I don't get it. Another 9mm fail.

[kryogen]

I tried again today, after hitek, pc (all failed), with 45-45-10 recluse tumble lube, and guess what, I got the worst leading in history.
OEM glock 17.

PC leads the less, hitek is next, and lube is worst.
COWW alloy. sized 357, 1 mil over barrel. Mildest load that will cycle the glock. Expanded with 38 expander. No swaging. No scraping, no FCD, no nothing. Pass plunk.
minimal crimp to plunk
pulled rounds are still 357

I use a medium load that will cycle the glock properly. Anything less does not cycle. (but with that 105 bullet, it has to go pretty fast to cycle, so that's maybe the issue. will go to a 124 weight).

I don't get it. Why does this refuse to stop leading. I am starting to be seriously annoyed.

Only 2 things I see now:

1: the OEM glock barrel leads no matter what with lube.
2: my COWW alloy is too ****ty and just smears down the barrel.

I've been trying for 2 years, there is nothing I didnt try.
I am seriously just about to sell all this, and buy boxes of cheap 124RN plated bullets.....

The only solution left would be to try PC + lube, since PC almost didnt lead (minimal after 100 rounds).
But seriously, I don't have time to PC. I have a baby.

Recluse lube gave worst results, smooth bore after 40 rounds. That's bad.

Any ideas? Is my alloy that bad?

lee 105 swc mold.

[Omega]

Try .02 over bore, it sounds like you are sizing too small.

[pretzelxx]

Try 358. Might not be getting a good fill.

Also, if you're running a large crimp you run the risk of resizing with the brass and shrinking the boolit diameter. To find out, pull a boolit after you've loaded it, I had a little too much on a few and that was about the same results you got.

[kryogen]

crimp is minimum to pass plunk in the glock. I would say it's quite light.
pulled rounds are still 357.

seriously, 2 mils over? When I tried that with pc and hitek, leading was worse.

[Scharfschuetze]

There's a thread (sticky I believe) about getting Glocks to use cast boolits. Probably in the Handgun Forum.

I size my boolits to .358" for all my 9mm semi-autos and 38/357 revolvers and use that diameter in all of 'em with good results. I did have to get slightly larger expanders (.355") for my Dillon press made so that overly tight neck walls don't squeeze the boolits down to a smaller diameter than .358."

Glock rifling has traditionally taken more care or technique to avoid leading. First option is probably to try the larger diameter with the PC boolits. You might also try the 147 grain boolits at a lower velocity and see how that works for you.

The final option, should all else fail, is to buy a conventionally rifled barrel for your Glock.

[RobS]

Possibly try a harder boolit to make sure you are not skidding the rifling. I have not tried to powder coat and then drop from the oven into a bucket of cold water but that may be an option and others have done so successfully. Note: it will take a few days to a week to reach full hardness of water quenched. Also I've found that even a powder coated air cooled WW boolit does better when allowed to age harden for a week and better if two weeks before reloading/shooting. This is the same as when not powder coating.

A thought to your larger diameter boolits: The larger boolit diameter may have left you with a boolit that was being shaved at the end of the chamber due to a short/sharp throat and the boolits will leave bit of scraped off lead and then it's a snowball effect from there as each boolit after passes through the barrel.

The 9mm can be PITA to get right due to the higher pressures, tough cases, barrels with short/abrupt throats, getting the correct boolit diameter, finding the right allow and lube etc. etc. I've found that using a slower powder and not pushing for velocities helps. Something like HS-6 and run the velocities around 900 - 950 fps with a 120-125 grain boolit. Keep working at it, look at the barrel throat and also look into working a harder boolit to stop any possible boolit skid.

[SSGOldfart]

Wolf barrels sold by Dillon are about 100 bucks problem solved I just ordered one for my son last week,same problem.
It's glock rifling???

[kryogen]

did the barrel solve your issues?

(in canada it's probably 300$, but if it fixes it, it's worth it....)

[dkf]

Your coated bullets pass the smash test?

Try sizing to .358 and water drop some of the bullets after they get out of the oven. I am shooting 150gr cast bullets out of my .357sig Glocks with pretty good accuracy. Didn't get any leading with my baked on VHT epoxy paint coated bullets. Just got a little leading towards the muzzle with alox. I don't think the bullet held enough alox and ran out of lube towards the muzzle. I was sizing some .357" and some .358". I was using HS-6 with them, starting loads up slightly past max.

If you decide to go with an aftermarket barrel, get a KKM. They are throated better for cast and a better barrel which is made in the US.

[sigep1764]

358 and lyman supermoly lube with a 358 expander for the sdb made by lathesmith has resulted in no leading in my stock glock barrels. What type of press are you loading on? There are several solutions to expand your brass to 357-358, depending on what youre using. If youre using conventional dies, a 38 s&w expander will work. If using the sdb, contact lathesmith.

[sigep1764]

Where are you located? If youre in missouri or near, pm me.

[castalott]

Pull some of your reloads apart to inspect and measure the slugs. Maybe somewhere something is sizing them down too small... ( I know your frustration...I like revolvers...)

[Handloader109]

I size to 356 for all my 9mm and no issues with leading. Pc doesn't leave anything in my g17. If it just won't work, I'd get a barrel. Just ordered a lone wolf for my g17 that is threaded:-) was only 109,so pretty chrap

[dudel]

Supposedly you can shoot lead in Glock barrels. I don't; but from what I hear everything has to be just so right. Too narrow of a tolerance window for me. I don't want to have to alloy, cast, size and lube 9mm Boolits for a specific gun.

So, I widened the tolerance window with a Lone Wolf barrel. Shoots all my lead fine, and no special things have to be done. Was less than $100 (probably more in Canada). If it's too much, plated might be a good choice. All my Glock barrels shoot plated just fine. Not all that expensive considering the "free" lead is not as available as it once was.

[Hickok]

Doesn't cost much, order a Lee 358-125-RF, cast with ACWW, size to .358" and see if it cures your problem. A lot cheaper than a new barrel.

[Garyshome]

+1 on the Lone wolf barrel, put one in my g 23 ran 4 or 5 hundred [Lee 401-175-tc] cast /lubed with LLA no leading at all. I was surprised the barrel was that clean, in fact the only reason I cleaned it was because my ruger lcp was leaded up pretty well, and my S&W 469 was gummed up from the LLA. No Glock bulge either!
The Glock barrel always got leaded up pretty bad.

[Petrol & Powder]

9mm drives me crazy because the barrels are all over the map. I agree that you may need to size to .358"
I know you measured some pulled bullets and got a .357" reading but I would also be willing to bet the base of the bullet was even less than that. You might have a very small band than is .357" but there's a strong possibility that the base of the bullet is a smaller diameter.
If you have a base that is .356" and only one little "belt" that is .357", you might be getting gas cutting around that very small band. The anvil of your micrometer could be reading that larger diameter and bridging over the lower (narrow) section of the bullet base.

[ioon44]

"2: my COWW alloy is too ****ty and just smears down the barrel."

could be on to something here

[Victor N TN]

Before I ever had a Glock, I had a Lewis Lead Remover. Brownell's still has them for about $30

[GabbyM]

If your alloy is nothing but plain WW air cooled it won’t shoot good in any 9mm. Regardless of what anyone tells you on the internet. Heat treat your WW bullets and they should work.


When you get tired of shooting those toy pistols. Do what us old men do and get a S&W 38 Special revolver. [smilie=s:

[Victor N TN]

I'm still back and forth between my 1911s in 45 acp and my S&W 629 x 6" 44 mag. I only take the 22 pistol when my grandkids want to shoot. Both our daughters even carry 45s.

But to each his or her own.

[runfiverun]

I'd look at the throat in the gun itself.
2 minutes and a couple of twists with a throating reamer would probably fix this.

[OBXPilgrim]

I had leading and keyholing in my g26 until i started sizing to .358 and throwing some lino or mono in with the coww to harden it up. Now its non-existant. I also like a little slower burning powder like Win WSF or Power Pistol or SR4756. Couldnt get good group out of mine with bullseye or reddot.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

kryogen,
It would be interesting to see if a GC boolit would solve your problems ...and it'd be interesting to know if a GC didn't solve the problem ? I have the RD TLC356-135 RF (6cav Lee, GC style mold)(not for sale). I could cast some for you, to try a test, if you want?

But I should add, I've only cast with this mold once, many years ago (right after I got it), That was before I honed my casting skills. According to my notes, the mold produced out of round boolits that day, measuring .355-.357 maybe they'll drop a better size, now that I'm not as much of a newbie caster, as I was back then :oops:
Jon

[Dusty Bannister]

This is your OP for this thread.
I tried again today, after hitek, pc (all failed), with 454510, and guess what, I got the worst leading in history.
OEM glock 17.

Just exactly what is the bullet that you are not having any success with?

[kryogen]

lee 358-105 SWC

I tried PB gas checks, didnt fix it.

[dkf]

Try a 124-147gr bullet.

[kryogen]

I could try to add alum tape to my 356-124RN mold to make it drop 360 or so, and then size 358.

The 105 of course is quite light and goes fast... but it punches nice round holes in paper and I like that.

My 357 bullets drop freely in the fired cases. I have been told that this would mean that I should size 358.
I'll try a few sized 358 and see.

Or I could consider buying a rifled barrel that might have a tighter chamber and throat.

[Geezer in NH]

I tried again today, after hitek, pc (all failed), with 454510, and guess what, I got the worst leading in history.
OEM glock 17.

PC leads the less, hitek is next, and lube is worst.
COWW alloy. sized 357, 1 mil over barrel. Mildest load that will cycle the glock. Expanded with 38 expander. No swaging. No scraping, no FCD, no nothing. Pass plunk.
minimal crimp to plunk
pulled rounds are still 357

I don't get it. Why does this refuse to stop leading. I am starting to be seriously annoyed.

