SHOT Show Marlins

[W.R.Buchanan]

Just got back from Shot Show.

All in all it was kind of mundane this year. I chose not to walk the whole thing and put 30 miles on my legs this time, instead I used the SHOT Show App on my I phone and only went to places I had business or interest.

Wanted to check out Marlin's guns.

I looked at all the display guns and talked to the rep while doing it critiquing all the while. I have to say the fit and finish was as good as any generic gun I saw at the show. The metal finishes were good and all the barrels were timed correctly.

He told me how it took them a while to completely retool the Marlin Line with CNC machinery and bring all the manpower up to speed on what was required to build nice guns. I think they have turned the corner on the QC issues of the past which were caused mainly by disgruntled former employees, and are now producing guns which are not only up to,, but exceeding the Marlin Standards of old. These have always been "no frills" Generic Working Guns, but now have moved up to a level that is above the old "truck gun" status.

They also have a new Custom Shop for their Leverguns which are spiffed up by Dakota Arms. They were nice! Nice higher grade wood and nice checkering and excellent custom gun metal to wood fit. Also these guns were deburred nicely and there were no sharp edges on the levers or hammers. I didn't get prices but the guns looked and felt nice,,, "but not too nice," that you wouldn't want to use them. I'd expect those Custom Finished Rifles to be in the $900-1100 range.

I had a hold of one rifle most of the time and thought in my mind it was an 1894 CB Short Rifle, after putting it back on the rack I noticed it had a round bolt!(completely Missed it!) It was actually an 1895 CB Short Rifle with a 20" Octagon barrel and in .45-70 cal. It once again was a Generic Gun with the common Marlin finish.

Not listed on the website. Wish I'd taken a picture.

I did manage to drive home the point of tumble deburring of internal and external parts as a way to improve the feel of the guns, and also stamp 1:20 Twist Rifling for the .44's firmly into his fore head.

Everything I saw in the Marlin Section of the Remington Booth looked better than last year.

Randy

[Hickory]

This is indeed news worth hearing.
Thanks

[jmort]

That is an interesting report.

[Shuz]

Randy--Thanks for pounding the 1:20 twist idea in their heads!

[dragon813gt]

Looks like I need to put funds aside for one of the Custom Shop rifles. Wouldn't mind a spruced up 1895 in 35 Remington w/ Ballard rifling. I don't need it but I sure want one. Or maybe a 1894C :)

[TXGunNut]

Thanks for the report, glad they are getting a handle on things. It's hard to get past the ugly wood on the new Remlins but I finally did it several days back. Haven't made it to the range yet but it looks good so far.

[Steve77]

I wish they would bring back the 41 mag:Bright idea::guntootsmiley:

[ReloaderFred]

I also talked to the Marketing Manager for the Marlin line of rifles at the Show at some length. He confirmed that the new rifling twist for the .44 Magnum rifles will be 1 in 20", which I told him would be a blessing. He said they had tested some of the rifles with 180 gr. ammunition and the results were horrible, and when they asked the ammunition manufacturer about it, they were told, "you can't shoot 180 gr. bullets through that 1 in 38" twist and expect any kind of accuracy". That opened their eyes to the twist rate problem.

I also told him something he didn't know, that there are two SAAMI specs for the .44 Magnum, one for rifles and one for revolvers, and that the bore diameter for the two are different. He didn't know that, and took copious notes while we talked about it.

I pointed out to him that probably 90% of the purchasers of these rifles will be buying off the shelf factory ammunition, all of which is loaded with .429" diameter bullets. They will take their new rifle and ammunition to the range and fire those .429" bullets down a SAAMI spec'd .431" diameter bore, and cuss their new rifle because it doesn't shoot accurately. I also told him that I knew of no manufacturer who makes a .431" diameter bullet, and if they did, it probably wouldn't chamber after being loaded into a case anyway. I told him Remington has a reputation for accurate barrels, so don't screw it up. He agreed and said he was going to bring up those points to the production people at their next meeting. He said the entire production line for the pistol caliber Marlins was off line at the moment, due to them trying to "bring it back on line the right way".

I have confidence they will. I've talked to this same manager in previous years, and he's always been forthright about the problems and the future production goals. I've got his e-mail address, and he asked me to forward any other ideas I had that would help to improve the line, and I told him I would.

Hope this helps.

