Bartletts Hercules Unique Powder

[jonp]

I didn't see any recent threads on this powder that Jeff has in stock. I'm a little curious that the description says to use Hercules not Alliant Unique data as other threads I've seen say that the two are interchangeable and the only difference is the Alliant is cleaner. Why the Hercules reference?

Has anybody ordered any and worked up loads to see how it reacts?

[9w1911]

He seems to list Hercules for powders quite often. Also I am certain load data for Hercules and Alliant is the same. I would love to give this a try Unique in a ball powder.

[GabbyM]

Is that what they were calling Russian Unique a few years back? I never had any of it.

[9w1911]

No, I believe the Russian Unique was a flake powder.

[jmort]

I just ordered a whole lot of it. It had better be good. The last batch I got from him started off as a Hercules 2400 equivalent and by the time he got to my batch/order, all that remained was a SR4759 equivalent which is some really good stuff.

[472x1B/A]

I ordered 36 lbs. a few months ago of this BR-5 powder to get the Hazmat Fee wavier. Bartlets powder description states it is 'similar' to Hercules Unique. I have found that I have to use one to one and a half grains more BR-5 in 9 mm and .38 spl. than Unique. Still working with .40 s&w and .44 mag.. I use a Lee 4 hole turret press with a auto disk powder measure. YMMV

[jmort]

"I ordered 36 lbs. a few months ago of this BR-5 powder to get the Hazmat Fee wavier."


Me too. I suppose having a grain or so difference in the right direction, my opinion, is OK. Keeps you below max, apparently. I am still waiting for mine.

[Hamish]

I just ordered a whole lot of it. It had better be good. The last batch I got from him started off as a Hercules 2400 equivalent and by the time he got to my batch/order, all that remained was a SR4759 equivalent which is some really good stuff.

I dithered a couple of hours and ended up with that Alcan 9450 too, great stuff! I need to go look at his web page,,,,,

[35 shooter]

HHHHMMMM. i use 12 gr. of unique in a 35 whelen case for reduced load shooting with a 280 gr. boolit (1275 fps.)

Wonder how this ball powder equivalent of unique works in reduced loads with larger rifle cases like the whelen?
Anyone tried it?

[RugerFan]

No, I believe the Russian Unique was a flake powder.

No, Russian Unique (Salute) is definitely not a flake powder. At least not what I have. Its closer to a ball powder in appearance than a flake.

[9w1911]

I have never seen it other than a batch for sale online and the guy took a picture of it. Now you guys make me want to get some BR5

[jonp]

I have never seen it other than a batch for sale online and the guy took a picture of it. Now you guys make me want to get some BR5

If you lived closer id split a 6 jug order to save hazmat. A ball unique sounds pretty good to me.

[9w1911]

Yea I live in the wastelands haha I'd love to split an order! Especially with you buddy! :)
Agreed, I'd love to try it out, I bet my 44s would love it.

[farmbif]

well, is there a consensus on this br5, i just got the first jug of universal that I have been able to find in about three years.
when i saw jeff had this unique equivelant I been hemmin and hawin just had not pulled the trigger on it yet

[vzerone]

Personally myself I like Unique with it's round flakes better then if it was a ball powder because it occupies more space in big cases like 45 Colt for example. Then you don't have that problem where the powder could shift to the front of the cartridge and that does make a difference in ignition.

[jmort]

I'm using it for 9mm and a 135 grain RFN so I bet it will be near 100%
I will try it in other applications like .357, but I don't disagree with the notion that it could be position sensitive in large cases. Will also do some 12 gauge and the gas seal eliminates any empty space.

[jonp]

I'm also not a big fan of ball powders in a larger case. Not because of the chance of a double charge but the movement of the powder.

"I ordered 36 lbs. a few months ago of this BR-5 powder to get the Hazmat Fee wavier."

I ordered jugs of WC860 for the same reason as without the hazmat it came in at something like $6/lb. I wanted to try duplexing loads as a cheaper alternative to straight powder but have not had a chance to try it yet. I have loading data for my 43 Spanish using AA8700 so I'm going to give that a try after the BP/duplexing Black Powder experiments.

