Lube Groove Diameter Question

[FISH4BUGS]

OK...so I have become a fan of lube grooves the size of the Panama Canal. It would seem that the wider the lube groove, the more lube there is and the harder you can drive them, all else being equal with plain base bullets.
My example: the H&G #51. A VERY wide lube groove. I can drive that very hard with 296 without leading.
I just traded for a Lyman 429421 that has a WIDE lube groove. I hope to drive that one hard too.
The question is: on plain base bullets, is there a relationship between the lube groove width and how hard you can drive them? It seems reasonable: more lube less friction less leading. Assuming a hard cast bullet (5lbs ww to 1 lb linotype).
This inquiring mind wants to know.

[JSnover]

You're not the only one who likes big grooves: http://www.biglube.com/Default.aspx
Another theoretical advantage could be reduced bore friction due to the reduced surface contact. If there is a relationship between groove width and velocity it probably places third after alloy hardness and boolit fit.

[bangerjim]

There are several on here that sell lube grooves. You should be able to find everything you want from them!

banger

[FISH4BUGS]

Exactly what I was getting at. Lube groove size, all else being equal, MUST add to the ability to be driven harder without leading given identical lead hardness and sized bullet diameter.
Now what am I going to do with all these gas checks?

[JSnover]

There are several on here that sell lube grooves. You should be able to find everything you want from them!

banger
Choose your vendor carefully. You don't want to waste your hard-earned cash on cheap Asian knock-offs and you certainly don't want to run afoul of the Loob Gruve Mafia.

[bangerjim]

Exactly what I was getting at. Lube groove size, all else being equal, MUST add to the ability to be driven harder without leading given identical lead hardness and sized bullet diameter.
Now what am I going to do with all these gas checks?

Coasters for fairy beer bottles?

[FISH4BUGS]

Coasters for fairy beer bottles?
You laugh....I have over 10,000 of 35 caliber and 6000 44 caliber gas checks. I bought them here and there from this site. Gator makes good checks and I have never used one of them. I guess maybe it is time to learn, no?

[bangerjim]

WOOOOW........that' s a lotta checks! I have a few thou scattered around (22/30/38/44), but my ratio is 60:1......I shoot 60 rounds plain or no check base to 1 round that is full-house and needs a check.

I know PC is supposed to not offer gas cutting protection and I tell people that all the time when the ask, but I have found less and less need for Cu GC's since starting powder coating ~3 years ago. Go figger!

banger

[FISH4BUGS]

WOOOOW........that' s a lotta checks! I have a few thou scattered around (22/30/38/44), but my ratio is 60:1......I shoot 60 rounds plain or no check base to 1 round that is full-house and needs a check.
banger
Yes but I shoot machine guns...I buy everything in bulk. Even gas checks. I try to buy less but it just doesn't work......the good news is no component shortage here! Don't tell the fire department!

[John Boy]

I have become a fan of lube grooves the size of the Panama Canal. It would seem that the wider the lube groove, the more lube there is and the harder you can drive them, all else being equal with plain base bullets. Have to disagree ...
Check out the GG depth & width on the Dan Theodore Mini Groove and Paper Patch Bullets. Zero lube starvation with either of them. On ignition, the revolution of the GG bullet leaves a thin microscopic layer of lube in the bore

http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd220/Meadowmucker/Bullets/Docs45-cal18-TMiniG5-groovetappered.jpg (http://s222.photobucket.com/user/Meadowmucker/media/Bullets/Docs45-cal18-TMiniG5-groovetappered.jpg.html)

http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd220/Meadowmucker/Bullets/IMGP0795.jpg



(http://s222.photobucket.com/user/Meadowmucker/media/Bullets/IMGP0795.jpg.html)http://i222.photobucket.com/albums/dd220/Meadowmucker/Bullets/Big-Lube-Three.jpg

Bullets with deep wide GG's leave a lube star at the muzzle
(http://s222.photobucket.com/user/Meadowmucker/media/Bullets/Big-Lube-Three.jpg.html)

[Mk42gunner]

My thoughts on wide and deep lube grooves are that they were (and are) useful with black powder or with marginal lubes from the old days. I do not think they are needed with some of the modern lubes available now, such as FWFL or Ben's Red to name a couple.

I do think a thick base band is better for a plain based boolit than a thin one, especially if you are planning to push it hard.

Robert

[waksupi]

I like a groove just a few thousands under bore diameter. Uses less lube, gives good hydraulic support for the bullet. If the grooves are too deep, and they are not uniformly filled, this could theoretically allow partial collapse of the nose into the groove area. Probably more relevant to rifles rather than pistols.
Just my gut feeling on the topic. Since liquid Alox works, I'm probably all wet.