Fred

[xdmalder]

Until they heat treat critical parts of the internals the new guns are still worthless for the long run. And blaming former employees for their problems 6 years later is getting old. So who is Remington going to blame for Remington guns turning into junk lately? Marlin employees? Their failure is solely on their shoulders. I fear their bean counters will never let it be a good gun again!

[dragon813gt]

They can't blame the old employees. None were brought over from New Haven. Remington is the one that screwed everything up.

And how long does it take to get the 1894 line up and running? They've already made them. There was a run of 44 mags last year. If they want to keep customers they better step up.

[Scharfschuetze]

Thanks for the info on the new Marlins guys. I have a few Marlins dating from 1903 to 2000 and I've watched with interest the decline in quality of them and the trouble that Remington had in getting back up to speed. I'm glad to hear that things are getting back on track. Hopefully they'll take your advice and sort the 44 Magnum's bore diameter out. If they do, perhaps I'll then entertain the idea of getting one.

[Hickory]

We can put some pressure on them with a postcard that says something like this;

It has come to my attention that the new production Marlin 1894 in 44 magnum will have a 1-20" twist barrel, this is great news, however, if you are going to change the twist of the barrel, you need also to change the groove diameter from .431" to .429" for it to be completely right. The oversized bore, 1-38 twist and microgroove rifling have always kept me from buying one.

Send Mail to:
Marlin Firearms
P.O. Box 1871
Madison, NC 27025

[xdmalder]

Is it the bore or the chamber that is oversized?

[wrench man]

I'll believe it when I see it!?, they put out a new 1894 44 Mag at the LGS a few weeks ago, it has the barrel clocked OFF, the tang to stock GAP could hold a few tater chips for a snack later! and blaming the former Marlin employees for the down fall is just a truck load of BS!!, the very last of the JM proof marked rifles may have been cause to the former employees but any with an REP prof mark it straight up Remington's problem.

[ReloaderFred]

Remington freely admits they went about the transition wrong. They've told me that for the last several years at the SHOT Show. It's not like they're trying to hide anything. The first mistake was moving the old machinery to the new location. It was old and worn out, and should have been sold off as scrap, and they say that. Some of the machines had dams built around them to keep the leaking fluid from running all over the place....

The other thing they ran into was that some of the changes that had been made over the years had been done by the machinists, but no drawings were ever changed to reflect those changes. One perfectly good example is the extractor for the handgun caliber rifles. At one time, the gripping portion of the extractor was almost 1/4" wide, but at some point it was changed to the current configuration, which is more like a bent nail. The part numbers never changed, even though the part changed. The older extractor would pull a split case out of the chamber with ease, but the new one won't. My wife's rifle (which she smilingly stole from me) has the wide extractor and never has a problem pulling a split case out of the chamber during a match. Mine has the newer one, and if I get a split case, then I'm done, because it locks up the rifle until I can get either a rod to knock it out, or something to gently pry it out.

The other big mistake was not installing the equipment in one dedicated area of the plant. They installed them wherever that had room to put a machine, which meant one part would be made on one side of the plant and the rest would be made somewhere else, and pushed all over the place on carts. That's not efficient, and they admit it was one of the problems they were dealing with. Another was that most of the old Marlin employees were near retirement age and didn't want to move, so they lost that knowledge.

We can cuss and discuss what's happened the last few years with the purchase by Remington, but what I'm mainly interested in is what the future is going to be for the Marlin line of lever action rifles. They said they're not going to let them die, and from what I've been told, it's not going to. They're trying, and I'm willing to give them a chance to make it right. They have the resources, so now we'll see if they truly have the willingness, and I believe they do.

Hope this helps.

Fred

PS: It's not like I really need another Marlin to add to the 15 or so that I already own, but I'd buy one of the new ones if it looked like it corrected all the past problems.

[boommer]

purdy much everything Remington has put hands on in later years [ they have cheapen and poor quality and this is only my opinion ] IN there hay day they they built a great product for the money.
Remington is part of a CON--GLAUM NOW and the bean counters will never let the people of knowledge, common sense, have any in put unless it will save them a bean!

When GO start looking at NEW OR NEWER GUNS I do shy away from them,again this is MY OPINION and I'm not alone on this one. I have few REM'S older and like very much.

Maybe I'm getting old, cranky, picky.

[.45colt]

When I see the MX/MXLR .338 Express Rifles back on the shelves THEN I will pay attention. 50% of Remlin's I have seen in the last years have had issues. I want them to get it right,but I'm not holding My Breath.