[kayak1]

I'm also not a big fan of ball powders in a larger case. Not because of the chance of a double charge but the movement of the powder.

"I ordered 36 lbs. a few months ago of this BR-5 powder to get the Hazmat Fee wavier."

I ordered jugs of WC860 for the same reason as without the hazmat it came in at something like $6/lb. I wanted to try duplexing loads as a cheaper alternative to straight powder but have not had a chance to try it yet. I have loading data for my 43 Spanish using AA8700 so I'm going to give that a try after the BP/duplexing Black Powder experiments.

Where are you getting powder without the hazmat fee?

[vzerone]

Where are you getting powder without the hazmat fee?


Bartletts waive the HAZ fee on certain types of powders if you buy enough volume of it. Sometimes Wideners does too.

[jmort]

Six kegs gets Hazmat waiver

[Hick]

I'll be watching for your reports on how this Unique works out. I haven't been able to locate any Unique and want to use it with CB in my 32 WS. I've got some 700X I'll try out for now, but I've been wanting to try Unique.

[kayak1]

Bartletts waive the HAZ fee on certain types of powders if you buy enough volume of it. Sometimes Wideners does too.

I normally shop at http://www.powdervalleyinc.com/, I odn't know the sites you have listed. Google couldn't point me to the bartletts could you share the link with me?

Thanks in advance!

NM found it. Thanks for the help. I will have to see about ordering some next week:
http://www.gibrass.com/gunpowder.html

[Elkins45]

The last time I bought powder from him I just drove to Owensboro and picked it up. In fact I watched him pour it into the jugs.

I killed a deer with a NOE bullet and some of his WC870 this fall.

[njtoo1]

I have been using BR-5 from Jeff since last fall and have had no problems with it loading all sorts of 38 special loads. Recently I received the following results from a S&W Model 66-1 2.5 inch revolver using 158 grain lswc bullets.

5 grains BR-5 got me 855 fps
5.4 grains BR-5 got me 885 fps

For me it burns much cleaner than Unique. I did use a few at 5.6 grains of BR-5 and it was a bit stout. So I'll keep it at 5 grains for general use. Accuracy was just as good as Unique for me from 7 yards out to 25 yards on the qualification range.

Hope that helps out a bit. I shoot about 2500 rounds a year and will pick up another jug or two of this if he still has it in stock.

[Ricochet]

Ball powder similar to Unique? That is how I've always thought of Accurate #5.

[DerekP Houston]

I have been using BR-5 from Jeff since last fall and have had no problems with it loading all sorts of 38 special loads. Recently I received the following results from a S&W Model 66-1 2.5 inch revolver using 158 grain lswc bullets.

5 grains BR-5 got me 855 fps
5.4 grains BR-5 got me 885 fps

For me it burns much cleaner than Unique. I did use a few at 5.6 grains of BR-5 and it was a bit stout. So I'll keep it at 5 grains for general use. Accuracy was just as good as Unique for me from 7 yards out to 25 yards on the qualification range.

Hope that helps out a bit. I shoot about 2500 rounds a year and will pick up another jug or two of this if he still has it in stock.

Thanks for the review! Still in stock now, though I'm not sure if I need to add any more to my surplus collection.

[Blackwater]

I'm with vzerone on the bulking up thing, and Unique has proven itself to be very accurate in many calibers, and I think this is part of the reason. Still, though, finding ANY powder that works now is a GOOD thing! I'd have a hard time justifying the size order I'd need to send one to Bartlett, but I may succumb to the temptation anyway. These days, more seems to be a better deal, even when it's not our old standbys. You guys help keep the temptation level high, too. Thanks!

[Ricochet]

I would like some of this, but a jug is probably a lifetime supply for me. I could go for 2. Anybody around the Bristol-Kingsport-Johnson City, Tennessee & Southwest Virginia area interested in going in on 6?

[Ricochet]

I've got a bite for one more jug. Message me.

[472x1B/A]

^^^ I think you will like this BR 5 powder. The description says it is 'similar' to Hercules Unique. I have found NOT to under load any loads and that most need 1 to 1 1/2 grains more per Unique loads. This is in .38 spl., .40 S&W, 9mm, and .45 ACP. ( These are the only ones I have been able to 'play' with so far. ) Other wise there will be unburnt powder in your cases.

