820 and Lee loader cups

[just bill]

I want to say hi to this side of the forum. Haven't had too many reloading questions, but here it goes.
I thought I'd pull out the old ever faithful Lee cups, 1966 vintage. My 820 surplus powder weighs in at aa9, to my surprise no data any where I can find for 820 or aa9. Is there some kind of conversion or spreadsheet formula to use for 820?
Thanks.
Bill

[Tracy]

Both wc820 and aa9 should weigh about the same per volume as h110.

[just bill]

Tracy

good to know

thanks,
Bill

[dale2242]

My lot of WC820 is extremely fine ball powder.
Much finer than H110/296I`
I`m not sure how that will effect the volume to weight ratio.....dale

[nicholst55]

My lof of WC820 said to use AA #9 load data minus 10%, IIRC - without walking into the next room and checking.

[just bill]

The problem I am having is that the Lee cups do not have either aa9 or 820 listed on the charts I have.

[454PB]

Looks like it's time to break out the scales and write your own!

[TCLouis]

Measured and Weighed
Sample of at least 3
WC 820 Lot #50282
Do not know how it compares to calculated volume/weight/weight change


Volume Weight
.3 4.4
.5 7.4
.7 10.3
1.0 14.3
1.5 23.3
1.5 23.3
1.9 27.8

I get 1.7 grains/revolution of thead justment on the RCBS small volume rotor

As an aside I can NOT get this powder/lot to light off with anything less that WSR or WSPM primers in the 357 or 44 Mag, using it in rifle cases with boolits it lights off just fine.

[just bill]

Looks like it's time to break out the scales and write your own!

Kinda thought about doing that, however I was hoping some one else had the same problem.
Thanks,
Bill

[BCB]

Not sure how this will post, but I actually measured the volume of WC-820 (lot#47320) using the Lee Dippers. I also tried to post a .JPG file of the actual AA#9 data from the slide rule that comes with the dippers. Mine is fairly old also, but not 1966 vintage I don’t think. I hope it can be enlarged...



POWDER

0.3

0.5

0.7

1.0

1.3

1.6

1.9

2.2

2.5

2.8

3.1

3.4

3.7

4.0

4.3



WC-820
4.51
7.52
10.53
15.04
19.55
24.06
28.57
33.08
37.60
42.11
46.62
51.13
55.64
60.15
64.67




Good-luck…BCB
























156126

[BCB]

One more try on the slide rule that comes with the Lee Dipper set...

(Maybe read it with a magnifying glass!!!)

156127

[just bill]

Not sure how this will post, but I actually measured the volume of WC-820 (lot#47320) using the Lee Dippers. I also tried to post a .JPG file of the actual AA#9 data from the slide rule that comes with the dippers. Mine is fairly old also, but not 1966 vintage I don’t think. I hope it can be enlarged...



POWDER

0.3

0.5

0.7

1.0

1.3

1.6

1.9

2.2

2.5

2.8

3.1

3.4

3.7

4.0

4.3



WC-820
4.51
7.52
10.53
15.04
19.55
24.06
28.57
33.08
37.60
42.11
46.62
51.13
55.64
60.15
64.67




Good-luck…BCB
























156126

Thanks, I have 2 charts one from the box and one of line. Neither had aa9 on it. I'm going to break out the scale and double check the data before I put it into play. I tried to enlarge the picture but it's not clear enough for reloading.
Bill

[BCB]

just bill...

I am trying to figure out exactly what you are looking for…

What cartridge are you going to reload with the WC-820?...

The copy of the slide rule from Lee shows a 0.3cc dipper = 4.6 grains of AA#9. And the 4.3cc dipper = 65.5 grains of AA#9. I did have to strain my eyes, but I could see that, although it is a bit blurry…

If you look at my data for the WC-820 lot # 47320, you will see that it is very very close to what Lee dippers indicate. I have found those dippers to be off most times, but only by a small percentage--could be light or could be heavy. The beginning and end dippers on the slide rule fall close to mine, so the in-between must be close also. Mine actually could be a bit more accurate as I weighed mine many years ago—I honestly don’t know why as I look back on it!!!...