[Love Life]

When I see the MX/MXLR .338 Express Rifles back on the shelves THEN I will pay attention. 50% of Remlin's I have seen in the last years have had issues. I want them to get it right,but I'm not holding My Breath.

A brand spanking new MX/MXLR in 338 Marlin Express would get my wallet's attention. Put on a spiral magazine tube so you can shoot pointy things and life would be mighty fine.

[.45colt]

I'm sure that Remlin and Hornady could develop the .338 if they chose. My Mx will shoot the 250 gr Remingtons in little tiny groups if I do My part. All it needs is a better selection of factory ammo.

[xdmalder]

I'm sure that Remlin and Hornady could develop the .338 if they chose. My Mx will shoot the 250 gr Remingtons in little tiny groups if I do My part. All it needs is a better selection of factory ammo.

If you go over to Marlinowners.com, JACKTW is developing bonded bullets made specifically for at least the 308 ME and 338 ME. Should be released very soon.

[FergusonTO35]

Glad to see Remlin is making changes, but blaming the transition to Ilion and former Marlin employees is getting really old. If a product was made when Remington/Freedom Group/Cerberus/whoever was in charge they are the ones responsible for it. The barrels clocked wrong thing that they have been doing for a few years now is just plain lazy and incompetent. Does no one really hold the rifle and aim before it gets shipped out?

[.45colt]

"If you go over to Marlinowners.com, JACKTW is developing bonded bullets made specifically for at least the 308 ME and 338 ME. Should be released very soon." Yep I'm aware of His work.

[FergusonTO35]

I should add that Marlin's unwillingness to maintain their factory and enacting an endless series of workarounds for problems is just as bad. I blame this on the great Race to the Bottom that Marlin and Winchester both ran for decades, seeing how many cheap department store guns they could crank out while spending as little as possible on maintaining their production system and QC. Both of them lost the race, as we can see.

[6pt-sika]

Just got back from Shot Show.



I had a hold of one rifle most of the time and thought in my mind it was an 1894 CB Short Rifle, after putting it back on the rack I noticed it had a round bolt!(completely Missed it!) It was actually an 1895 CB Short Rifle with a 20" Octagon barrel and in .45-70 cal. It once again was a Generic Gun with the common Marlin finish.

Not listed on the website. Wish I'd taken a picture.



Randy
As much as I hate to admit it I'd kinda be interested to see an 1895CB with a 20" barrel . I've not owned a lever 45-70 for a few years now but I've still got dies plenty brass and a couple molds .

[runfiverun]

still ain't buying one.

[Rattlesnake Charlie]

Encouraging.

[TXGunNut]

still ain't buying one.

I did. Hope I don't have an "I told you so!" coming, lol.

[Gtek]

Still think I would rather sandblast and paint an old freckled one.

[Scharfschuetze]

Remington is part of a CON--GLAUM NOW and the bean counters will never let the people of knowledge, common sense, have any in put unless it will save them a bean!

That brought back memories of a two different discussions that I had over the years.

The first one was with a Boeing aerospace engineer friend of mine years ago while we were pulling targets at a state level National Match. He was offered a position with Remington with a salary increase and other benefits. At the interview, they offered him the job in Ilion. He then asked a few questions about the company, the one of interest here is below.

Friend: "Do you have a rifle team?"

Remington: "No, why would we have one?"

He said he was taken aback by that and wondered if they, like politicians, had completely lost contact with their customers. At the time, I shot a .22 LR 40X small bore rifle in small bore matches and sometimes used a short action 40X in 308 calibre across the course in National Match shooting. We both wondered how you made match rifles and didn't have first hand experience in the company to improve them. By the way, he declined the offer.

The second conversation was as insightful as well:

Back when Kimber was still in Oregon, I had dinner with the CEO of that company while dining with a mutual friend. I thought that it would be a nice evening talking rifles and getting the details on the production of what at the time was considered a premium rifle. That turned out to be a pipe dream as the CEO had no idea what marksmanship was or even what made a rifle accurate. The food and drinks were good, but I've had more interesting conversations with a rock. Not too long after that one on one discussion, Kimber announced that they were basically out of business. They did show up in New York State of all places and seem to be back on track there. Can't figure that one out.


I attribute this type of corporate culture to the advent of the university educated MBA CEOs that only are concerned with the bottom line and have no idea what the customer wants or needs.

With all that said, I still do enjoy shooting and loading for my Marlins from .22 RF through 45/70.

