Lighting

[fred2892]

20 years ago I built my reloading room/shed/workshop. It is timber built and has stood the rest of time very well. This spring I plan to upgrade the electrics, more sockets in better places, upgraded consumer unit and new wiring.
But what about the lighting? Lighting technology is now light years ahead of where it was 20 years ago and to be honest I don't know the difference between LED and a candle.
Room is 16' x 8', bench is 3' x14' and holds a 2 foot casting area, 2 Dillons a redding T7, a couple of lubesizers, a rockchucker and a bench mounted powder thrower and is currently lit by 3 five foot fluorescent tubes.
I am open to any ideas and suggestions for how to light this area, I am not interested in cost, just efficiency.
Please school me on new technology and feel free to tell me if I am wasting my time and should just stick with the fluorescent tubes.
Thanks
Fred

[dragon813gt]

What tubes are you using and how much do you use the shop? LED is still rather expensive. Amazon sells LED conversion kits so you have a reference. Another option is to replace the ballasts w/ newer more efficient ones. I'm using current technology fluorescents. The cost to upgrade to LEDs isn't worth it for me. Especially when there is minimal cost savings.

If you decide to go LED just be aware that there is usually a plethora of bulb color options. For a shop the daylight spectrum is what you would want. But some people don't like that color lighting.

[dudel]

I used the High Output (HO) tubes in the garage, and they replaced a number of the standard tubes. Available from HD and Lowes. Lit up a 40x40 garage with just 6 HO tubes.

[Three44s]

The prices on LED equipment has come down a long ways and the longer life factors into the equation as well.

I also like the fact that LED works MUCH better in cold environments. I like having light now and not in an hour from now.

My load room is still mainly lit with Fl. but have small working lights that are LED. When we have a working unit, we keep running it. If it needs a ballast or replacement we can it and shop for a deal on a LED unit however.

Three 44s

[fred2892]

What tubes are you using and how much do you use the shop?

3 to 4 hours per day, every day. These units were not new when I fitted them in my shed, they were at least 10 years old, so a total of 30 years up to now on the original tubes. This is whats printed on the tubes

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/16/01/20/606ed1701bc2f46a472c773fa02653b9.jpg

[quietmike]

I just installed this light over my bench.
Incredible amount of light compared to a standard fluorescent.
It looks like sunshine, so far very happy with it.

http://www.amazon.com/Feit-917972-Electric-Utility-Light/dp/B00LFAY5SM/ref=sr_1_1?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1453308701&sr=1-1&keywords=Feit+917972

[oldcanadice]

I'd go with the LEDs. The ones I have are WAY better than the fluorescents they replaced. They seem to give off way more light and the daylight color is more brilliant.

I put in essentially the same leds as quietmike references in my garage and in the laundry area. The difference is that I got mine at Costco for $40 and I think they are now on sale for $30. Costco also has a direct replacement for fluorescent tubes, but I don't know how good those are. You might want to look into that kind of option.

BTW: I am also replacing all of our incandescent bulbs with leds as the bulbs burn out. I find the light from a 40 watt equivalent led seems brighter that a 60 watt incandescent.

[jsizemore]

If you use a digital scale, some don't like fluorescents. There are a bunch of direct replacements for incandescents at the home centers. There are under counter task lights that can piggyback electrically to give you light exactly where you want it. Check some of the displays for light color that fits your needs. Daylight can be a bit too much up close. Most folks favor soft white.

[fishboy747]

I am paying 28.00 for replacement LED lights from Costco here in Alaska and I have removed the compact florescence light bulbs and what a difference in light output much brighter IMHO you would make a mistake if you used anything but LED's save on energy 28 watts each versus 40 per bulb on normal florescent lights.

[dragon813gt]

The daylight color will screw up your circadian rhythms if you spend a lot of time around it at night. This is something to consider because it is real. A softer, more yellow, light is desired for nighttime use.

[smokeywolf]

Although I'm a strong proponent of LED lighting, dragon is right. Higher kelvin temperatures (blueish light) can disrupt sleep patterns and contribute to a weakening of your immune system. I would use lighting above a color temperature of 4,000 degrees kelvin, sparingly.

4,000 is still considered a white light, while 5,000 degrees kelvin is a bluish white.

[triggerhappy243]

well I like a well lit work area with out anything casting shadows. My reloading room is painted gloss white. I have lights directly over the work area, so I do not light up the whole room. Fluorescent lighting is a whole lot cheaper to buy than L.E.D. If the wall your bench is up against is pure white, it will reflect the light back at the bench... thus eliminating most of the shadows.Also, If your lights extend past each end of your bench, it better lights up the sides of what you are working on.... Again, no shadows.