Only 2 things I see now:

1: the OEM glock barrel leads no matter what with lube.
2: my COWW alloy is too ****ty and just smears down the barrel.

I've been trying for 2 years, there is nothing I didnt try.
I am seriously just about to sell all this, and buy boxes of cheap 124RN plated bullets.....

The only solution left would be to try PC + lube, since PC almost didnt lead (minimal after 100 rounds).
But seriously, I don't have time to PC. I have a baby.

Recluse lube gave worst results, smooth bore after 40 rounds. That's bad.

Any ideas? Is my alloy that bad?
Seating must have been hard as 45 bullets don't feed well in a Glock 17

[jonp]

I'd try water dropping them for a higher BHN and then both .357 and .358. Next would be heat treating for harder yet. Did I miss what you are using for lube and powder?

I'm not familiar with the 454510 in a 9mm. Are you sure of that number? It sounds like a 45 caliber mold. I can say I've never gotten 105gr to work right in my 9mm semi-autos. I'd try a heavier boolit. Some guns just don't like something and thats it. I've got a couple of Kahr CW45's that will not work with a 165gr boolit no matter what and 185gr cast are more trouble than their worth

[kryogen]

454510 is recluse tumble lube.

[zomby woof]

Harder better boolits. 9mm can be difficult.

[dubber123]

If your alloy is nothing but plain WW air cooled it won’t shoot good in any 9mm. Regardless of what anyone tells you on the internet. Heat treat your WW bullets and they should work.


When you get tired of shooting those toy pistols. Do what us old men do and get a S&W 38 Special revolver. [smilie=s:

While it may be true that the polygonal rifling in Glocks needs harder lead, my 9mm's do very well with AIR COOLED WW's. I never need to brush them, just an oily patch before storage. I do shoot .358" in 2, and one, a Walther, gets .359" I would size as large as will freely chamber. From fooling with a coworkers Glock 9mm, that may be quite large indeed..

I do agree the .38 Spl is much easier to work with, so I keep a dozen or so of them around. :)

[kryogen]

will try heat treated 358 and report.

[fredj338]

I can range ac range scrap in my glocks with any of those options with minimal to no leading. You could just have an ugly rough barrel. Certainly try water quenching. Is the bbl newer or does it have a few 1000 rds of jacketed down it?

[kryogen]

2000 or so. Its mirror smooth.....

[swmass]

Just got through with a year long 9mm casting **** show for lack of better words. Used 45/45/10, tumble lube lee mold, and 120gn tc. The Barrel slugged at 0.355. I sized the TC bullets to 356 and tumble lubed them...got really bad leading. The TL bullets keyholed and leaded like hell too. Finally switched to the lee 125gn 358 mold, sized to 357 with water quenched wheel weights (all of my bullets were quenched wheel weights). I also started pan lubing. I fill the crimp groove with lube as well giving me 2 grease grooves. No more leading for me and I couldn't be happier. Shot a few sub 2 inch groups at 15 yards as well so they're good to go for me. Also, pan lubing has worked awesome for me and I've had no troubles at all using half paraffin, half Vaseline and a tablespoon of stp. I was hesitant after seeing people complain about pan lubing but it's been pretty damn easy for me... I'm shooting them out of a lone wolf in a glock

[MtGun44]

Air cooled clip on wheel weights works fine for me.

What lube? LBT soft blue is a good one, as is NRA 50-50. Hardness is typically not a
primary factor. Try larger diameter.

STRONG recommendation for Lee 120 gr Truncated Cone bullet with conventional
lube groove, NRA 50-50 at .358.

[GabbyM]

While it may be true that the polygonal rifling in Glocks needs harder lead, my 9mm's do very well with AIR COOLED WW's. I never need to brush them, just an oily patch before storage. I do shoot .358" in 2, and one, a Walther, gets .359" I would size as large as will freely chamber. From fooling with a coworkers Glock 9mm, that may be quite large indeed..

I do agree the .38 Spl is much easier to work with, so I keep a dozen or so of them around. :)

My response is simple. WW is a scrap metal item. Ones I've worked with over the last several years have run about BHN #9. Tested with a Saeco unit. Then using the conversion sheet. This is opposed to what some say they get with a BHN #12 from air cooled WW.

I have melted down around four thousand pounds of scrap WW this century. None of which has been any where near hard enough to make a decent 9mm bullet. WW is not an alloy description it is a type of scrap metal. I do not use straight WW for my 38 Special bullets. Since it's not good enough. Scrap yard pays eight cents a pound for WW and that's all they are worth.

[6622729]

My response is simple. WW is a scrap metal item. Ones I've worked with over the last several years have run about BHN #9. Tested with a Saeco unit. Then using the conversion sheet. This is opposed to what some say they get with a BHN #12 from air cooled WW.

I have melted down around four thousand pounds of scrap WW this century. None of which has been any where near hard enough to make a decent 9mm bullet. WW is not an alloy description it is a type of scrap metal. I do not use straight WW for my 38 Special bullets. Since it's not good enough. Scrap yard pays eight cents a pound for WW and that's all they are worth.

I'm shooting 124gr truncated cone and 124gr round nose from straight clip on wheel weight alloy, water dropped from Lee molds and loaded as cast. I'm shooting them in Glock 19 lubed with 45/45/10 and have no issues with either the stock barrel or the KKM barrel. They test 12-14 hardness.

To the OP, I suggest you forget the powder coating and use the 45/45/10 lube and size for .358. Go back and cast a few and water drop them to harden them up a little. Continue with a medium crimp for now. Use a mid powder load and see how that does for you. What powder and charge are you using by the way?

[depoloni]

What POWDER are you using?
I had some hiccups regardless of doing things "right" in several 9mm pistols with cast early in. With Titegroup and several other particularly fast powders.

Now before I get torched because I know full well a lotta folks use Titegroup in 9mm... I still use a lot of it in 45acp with zero problems. And it may have been something I was doing that I never did resolve. But I decided to go back to 231, unique, and several other somewhat slower powders and with the exact same boolits/loads any significant leading went away and accuracy increased.

Only thing I could seem to resolve is that based on recovered boolits (all loads were "mild") the ones with Titegroup had skidded-out grooves in the PC once recovered, whereas the ones with 231, unique, and power pistol did not. I suspected the initial impulse-drive into the lands was causing it but I'm no expert. What I do know is I switched to something a little slower and the problem went away entirely.

[6622729]

I'm using Ramshot Silhouette. I also have HP38 and RE-86 which I haven't tried yet because I was good to go right from the start with Silhouette. The OP never said what he is using. Powder and load are of course huge variables that also must be overcome.

[GhostHawk]

I have no problem casting for 9mm, my Highpoint carbines or my buddy's Beretta 92fs. Bullets soft enough that you can mark them with a thumbnail. But my load is a nice easy 3 gr of Red Dot. Lube is Bens Liquid Lube (on everything)

Good accuracy, and no problems. So if you are having problems, confirm that fit is correct. Actual boolits 1-3 thousands larger than groove. Moderate loads. That includes pulling a loaded round and verifying that it is not getting swaged down in the process. Save the hot stuff for once you have everything working right.

Find a lube that works for you, it has to actually work. For me and many others that is Ben's Liquid lube, being Lee Alox and Johnson's One step floor wax. Easy to mix, less time and effort than PC. DON"T use too much.

Once all that is set and done re-examine your powder choice. Start by backing off to start loads, or a slower powder.

Push a soft boolit too hard and it is going to lead, period.

[btreanor]

Something that helped me a lot with shooting lead boolits in 9mm was to use a slower burning powder. I had huge reductions in leading and much improved accuracy when I switched from Bullseye to HS-6 with the Lee 120 TC (non-TL) design. Also, I never had any luck with that Lee 105 SWC in my 9mm guns.

[Lloyd Smale]

I agree with gabby. Harder is better but all my glocks will shoot cast hps cast out of 5050 ww/pure without leading. I size to 358 and use a good soft lube like felix lube and shoot a jacketed bullet or two through the gun after ever three or four mags. don't remember the last time I ran a brush through one. One thing with cast in a semi auto I make a habbit of is not pushing for the last fps. I allways back off my load by a grain or two from top end. Even if I'm using real hard lead.

[mozeppa]

what good is a 105 grain boolit that moves real fast and punches pretty holes ...if it misses the target and leads up the barrel?

in my experience the grain weight of the the boolit for a 9mm performs better between 124 & 147 grains ...and the profile will still punch pretty holes all that is needed is the right powder combination worked up for it. (seems to be more load data in this range too.)

it might not move fast but accuracy is the goal.

why miss the target at the speed of light? when just below the speed of sound works best?



(edited to say...) NO FIREARM regardless of caliber will shoot its very best at maximum speeds....not just my opinion.

[6622729]

what good is a 105 grain boolit that moves real fast and punches pretty holes ...if it misses the target and leads up the barrel?

Is that what a 454510 mold is, a 105gr bullet? I have been poking around and can't find it to see what the OP is working with.

[sigep1764]

He meant to say 45-45-10. This refers to a lube recipe, 45% something/45% something else/10% one more ingredient. The name of the lube from his post is Recluse, a pretty well used lube. Ive never used liquid lube so i dont know the ingredients.

[kryogen]

I use unique or hp38.
I already have the 120tc but its 356 so i will add some alum tape to the mold blocks to get it 2-3 thou larger (beagle technique).

I have a 124rn also but its tl design so i would rather not fool with it.

Ok, so I will try the lee 120-tc sized 358, heat treated, and report. thanks.

[6622729]

He meant to say 45-45-10. This refers to a lube recipe, 45% something/45% something else/10% one more ingredient. The name of the lube from his post is Recluse, a pretty well used lube. Ive never used liquid lube so i dont know the ingredients.

