Colt Official Police

[Kevinakaq]

Found a Colt Official Police in 32-20 earlier today at a local pawn here in Florida while down for Christmas. Has a five inch barrel, about 80% condition. Just didn't have much experience (none as a matter of fact) with it looked like a fun gun. Action tight as can be. I know they don't traditionally bring much as compared with other Colts from some research today and honestly I think I am more intrigued with the caliber than the pistol, but I like both! They wanted 449 and said they would take 400 OTD which I still think is a bit high. May offer them 350 and see what happens as they know I am a shrewd (aka cheap) buyer. Grips were in surprisingly good condition as well. I have a few pictures I may post later after dinner. Looks like it was made in 1950 (correction - 1929) from an internet serial number lookup.

Just looking for thoughts/opinions on the item as I truly enjoying learning another gun/caliber. Thanks ahead of time.

Kev

[salvadore]

I own a 1931 OP 5" barrel in 32/20. It's one of my favorite shooters, you should jump on that deal right now. I paid almost $700 4 or 5 years ago, and had to gunsmith it a bit to get it right. A Lyman 3118 style pb bullet over 3.7gr of 231 is an amazingly accurate load in my OP, but have used a gc bullet using 1680 for a high pressure load. All my bullets are sizes .314 and have never used any jacketed bullets, but that's just me. Have fun, you'll love it.

[Outpost75]

The post WW2 OP has better metallurgy than those made prewar. It is a sturdy gun which will give you good service. Even the pre-WW2 ones made in the late 1920s are pretty good, if you don't get stupid on loads.

If rollmark says Official Police, rather than Army Special, that puts it 1929 and after, which means that at least the frame is heat treated. Residal Army Special barrels and cylinders were used up in production until they gone. I have seen them installed on frames with frame serial numbers up to 1940, but nothing hard and fast, it depended upon which tote box the guy on the shop floor grabbed. I have seen cylinders which were hot heat treated in guns made in the early 1930s. Army Special cylinders test 80-90 Rockwell B, and the heat treated later ones 20 Rockwell C minimum, Rc24 being typical. Obvious difference.

Good thing is that a .32-20 cylinder is heavier walled than the same diameter of cylinder would be in .38 Special, and is strong enough for modest velocity increases over 1873 Winchester type loads. NOT loads for the Winchester '92, but you can safely load to standard .38 Special pressures 18,000 cup vs. 14,000 for .32-20. Basically you don't go looking for hot loads, but you have safe wiggle room if you make an honest mistake.

A charge of 3.0 to 3.2 grains of Bullseye in 1:30 alloy approximates factory lead bullet ammo of years gone by, or 4.0-4.2 grains of W231 or 4.2-4.5 grains of Unique, or 4.5-4.8 grains of PB or Herco.

If you have a chronograph, in a 6-inch barrel and revolver with 0.008" cylinder gap, you are looking at about 900 +/- 30 fps to old classic approximate factory ammo with a 115-grain bullet and maybe 950 +/- 30 fps with 100 grain bullets.

DA revolvers with simultaneous ejection which show sticky extraction, in which all six fired brass cannot be readily pushed out with thumb pressure only is a reliable pressure sign. Such loads are close to 20,000 psi and are an indication to reduce the charge 10%! If you have to strike the ejector rod with the heel of your hand that is a BAD indication that you are getting into Winchester 92 range and steady use will loosen up your nice old gun.

This is the bullet I like in .32-20. Most guns will need .314".

156054

[bedbugbilly]

I have a 1910 Colt Army Special in 38 that I love shooting - which of course was the same gun but it was renamed as the Official Police in 1927 for marketing purposes.