[triggerhappy243]

forgot to mention, the newer tubes are available in a variety of output,lumins, as well as color.

[popper]

Cree® LED T8 Series tubes, Powered by Cree TrueWhite® Technology, the Cree LED T8 Series delivers the industry’s best color quality and accuracy in both 3500K and 4000K color temperatures. Its innovative oval shaped design allows for more uplight than other LED replacement lamps, creating more uniform light output during its 50,000-hour lifetime. The Cree LED T8 Series’ patent-pending circuit design enables compatibility with Instant Start, Programmed Start, Rapid Start and most dimmable fluorescent ballasts. The most compatible LED T8 replacement tube on the market, the Cree LED T8 Series provides flexibility for customers looking for an easy upgrade to LED, especially for education, health care and commercial office applications.
Germans have been working a solution for a while too, forget the name of the LED manufacturer (Seimens?). If you go LED, Cree makes good ones (LEDs) to spec. No poor ones to wink out on you like the crud from China. They are not just an assembler. Don't work for Cree but used a lot for Boeing, don't work for them either.
The fixture they are installed in will make a lot of difference in the light pattern and brightness, light angle is normally 45-60 deg.
edit: 6 years designing various LED systems before I was retired.

[dragon813gt]

Another thing to consider w/ the LED tubes is how they disperse the light. Popper brought up the angle. Most of the tubes just focus the light down w/ a very narrow throw. Just another piece that complicates things. If I was going to install LEDs it would be a fixture w/ out tubes.

[lightman]

I'm retired from the electrical business, but I'm not really up on LED's. They are getting cheaper, and better. You could do much worse that using old school T-8 fluorescent fixtures. You get good output, good color and no/little warm up time. For LED, I would do some research, maybe talk with a salesman at a wholesale electric place. I have better luck with fixtures from wholesale electric places than the cheaper stuff that you get at the big box stores. I'll be looking at LED conversions soon, myself. It sounds like popper knows something about them, maybe worth checking it out.

[smokeywolf]

I'm retired from the electrical business, but I'm not really up on LED's. They are getting cheaper, and better. You could do much worse that using old school T-8 fluorescent fixtures. You get good output, good color and no/little warm up time. For LED, I would do some research, maybe talk with a salesman at a wholesale electric place. I have better luck with fixtures from wholesale electric places than the cheaper stuff that you get at the big box stores. I'll be looking at LED conversions soon, myself. It sounds like popper knows something about them, maybe worth checking it out.

LEDs have a near zero warm up. Rise and fall time on LEDs is 7 nanoseconds. I did some experimentation with LEDs back in 1999 for use as a light source for motion picture film projection used in optical effects and image transfer.

[Gumberc563]

When I got out of the Army in 2013 and moved into our current house I decided to update all of the lighting in my shop. Part of my shop is used for wood turning and part is for firearms. I went with LED bulbs, not the long florescent style but more like a traditional bulb. I bought 6 of the "sunlight" color (I believe it is in the 57K range, the box will say sunlight). When they are all on it is Bright! I have them hanging down from the ceiling over my lathe, work bench and 2 that turn on independently for when I need it really bright. It did hurt the wallet a little buying the bulbs, if memory serves each bulb was in the $50-$60 range. I wont be going back to florescent bulbs.

[bangerjim]

I still use standard fluorescent "shop" light tubes in all my 20+ fixtures in my 3 shops. The BIG diameter ones! I bought 2 cases of tubes last year when I found out they were going to those stupid little diameter ones.

I have looked at LED tube lights but at $35+/fixture......they are still on the shelf at Costco/Sam's store!

I date all my tubes and get normally 3-4 years of life out of one, averaging 3-5 hours a day.

Still cannot beat standard fluorescent 40 watt (or equivalent) tubes. I have 4 more new fixtures in the boxes stored away for replacements, if ever needed. I have never had a ballast/starter go out in the newer fixtures I have.

banger

[TXGunNut]

Should finish up my shop this year, will have fluorescent tubes for general lighting and LED's over work areas. I won't keep it very warm out there in the winter time so LED's will be a good plan. Will put in plenty of outlets for more lighting as the shop evolves. Also have a translucent panel in the roof so daytime projects will benefit from good ol' natural light.

[lefty o]

put all led in the new room i built. will never go back to flourescents. doesnt cost any more to buy a good LED fixture, they run on half the wattage, they dont lose color/brightness like flourescent tubes, and they last a very long time. i believe mine are in the 3500k range over my benches, and i really like them.