I thought he was referencing a mold number. Of course I know what 45/45/10 is, I use it myself. The OP just edited his first post and clarified that now.

[6622729]

Stop with the trickery and get back to the basics. You're asking for help so stop doing the advanced stuff until you get the basics to work. Don't tape up a mold to make your bullet bigger, forget the Hitec coating. Go cast any of the Lee 356 tumble lube molds you have using your straight wheel weight alloy and water drop them. Lube them lightly with the 45/45/10 you also already have and load them without sizing. If that somehow fails to work, at least we have a baseline of stuff we're all doing and can help you from there.

Once and for all please identify the powder and charge you have been trying to make work. We're all trying to help you but we're shooting in the dark so to speak. lol.

[kryogen]

Stop with the trickery and get back to the basics. You're asking for help so stop doing the advanced stuff until you get the basics to work. Don't tape up a mold to make your bullet bigger, forget the Hitec coating. Go cast any of the Lee 356 tumble lube molds you have using your straight wheel weight alloy and water drop them. Lube them lightly with the 45/45/10 you also already have and load them without sizing. If that somehow fails to work, at least we have a baseline of stuff we're all doing and can help you from there.
Once and for all please identify the powder and charge you have been trying to make work. We're all trying to help you but we're shooting in the dark so to speak. lol.

Powder charge is irrelevant. I said that I was using the min charge that cycles the glock with unique. I don't know. Somewhere around a medium load in the book.

I am past that baseline, no need to go back to what has been demonstrated not to work in a glock 9mm. (356TL unsized with tumble lube).
I have tried it if you care. I have the TL356-124RN mold. It leads. Bullets come out at 356-357. Doesnt work.

I also have the 356-120TC, but they drop at 356-357. They used to lead also.

So I have added 2 mils alum tape to my blocks and will cast some 120-TC, and size 358, heat treat and 45-45-10 and report.
I will also try a few with 45-45-10 + soft lube in the groove.

Will report once I have had a chance to shoot those. Maybe in a week or so.

If that still leads, I'll order an aftermarket barrel.
I am in canada so expect to pay too much. USA made stuff isnt in stock.
I have found this in stock in my province (state).

IGB barrel Glock 17. 300$ or so. Top quality.
Fully supported chamber option. Match barrel.
I don't care about the price. I want to shoot lead in 9mm.

http://www.igbaustria.com/shop/shop_content.php?language=en&coID=100&

[GabbyM]

With that 105 grain bullet you want at least 5.7 grains of Unique in a 9mm. 4.5gr makes a good soft load with a 122gr RN or TC. Going to light can mess up the cycle. If you just have to use light charges because that's what you want to shoot. You do need to load as large a bullet as it takes to fill the throat. That said I never saw a 9mm that would not shoot with .357" diameter BHN #15 bullets. If the bullets are to small the half decent charge will have enough pressure to obturate it to fill. That's where all that smoke comes from. They'll smoke even if they don't get fatter because they will get shorter. For one thing if you don't get Unique up around 30,000 CUP it is dirty stuff. It's good 9mm powder but dirty 45 or 38 Special powder because they are not high pressure rounds.

[Wheeljack]

My problem was solved by going to the highest load recommended. I had started with the lowest load and too much leading, so next it was the highest load. Now, I'm working my way down to find the lightest load that doesn't lead.

[kryogen]

I just cast 200 120tc with the alum tape to make larger. They weight 123.5
They drop around 357-359 a bit out of round. Sized 358. (best I can do).

I am heat treating at 425 for 1 hour right now. Will load a few once cooled and test.
Will try some with just 45-45-10, some with dip lube in 2500+. will report.

[Love Life]

I like Lotak Hard or Speed Green from the Bullshop in 9mm. Smokes, and makes a mess, but works very well for me.

All of my 9mm have preferred harder bullets sized to .357 at a minimum.

I use HP38 the majority of the time for 115-147 gr bullets.

[kryogen]

what load hp38 for 120tc ?

[Love Life]

I'd have to check my notes, but it came from the Lyman 49th.

[Love Life]

I checked my notes. I used 125 gr bullet data. I started at 3.8 and worked up to 4.4. Notes don't say anything about pressure issues. OAL was/is 1.100 with a form taper crimp.

Work up from 3.8 and you should find something good between there and 4.4. I also water quenched.

[kryogen]

ok thanks will start around there.
the lee 120tc at 1.050 is equivalent to the lyman 356402 at 1.110

[kryogen]

Should the 45-45-20 work or I should just lube with 2500+ for better results ?

I could pan lube and use a cookie cutter if 45-45-10 doesnt work.

or maybe tumble lube + pan lube after for double lube?

[Love Life]

Try with the 45-45-10 1st and then try the 2500+. Maybe try 2 coats of the 45-45-10?

[kryogen]

I'll load 20 of each and see, I'll try to report next week when possible.

[RobS]

Don't forget to let the boolits age harden before reloading and shooting. A person can speed age things with the use of the oven. After quenched and I let the boolits sit for an hour our so then back into the oven 190-200 degrees for 2 hours. They will reach nearly their peak hardness in 12-24 hours depending on how hot the very 1st oven temp was when you quenched.

[kryogen]

Yes they are hardening now. Peak hardness is reached in 48 hours or so with heat treat and quench.

Will load and test next week.

I have 20 that are lubed with 2500+ and 150 or so with 45-45-10.
Will try 20 of each, if the 45-45-10 lead, I'll just add a 2500+ pan lube.

[Landshark9025]

Yes they are hardening now. Peak hardness is reached in 48 hours or so with heat treat and quench.



Just curious, have you verified that with a hardness tester? I've seen it take longer if the antimony content is low. Just my experience.

Here's a couple of observations I have made while chasing a similar issue in a polygonal rifled HK. I've not completely solved it yet but I can shoot 2-300 rounds with no major loss in accuracy.
1. The Lee TL-356-120-TC seems to be the most problematic mold for 9mm. There are a ton of posts about it. I don't have one and that is why. It's pretty reviled.
2. The exact opposite is true of the 356-120 TC. I have two of these molds.
3. The only time I got zero leading in my HK was with the 356-120 TC, from straight COWW that test at approx. 14BHN on a Cabine Tree tester(a little hard for COWW, but it is such an inconsistent source anyway). They were pan lubed with 50-50 Lithi-Bee and sized to .357 on a Lee push through sizer.
4. Using just Range Scrap- which I get for free, I get one groove with leading about 0.5mm wide approx. 2/3 the length of the barrel, pretty much in the middle and the next one about 1/3 that much. If you took a six cavity mold and poured one long continuous sprue, then shrunk that down to it was about 0.5mm at its widest point, that what it looks like. Looks like someone dribbled lead in that groove. This is what I get with Lithi-Bee in various ratios, Ben's Red, Ben's Red with BLL on top, and HT/Q woth all the above. I always get some after about 2-300 rounds. Not enough to affect accuracy. Best so far is HT/Q, with Ben's Red and two coats of BLL.
5. While trying to sort it out, I tried sizing to .358. That made it worse.
6. A 358-125 RF, sized and lubed the same, with the same alloy produces tremendous accuracy.....for about 10 shots. Then it leads horribly. I say this as you may want to try a different bullet. If you are having trouble with a known "problem child" mold, and then the 105 mold, I wonder if you are not having enough contact with the driving bands.
7. One thing I did that reduced the amount of leading I was getting across the board was to take a cleaning patch, coat it with Flitz, and wrap it around a bore brush. I passed this back and forth through the barrel about 20 times and it really shined it up. Guys will talk about "fire lapping" or other methods. This was a small step in that direction. It really seemed to help.
8. And this was really key for me. Make dang sure your bore is clean. I mean REALLY clean. I can clean mine so it feels silky smooth when I run a patch through it. I can take it outside and hold it in the sun. I can put a patch on one end to help see....but until I put this (https://jet.com/product/detail/2c988276bb5c42b2bd3ad4c0cf5381af?jcmp=pla:ggl:hard ware_a3:tools_flashlights_headlamps_a3_other:na:na :na:na:na:2&code=PLA15&k_clickid=b832ac59-7112-4f4b-9ce2-2f3f4cb4adf3&gclid=CjwKEAiA7_OzBRDA8OfT3orp51oSJACVqslItItHa-SkxI3fsL2AqLfpFRJX3LLRl1YSWKltmU-NaBoCpPbw_wcB)in the chamber, I can't verify the lead is gone. If there's any from before, it will just start it again and you are chasing the wrong variable.

So, for me, a soft lube with a hard alloy worked. HT/Q Range Scrap with various lube- especially with two coats of BLL is "close enough". Certain molds are more well liked by my gun than others.

Because I could not get any more of that exact COWW alloy and am cheap, I have been frustrating myself trying to make things that "almost" work, work. Part of that is because I wanted just one alloy for 9mm and 38 SPL- which is a lot less finicky. I recently bought some Superhard and tin and will be making my own alloy for 9mm. Right now I have an alloy of 95/3/2 which the lead alloy calculator puts around 12BHN. I think it will test higher than that.

Good luck.

FYI, I get the same amount of leading, in the same grooves using store bought Hi-Tek bullets or home PC bullets with HF Red and range scrap. The store bought was really a mystery. I think I have two grooves that just need a bit more conditioning.

Good luck.

[Cherokee]

Keep us informed. My 9's are conventional rifling and have no problems. I use Lee 356-120 TC and Carnauba Red, best bullet I have found for 9's. My XDM can go 1000 rounds without hurting accuracy.