I've been looking for a 32-20 for a long time in either a AS/OP or a Smith. The price of the AS/OP seem to be rising just like anything else. Personally, if I found one in 80% that was a 32-20 and it was mechanically sound . . . I'd probably go $400.00 just because I've been looking for one. Around here, OPs in 38 special seem bo be bringing around $450 or so. I can't speak as to what a 32-20 would go for. If it's something you want though, I'd offer them $350.00 and see what happens. You already know that you can buy it for $400.00. I kind of think that for the average person who wants a shooter and doesn't reload . . . a 38 is going to be more desirable . . . but I could be wrong on that.

I likd vintage S & W revolvers - K frames, etc. . . but as shooters, not for the collector value. I know that in the last couple of years, the price of a decent with some wear M & P K frame has gone up. What used to be a $250 handgun is now a $350 or +. I paid $350 for my Army Special - 38 spl. - 6" - 1910 - original grips and about 90% on the finish from holster wear and that was a few years ago . . . so I don't think the price is that much out of line.

Good luck . . . . I agree . . . a 32-20 would be lots of fun! I'm all set up to reload for it but just haven't run across a good one . . . the older ones I've seen have either been as loose as a goose or terrible bores or way overpriced.

[Kevinakaq]

pictures of the pistol.

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Looking at pics again 80% may have been high, more like 75 or so blueing. Also looked up serial number on another site and looks like a 1929 - 5435@@.

[salvadore]

Buy the gun stud muffin.

[scattershot]

The OP shares the same lockwork as the Python, and is a great pistol. I'd buy it in a heartbeat. They aren't making that quality any more.

[onceabull]

The Last 5" Colt O.P. I had brought $620 at a local gun show around 2 years ago...It was easily a 90% revolver though,and by serial # ,one of the last 32/20s made... Onceabull

[rintinglen]

I paid 350 for a similar gun, save that mine is a 1922 Army Special last year. I have generally found the 32-20's to be tight and sound, more so than the comparable vintage 38's. I believe that this is due to the difference in 32-20 ammunition availability, which, even back in the day, was much more scarce than 38 special ammo.

[Scharfschuetze]

My OP in 38 Special with some of my old PD stuff. Great revolvers. I like this one much more than the Python that I had and used for a while as a PPC revolver.

While I have an S&W Hand Ejector in 32/20 that's a hoot to shoot, I'd really like to have an Official Police in 32/20 such as the OPs.

[Kevinakaq]

The post WW2 OP has better metallurgy than those made prewar. It is a sturdy gun which will give you good service. Even the pre-WW2 ones made in the late 1920s are pretty good, if you don't get stupid on loads.

If rollmark says Official Police, rather than Army Special, that puts it 1929 and after, which means that at least the frame is heat treated. Residal Army Special barrels and cylinders were used up in production until they gone. I have seen them installed on frames with frame serial numbers up to 1940, but nothing hard and fast, it depended upon which tote box the guy on the shop floor grabbed. I have seen cylinders which were hot heat treated in guns made in the early 1930s. Army Special cylinders test 80-90 Rockwell B, and the heat treated later ones 20 Rockwell C minimum, Rc24 being typical. Obvious difference.

Good thing is that a .32-20 cylinder is heavier walled than the same diameter of cylinder would be in .38 Special, and is strong enough for modest velocity increases over 1873 Winchester type loads. NOT loads for the Winchester '92, but you can safely load to standard .38 Special pressures 18,000 cup vs. 14,000 for .32-20. Basically you don't go looking for hot loads, but you have safe wiggle room if you make an honest mistake.

A charge of 3.0 to 3.2 grains of Bullseye in 1:30 alloy approximates factory lead bullet ammo of years gone by, or 4.0-4.2 grains of W231 or 4.2-4.5 grains of Unique, or 4.5-4.8 grains of PB or Herco.

If you have a chronograph, in a 6-inch barrel and revolver with 0.008" cylinder gap, you are looking at about 900 +/- 30 fps to old classic approximate factory ammo with a 115-grain bullet and maybe 950 +/- 30 fps with 100 grain bullets.

