full of FFFg or FFg is a pleasant load with some authority.
I also do some smokeless with good results but will let people do their own research and decision making on that call.

Neither one has a very comfortable grip and it gets worse as the power increases. That big old 1879 horse pistol with the cannon barrel sure makes a shooter grin though!