[RobS]

Many people who use .358" boolits and have worse leading than with .357" could very well be because the larger boolit scrapes off at the start of the sharp and/or abrupt throat more so than the .357. Add to this with a boolit that has a more rounded ogive, Lee 358-125-RF, vs another design that doesn't, Lee 356-120-TC, and you are adding fuel to the fire. Lead scrapes and then is transposed to the bore and the next boolit will iron it on and so on and so forth. I have worked on the throats of a few barrels that had less than friendly barrels and when finished the similar leading that many newer semi auto's have simply does not exist any longer. There is a very good post somewhere talking about this on the forum I just can't remember where it is right off hand.

[220]

I have a conventional rifled 9mm that I can not get to stop leading entirely.
I tried everything you have listed as well as a cupboard full of powders 10-20+BHN and it all failed.
A GC mould made a big improvement 200+ rounds and still acceptable accuracy where previously I would see tumbling after as little as 30 rds.
Slugs at .3555 but after reading everything I could find on 9mm and cast ran across a few people that have similar issues and their cause is the same as mine. While slugging will show .3555 the barrel actually has a tight spot about 1" in front of the chamber rest of the barrel is actually closer to .3565. Push a cast boolit of any size down the barrel from the chamber though the tight spot and hold it up to light and you can see light around it.
Doesn't matter what I do with the barrel any boolit and lube combo is going to struggle being swaged down and then trying to bump back up, gas cutting is going to be a given.
I have just decided to live with it GC has made it usable for 200rds and Ive found a PB load that will hold accuracy for more than 70rds. A new barrel would solve the issue and probably cheaper than everything else I tried to get it to shoot lead but I didn't want to let it beat me. lol

[Landshark9025]

That is interesting, Rob. I would like to know more if you are up for it, but do not want to hijack the thread. I will PM you.

thanks,


Many people who use .358" boolits and have worse leading than with .357" could very well be because the larger boolit scrapes off at the start of the sharp and/or abrupt throat more so than the .357. Add to this with a boolit that has a more rounded ogive, Lee 358-125-RF, vs another design that doesn't, Lee 356-120-TC, and you are adding fuel to the fire. Lead scrapes and then is transposed to the bore and the next boolit will iron it on and so on and so forth. I have worked on the throats of a few barrels that had less than friendly barrels and when finished the similar leading that many newer semi auto's have simply does not exist any longer. There is a very good post somewhere talking about this on the forum I just can't remember where it is right off hand.

[Landshark9025]

Good point, 220. I seem to remember a thread on a Walther that had a similar issue? Not sure, but if I recall the story was the guy contacted the manufacturer and was told it was "in spec" because it was designed for jacketed.

If that is what the OP has going on, a new barrel is surely the only fix.


I have a conventional rifled 9mm that I can not get to stop leading entirely.
I tried everything you have listed as well as a cupboard full of powders 10-20+BHN and it all failed.
A GC mould made a big improvement 200+ rounds and still acceptable accuracy where previously I would see tumbling after as little as 30 rds.
Slugs at .3555 but after reading everything I could find on 9mm and cast ran across a few people that have similar issues and their cause is the same as mine. While slugging will show .3555 the barrel actually has a tight spot about 1" in front of the chamber rest of the barrel is actually closer to .3565. Push a cast boolit of any size down the barrel from the chamber though the tight spot and hold it up to light and you can see light around it.
Doesn't matter what I do with the barrel any boolit and lube combo is going to struggle being swaged down and then trying to bump back up, gas cutting is going to be a given.
I have just decided to live with it GC has made it usable for 200rds and Ive found a PB load that will hold accuracy for more than 70rds. A new barrel would solve the issue and probably cheaper than everything else I tried to get it to shoot lead but I didn't want to let it beat me. lol

[hardwired]

Just got through with a year long 9mm casting **** show for lack of better words. Used 45/45/10, tumble lube lee mold, and 120gn tc. The Barrel slugged at 0.355. I sized the TC bullets to 356 and tumble lubed them...got really bad leading. The TL bullets keyholed and leaded like hell too. Finally switched to the lee 125gn 358 mold, sized to 357 with water quenched wheel weights (all of my bullets were quenched wheel weights). I also started pan lubing. I fill the crimp groove with lube as well giving me 2 grease grooves. No more leading for me and I couldn't be happier. Shot a few sub 2 inch groups at 15 yards as well so they're good to go for me. Also, pan lubing has worked awesome for me and I've had no troubles at all using half paraffin, half Vaseline and a tablespoon of stp. I was hesitant after seeing people complain about pan lubing but it's been pretty damn easy for me... I'm shooting them out of a lone wolf in a glock

I'm looking for a mold and sizer to try 9mm casting on a Glock. What are the recommended molds for someone new that wants to be successful at getting 9mm to work?

I was thinking the Lee 356-125-2R round nose which looks like a typical 9mm projectile.
Bit it seems like the molds discussed here that work for 38 special and 357 that throw a larger diameter round is better??

Is the "lee 125gn 358 mold" you mentioned the Lee 358-125-RF #90574?
What are you using to size to 357 and what does this mold normally throw in diameter?

Thanks

[RobS]

That is interesting, Rob. I would like to know more if you are up for it, but do not want to hijack the thread. I will PM you.

thanks,

Here is the thread: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?232061-1911-Throating Even though it is for a 45 auto 1911 same applies to all semi autos that have this particular issue.

[Love Life]

Glocks usually have decent throats in their factory barrels, but I completely agree that a bad throat can lead to a lot of issues.

[kryogen]

Throat seems decent

[mozeppa]

Is that what a 454510 mold is, a 105gr bullet? I have been poking around and can't find it to see what the OP is working with.
last line of the o.p. states "105 swc lee mold"

[Forrest r]

Throat seems decent

You have something mechanical going on.

I pc my 9mm bullets and size them to .356. Using nothing more than scrap lead/hill picking's/berm lead that I make in #100 batches and it usually is around 8bhn to 9bhn. The pc'ing process anneals that alloy making it softer than what it starts out at.

I use the .356 bullets in 3 different 9mm's. A springfield ro that slugs out @ .356, a taurus pt111 that slugs out @ .358 and a contender bbl in 9mm that slugs out @ .355.

I've shot bullets like these 110gr wc's harvey swc's in all of the 9's with loads from anything from mild to wild and had no leading in any of the 9mm's sizing those pc'd bullets to .356.

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t242/forrestr-photo/110gwcampharvey_zpsxewqmkwp.jpg (http://s162.photobucket.com/user/forrestr-photo/media/110gwcampharvey_zpsxewqmkwp.jpg.html)

Shot countless 1000's of the mihec 125gr hp's in the 9mm's sized to .356 with a full house load of power pistol. The taurus pt111 with the bbl that's slugged out at .358 eats these .356 bullets like candy with no leading. But I only shoot 200 to 300 rounds in a range session with it.

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t242/forrestr-photo/9mmtaurus_zpsnlqcm8kg.jpg (http://s162.photobucket.com/user/forrestr-photo/media/9mmtaurus_zpsnlqcm8kg.jpg.html)

Playing around with the contender bbl and 150gr hb bullets with mouse fart loads @ the 50yd line. The contender slugs out @.355 and shoots anything from these lite target loads to p+ 110gr pc'd bullets getting sreaming (1500fps+) velocities out of that 10" bbl.

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t242/forrestr-photo/358709mm_zps9110adbe.jpg (http://s162.photobucket.com/user/forrestr-photo/media/358709mm_zps9110adbe.jpg.html)

I undersize my 9mm's by any cast bullet standards for 2 out of 3 of my 9mm bbl's. The soft pc'd bullet will easily expand to fill and seal those bbl's @ velocities ranging from 600fps to 1600fps. Heck that pt111 bbl shoots full house loads of power pistol (1050fps from the 3.2" bbl pictured above) with bullet .002 undersized for that bbl and it gets no leading and the bullets don't tumble.

The only thing all 3 of the 9mm bbl's I use have in common is that they all have excellent throats in them.
The contender has huge revolver depth riflings (.004) and is .355.
The springfield ro has shallow semi-auto riflings (.002) and is .356.
The taurus pt111 has shallow semi-auto riflings (.002) and is .358.

I've shot coated bullets in at least 12 different firarms that I can think of off of the top of my head. With loads that ranged from 8,000psi to 50,000+psi with bullet speeds anywhere from 600fps to 2300fps and never had any leading in any of those firearms.

There's got to be something in that bbl scraping off the coating on those coated bullets to lead your bbl. I'm running 34,00psi loads with a .002" undersized bullet in 1 of my 9mm's and get no leading from the coated bullets I'm using. I've sized coated bullets to .308 and shot them in a 308 with loads in the 25,000psi/2000fps range and got zero leading.

You've tried several different bullets, alloys, lubes, hardening of those alloys and the only thing they all have in common is what I call mechanical.

The bbl
The reloading die

You've already checked for bullets being scraped or re-sized from the reloading dies.

That leaves the bbl.

[kryogen]

that's a way to see it. will report asap after next try

[Landshark9025]

Throat seems decent

Might want to try to take some decent pictures of the throat. I found a flashlight pointed at some patches to illuminate them and then hold the barrel over that works well. Kind of a filtered, indirect light. I bet if you posted some pics into this thread someone would be able to take it from "seems decent" to "Yep, that's good" or "Nope, that needs work."

Might save you a frustrated range trip.

[bangerjim]

Have a couple friends with Glocks and they have a real time with cast in them! G's are made fro and love FMJ's. The instructions say shooting cast lead voids the warranty. But they all say that!

As said earlier....the rifling they use????? New barrel maybe?????

All my 9's (NO Glocks! Ever.) like 358 sizing and FCD's. I shoot 9-12 Bhn + PC with ZERO leading.

You have been fighting this for quite some time! Hope you finally figure it out. Or trade for a non-Glock gun maybe??