[krems]

I really like the JM Marlin 1894 CB rifles but......I would really like them if the 45 colt had a tighter chamber ( mine is way oversize )..and the 44 mag didn't have such a large bore. (.431+). I can barely chamber a .4315 bullet in Starline Brass. I may have to go get some WW Brass. As far as the barrel twist on the 44 mag goes.....I would be happy with a 1 in 24 or 30 barrel twist. I noticed that Mic McPherson will rebarrel a 94 Marlin in 44 mag but uses a 1 in 30 twist barrel. He didn't like the fast 20 twist barrels.

Krems

[Mauser48]

Yeah I would like an 1894 in 357 but they are impossible to find and I'm not paying $1000. All I see them making is the 336's.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Lots of good discussion here. Glad I started this thread.

This company has an opportunity to do something special for the gun world. Be interesting to see if next year when I go to their booth that they have something different and hopefully better.

I volunteered to suss out their production lines on these guns. It really wouldn't be that hard to bring both the quality and workmanship up several notches in literally a few days.

Randy

[Rizzo]

Did any of you that talked to the Marlin folks at the Shot Show find out if they will be producing the 1894C (357 mag) Marlin/Remlin again?

[ReloaderFred]

Rizzo,

Yes they will, but only after they get their production straightened out. They said there had been too many starts and stops, along with problems, so they've stepped back and looked at the whole process again and will start building rifles when they think they're able to do them right. Eric, the marketing manager for the Marlin line, said he wouldn't even speculate on when it will be, since they've missed so many dates already, but he was optimistic that it would be pretty soon.

Hope this helps.

Fred

[Kevinakaq]

Layed away a 1895cb 26" 45-70 other day from buds....will post pics when i have it in hand. This will be the first Marlin I have ever owned that has a crossbolt safety (and i have had and have a few Marlins). Wish me luck!

[Windwalker 45acp]

There's only one lever maker in my mind, Marlin. Everyone I've owned have been smooth as silk and great shooters. Wish I had kept them all. The only one I own today is a .444




Yeah I would like an 1894 in 357 but they are impossible to find and I'm not paying $1000. All I see them making is the 336's.

You and I are in the same boat. I would love to own an 1894 in .357... it can even be a beater! I just want a good truck gun and I want that one for it. Maybe they will will start producing them again...

[FergusonTO35]

Really, really hope the octagon barrel cowboy version comes back.

[Rizzo]

Rizzo,

Yes they will, but only after they get their production straightened out. They said there had been too many starts and stops, along with problems, so they've stepped back and looked at the whole process again and will start building rifles when they think they're able to do them right. Eric, the marketing manager for the Marlin line, said he wouldn't even speculate on when it will be, since they've missed so many dates already, but he was optimistic that it would be pretty soon.

Hope this helps.

Fred


Thanks Fred.
Good info.

[ironhead7544]

I also talked to the Marketing Manager for the Marlin line of rifles at the Show at some length. He confirmed that the new rifling twist for the .44 Magnum rifles will be 1 in 20", which I told him would be a blessing. He said they had tested some of the rifles with 180 gr. ammunition and the results were horrible, and when they asked the ammunition manufacturer about it, they were told, "you can't shoot 180 gr. bullets through that 1 in 38" twist and expect any kind of accuracy". That opened their eyes to the twist rate problem.

My 2000 production 44 Magnum Cowboy will take a .433 bullet in the plunk test. Still seem to be some more play there. Very accurate with this bullet, 200 gr RNFP cast. Never had any blowback from any load. Thanks for the info in this thread.

I also told him something he didn't know, that there are two SAAMI specs for the .44 Magnum, one for rifles and one for revolvers, and that the bore diameter for the two are different. He didn't know that, and took copious notes while we talked about it.

I pointed out to him that probably 90% of the purchasers of these rifles will be buying off the shelf factory ammunition, all of which is loaded with .429" diameter bullets. They will take their new rifle and ammunition to the range and fire those .429" bullets down a SAAMI spec'd .431" diameter bore, and cuss their new rifle because it doesn't shoot accurately. I also told him that I knew of no manufacturer who makes a .431" diameter bullet, and if they did, it probably wouldn't chamber after being loaded into a case anyway. I told him Remington has a reputation for accurate barrels, so don't screw it up. He agreed and said he was going to bring up those points to the production people at their next meeting. He said the entire production line for the pistol caliber Marlins was off line at the moment, due to them trying to "bring it back on line the right way".