DA revolvers with simultaneous ejection which show sticky extraction, in which all six fired brass cannot be readily pushed out with thumb pressure only is a reliable pressure sign. Such loads are close to 20,000 psi and are an indication to reduce the charge 10%! If you have to strike the ejector rod with the heel of your hand that is a BAD indication that you are getting into Winchester 92 range and steady use will loosen up your nice old gun.

This is the bullet I like in .32-20. Most guns will need .314".

156054

Great information Outpost. I really appreciate you taking the time to type that up!!! There is a high chance I will swing by the pawn store tomorrow morning and add a fine pistol to the collection. I did notice that there was no spring return on the ejection. Is that normal? I had to manually push the ejection back into the cylinder. Was not difficult, but was did not return as a Model 10 would.


I have a 1910 Colt Army Special in 38 that I love shooting - which of course was the same gun but it was renamed as the Official Police in 1927 for marketing purposes.

I've been looking for a 32-20 for a long time in either a AS/OP or a Smith. The price of the AS/OP seem to be rising just like anything else. Personally, if I found one in 80% that was a 32-20 and it was mechanically sound . . . I'd probably go $400.00 just because I've been looking for one. Around here, OPs in 38 special seem bo be bringing around $450 or so. I can't speak as to what a 32-20 would go for. If it's something you want though, I'd offer them $350.00 and see what happens. You already know that you can buy it for $400.00. I kind of think that for the average person who wants a shooter and doesn't reload . . . a 38 is going to be more desirable . . . but I could be wrong on that.

I likd vintage S & W revolvers - K frames, etc. . . but as shooters, not for the collector value. I know that in the last couple of years, the price of a decent with some wear M & P K frame has gone up. What used to be a $250 handgun is now a $350 or +. I paid $350 for my Army Special - 38 spl. - 6" - 1910 - original grips and about 90% on the finish from holster wear and that was a few years ago . . . so I don't think the price is that much out of line.

Good luck . . . . I agree . . . a 32-20 would be lots of fun! I'm all set up to reload for it but just haven't run across a good one . . . the older ones I've seen have either been as loose as a goose or terrible bores or way overpriced.

Thanks BedbugBilly for your comments. I truly think the price is medium side of fair and like I posted above will probably get it. Besides it is not like getting a new "plastic" pistol (of which I have several and enjoy). The price is only going to go in one direction. Besides to me it is pretty darn cool and that is enough to satisfy the need!


My OP in 38 Special with some of my old PD stuff. Great revolvers. I like this one much more than the Python that I had and used for a while as a PPC revolver.

While I have an S&W Hand Ejector in 32/20 that's a hoot to shoot, I'd really like to have an Official Police in 32/20 such as the OPs.

That is a darn nice looking pistol! I do enjoy my 38's as well but I absolutely love loading for and learning new calibers. Never even handled a 32-20 before Saturday. The one I am eyeballing does not have nearly the finish as yours, but action is tight as a drum and that is where it counts. Thinks for your pic and your post!


The OP shares the same lockwork as the Python, and is a great pistol. I'd buy it in a heartbeat. They aren't making that quality any more.

Roger that logic! How many more will I run across? Regret is highly overrated...

[Outpost75]

Sounds like somebody may have taken it apart and lost the ejector spring. The same spring is used in the Army Special, Official Police and Officers Model Match. Numrich is currently out of them, but this is the part you need. Bob's Gun Shop or Jack First should have one.

http://www.gunpartscorp.com/Products/201400A.htm

[Kevinakaq]

Sounds like somebody may have taken it apart and lost the ejector spring. The same spring is used in the Army Special, Official Police and Officers Model Match. Numrich is currently out of them, but this is the part you need. Bob's Gun Shop or Jack First should have one.

http://www.gunpartscorp.com/Products/201400A.htm

Thanks Outpost. I am taking her apart right now and will investigate the issue. Ran a patch down bore before ourchasing and is minty fresh! They would not back down from 400 otd so i relented. I figured it might be a while before I run into another 32-20 so why keep looking... Had asked 459 plus tax so they moved nearly 20 percent. All in all it is a nice addition to the collection and will be ordering some starline brass soon, a mold, and some dies! Thanks for the input guys.