Good luck in 2016.

bangerjim

[kryogen]

I'll just buy a quality aftermarket barrel that's made for lead and stop that nonsense.... been trying for 2 years. Will order tomorrow. Thanks.
http://www.igbaustria.com/shop/shop_content.php?language=en&coID=100&

300$ CAD or so, expensive but looks good and avail in canada in my province in stock.

[Love Life]

Glocks do fine with lead. Just have to give them what they want.

[dragon813gt]

Glocks do fine with lead. Just have to give them what they want.

Lies, you're perpetuating an internet falsehood. Learned about them earlier in another thread and wanted to parrot it :laugh:

We have had very few issues shooting cast out of the stock barrels. Maybe we just got lucky from the start :popcorn:

[Boolseye]

I'll just buy a quality aftermarket barrel that's made for lead and stop that nonsense.... been trying for 2 years. Will order tomorrow. Thanks.

I enjoyed reading through the thread–it sounds like you're doing everything right and not succumbing to despair.
I doubt there are many that cast for the 9mm that haven't had to travel a learning curve. Good work, you'll have satisfaction with that aftermarket barrel, I feel sure.

[HATCH]

I got rid of my 9mm but I do have 4 glock 40s
3 23s and a 27
I cast with lead from the foundry (95/2.5/2.5) and lube with Magma Green (color doesnt really matter with them)

I don't have any leading problem.
My primary 23 has a lone wolf barrel ($89) but the rest are factory.
My brother ray shoots a 23 and its bone stock. He has no leading issues either.

I would say increase the hardness of your lead.

[kryogen]

Did some testing tonight
COWW, heat treated water quenched.

20 rounds with 2500+, little leading (2 traces)
20 rounds with 45-45-10 important leading.

Load was a bit mild, didnt cycle completely all the time.

Will try to add 2500+ to some of the bullets that I have already lubed with 45-45-10.
I will also try to increase pressure to have a better seal and see if that leads less.

I'll report after that.

[Boolseye]

I have never succeeded in getting no leading at all with the 9.
It's just not a .38 (my K-frame always has a mirror bore unless I'm blasting full-house cast, non-GC .357s downrange).
As long as I can keep accuracy good and eliminate key-holing, a few scrubbs with a bronze brush now and then don't bother me at all.

At the risk of repeating whats been said: The Lee 124 TLTC was more trouble for me than it was worth. I have found success with the Lee 120 TC and NOE 358-135 RF, as have many others, sized to .358, expanded with a Lyman m-die.

Again, good work. I have seen some throw their virtual hands up in exasperation, at which point the folk who know (The MTGun44s and Larry Gibsons among us, I do not include myself) are forced to stop helping.

[RobS]

It's better with the harder boolits and white label 2500. I bet with an even softer lube you would do a bit better. If I remember right you are pan lubing with 2500. Maybe if you soften this lube just a little with some Vaseline it will flow better. I found that either BAC or 50/50 worked better in lower pressure handgun rounds than either 2500 or CR from white label.


Did some testing tonight
COWW, heat treated water quenched.

20 rounds with 2500+, little leading (2 traces)
20 rounds with 45-45-10 important leading.

Load was a bit mild, didnt cycle completely all the time.

Will try to add 2500+ to some of the bullets that I have already lubed with 45-45-10.
I will also try to increase pressure to have a better seal and see if that leads less.

I'll report after that.

[Landshark9025]

I bet with an even softer lube you would do a bit better.

The chapter on lubrication from "From Ingot to Target" would bear that out. From the book:

Where hard lubes run into trouble is in the intermediate pressure/temperature ranges of +P loads. There are greater needs for lubrication in these velocity ranges than in the range for “standard” revolver loads (i.e. 16,000 CUP and 850 fps). However, current hard lubes generally melt very little in this range, so the only lube pumping mechanism is still simple displacement by the lands. Since very little of the lube has melted, it can’t play much of a role in bore sealing and significant leading is commonly encountered with loads in this ballpark that are lubed with hard lubes.

http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Chapter_5_Lubrication.htm

Guess what is kind of close to +P revolver pressure? Starting loads for 9mm. Even the max loads for 9mm are "generally" in the midway point between "general" +P and "general" magnum revolver.

[kryogen]

I am NOT using a TL boolit.

I'll raise the load to 4 grains of 231, up from 3.6 (max 4.4) to see what happens.
Pressure will increase, maybe a better fit of the bullet in the bore, and glock will cycle better anyway. it did fail to lock the slide back a few times so I'm right on the min pressure to have it cycle. Tells me I need to go up a bit.

I have been dip lubing as I don't have a cake cutter yet, and I'm not buying a lubri sizer before I can get all this to work reliably.
My 120tc drops a bit undersize also, maybe I'll need to buy a 358RF mold or something.

[Boolseye]

Yes, I'm aware that you're not using the TL. Smart man :-)
fit is king, you'll get it.

[toallmy]

:popcorn:I use soft lube , it's a bit messy but no leading ( Emmerts ) if you like pm me and will be glad to send sample . Lee 124 tc at 3575 sized and lubed, or arsonal same style.

[kryogen]

My 356-120-tc mold drops 355-358 out of round, even if it's made larger with alum tape. (bullets are out of round)
I just ordered the lee 358-125-RF mold, should drop at 358 and I should be able to get real 358 boolits to test.
Will report, both with 45-45-10 and 2500+ might be next week.
I also have a 358 cake cutter from buckshot on order.

[toallmy]

[smilie=f::brokenimaOffer on 3575-358 soft lube bullets stands , if you like. Don't hurt to try.

[swmass]

Thats the mold that fixed my problems... people say they push 45/45/10 pretty fast so it should work. I pan lube now but I may try tumble lubing them just for kicks... That mold is great because it doesn't drop too small which is a problem I had with my 356 9mm molds... even if its a little out or round, size them to .357 or .358 and all will be well. I'd put bullet fit above lube. Good luck, its a good feeling to finally go out and shoot your 9mm loads with no leading. Keep at it, you'll get it eventually and it will be worth it. I was pretty discouraged with my cast bullets in 9mm until I tried this mold. I shoot them at 1.020 and have had no feeding issues in my m&p or glock. I use bullseye powder FWIW

[RobS]

Thats the mold that fixed my problems... people say they push 45/45/10 pretty fast so it should work. I pan lube now but I may try tumble lubing them just for kicks... That mold is great because it doesn't drop too small which is a problem I had with my 356 9mm molds... even if its a little out or round, size them to .357 or .358 and all will be well. I'd put bullet fit above lube. Good luck, its a good feeling to finally go out and shoot your 9mm loads with no leading. Keep at it, you'll get it eventually, and it will be worth it. I was pretty discouraged with my 9mm cast bullets in 9mm until I tried this mold. I shoot them at 1.020 and have had no feeding issues in my m&p or glock. I use bullseye powder FWIW

Regards to this particular mold (Lee 358-125-RF) these two things are what I've done, exact same COAL too. Just covers up the crimp groove and works well in the 9mm loading I've done.

[kryogen]

Regards to this particular mold (Lee 358-125-RF) these two things are what I've done, exact same COAL too. Just covers up the crimp groove and works well in the 9mm loading I've done.

do you happen to use 231 or hp38? charge?

I've heard that this bullet around 1.040 can use the same charge as the 120tc at 1.050.... I might try it at 1.040 and see.
Should I lube in the crimp groove also or not?

[RobS]

I didn't lube in the lube groove but wouldn't see why one couldn't for 9mm work. I didn't use 231 rather HS-6 at 6.0 grains and AutoComp at 4.3 both near minimum charge. I would think you would be good at 4.0 of 231 as that would pretty much be the same velocities and about the same pressures as far as I can calculate.

[kryogen]

Will try and report as soon as my mold gets there +2 days for hardening.

[rsrocket1]

The good thing about the Lee 356-120-TC is that the cone tapers off immediately. The bad thing about the 358-125-RF is that there is no taper until way up the bullet. That means you have to size the bullet if the throat of your barrel is smaller than your cast bullet. It also is bad for short/no throated barrels like CZ's.

I guess I lucked out. Both my 356-10-TC and TL356-124-R drop at 0.358" and powder coating brings them up to 0.360". I can then size them either to 0.356 or 0.358" or simply load them as-is so long as the fat part is all below the rim.

Hopefully your Glock has a wide enough throat to allow the fat part of the bullet to chamber properly. A plunk test will give you immediate feedback.

Good luck with the new bullet and thanks for the thread.

[kryogen]

I loaded another 30 rounds for testing.
The 120tc, but with 45-45-10 + a pan lube in 2500+.
Seated over 3.9 of 231, up from 3.6.

Will see how the stronger charge + double lube take care of the issue.
(Before I have a chance to test the other mold when it gets in next week)

[kryogen]

I don't expect it to fix all the issues, but the new mold won't be there until later next week, so it will allow me to do some testing in between.
When I get a load that works without leading with lube, then I might consider just buying a star and being able to quickly process bullets.
And if it does work with canauba red, it would be awesome, 650 + star + CR lubed bullets = quick.

I made a temporary kake kutter from a 300 win mag case that I cutback and enlarged the primer hole. It does work, but the taper is too wide and it's hard to push.
Waiting for a nicer cutter from buckshot.

[mjwcaster]

Haven't seen it mentioned-
What are you using to measure the Boolits?
Micrometer or caliper?
A caliper will not show an out of round Boolits, just an average of the size of the Boolit.
I had leading when I started casting, Boolits measured OK with calipers.
When I finally broke down and got a micrometer I could measure the Boolits were out of round on the parting line, small on one side large on the other.
Just the small portion being under sized was enough to cause leading.
Just another thought.