I have confidence they will. I've talked to this same manager in previous years, and he's always been forthright about the problems and the future production goals. I've got his e-mail address, and he asked me to forward any other ideas I had that would help to improve the line, and I told him I would.

Hope this helps.

Fred
My 44 Magnum Cowboy plunk tests with a .433 RNFP cast. Seems to be a bit more play there. Very accurate with this bullet.

Thanks for all the info on this thread.

[Four-Sixty]

I'm awaiting the return on an XT-22 I got my son for Christmas. We tried to mount a scope on it two weeks ago and discovered the barrel was pointed to the 4 O'clock position. I sent a Ruger SR45 in for a magazine problem a day before, and it has already come back. I can't even track the progress of the XT-22 on the Marlin web-site, or by the automated phone system.

[FergusonTO35]

I'm awaiting the return on an XT-22 I got my son for Christmas. We tried to mount a scope on it two weeks ago and discovered the barrel was pointed to the 4 O'clock position.

Wow. Just wow.

[TXGunNut]

Took my RemLin 1895 45-70 rifle to the range today. Probably only a couple of years old so likely made on the new machinery by the new folks. Functioning was great and accuracy was on a par with my Guide Gun, which is pretty darn good!

[runfiverun]

sounds great.
still not buyin one.:lol:

I'm off Rossi's too since Taurus took them over.
which sucks, I have a cabinet dedicated to lever guns, and another spot in the gun room just for lever guns and it has a couple spots I could fill with the right calibers. [38-40/32-20/41mag and 480 Ruger are the short list]

[xdmalder]

sounds great.
still not buyin one.:lol:

I'm off Rossi's too since Taurus took them over.
which sucks, I have a cabinet dedicated to lever guns, and another spot in the gun room just for lever guns and it has a couple spots I could fill with the right calibers. [38-40/32-20/41mag and 480 Ruger are the short list]

Adam at Ranger Point Precision could probably make you a 480. He makes a wildcat called the 44 Ripsaw which is a 480 Ruger I believe necked down to the 44 cal. He uses the Marlin 1894 as the platform.

[FergusonTO35]

I notice all my local Walmarts carry the 1895 .45-70 now. Regardless of what you think of Remlin I think it is awesome to see a .45-70 lever action behind the glass. Many people would never even see one otherwise.

[Tackleberry41]

Im gonna go out on a limb and say the guns they had at the show were the cream of the crop. I saw several brand new ones in the rack at the LGS, same problems as usual. The guy will nod his head as you explain things, he might even write it down, but wont survive the board room. All the board is wanting to know is how much they are going to make. And Remington itself seems to be nosediving on quality. Guess they see the end of the tunnel, its time to get all they can before the whole place collapses.

[rockrat]

Hey R5R, I have a NIB davidsons 92 Win in 38-40 I would part with!!!

[runfiverun]

rockrat your killing me. [or are gonna get me killed]
I got a mold, some brass [somewhere] and a die set.
I used to have a pair of consecutively serial numbered Ruger vaquero's in 38-40 but let my Dad talk me out of them.
i'll probably get them back some day.

I'm afraid to ask how much with tax season coming up.
PM me :lol: let's see what we can work out.

[W.R.Buchanan]

So just for giggles I go on Gunbroker and there's the 1895 Cowboy with the 18" Octagon Barrel I talked about earlier. $779 http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=540577420#PIC

Wood was decent and would refinish into a nice piece.

Obviously not a rare item .

Randy

[Kevinakaq]

Buds has it for 641 with price match.

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/719002293/Marlin+1895+Cowboy+.45-70+18%22+Barrel


So just for giggles I go on Gunbroker and there's the 1895 Cowboy with the 18" Octagon Barrel I talked about earlier. $779 http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=540577420#PIC

Wood was decent and would refinish into a nice piece.

Obviously not a rare item .

Randy

[Hickok]

I sure hope they get it together. I still have 100 pieces of .35 Remington brass waiting on a rifle to shoot it in. My last new Marlin .35 Rem couldn't be zeroed with iron sights. It would have needed off-set sights like a British Bren MG.

[Windwalker 45acp]

I sure hope they get it together. I still have 100 pieces of .35 Remington brass waiting on a rifle to shoot it in. My last new Marlin .35 Rem couldn't be zeroed with iron sights. It would have needed off-set sights like a British Bren MG.