[BaconStrips]

I don't know when he started it but I just noticed Bartlett is charging $15 hazmat on 6 jug orders now.

[ScotMc]

Hi.
I have been using 4 grains of the BR5 with a 158 lead SWC in my Colt Official Police 38 spcl. with no issues. Seems to burn a lot cleaner than the "old" Unique. Plan to try it in the 30-30 with cast boolits next. This is a great forum.

[shooting on a shoestring]

Welcome aboard ScotMc.
Gee using non-canister powder to push boolits out of an old 38 and doing the same in 30-30, yep this is where you fit in.

Im curious about BR-5. I've tried AA5 in 38 and had some granules hanging around in the cylinder and a bit in the barrel. Not any kind of problem, just enough to see. Do you get something similar with BR-5?

[ScotMc]

Thanks for the "welcome". BR-5 seems to burn fairly clean without any granules. January I tried 50 rounds in the 38 and have not had time to load any more to try. Good accuracy at 25 yards. I am on an overseas vacation for 3 months. I get home early April and will report back after I play with BR-5 in the Remington 788 in 30-30.

[Lloyd Smale]

am I out of touch? I look at 100 bucks for 6lbs plus shipping and hazmat and have to wonder if its just as cheap to buy some unique. At least when the unique runs out and you have loads worked up you can allways buy more.

[DerekP Houston]

am I out of touch? I look at 100 bucks for 6lbs plus shipping and hazmat and have to wonder if its just as cheap to buy some unique. At least when the unique runs out and you have loads worked up you can allways buy more.

it * used* to be a better deal lloyd, you could buy 6 kegs and get free shipping/hazmat was my understanding.

[Screwbolts]

Lloyd,
Yes you may be out of touch with all areas and pricing, the last unique I saw it on the shelf/list, it was $32.95 a pound and if you bought 6, that is by my old school math, 197.70 plus 8.25 sales tax = $ 214.00 plus gas or diesel to drive 80 miles round trip. By my way of thinking, 6 lbs fer $100 plus $45 to ship it ( haz and shipping) saves this farm boy some money.

Ken

[Jeff Michel]

am I out of touch? I look at 100 bucks for 6lbs plus shipping and hazmat and have to wonder if its just as cheap to buy some unique. At least when the unique runs out and you have loads worked up you can allways buy more.

I think your right, I just picked up an eight pound bottle for 139.00 and tax. Surplus powder doesn't appear to be that good of a value anymore when you compare it to what available.

[Lloyd Smale]

last I saw (about 6 months ago) a keg of bullseye was 197 bucks (8lbs) in gander mountain and they've allways been on the high side. For the few bucks saved I don't know if I want to get into a powder that a year from now is gone and all my load development is for not. then factor in that you use about a 1/3 to a 1/2 less powder using bullseye to get the same velocitys and you can see what really saves you money. Now if I could just find some more bullseye or 231. That to me is what this surplus is good for. It gets me by when commercial powders just aren't on the shelves.

[Lloyd Smale]

not any more. 30 bucks for less then 6 jugs and 15 bucks for more then 6.
Six kegs gets Hazmat waiver

[TMenezes]

Anyone still using this powder? I was thinking about trying it. Also if anyone in CA wanted to split an order that would be awesome.

[Kosh75287]

I would love to give this a try Unique in a ball powder. Alliant BE-86 is reasonably close, though the loading data is slightly different.
AA#5 seems (to ME) to burn at about the rate of Alliant Herco, but burns cleanly and meters well. AA#5 data & Alliant Herco data are NOT INTERCHANGEABLE. I do not want this post to sound like I am saying that.

I'd LIKE to get a keg of the "Unique" that Jeff Bartlett has, but I have an 8# jug of Alliant Promo that I am still trying to whittle down. Even with the large volume at which Mr. Bartlett sells his powders, it is currently less expensive for me to buy Alliant Unique or 20/28 off the shelf. My reloading component supply is 2 miles away, and most of the powders that sell for over $32/lb are made by VV (they seem to work wonderfully, but not THAT "wonderfully").
I sure don't need 6 jugs of "Unique", either. I am pretty sure that in the future, I will regret not getting some of this powder in the present. But right now, there's no way to justify the outlay.