[kryogen]

Haven't seen it mentioned-
What are you using to measure the Boolits?
Micrometer or caliper?
A caliper will not show an out of round Boolits, just an average of the size of the Boolit.
I had leading when I started casting, Boolits measured OK with calipers.
When I finally broke down and got a micrometer I could measure the Boolits were out of round on the parting line, small on one side large on the other.
Just the small portion being under sized was enough to cause leading.
Just another thought.

mitutoyo micrometer
like I said the 120TC is out of round from 355 to 358, so that's an issue, that's why I ordered the 358-125-RF mold, to get a real 358 all around.

[mjwcaster]

Did you order a 2 cavity or 6?
I am new to casting, but have given up on the Lee 2 cavity.
The 6 is just much better made in my limited experience and as reported by others.

Sorry if I missed it before, this has gotten to be a long thread.

Good luck.
It is much more fun to shoot rather than scrub lead.

[Boolseye]

Is it feasible for you to return that 356-120 TC to Lee? .355" is under their specifications (+.001", -.000"), and that's enough to cause problems. I feel as though their QC has been a little lax lately, especially with molds dropping too small.
That particular mold doesn't usually need to be babied to work.

[Finster101]

For what it's worth, I use the 358-105 in several 9s to include XDs , Smiths and Sigs. I powder coat and size to .358 and charge with 4 grains of Promo (Red Dot) I get zero leading and very good feeding and cycling with this combo. I have a friend with a Glock I may ask to borrow it and try it. I don't own or want one. There is nothing wrong with them they are just not a fit for me.

[kryogen]

Is it feasible for you to return that 356-120 TC to Lee? .355" is under their specifications (+.001", -.000"), and that's enough to cause problems. I feel as though their QC has been a little lax lately, especially with molds dropping too small.
That particular mold doesn't usually need to be babied to work.

Not really, I'm in canada and shipping would be more than the mold.

[kryogen]

Did you order a 2 cavity or 6?
I am new to casting, but have given up on the Lee 2 cavity.
The 6 is just much better made in my limited experience and as reported by others.

Sorry if I missed it before, this has gotten to be a long thread.

Good luck.
It is much more fun to shoot rather than scrub lead.

I only have lee 6 cavity molds.

[krag35]

Doesn't cost much, order a Lee 358-125-RF, cast with ACWW, size to .358" and see if it cures your problem. A lot cheaper than a new barrel.

That Lee 358-125-RF has worked well in all of the 9mm's I have tried it in. I have not kept a Glock long enough to reload for it, so YMMV.

[kryogen]

should get it next week. it's in the mail.

[Landshark9025]

I probably missed it somewhere, but I am guessing you are using a push through die to resize them and make them round to the right size, right?

[anotherred]

My 357 bullets drop freely in the fired cases. I have been told that this would mean that I should size 358.
I'll try a few sized 358 and see.

Maybe I missed it, but have you slugged the barrel and actually measured the slug?

[kryogen]

I probably missed it somewhere, but I am guessing you are using a push through die to resize them and make them round to the right size, right?

cant make a 355-358 out of round bullet round to 358.
That's why I have a 358 mold in the mail.

[kryogen]

Maybe I missed it, but have you slugged the barrel and actually measured the slug?
barrel is 356
.3558 exactly (at least the tightest spot is)

[swmass]

That was my exact problem with the 120tc mold. (355-358). Slugged my barrel at 356. Tried sizing em, going unsized... But at the end of the day it might as well be a .355 bullet. Wont lecture you about sizing and all that because you clearly get it. I'd have high hopes for the new mold because it will most likely fix all your problems and the headache will be over!

[Dusty Bannister]

Not really, I'm in canada and shipping would be more than the mold.

Seriously? $40.00 to ship a 40.00 mold? I know that it is more expensive, but that just doesn't sound right compared to shipping an item several years ago.

[kryogen]

Shipping from and to the usa is such a pain, I try to just avoid it.
Less expensive shipping options have bad tracking and I have lost items in the past. Plus, it takes 2 weeks or so, with mediocre tracking.
And then, you get charged abusive duty fees and all that by the courrier companies.

The mold is 60$ in canada. I won't bother, I'll just put it in a box and forget it.

[kryogen]

undersized 120tc with 3.9 of hp38 at 1.050 worked really well but still leaded a bit after 30 rounds. Nothing major but still.
the tumble lube with 45-45-10 did not help VS just the 2500+
The stronger powder charge did not help.

next try is going to be the 358 125 RF, will report, possibly next week.

[Boolseye]

Yeah, you'll probably not obturate the needed .002" into existence with that boolit.
i will sometimes double lube a boolit. Pan-lube, in my case , followed by a tumble in 45-45-10. kinda smoky, but it can help a bit with a marginal boolit. Beagleing and/or lapping are options, however. I've lapped a couple Lee 6-cavs, could buy a couple NOEs for the labor involved.

[kryogen]

should get the mold tomorrow, cast some hopefully tomorrow, load some this weekend, and shoot next monday and report.

[kryogen]

Got the mold, looks nice, cant wait to try it and report. Will let you know next monday evening.

Will coat 20 with 45-45-10 and lube 20 with 2500+, test both, starting with 2500+, and then check for leading, and then the TL, and check for leading, and I'll report.
if a 125 grains .358 heat treated quenched bullet with 2500+ doesnt fix it for me in the glock, I'll get a rifled barrel.

I got a report from a fellow shooter at my range that tested a lone wolf barrel, with the 105 SWC water dropped, sized 357, 45-45-10, not even 38 expanded cases, and he said that he got very minimal leading after 20 rounds. Looks like the rifled barrel makes it more predictable.

[6622729]

Got the mold, looks nice, cant wait to try it and report. Will let you know next monday evening.

Will coat 20 with 45-45-10 and lube 20 with 2500+, test both, starting with 2500+, and then check for leading, and then the TL, and check for leading, and I'll report.
if a 125 grains .358 heat treated quenched bullet with 2500+ doesnt fix it for me in the glock, I'll get a rifled barrel.

I got a report from a fellow shooter at my range that tested a lone wolf barrel, with the 105 SWC water dropped, sized 357, 45-45-10, not even 38 expanded cases, and he said that he got very minimal leading after 20 rounds. Looks like the rifled barrel makes it more predictable.

I sure wish you weren't having so much trouble. I shoot water dropped wheel weight cast lead in a poly barreled Glock 19 without issue. Because I planned to shoot a lot of lead in my Glock and because of the unsupported case issue, I bought the KKM barrel which supports the case better and have continued to not have any issues. Lee 124TC, Lee125RN tumble lubed with 45/45/10 and loaded as cast.

[ironhead7544]

Never had any luck with the lighter cast bullets. Found some 160 gr RN cast at a gun show. Very accurate in the G17 and G26. Very light leading but I clean it with Chore Boy every 100 rounds.

[kryogen]

They drop 358-361 so its all good to size to 358. They weight 130gn.
loaded 20 of each at 1.040 with 4.4 of hp38. Half with grease and half with tl.
the bullet seems to just hit the lands at that length. It plunks ok but cannot really rotate freely. Will shoot monday night and see and report on function and leading.

i can confirm that i dislike pan lubing.

[kryogen]

Ok report.
Feed and function 100%.
Even though some had reported the load as mild or moderate, the load felt quite hot. 4.4 of hp38 at 1.040.
I don't know the fps, but they recoiled like full blast FMJ. I am probably going to drop to 4.3 for my next tries.

20 rounds with 2500+ did lead a bit.
+ 30 rounds with 45-45-10 did lead moderately.

So far, grease has given me better results than tumble lube all the time. But I won't blame TL until I can get a load to not lead at all with grease.

I'm buying a rifled barrel tomorrow and will test the same load and report.
I came to the conclusion that the OEM glock barrel does not like my wheelweight bullets no matter what. At that point I have tried everything.
If they still lead with the new barrel, then my alloy has an issue.

Leading isnt major after 50 rounds, but there is leading in the barrel. Bullets shot well though. Those FP bullets make nice holes in paper also.

[Dusty Bannister]

"Even though some had reported the load as mild or moderate, the load felt quite hot. 4.4 of hp38 at 1.040.
I don't know the fps, but they recoiled like full blast FMJ. I am probably going to drop to 4.3 for my next tries."

That verifies the data in the Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook, 4th edition. 4.4 grains of 231 is listed as the max load for Ly 356637 which is a 125 grain bullet. They used the bullet sized to 356". Their starting load is 2.9 grains. Yes, your pressure is right up there and I imagine case ejection was "lively". Maybe if you let the bullets mature a bit longer, things will resolve?

[kryogen]

Yup, according to lyman I was probably just at max or a bit above max. That's what they felt like.
I think that I'll lower charge to 4.2 and try an OAL of1.030 or so (seat to end of crimp groove) for less interference with the lands.
After heat treating and water quench, it looks like very little is gained after 48 hours, and they have had 48 hours to harden. http://www.lasc.us/heattreat.htm

I think that I might order a storm lake barrel and try again.

[Dusty Bannister]

If you seat the bullet deeper, that will increase pressure. Do you think that is a good idea? How about trying to "work up" to an accurate load as is always recommended? Generally cast bullets do not do well with excessive bullet jump when it comes to accuracy.

I thought you said in an earlier post that the barrel was already ordered?

[kryogen]

at 1.040 the bullet side near the case hits something, it will plunk to the bottom, but can not spin. Does it matter?
I tried to order a barrel this morning but called and they are out of stock. (canada)
Trying to find a storm lake somewhere, looks like they might have some in alberta.
It's hard to find gun barrels in stock here. no one has kkm, lone wolf is out of stock, and storm lake is almost out of stock everywhere. a shop had IGB but they are out of stock also.

My only concern with the storm lake is that they are now reaming the throat much larger now, and I know that a member here had an issue with leading because it was gas cutting at the too large throat. Your opinion?

[Dusty Bannister]

at 1.040 the bullet side near the case hits something, it will plunk to the bottom, but can not spin. Does it matter?

