A special .38 Special

[avogunner]

Ok gents, I have this .38 special cartridge ......
By the head stamp, WCC 42 38 Special, it's a WWII military cartridge for something but I haven't found out what. Maybe used in some kind of rig to sever a cable in an emergency?? Anyway, just a guess on my part. What say you guys?
Thanks
&
Semper Fi

156153

[hicard]

Looks like a man-stopper full wad-cutter to me.

[bedbugbilly]

I may be way off on this . . . but somewhere quite a while ago I read about some 38 special cartridges issued to pilots which when fired in the the air, would act like tracer rounds for locating them when they were downed?

I agree . .. . it looks like a nasty big WC but what does the projectile portion look like it is made of? Lead or other material?

[twc1964]

I dont have an answer for you but that sure looks like i wouldnt want to be on the wrong side of the trigger. "Smack"!

[Outpost75]

It is an aerial signal flare.

[bedbugbilly]

outpost75 - I've never seen one - read about them and I was just thinking that the aerial tracer/flare might be what this on is.

Can you elaborate on that special cartridge? Obviously the powder charge would ignite the projectile (I'm assuming) but what was it made out of? Magnesium or some other composite? If I'm remembering correctly from what I read, these were fired straight up or close to it . . .. distance was not great but enough that it could be seen?

[StratsMan]

Sounds like Outpost has the most likely answer... I can only add that I believe they are magnesium, and will toast your barrel. Of course, if you're injured in a hostile environment then burning out a barrel is a small price to pay for your life. I currently have a bunch of their modern counterparts (commercially built, still in the original packaging) in common rifle calibers. They were marketed as rescue flares for hunters, to be fired straight up. Can imagine their fire-starting capability if they hit the ground before they burn out.

[Outpost75]

outpost75 - I've never seen one - read about them and I was just thinking that the aerial tracer/flare might be what this on is. Can you elaborate on that special cartridge? Obviously the powder charge would ignite the projectile (I'm assuming) but what was it made out of? Magnesium or some other composite? If I'm remembering correctly from what I read, these were fired straight up or close to it . . .. distance was not great but enough that it could be seen?

These have a magnesium jacket and are filled with a tracer element with igniter compound which is initiated by the powder charge. They produce a dim night trace until they get up about 1000 feet, then the magnesium ignites and some versions had a bursting charge which would burst the magnesium casing like a firework.

The reason for the bursting, low altitude flare was so that it would not be mistaken for anti-aircraft fire.

[avogunner]

This is interesting....an aerial flare. Thanks for the info fellas...I certainly don't plan to shoot it and it will remain on my bullet board next to the other oddities I've collected over the years.

Semper Fi.

[Jim Flinchbaugh]

that design would be hell on bowling pins :)

[CastingFool]

I was thinking it was a cable cutter round, too. On Chinook helicopters, there is an internal hoist. In case of an emergency, the flight engineer or pilot can cut the cable by energizing the cable cutter which uses a .38 round to drive a wedge that severs the cable and jams up what remains in the spool to keep it from whipping around. Of course, a flare round makes a whole lot more sense, since Chinooks were not even designed in WWII

[Nueces]

Looks to me like the projectile is the same diameter as the case, so it would not chamber in a standard 38 Special chamber. Must be some special use round, whether OEM or not.

[ph4570]

Flare -- yes, I have some in 308.

[HarryT]

I think flare ammunition has a dot of paint on the projectile and all the flare cartridges I've seen were round nosed. I also don't think it is an anti-personnel round because it would be illegal under the Geneva Convention. While I was flying the friendly skies of Southeast Asia, I was issued a S&W Model 15 with 18 tracer cartridges (I carried my S&W Model 19 with commercial ammunition instead). Chopper pilots told me a cylinder full of .38 tracers looks like machinegun fire and there's a good chance they would retaliate (with vengeance).

[jonp]

Didn't the signal flares have purple on the bullet or some other color to make them easy to identify and were all round nose?

[MtGun44]

Interesting.

My father was a Navy pilot in WW2, and carried a S&W Victory model (Model 10 with rough finish)
and they issued JRN tracers, which do NOT look like that.

[avogunner]

Yeah....I'd like to revisit this. I have a 1920's M&P (pre-model 10) and as mentioned in a few threads, this round does NOT chamber, so it can't be used in a pilots Victory model .38. Also, the .38 flare rounds I've seen on my internet searches are painted round nose. Can anybody point to some reference material for this particular round? I'm still thinking a cable cutter of some sort.
Thanks

[andy h]

Have a look at the 5th picture down on this international ammunition association web page.
It appears to be a cartridge for a Powder actuated reefing line cutter M9 Cut's a nylon parachute line.
http://iaaforum.org/forum3/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=16442

[avogunner]

Ahh, great link. Thanks Andy.

[fatelk]

Yes, that's a good link. It sure looks exactly like the cartridge on the far right in the bottom photo.

That photo solves a bit of a small mystery for me also. Many years ago I bought a tattered box of .38 special rounds at a show for a couple bucks. They all had a short wadcutter-style machined aluminum bullet with firing pin shaped tip, and "ORDCO 1959" and lot# etched on each round (IIRC). I stupidly shot one in my Dan Wesson .357. The "bullet" stuck in the forcing cone and red fire came out the cylinder gap for a couple seconds at I recall.

Anyhow, they look exactly like the sectioned cartridge fourth from the right in the aforementioned photo. I had long figured that they were some kind of line cutting cartridge, but this is the first time I'd ever seen a photo of another one.