77-357 77-44 or a lever 357 or 44 options

[csatrustburg]

I really didn't know where to post this question I am a hunter not really into paper punching new to casting and love my handguns! Thanks to everyone here I killed two with cast in pistol. Like a lot of people its so fun I have decided to get two rifles one in 357 and one in 44. Now the question I want accuracy at 100 yards and torn on the rifles reading on here I have seen troubles with the 77 styles and accuracy so I thought about a marlin. I want to be able to install a scope. My uncle has a 77-44 and I tried to use a 420-250 Kt but over all length did not work to long. Really looking for input here guys I have two lee molds both gas checked swc design and a few other options but would like to use my pistol rounds. What's the better of the two and will chamber longer length boolits?

[Camba]

I have both, the Ruger 77/357 and the 77/44. I love both rifles. I shoot more the 77/357. Initially, I was able to get groups smaller than 2" at 100 yards. Later, using the RCBS 35-180-SIL and the LEE 357-200-RF mold, I was able to get some impressive groups (around 1") more consistently.
My 77/44 is one of the first few rifles made in this caliber and the accuracy is decent. As with any magazine fed rifle, the OAL of the cartridge has to be within the allowed limits of the magazine. That has not been a problem for my rifles and that does not affect my liking of both of them.

[Blammer]

Get one of each, sell off the ones you don't like. :)

in my experience with my 357 mag lever gun, it does not feed SWC's at all. RNFP is the choice of the day for hunting and accuracy.

my 44/77 is pretty much the same way, SWC's don't feed well or shoot well.

[csatrustburg]

I had read your post from earlier in the year where you had troubles with accuracy but wound up being the screw on the mount. My thing is the mag is short I read I think it was 1.62 COAL dang auto correct is the longest you can load was hoping few more guys chimed in with there results too. I am thinking about the 77s I like a bolt better than a lever but would like to shoot the same boolits I already load. Noe 432-265 and a Lyman 358 170 grain I cant remember the number of that one but I do have a 6 cavity lee in 158 GC and 240GC just hats to start loading different. Boolits thanks for your reply!

[csatrustburg]

Wooow blammer no sell just add more! I was just reading a bunch of people with bad reviews on the 77s!

[Blammer]

edited post above. :)

[Blammer]

with my 77/44 I went with a RD design RF point in 265 gr wt. I could get it long enough to just kiss the lands and still work in the mag, and it turned out to be a very accurate bullet.

[Blammer]

http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/product_info.php?cPath=37&products_id=224

this is the bullet I really like for my 77/44

I got the RG version so I can cast HP's and "dish" nose, they really put the smack on things. :)

[Mica_Hiebert]

I like my 77/357 it shoots around 2 inches at 100 yards which is plenty accurate for hunting. I really doubt a lever gun will do much better. I figure with a 2 inch group your going to hit within 1 inch of where you aim. I other words it my not be a long range varmint gun but if you can't put it in a deer or coyotes boiler room you need to pick up knitting...

[csatrustburg]

Thanks guys new guns and molds old lady going to be happy oh wellnif it feeds you all year what's to argue about?

[Blammer]

go to the bullet swap area, see about getting some samples to try in your new rifle, before you buy a mould.

[Jeff Michel]

I have both versions of the Ruger and both of the Marlin lever. Watch your OAL in both styles and your on your way. I don't have the same problem as Blammer feeding SWC's in my lever gun. Maybe it varies with the gun. I find myself picking up the Ruger's 8 out of 10 times but both shoot about the same, either way you go you'll be pretty satisfied.

[45-70marlin]

I have the 77/357 and I love this gun! It shoots the swc just fine. I have the Lee tumble lube swc and that rcbs gas check 158 gr. Both shoot great.

[csatrustburg]

Wow great guys thanks for everything too. I reckon if I cant settle on the right one just get them all one question on the marlin's though is do I need to get a JM stamped if I go that route? I really appreciate everything too I love this site!