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[Kevinakaq]

took it apart and spring is just fine. BUT the ejector rod does not fit through the hole in the cylinder easily. it is simply to tight and needs a little more clearance to enable the spring to function.

[Outpost75]

Sounds like hardened, oxidized oil or grease in the holes.

Give it a thorough cleaning and also check for a bent ejector rod before doing anything else.

[Kevinakaq]

check for a bent ejector rod before doing anything else.

I would have to agree. The ejector rod only fails to return due to friction when the cylinder is in certain positions. Looks like I need to find an ejector rod! I don't have the tool with me in FL anyway to remove the crane bushing.

[Dan Cash]

I gave $450 for a 1914 vintage AS .32-20 in similar condition. Had to work on timing as it was truning the cylinder early and burring the bolt notches. While at it gave it a 24 hour soak in transmission fluid. Wioth timing spot on and crud removed it works as slick as a Python. I use this gun a lot with 105 grain, plain based cast over 8.8 gr of 2400. About 1300 but a lot of extreme spread. It is accurate enough.

[Kevinakaq]

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/67729401/Video.MOV

short video illustrating problem. And with the exception of removing the ejector rod (don't have tool for the crane bushing with me) I have completely dissembled the firearm and cleaned and reassembled. With the ejector rod assembly out of the cylinder the spring and return functions fine.

looking at the ejector rod is appears to be slightly bent.

[Outpost75]

Bent ejector rod is a fairly common replacement. May be an indicator that revolver might have been fired either with too hot handloads or high velocity rifle ammunition so the user had to hammer on the ejector rod to get the brass out.

That calls for close inspection of the chambers for possible bulges or pressure rings. Not as much risk of this in a heat-treated cylinder, but the older Army Specials frequently failed in this manner when people got too zealous with high performance handloads. I speak from personal experience...

[Kevinakaq]

Bent ejector rod is a fairly common replacement. May be an indicator that revolver might have been fired either with too hot handloads or high velocity rifle ammunition so the user had to hammer on the ejector rod to get the brass out.

That calls for close inspection of the chambers for possible bulges or pressure rings. Not as much risk of this in a heat-treated cylinder, but the older Army Specials frequently failed in this manner when people got too zealous with high performance handloads. I speak from personal experience...

I inspected thoroughly and looks gtg. Called Jacks and they want 35 for an ejector rod. Shame Numrich is out of stock as they are around 13. No hurry and will order when I get back to NH. Lots of time to work on projects over winter... This is all a great learning experience (what I enjoy most) and I truely appreciate all the information.

Merry Christmas!

[tim338]

Looks like a good Christmas present to yourself.

Merry Christmas

[Crank]

Kevinakaq,
You did great at $400, I just gladly handed over $450 for a 4" Army Special in 32-20. As for a bent ejector rod, that isn't that bad of a job to correct. Assuming that you haven't done it before and developed a calibrated eyeball, locate a V-block from someone that does machinist work and use that to determine where the bend is by laying it in the V. Make a note of the location (paint, Dykem, magic marker, etc...) and lay the rod with the bend facing up on a piece of old holster leather. Use a clamp to keep it from tipping over while you hands are preoccupied with the next step. Take a brass punch and slowly start striking in that spot with increasing force until you start to straighten it. The leather allows it to flex beyond straight so that it springs back to, hopefully, the straightness it should have. Trial and error should produce satisfactory results in short order without spending a dime. Enjoy your new acquisition!

Mark

[bedbugbilly]

Looks like you bought a "keeper"! LOL Congrats! The fix shouldn't be bad and the photos of it look good! I wish I could find one in 32-20! Enjoy it and have fun shooting it! A nice Christmas present to yourself!