Ouch, sorry to hear that Hickok. I've always been a huge fan of Marlin's Leverguns and I really want Remington to step up their Q&C to keep the 'heritage' alive with that brand. I'm saving my pennies now for another one.... but it looks like I may go used instead of a new Remlin.

[Hickok]

I hope to find another Marlin .35 Rem. someday. I really like the Marlin Lever-Actions too. I sold mine to a fellow who wasn't concerned about the iron sights.

I used to see used .35's in the gun racks aplenty, but not any more. Hopefully, the new Marlins are getting straightened out.

[jimofaz]

I am hopin' for the 1894 & 1895 'Cowboy' rifles to be brought back, with a 24" cut-rifled barrel offering in amongst the build options.....

[Knarley]

The question I have is how long is it going to be before the "Remlin" junk is gone from the market? And how would one know a good one from a junk one?
IMHO, if it has a JM stamp, I'd consider it, If it has a REM stamp, I'm putting it back on the shelf, even IF the barrel isn't @ 37 degrees off.
And I'm sure Remington isn't gonna recall the junk ones, so buyers have pretty much been screwed. A pig in a poke ain't for this pilgrim.......
The answer is............ never!! Those junkers will be circulating for ever.
Knarley

[W.R.Buchanan]

Knarley: the answer to your question is,,, that you have to look at any gun before you buy it. If it ain't right don't buy it. I would never buy a gun of any make that had obvious problems. with Marlins if there is some minor internal problem, (I don't know what that could be?) it is easily fixed.

I only buy Marlins used or new with the intention that they will need to be reworked internally to suit my tastes. Wood will also need Refinish as what they do to wood is abhorrent to me.

But the end result is a joy to shoot and the fact that I have contributed my own limited skills to that end is very satisfying. The other thing is that it makes your gun unique and as such people do notice it.

Oh and just because it has JM stamped on the barrel doesn't mean that it is some Holy Grail of the firearms world. They made plenty of junk before Remington bought them out, and if Remington hadn't bought them out we wouldn't be having this conversation as there would be NO NEW MARLINS AT ALL!.

Randy

[6pt-sika]

Hmmmm this 1895 with the 18" octagon barrel intrests me but the same thing in 444 I'd like a touch more !

[Ed in North Texas]

Knarley: the answer to your question is,,, that you have to look at any gun before you buy it. If it ain't right don't buy it. I would never buy a gun of any make that had obvious problems. with Marlins if there is some minor internal problem, (I don't know what that could be?) it is easily fixed.

I only buy Marlins used or new with the intention that they will need to be reworked internally to suit my tastes. Wood will also need Refinish as what they do to wood is abhorrent to me.

But the end result is a joy to shoot and the fact that I have contributed my own limited skills to that end is very satisfying. The other thing is that it makes your gun unique and as such people do notice it.

Oh and just because it has JM stamped on the barrel doesn't mean that it is some Holy Grail of the firearms world. They made plenty of junk before Remington bought them out, and if Remington hadn't bought them out we wouldn't be having this conversation as there would be NO NEW MARLINS AT ALL!.

Randy

My really, reeally favorite leverguns are my Savage 99s (.250-3000, .300 [2] and .308 Win). But there are no new Savage 99s at all. I love my Marlins (.45-70, .30-30, .35 Rem, .357, .44 Mag, .45 Colt) and thanks to Remington I might find some more that I want to pass on to the grandkids.

[fecmech]

Oh and just because it has JM stamped on the barrel doesn't mean that it is some Holy Grail of the firearms world. They made plenty of junk before Remington bought them out, and if Remington hadn't bought them out we wouldn't be having this conversation as there would be NO NEW MARLINS AT ALL!.
Amen to that! Two friends had late model JM Marlins, a 39 and a 94. The 39 had burrs in the action and parts were galled and a 7 lb. trigger. I cleaned it up for him. The 94 would not feed from the mag, he sent it back and had it repaired. JM stamping is a long way from a gold standard.

[Knarley]

Well, if you gentlemen are looking to buy guns to work on, then you have found a gold mine. Perhaps they should sell their guns in "Kit" form.
But I myself would have a problem buying a NIB gun to have to work on. I buy "junkers" for that.............
I'm not saying the JM stamp is the "Gold Standard", but having a good foundation is always a good start. Ever try building a house on marshy ground, or for that matter a cliff?
They say that one gets only one chance to set a first impression..............................

Regards,
Knarley