[fred2892]

Thanks for all the advice. I have found that my fittings and tubes are T12 standard. I plan to keep the fittings and replace the tubes with T8 which use the same fittings. I then intend to fit LED lighting under the lower shelves that are at the back of my benches.
My only question now is the colour range for the LED bench lighting. I'm thinking higher up the range towards the 5000k as it will be switched lighting and independent from the overhead tubes and will only be on when I am actually reloading/casting/sizing.

[lightman]

The T-8"s use the same lamp holders as the T-12"s but you will have to change the ballast. Thats not a hard job on 4ft fixtures but requires a little more work on the 8ft fixtures. There is a diagram on each ballast if you need it.

[lefty o]

i think youll find somewhere between 3500-5000K will be what your looking for. any lower and they are piss yellow and useless.

[flashhole]

Wow - never saw so much bull chit in my life.

I ran the nations premier lighting standards lab for 7 years and interfaced directly with the photometry and radiometry departments at the National Bureau of Standards (NBS), now the National Institute for Science and Technology (NIST). These are the people who define what lighting is, luminosity and color, and how you measure it.

LEDs come in two flavors of white - discrete Red, Green and Blue emitters contained in a single package (rare) - the combination of which, in an additive color system, makes white light by international agreement ... or a yellow phosphor doped onto a blue LED (very common). The blue light from the LED excites the phosphor causing it to re-emit and the aggregate emission of the blue LED with the broad-band emissions of the yellow phosphor is white light. The phosphor chemistry is adjustable to some degree allowing the manufacturer to change the Correlated Color Temperature (a measure of hotness, blue to yellow, hotter to colder respectively) to what is most appealing to the consumer.

Theory says LED technology is ~200 times more efficient than fluorescent technology. In practice they are not quite there but if you look at the energy exchange mechanisms it is not hard to accept.

A fluorescent lamp is an energy exchange system that results in visible light but there are several loss mechanisms.

There are cathodes at both ends of a phorescent lamp. A cathode is a device that generates electrons but in a fluorescent lamp it does double duty as both anode and cathode. Alternating current feeding a ballast will be used on one half sinusoidal cycle to excite a cathode creating a source of electrons available to propagate an arc. The opposite end of the lamp is in cathode mode. On alternating half cycles the situation is reversed. Inside the lamp there is a buffer gas, typically Argon poisoned with a small percentage of Neon. The Argon/Neon mix is optimized so as to strike an arc at the lowest ignition voltage. When the conditions are met to create the plasma, the arc is struck (this arc is called the positive column).

Also in the lamp is a small amount of Mercury. Mercury is the ultra-violet (UV) engine. UV is needed to excite the phosphors deposited on the inside of the lamp. Mercury undergoes a physical state change when exposed to elevated temperatures created by the positive column. It goes from metaloid state to gaseous state. When in gaseous state it undergoes a second physical state change via electron bombardment from the free electrons in the positive column colliding with the Mercury atoms. This excites the Mercury to a momentary, unstable, higher energy level. The Mercury collapses back to a stable state and the collapse generates a UV photon. That photon is absorbed by the phosphor on the inside of the fluorescent lamp and re-emitted as visible light.

Light energy is completely transparent to the wavelength of light it emits no mater the generation mechanism. This helps fluorescent lamps be more efficient with in a reflector housing.

Dr. Crook was the one who solved this puzzle and the space in front of the cathode where the energy exchange takes place is called the Crook space. This is where electrical energy is converted to kinetic energy allowing the fluorescent lamp to work. The energy exchange is not very efficient but was the best we had for more than half a century.

LEDs are a completely different animal. The LED works via electron flow across a "P" and "N" junction. The identical type P/N junction in a transistor or diode except the sandwiched layer is doped with a material that emits visible light when current flows across the junction. The chemistry of the dopant is what determines the color of the LED (Red, Green, Yellow, Blue). Blue LEDs came commercially available around 1997 and satisfied the third color requirement for an additive color system. The color primaries in an additive color system are Red, Green and Blue. With these 3 primaries all other colors in the CIE color spectrum can be generated. You pick what spectrum is desirable to you.

It is more economically feasible to make white light by adding a yellow phosphor to a blue exciter because the blue energy

LED lighting requires DC to meet the forward voltage requirements for illumination, not AC. A converter is needed to operate any LED light source. There is a bit of a conversion loss going from AC to DC but you are still better off (energy wise and light efficiency) with LEDs. In our lifetime we will see LED lighting systems dominate commercial lighting applications.