+I looked back through some of the threads and was unable to see where "spinning" was desired. To me, that would just indicate the bullet was seated off the lands and unsupported when fired. I prefer no jump for cast bullets.

I tried to order a barrel this morning but called and they are out of stock. (canada)
Trying to find a storm lake somewhere, looks like they might have some in alberta.
It's hard to find gun barrels in stock here. no one has kkm, lone wolf is out of stock, and storm lake is almost out of stock everywhere. a shop had IGB but they are out of stock also.

My only concern with the storm lake is that they are now reaming the throat much larger now, and I know that a member here had an issue with leading because it was gas cutting at the too large throat. Your opinion?

+I think back about post #82 you indicated you were ordering a barrel the next morning, so that is why I thought it was already a done deal. So you start over again, and this time you will not be making the same mistakes and going through the "Monkey Motion" as you have in the past. You will slug the barrel to determine what is needed to fill the grooves and how much extra is needed to get a good seal. You will use the dowel rod method to know exactly what the finished cartridge OAL needs to be so the nose of the bullet is engaging the lands (or not). You know you will be far better off to use a good wax or grease bullet lube and not waste your effort with TL, although it might work great after you establish the load. You will know that you need to start with the recommended starting load and work up to the accuracy load instead of going to the max load and then backing off.

Mean time, there is no reason you can not begin with the starting load and work your way up to reliable cycling and probably not have the leading you are presently experiencing with max or over max loads. And since you have not mentioned where the leading is forming, it can not be guessed if you are exceeding the lube limits, or the alloy limits. You are close, just finish the trip and you are home.

Sorry, I thought it would break out my comments from the quoted original post. Look for the (+)

[kryogen]

Well i will try 40 or so lower powder charge bullets saturday. Those will have had time to harden 5 more days. Will report.

[kryogen]

Ok well I have 20 loaded with 4 grains that had more time to harden.
If those still lead, I'll try powdercoating again, with all else being the same. (load, OAL, bullet, size)

Would have to cast more as those have been sized and in contact with grease.

[Landshark9025]

Ok, as a relatively new caster and reloader, I gotta ask, "Why are you backing down to just 4.0gr?" I have not verified it myself, but if, as others have said, Lyman is recommending a starting load of 2.9 and a max of 4.4, why are you not loading 5 or so at .2g increments starting at 2.9-3. shooting each load from a rest for accuracy?" That would give you 30 or so which would verify fit. If you have minor leading, then maybe lube or the load at the top or bottom of the ladder was the culprit and you can start fine tuning it with whatever loads, lubes, powder types showed the most accuracy promise.

If your accuracy at 2.9 starts out bad and just continues to get worse because they all leaded the barrel, then it seems to me you have a larger issue- such as or alloy to solve and you eliminated the guessing work. Saves time for me.

Start low, work up. It either shows promise that can be capitalized on by fine tuning or a major problem that requires starting over.

[kryogen]

Ok, as a relatively new caster and reloader, I gotta ask, "Why are you backing down to just 4.0gr?" I have not verified it myself, but if, as others have said, Lyman is recommending a starting load of 2.9 and a max of 4.4, why are you not loading 5 or so at .2g increments starting at 2.9-3. shooting each load from a rest for accuracy?" That would give you 30 or so which would verify fit. If you have minor leading, then maybe lube or the load at the top or bottom of the ladder was the culprit and you can start fine tuning it with whatever loads, lubes, powder types showed the most accuracy promise.

If your accuracy at 2.9 starts out bad and just continues to get worse because they all leaded the barrel, then it seems to me you have a larger issue- such as or alloy to solve and you eliminated the guessing work. Saves time for me.

Start low, work up. It either shows promise that can be capitalized on by fine tuning or a major problem that requires starting over.

You are wrong.
You said "I have not verified it myself"
Then why are you telling me what to do if you didn't even read the book?
Please check the book again and post once you have read that book. Because I have it on the desk in front of me, next to the lee book, and 2 hornady books, and I don't need advice from someone who didn't read the book and posts wrong loads.

[Landshark9025]

You are wrong.
You said "I have not verified it myself"
Then why are you telling me what to do if you didn't even read the book?
Please check the book again and post once you have read that book. Because I have it on the desk in front of me, next to the lee book, and 2 hornady books, and I don't need advice from someone who didn't read the book and posts wrong loads.

Because I was trying to be gracious and give you an opportunity to provide reasoning as to why, it seems from this thread at least, that you are not following generally accepted best practices that have been suggested numerous times.

It appears to have been an error on my part to extend that courtesy. One I'll not make in the future.

Be well.

[Dusty Bannister]

Perhaps he is reading the information from my post #128 ? Where I specify the source. I believe you verified that your max load was hot. He is NOT posting wrong loads according to the Lyman manual. There is no harm in suggesting that safe reloading practices be followed.

[kryogen]

He is.
book states 3.9 to 4.4
he posted try 2.9 to 3 in .2 increments
this wont cycle its a full grain under min load.
You entered 2.9 instead of 3.9 and that beginner just gave me advice based on wrong numbers. He does not even own the book and he is giving memwrong advice. I truly hate beginners giving wrong advice. Read the book or don't give your opinion.

[kryogen]

Perhaps he is reading the information from my post #128 ? Where I specify the source. I believe you verified that your max load was hot. He is NOT posting wrong loads according to the Lyman manual. There is no harm in suggesting that safe reloading practices be followed.


Oh i'm just quoting rgarding my previous post.

[kryogen]

Because I was trying to be gracious and give you an opportunity to provide reasoning as to why, it seems from this thread at least, that you are not following generally accepted best practices that have been suggested numerous times.

It appears to have been an error on my part to extend that courtesy. One I'll not make in the future.

Be well.Excellent idea, please do not give me wrong advice in the future.

[Dusty Bannister]

I will check my Lyman manual, edition number and when it was printed. It may be a typo in my book. What is the printed date of your Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook, 4th edition?

[Landshark9025]

Last chance for you not to be an ***. I've been at this long enough to be clueless, think I have it figured out, and then realize I have much to learn. And yes, I have multiple, worn manuals.....I just did not consult them. Several hundred pounds of lead have gone through my pots. Enough to take 356-120TC from severe leading to minimal leading in an HK polygonal rifled 9mm with nothing but range scrap and tin and the appropriate lube. I have also achieved lead free shooting with the same barrel with COWW and am now working through a couple of custom blends. All feats you have thus failed.

Civility would have dictated a response along the line of "possible typo, I worked up from the minimum published load in 'x' resource and had 'y' results". Because THAT was the question I asked.

I am now done with this thread and you are welcome to the last word.

[Dusty Bannister]

Well, perhaps a review of your posts will clear up some of the misunderstanding. I see back on post #120 you said you were going to get a Lee 358-125-RF. But I do not see where you actually announced you were changing from the Lee 356-120-TC. The data would be different, but since you never really said anything, it would be hard to know what you were doing. You might consider that your lack of input resulted in this misunderstanding. Without good information..........

[kryogen]

The 356 120tc doesnt cycle before 3.9 grains of hp38 in my glock, and this load still leads.

Load data for the 358-125-rf is approximately somewhere in between 3.9 and 4.3-4.4 depending on the approximation bullet to lyman mold #.
I'll shoot 20 at 4.0 this morning and report.

[DerekP Houston]

He is.
book states 3.9 to 4.4
he posted try 2.9 to 3 in .2 increments
this wont cycle its a full grain under min load.
You entered 2.9 instead of 3.9 and that beginner just gave me advice based on wrong numbers. He does not even own the book and he is giving memwrong advice. I truly hate beginners giving wrong advice. Read the book or don't give your opinion.

Damn that's a hella slam for a new guy just trying to me helpful. Best of luck with your 9mm challenges.

[kryogen]

Damn that's a hella slam for a new guy just trying to me helpful. Best of luck with your 9mm challenges.

He has been there for 2 years now

[sigep1764]

I thought canadians were supposed to be nice?

[kryogen]

4 grains of hp38 with the 358 heat treated 125 RF still leaded a bit. Only shot 5 rounds though, but there are silver steaks, so I would expect some leading after 50 rounds or so.

The stock barrel shoots so bad with plated 355 that I'll probably buy an aftermarket anyway. It shoots all over the target at 25 feet. The 358 did much better.
I'll report once I have the new barrel, will test same load.

[kryogen]

I just bought a wilson combat match barrel online. (ooch exchange rate, 300$ CAD+tax)
There seems to be good reviews for that barrel, and my OEM barrel shoots awesomely bad even with plated FMJ.
Will report asap.(probably next week or so).

[kryogen]

Looks like it will not be delivered until the end of the week and I'll be busy with some training next weekend, so results won't come until monday feb 1st I guess. Will slug sunday, plunk test, and shoot monday. Will report after that.

[kryogen]

got the barrel, had a chance to test the fit yesterday (but not to shoot).

Well made, drops in the glock perfectly, my FMJ and cast loads plunk test fine just like in the glock.
So far so good, still need to slug sunday and I'll see how it will chew 355 plated and 358 cast on monday.

[kryogen]

Ok, the wilson barrel slugs around .3554 to .3556.

I'll test it with the 358 boolits, but maybe it's going to perform better with 357? 2.5 mils over is quite a step isnt it?

Will test tomorrow evening at the range. Will test .355 plated, and then .358 lead.
If they still lead, I'll try 357 lead next week. (I don't have much time to shoot with the baby and the business).

[kryogen]

I shot 15 or so rounds in the wilson barrel and there didn't seem to be lead deposits in the last third of the barrel as it was the case with the oem barrel.
There was some black gunk in the first inch of the barrel. lube maybe? I don't know.

