38s/w webley

[toallmy]

I have a set of 38s/w dies and some brass coming from a member hear. But I want to use loading a 38 webley , with over sized bullets. What sort of problems will I run into with this project such as resizing , case mouth expanding, seating ...... I understand it is a very open question with so little detail from me. So as soon as I get the stuff in front of me I'd like to know ,or have an idea what to start on. This is for a younger brother with a Webley that has the larger bore. I am going to work now , but would appreciate all advice . Need to find some cast bullets for the project as well. I'll check back this evening .I am going to keep looking through the archives a lot of info on the old webley. Thanks for all thoughts.:veryconfu:veryconfu:veryconfu

[Outpost75]

RCBS makes a .38 S&W "Cowboy" die set which has the proper expander plug for the larger bullets.

Or you can just buy a Lee 9x18mm Makarov die set and substitute a .38 Special shell holder.

[chevyiron420]

Well, its going to depend a lot on your dies, boolits, and the gun. I am not experienced with the Webley, but I do load this round for my Regulation Police and a H&R 926. A few years back a lot of the dies over sized the cases and your loaded rounds would end up looking like a coke bottle. If you get dies like that case life will be short and you expander plug will be even more critical. What I mean is, if the plug doesnt match the length and diameter of your boolit, the tight case will size down your boolit when seated. Thats why I chose the Makarov dies. Maybe the cowboy dies are better, I dont know.
Boolits are another issue, what weight and design are you going to use? .361 diameter boolits are not oversize for this cartridge, but normal. My smith wants .363. You need to slug your barrel and cylinder to find out what size boolits are needed. Also, overall length is very important. The 38S&W likes a boolit with a short shank and long nose, just backwards of most modern designs. I seat to 1.150 and have a lot of shank sticking out of the case. If you have your boolits sized to a snug thumb pressure fit in the throats, then you may have problems with the rounds hanging up the gun. My H&R does this. Anyway you cant just stuff any boolit down the case to the crimp groove and call it good. Powder space is cramped in this short rascal.
Phil

[Ballistics in Scotland]

The bullet diameter shouldn't be a problem. The American version of this cartridge usually had a .361in. bullet, just the same as the Webley, and I very much doubt if anybody made dies that wouldn't work well with it. The question should rather be whether you can get by with .357 bullets, if you have a mould or supply of them. Maybe your combination of brass and dies will give the cases a grip on the bullets, and in that case you might get acceptable accuracy. It is more likely with a soft bullet than a hard one, but a lot of commercial casters or swagers go a lot harder than this revolver needs.

Older civilian Webleys could be sighted for the 145gr. bullet, but the military cartridge and sights were originally for 200gr., modified later to about 175gr. But most military revolvers aren't so marked. So you will have to find the load which makes the height of impact right. If you are really lucky you might have one with an interchangeable front sight blade, which is easily replaced with a higher or lower one.

[Ilwil]

I had S&W (Lendlease), Enfield and Webley revolvers in this caliber. I used Lee dies to load for them, and they worked fine. At one point, I bought some jacketed .360s thinking the accuracy of the revolvers would improve. (They weren't bad with cast .358s, just nothing special.) The dies handled the .360s just fine, and they all shot well, but alas, with no better accuracy. So, I moved them all, and got out of the .38 S&W game. I traded the Lendlease gun, marked "Osterreich Politzei" at our big gun show for a cherry Springfield trapdoor, made in 1866, in .50-70. I may never shoot it, but its a lot more fun to look at, adorning one side of my book case.

[toallmy]

I will try to begal a mold , I have a 38 swc that cast at 360 as is. But I guess I'm going to have to wait and see about the dies. Well I'll cast a few with some tape in the mold and see about the fit in the cylinder and barrel. I have a lot of time for this , it is just for fun , and my little brother will be tickled to be able to hit a pop can. He has shot some 38 s/w out of it but thay were undersized for the gun. But he loves his strange guns. Sometimes we go shooting some clay targets he'll get out his blunder bust.

[9.3X62AL]

Both my Webley-Enfield and S&W M&P Lend-Lease 38/200s have .362"-.363" throats. A smaller Colt Police Positive (c. 1920) has .359" throats. You pays your money and takes your chances. The Colt and S&W shoot quite well, while the W/E will keep all shots inside the "7-bottle" of a B-27 target at 50 yards.

I use an NEI #169A casting that duplicates a 200 grain RN design specific to the earlier 38/200 loadings. It only gets 675-700 FPS, but 200 grains smacking an iron target leaves no doubt that it was hit, even at those modest velocities.

[toallmy]

I thank you gentlemen for the thoughts .

[Bigslug]

I'm running .361" slugs in the Lee die set with no drama whatsoever.

NOE's got two mold designs that will be fine in your Webley. I'm running the 364-200RN and it shoots great, although as it turns out, it's not a historically correct slug. I came after the party was, but I believe some research signals got mixed and what was created was a more conical profile closer to that of the WWII 178 grain FMJ. Don't bother me none, and it looks like it'll make a pretty good .35 Remington bullet too.

The other one is the correct MKI round nose.

Both are here: http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/index.php?cPath=38&osCsid=3rev2trn00havuo2k9ddbtrj21

[bouncer50]

I have two Webley in 38 S&W they were made in 1942 they are double action only. It take too men and a boy to work the double action only trigger. Keep you reload on the weak side the break open design is weak point on the webley. I use 358 size bullets cast with almost pure lead to upset in the chamber. I am happy to get a 4 to 5 inch group at 15 yards with that damm heavy trigger pull. The bullet only goes about 600 fps. The British learn in the weather months the Gremans had on heavy wool jackets that made them almost bullet proof to the 38 S&W rounds. Another thing they did was went they ran out of 38 S&W ammo they would take 9MM ammo and tie wire around the rim and shot that instead. Not very safe to do but something to shot is better then no gun at all.

[9.3X62AL]

Hmmm.....my Webley-Enfield is also a DAO, and its trigger is firm but not the worst-ever stroke I've encountered. THAT award goes to my re-arsenaled Nagant M-1895 revolver, hands down.

Using the NEI #169A mould design for the 38/200 caliber creates a curious situation. The bullet at .810" in length is longer than the case it fits into (.775"). Not a thunder-and-lightning Magnum, but I won't stand downrange with a fielder's glove to catch them for recycling, either.

[toallmy]

I am just going to try to get a safe light plinker out of it , and a pop can at 25-50 ft. would tickel him. I am a middle aged man that still likes chunking rocks.

[Salmoneye]

My Albion Motors Enfield No2 Mk1** has .356" throats...

I load 158gr Truncated Cone boolits from Penn @.358" using .38spcl dies...

The load I use is 2gr Red Dot...This is from the old Lyman manual #44...