[chutesnreloads]

It's not a bolt or a lever but I'd be surprised if a Handi-Rifle won't chamber the rounds you already have loaded

[csatrustburg]

I thought about them if I could get it priced right but I think I'm going to stick with a bolt or lever for hunting and a quick follow up shot

[Lonegun1894]

I don't have a 77/357 or a 77/44, but do have Rossi 92s in .357, .44, and .45, and all are good for 2.5-3"@100 from a rest, and all 3 of them feed SWCs just fine. One quirk though that may mess up your plans is that SAAMI spec for a .44 Mag handgun bore and a .44 Mag rifle bore are NOT the same. You're looking at .429-.430" for a handgun, but .432" for a rifle. In the case of my .44s, I use .430-.431" for the handguns, but use .434"s for the rifles. Speaking of, the .44 rifles are the Rossi 92 mentioned earlier and a H&R Handirifle, and both shoot great, but I use irons on both, not scopes. They'd probably do better with scopes, but I use these rifles in fairly close quarters where I seldom need to shoot past 100yds, so the irons are about perfect for my needs.

[Digital Dan]

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/Guns/photo%202%202_zps2588rqcx.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/Guns/photo%202%202_zps2588rqcx.jpg.html)

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/Guns/627b4656-cd5c-45f5-a12c-e336e1f16dcd_zpsi3ucunrq.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/Guns/627b4656-cd5c-45f5-a12c-e336e1f16dcd_zpsi3ucunrq.jpg.html)

[csatrustburg]

Not a bad group there Dan the molds I use will not drop to that diameter. But could always pick up a new one or paper patch od powder coat the ones I have and just buy another sizing die thanks for the heads up bud I hadn't thought about that but measly resolved a friend Pc everyday at work! He also made up. Some jigs that hold a 100 boolits each so they get done fast he joined to I think he will probably. Sell some of those or do some trades.

[Cowboy_Dan]

Lonegun is right about the SAAMI specs, but sometimes you get lucky, like my Dad's Marlin (pre-Remlin) 1894 with a .430" groove. Drives tacks out to 50, haven't really shot it at 100 yet though.

[Lonegun1894]

I just checked my notes. My H&R slugs at .4325", while my Rossi 92 slugs at .431", but both will chamber the same .434" bullets. Go figure. And both will put them into 2.5-3"@100yds, and often under 2", but that goes for all my Rossis. I went and checked cause I remembered the bores were different, but both shot the same boolit. And I wasn't lucky enough to be able to use the same boolits for both rifles and handguns. I differentiate by using two different designs so a quick look tells me if I am looking at a rifle or a handgun load.

[Motor]

I hate threads like this. It's like asking "which beautiful lady would you like" All of them of course !!!:guntootsmiley:

I'm bad a deciding when all the options are good.

Motor

[Blammer]

It all comes down to personality. :)

or duct tape...

[csatrustburg]

Well I had asked because of all the bad reviews on the 77s but looks like a few people are having luck with them prices are the same either way I go

[AnthonyB]

I have the 77/357 and am very happy. It shoots better than I can hold.
Tony

[robg]

Camba I use the same sil boolit in my win94ae trapper same results 2"at 100 yards what powder do you use ?11.5gr 2400=1250fps is my load

[csatrustburg]

It would be nice if someone made a mag for them that would accept longer lengths that's the only thing I have seen I heard they are s little rough but some lapping compound should fix that

[Ramjet-SS]

I gave my grandson a 77/44 and load up Lee 300 grain RF it has acceptable accuracy at 100 yards. 2-2.5 inches. Great little stainless gun and light weight easy to shoot.

[csatrustburg]

Well looks like a 77 it is that's great not to much on a lever gun

[Blammer]

I like my 77/44, my brother shot a deer at 200yds with it, using my cast bullets. :)

http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g81/blammer8mm/2013%20Deer/91d41ffe-3ba4-4235-a4a7-fe6ca12d37be_zpsdef9c1f8.jpg (http://s54.photobucket.com/user/blammer8mm/media/2013%20Deer/91d41ffe-3ba4-4235-a4a7-fe6ca12d37be_zpsdef9c1f8.jpg.html)

oh yea, some details.

the first shot struck the deer at the base of the horn at the head and pretty much brain shot it.
it was kicking a tad so he finished it off with another. The one horn he shot off, we tied the drag rope around it and used it to drag the deer back to the Ford.

that is a HUGE deer around here, a really nice sized 8pt, he was probably 200lbs or dang close to it.