I just set my micrometer bushing for my RCBS Uniflow to 2.0 and threw 10 charges each of WC-820 and AA#9. I then divided the total weight of the 10 throws and got an average charge for AA#9 at 9.05 grains. For WC-820 it was 9.06 grains. In my opinion, they are the same powder—at least my AA#9 and WC-820 are…

I have shoot equal charges of both side-by-side with the same recipe and they chronographed literally within 10 fps. Seems like the same powder to me…

Regardless, I doubt you need the precision with this powder you are looking for. If you do need this type of precision with charges, the Lee Dippers aren’t your tool of choice. You will need to throw the charge light and trickle to the weight you want. Or use a Lee Dipper that holds a lighter charge than you want and still trickle to the final weight…

Most uses for either powder do not require accuracy to a tenth of a grain…

Just my thoughts, but to each his own medicine…

Good-luck…BCB

[BCB]

The problem I am having is that the Lee cups do not have either aa9 or 820 listed on the charts I have.

If it's the same lot as mine (47320), it is H-110 data minus 10%...

If yours said minus 10% of AA#9 data, you must have a pretty fast lot...

I have heard there are 3 different lots of WC-820...

Good-luck...BCB

[just bill]

BCB,
Thanks, I'm teaching some one reloading, I'm giving them most of my beginning tools and want to be sure to they learn correct procedure, the cups were the first tools as well as a set of 310 reloading set. When there is a discrepancy in data I investigate. Since the 820 is not really published as such but is the "same as " I'm overly cautious. You have been very patient and a wealth of knowledge, with the way powder is available I just want to broaden options, for powder of opportunity.
Thanks,
Bill

What part of western PA. I'm originally from Pgh.

[TCLouis]

WC 820 offerings

One HS7 speed

One AA# 9

One H110, this one LONG since not offered, as in YEARS ago

[BCB]

WC 820 offerings

One HS7 speed

One AA# 9

One H110, this one LONG since not offered, as in YEARS ago

Yep, I have read many times there were 3 different offerings...

My lot # 47320 is the H-110 minus 10% canister...

I got it from Camp Perry in 2002 and the price was a few cents less than $60 for 8 pounds...

I've been pecking at it since then but not too often anymore. My handgun ammo has become mostly round nose stuff and low velocities--easy to shoot and accurate. Small charges of fast burners...

And on a side note, I have an 8-pound keg of a powder designated No. 9-S. I don't remember where it came from as I don't have any notes on the container, but it shoots exactly the same as my lot of WC-820. May be the exact powder but a different name...

Good-luck...BCB

[BCB]

BCB,
Thanks, I'm teaching some one reloading, I'm giving them most of my beginning tools and want to be sure to they learn correct procedure, the cups were the first tools as well as a set of 310 reloading set. When there is a discrepancy in data I investigate. Since the 820 is not really published as such but is the "same as " I'm overly cautious. You have been very patient and a wealth of knowledge, with the way powder is available I just want to broaden options, for powder of opportunity.
Thanks,
Bill

What part of western PA. I'm originally from Pgh.

Clarion--About 60 miles north...

[just bill]

Clarion--About 60 miles north...

Worked there many moon ago, surveyed for J&L, I believe.

[BCB]

Worked there many moon ago, surveyed for J&L, I believe.

Not familiar with that company...

[Mk42gunner]

just bill,
Since your Lee dippers are from 1966, aren't they calibrated in cubic inches and made from red plastic? The current ones are in cubic centimeters and yellow plastic.

Reason I ask is I had a couple of shotgun Lee loaders from about 76 and 77 for shotguns with the red powder dippers. Shot dippers were black.

I have read that some of the very early ones were aluminum, but I have not seen any of them in person.

Robert

[just bill]

just bill,
Since your Lee dippers are from 1966, aren't they calibrated in cubic inches and made from red plastic? The current ones are in cubic centimeters and yellow plastic.

Reason I ask is I had a couple of shotgun Lee loaders from about 76 and 77 for shotguns with the red powder dippers. Shot dippers were black.

I have read that some of the very early ones were aluminum, but I have not seen any of them in person.

Robert

They're black, however since there were so many variables they are part of the history box, the balance beam has taken their place.
Thanks,
Bill