I then shot 80 or so fmj, checked the barrel again after, and there's no lead in there.

Success? Can't tell, but I'll shoot 50 or so next time and report.

The 358 lead bullets shoot much better than the 355 plated fmj. Much better groups.
The wilson also shoots better than OEM. (at least with plated reloads, and lead). Can't really say for commecial jacketed, I don't shoot that.
Will re-test some 45-45-10 coated bullets also, maybe they are going to work now with the rifled barrel.
Easier to TL vs pan lube, and if tl works, I'm probably not going to buy a 1000$ CAD star.

[kryogen]

Seems to work with the wilson combat rifled match barrel.
358, 2500+ grease, no lead after 50 rounds. Good precision. (will confirm tomorrow after barrel cleaning, there seems to be gunk in there, but it looks like lube residue, should disappear with a few patches). Nothing in the second half of the barrel like there used to be with the OEM.
Lee 358 124 RF, hp38. 100% reliable in the glock.

Next try will be tumble lube with 45/45/10. If that works, much easier than the grease.
If it doesnt work, I'll give PC another try. (less toxic smoke).
Or, buy a star and use BAC....

Now that I have a load that works with grease, I can try to use alternatives, like PC or hitek.
Hitek didnt work with OEM barrel, but I'll try it again with that new barrel.
It's easier to process vs PC... but PC is thicker and offers more leading protection.

[Forrest r]

[smilie=w:Glad to see you finely getting results at the range.

I like/use the pc process with most of my pistol bullets anymore. No smoke, firearm stays cleaner/more accurate with longer round counts at the range. Pc'd bullets also seem more forgiving, I've started to go back and re-tested bullets/loads in firearms that I did with traditional size/lube methods. So far it's been a real eye opener to say the least. Have a beater 629 that I picked up in 2006???, anyway I've had time to do allot of test loads in it. Was just looking for plinking loads that would do minute of golfball/ 1 1/2" @ 25yds. After testing a bunch of bullets and several powder over the years I ended up with 2 plinking loads for that revolver. Went back and re-tested using the same 5 bullets and the same 7 powders that I used before. The only difference was now the bullets are pc'd. With the pc'd bullets I ended up with 13 different loads that would do 1 1/2" @ 25yds, that's huge, 2 vs 13!!!

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t242/forrestr-photo/629accuracytargets_zps87d7149e.jpg (http://s162.photobucket.com/user/forrestr-photo/media/629accuracytargets_zps87d7149e.jpg.html)

Bought a nm 1911 in 9mm last fall. Never had time to work up a load for it and finely got some free time. So I've been working on 9mm target loads. Ended up with this 125gr bullet doing 1100fps in that 5" bbl'd 1911. That 1911 is heavy enough that it's actually a pretty soft shooting load.

http://i162.photobucket.com/albums/t242/forrestr-photo/ro9mm50ft_zpslprjmumk.jpg (http://s162.photobucket.com/user/forrestr-photo/media/ro9mm50ft_zpslprjmumk.jpg.html)

Glad to see your up and running & good luck with your testing.

[kryogen]

my main concern with grease is that It produces a lot of toxic smoke, and i always feel sick when i come back from the range. Even with the indoor range ventilation, I end up breathing too much smoke. I would need to shoot with a respirator.

I also generally dislike the die gumming up, and you cant really tumble clean the loaded rounds if they are lubed lead because corncob just sticks all around.

I will give hitek 2 coats another chance first, and if it fails, ill try pc again.

[DerekP Houston]

Now that you have the leading problem figured out, I imagine it will stop scraping the hi-tek coating off as well. Agreed with the smoke problem for grease lubes the PC rounds are much cleaner to me just time consuming. Glad you finally found a solution seems the barrel was indeed the issue.

[kryogen]

I just cleaned the barrel and after getting rid of the lube and carbon ,I noticed a lot of patches of lead in the first inch of the barrel or so.
The rest of the barrel was clean.

I'll try the same load, same lube, with 357 bullets instead of 358. The barrel is +- .3555, so maybe 2.5 mils over is quite hard to fit into the barrel. It was definitely really hard to slug the barrel with a 358 bullet.
The lube and lead combo seem to work though, because the rest of the barrel was super clean.

I guess that 1.5 mils over might be easier to get into the barrel without leading?

Throat is smooth, lands are beveled.
Opinions?

[Dusty Bannister]

"It was definitely really hard to slug the barrel with a 358 bullet."

Most folks like to use a soft lead, well lubricated slug much larger than the groove diameter. Easier to drive through, and certainly less chance for "spring back" and an error in reading the measured sample.

Did you start with a dry barrel, or did you attempt to condition the surface by running a patch with a little of your bullet lube on it? Not smeared on, just a hint of an application, since you have been having so much trouble with leading.

[kryogen]

Yes, dry barrel. Should i run a patch with some lube before i shoot?
will report asap with the 357 sized. Possibly this week.

[Shiloh]

.357 works for me. .358 is even better.

Shiloh

[kryogen]

Nothing to loose, I'll shoot 50 or so 357 this thursday and compare to 358 (same load, same lube).

If I get the same amount of leading, I'll try to PC some 357 and see.

What's nice is that I now have spots of lead just in the first inch, the rest is super clean.
Before that, the first half was quite clean, and it was really bad the next half of the barrel.

[kryogen]

357 full of leading after 30 rounds also.
Only thing left is to try 357 powdercoated. I am really starting to wonder if this is all worth it considering the time and effort required to cast and PC and cook 100 rounds, when a pack of 1000 9mm plated bullets is 100$.... I am seriously considering selling all this and just buying plated. My scrap WW lead simply doesnt seem to want to work with 9mm.

last test will be shooting PCed bullets at 357 then I'm done if that fails.

[DerekP Houston]

357 full of leading after 30 rounds also.
Only thing left is to try 357 powdercoated. I am really starting to wonder if this is all worth it considering the time and effort required to cast and PC and cook 100 rounds, when a pack of 1000 9mm plated bullets is 100$.... I am seriously considering selling all this and just buying plated. My scrap WW lead simply doesnt seem to want to work with 9mm.

last test will be shooting PCed bullets at 357 then I'm done if that fails.

Yeah that pretty much sums up why I gave up last time as well. I'm giving it another try though for kicks. At this point it is just a matter of pride, I'd like to figure it out. IIRC you are using a standard glock with upgraded barrel?

[kryogen]

I might just sell the lead and stop, because really, I don't feel like hand picking bullets with tweezers to ESPC, then tweezer on a tray to cook, then all this for like 100 bullets, that's 10$, hours of time....
even if it worked, I don't have time to do that with the baby and everything, and I can afford the plated bullets anyway.

My goal was to make it work with wheel weights and lube, because that would have been reasonably fast in a lube sizer, but its just not happening, and I really don't feel like starting over with 45 or whatever.

I don't have a lot of free time with the baby and the business, and at this point, I have kind of determined that scrap wheel weights + lube leads in 9mm.

I'm probably just selling everything, lead, melter, molds (dont ask, i'm in canada).

Yes, glock 17 with an aftermarket match rifled barrel.

And at 100$ per 1000 plated bullets that I can just dump in my press and load, that always work and never lead, it's kind of hard to justify the trouble right now.

I'm out guys, thanks for the whole cast bullet journey, that was fun over the years but now with the baby (and more coming), I simply don't see myself having time to play with lead again in the next 20 years or so.

[Boolseye]

You're welcome, take care! Good luck with the little ones, peace to you.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[6622729]

And at 100$ per 1000 plated bullets that I can just dump in my press and load, that always work and never lead, it's kind of hard to justify the trouble right now.

I'm out guys, thanks for the whole cast bullet journey, that was fun over the years but now with the baby (and more coming), I simply don't see myself having time to play with lead again in the next 20 years or so.

I'm sorry to see collectively we couldn't resolve your 9mm cast issues. I've had nothing but great performance from cast lead from several different molds. I am loading 9mm like a commodity now using a Lee Auto Drum powder measure and BE-86 powder. With all of that said, I recently discovered Berrys plated 125gr round nose for 9mm and had I started with plated, I have to admit, I'd probably never gone off the reservation into the world of cast for 9mm. Those Berry's load so clean, fast and consistent and are not expensive! As long as I lube my cast a couple days in advance, the Recluse tumble lube isn't much issue either but those Berrys are gorgeous.

[kryogen]

I shot 35 tonight to test, powdercoated, 357, in my rifled barrel.
For the first time, I went with the lab radar.
I though that they were slow, but they shot at 1100 FPS (3.9 HP38) 124RF

Not that much residue, a bit of leading only after 35 rounds.

Maybe I should find the lower charge that cycles? 1100 fps is quite fast for a lead bullet, maybe if I go back to finding the lowest load that cycles, well, it wouldn't lead that much at all?
(that speed with lube gave generous leading)

[Bookworm]

I have only started loading cast in 9mm, and load for 2 handguns, neither of which is a Glock. That being said, I don't drive the boolits that fast (1100fps), mostly because I don't want to chase the brass through the brush in my range behind the barn. I shoot for (pun intended) something less than 1050, with ~975-1000 just fine. Even 900 is cool, the brass doesn't go far, and it's all about the practice.

After reading this entire thread, it occurs to me that I have read similar threads about loading 9mm cast. Many of these threads involve Glocks, and the different rifling used in them, and the singular problems inherent with that design.

I have considered purchasing a G26, or the newer single stack - G43 ?

However, it seems that so many folks have troubles with Glocks and cast boolits, that the easy way is to use plated for practice and jacketed for carry.
But that means I would need to stock plated, for just that one firearm.

I just don't need the logistical complications involved. I suppose I'll just stay with the conventionally rifled weapons.

Never really liked the way Glocks looked anyway....

[kryogen]

maybe you missed the part where I was using a rifled barrel.