[tim338]

I have a 77/44 and it is starting to shoot good. Took a it of time and elbow grease to get the barrel broke in. It will shoot a honest 1 3\4" at a 100 yards with 265 grain j bullets and H110. I am going to try cast in it this summer.

[csatrustburg]

I really appreciate all the responses to this I am glad the 77 is doing good it was what I wanted! Blammer that's was a long shot! But exactly what I hope to get something that shoots good. Thanks guys for everything!

[Camba]

robg:
My load is 15.8gr of H110 with CCI-550 SPP. I use the same load for both, the RCBS 35-180-SIL (192gr) and the LEE 357-200-RF (205gr).
The RCBS 192gr does consistently better that the Lee 205r.
I have not check the veolcities for these loads and they do not show any signs of high pressure.

Camba

[wvmedic]

I have a 77/357 and have taken two deer with it. I really like it, I did have to do some work on the magazine to get it to feed well. It had a bad lip on the magazine that had to be taken off then polished, feeds fine now even with SWC.

I did just buy a new Marlin 1894, I was torn between it and a 77/44, the twist rate and number of rounds was my back and forth. The 77/44 is 1:20 while the 1894 is 1:38, the 1894 holds 10 rounds, the 77/44 4 rounds.

For hunting, I am fine with 4 rounds or throwing another magazine in my pocket. Though an extra magazine is extra money where as the 1894 is no extra cost for the extra rounds. Also, if one would happen to use it as a defensive weapon, the extra rounds come into play. That is why I chose the 1894 over the 77/44.

Jeff

[JoeH]

I recently acquired a Marlin 94c in .357, one of the JM Marlins. I haven't yet tried any cast out of it, that will come later when things warm up outside. I can tell you it feeds everything I have tried in it. It will even feed a .38 special wadcutter from the magazine! Years ago I had a Winchester 94 and the Winchester will feed a longer round than the Marlin but that one was never a tack driver.

[csatrustburg]

Great guys I really thank all of you for your time I have been torn but really think its a win win either way a new gun! Just hope it shoots boolits good I have found almost a full five gallon bucket of WW that need some work soon as the weather breaks! Another year of testing soon as I make a decision on what to get.

[wonderwolf]

I have the 77/357 and love it. Feeding issues depend on the strength of the spring first I have found and bullet design second. I've put a lot of ammo through mine and taken several ground hogs with it. I've shot lots of wadcutters through it as well and it will feed them, the key is to cycle the bolt smartly every time (at least that works for me).

My problem is I like to shoot with irons instead of glass but this rifle isn't something that I rely on to put meat on the table although I wouldn't hesitate to use it for that, It a companion to my 5" GP100 which gives me a nice common caliber to have "around the woods".

The scope I use is a Older K 2.5

http://wonderwolfs.blogspot.com/2015/12/ruger-77357-accuracy-with-125gr-38.html
http://wonderwolfs.blogspot.com/

The above has a few notes on the 77/357 and what I've done to mine. Also have some info about shooting the .38 short colt in it.

[ironhead7544]

The lever rifles can be fussy about ammo. The 77/44 has a magazine that will only take the factory length ammo or shorter.

My 77/44 would feed anything that would fit in the magazine. It also had no problems with the heavier bullets. The 1894 might be set up for 1.610 or in the later models, 1.710. My 2000 year production 44 Mag Cowboy will take 1.710 and will feed the Keith bullet. The 1894 is not accurate with over 265 gr bullets. That is not really a handicap. The Marin bore generally runs over size and mine needs a .433 bullet for best accuracy.

You will have to find a bullet that will work with both rifle and revolver. Not too big of a deal. You will have to do a bit of testing and shoot more.

[csatrustburg]

This is good I have a friend that PC boolits for me so the molds I already have will work just need more sizing dies plus we have a gunshow this weekend might run across some good deals on something the 125 grain info was great we have a Noe 356-135 HTC mold so that could work too. Thanks guys for everything.

[Leadforbrains]

I love my Ruger 77/.357. It kills deer just fine and it groups well with a 160gr cast lead FN boolit over 2400. Easily one of my favorites.

[robg]

The .357 is such a flexible round and so easy to cast for and load,cheap to

[csatrustburg]

I have a line on a pres cross bolt nm stamp 357 for five hope it comes through missed a 77/44 for five last weekend

[singleshot]

I have the same experience as ironhead, 77/44 will feed anything. Likes boolits much better than j's. 4.5" vs 10" groups at 200m.

[robinsroost]

I had a Rossi model 92 or 93 in .357 magnum that loaded and shot LSWC's without any problems and was very accurate. I couldn't put a scope on it because it ejected from the top. I still have an 1894 Marlin in .44 magnum with a Pro-Point red dot scope on top. It will also load, chamber and shoot LSWC's well. It is a great 100 yard deer and hog gun.........robin

[W.R.Buchanan]

I might as well insert my .02 here. The 77/44's can shoot SWC's just fine as long as you load them in .44 Special Cases. Limit in the mag is 1.610ish. or you can also single load longer cartridges.

On the Marlins if you chamfer the chamber mouth they will feed anything. Most will feed SWC's at 1.68 out of the box without problems. With a simple mod to the lifter and they will feed longer. However the twist rate is still 1:38 so anything over about 280 gr is iffy. I have heard that a lot of guys get good results with the Lee 310 gr boolits and they can be loaded short enough so they will work in either the Ruger or the Marlin.

All of the above are solid 150 yard guns and if you can shoot they'll go to 200. I shoot Short Range Silhouette with mine and the boolits go 200 meters just fine and knock down 55lb Rams with authority, when I can connect! Mind you hitting a Steel Target in the butt really doesn't matter, on a deer it probably would, and you should assess your real world skills before attempting a questionable shot on a game animal...

Randy

[Fenring]

The Lee 310gr WFN works fine in the Ruger .44 rotary mag. I load them in my 96/44, 20gr of H110 / ADI2205 = 1500fps. Air cooled COWW's. Get 'spansion.

[BigMagShooter]

does twist really matter a lot in the 357?

[Lonegun1894]

It does make a huge difference just like it does in anything else. I mean, you will be able to do something with the rifle regardless of twist, but the question is will you be able to do what you want? In my case, I have a Rossi 92 in .357 with 1:30" twist. It does great with 158gr boolits, my most used bullet. I have tried a 180gr, and accuracy was spotty. It would shoot an excellent group, then ruin it with a shot that shows a bit of wobble. I got a 200gr mold for my .35 Rem a couple months ago, so tried it in this rifle too, not expecting good results, and got a shotgun pattern with mostly keyholes at 25yds. Now these same 200gr boolits shoot well in my .357 Contender with a faster twist ( I want to say 1:16 or 18" IIRC).

I looked it up, and TC factory twist for all .35s, including .357 Mag, is 1:14" twist, so I was wrong in thinking 1:16-18".

[Rally]

I agree with Singleshot. My 77/44 shoots patterns with J's, no matter the weight. It shoots the Noe 432-265 dimple point real well.
My Marlin 336 in .44 mag loves the same bullet as the 77/44 and both like them sized .431.
My Marlin 1894 in .44 likes the same bullet but needs to be just lubed and shot as cast. I'm looking for a .432 sizer die.
My 1894 in .357 loves the Noe 360-180 and also seems to prefer the dimple points.
If you decide to get a lever gun, I'd advise you look hard at the Ranch dog moulds and get an RG mould so you can test both HP and DP versions in your rifle.

[Iowa Fox]

Ralley, I had Buckshot make me a 432 sizing die. Best money I spent chasing the 44. I was suspicious the 431 needed to be a little bigger and I'm lucky as several of my molds drop over 433. It made all the difference in the world, should have him make me a 433.

[Three-Fifty-Seven]

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[Rally]

Thanks Iowa Fox.
I'd heard Buckshot made them, then heard he wasn't making them anymore. I'll have to get in touch with him to find out for sure.