[TMenezes]

I just noticed that Hodgdon CFE pistol was developed at the request of the US military. I compared the loads you all are sharing and they appear to be about the same as Hodgdon CFE load data. Do you think this Mil Surp powder and CFE could be the same powder?

[jbelder]

No, Russian Unique (Salute) is definitely not a flake powder. At least not what I have. Its closer to a ball powder in appearance than a flake.
I got 30+ pounds of it. It definitely a flake powder. Red in color looks just like unique.

Sent from my ASUS_Z012DA using Tapatalk

[472x1B/A]

Am on my last jug of BR-5. Have been jabbing my Mrs. about a new order for more BR-5. Up to 10 grs. in .44 mag. SBH with cast 240gr. SWC's. 50/50 alloy with slight leading. Going to go 10.5 grs. next week with harder alloy and see what happens. I started out at 7.5 grs. and was just too light of a load. Have been working up from there over the last 6 months. For me, this is cheaper than actual Unique at my LGS..

[Shiloh]

No, I believe the Russian Unique was a flake powder.

And gone when I heard about it. He used to have a dozen or more powders all the time in the good old days of cheap surplus powder.

SHiloh

[Shiloh]

I just ordered a whole lot of it. It had better be good. The last batch I got from him started off as a Hercules 2400 equivalent and by the time he got to my batch/order, all that remained was a SR4759 equivalent which is some really good stuff.

A group of us bought 48 pound of the 4759 Clone. I think it was called 7641 back then. Over two orders I wound up with more than 25 pounds. I asked him to put as much in a jug as he could get and charge accordingly. He was happy to accomodate.

Great powder for all my cast boolit rifles. I have less than 8 pounds and have been using 4227 instead to stretch it out.
I miss the days of plentiful and cheap surplus powder. Thast powder has to go back almost 15 years.

Shiloh

[Ganderite]

I bought a few jugs of it in the hope it would be as useful as the IPP powder I bought a few years ago. (Also in the Unique speed range.)

I loaded my first test of it last night and shot it today. It metered very well. I am pleased with it.

9mm with a 135 LRN bullet and BR5 powder. I loaded 3.0 to 5.5 in 0.5 gr increments, to get a "feel" for the powder.

3.0 & 3.5 were too mild to cycle the pistol (Canik)

4.0 was a very accurate mild load. 5.0 was also quite accurate and snappy.

I will use 4.0 on paper and 5.0 on steel.

[Lloyd Smale]

was interested in the br2 until I saw the price. 5lbs for 80 bucks. I bought pr200 from him (which is probably the same thing) just 5 years ago for 49 bucks for 6lbs. Id like some more because I'm down to about 10lbs but that's not much cheaper then aa2 (which is the same thing) my guess is that he got it a heck of a lot cheaper then that and is making a killing off of it because of shortages.

[Lloyd Smale]

was interested in the br2 until I saw the price. 5lbs for 80 bucks. I bought pr200 from him (which is probably the same thing) just 5 years ago for 49 bucks for 6lbs. Id like some more because I'm down to about 10lbs but that's not much cheaper then aa2 (which is the same thing) my guess is that he got it a heck of a lot cheaper then that and is making a killing off of it because of shortages. Guess I just don't see why some get excited about this unique replacement that is a 100 bucks for 6lbs when you can get brand new unique on midway for 150 bucks for 8lbs and when its gone be able to buy another keg that is the same powder. When his br5 runs out your going to have to start load development all over again for any gun you use it in if you have to switch back to real unique. If he was back to even 10 bucks a lb I might consider it but not at the prices hes asking for it now.

[ScotMc]

Kind of an update on my previous posts. I have been using the BR-5 in my 9.5 inch Super Redhawk in 44 mag with a 2.5-8 Luepold.
I'm using 9.5 grains BR-5 with a 240 grain flat point plated Rainier bullet, CCI 300 primer. I consistently shoot 2" to 3" groups at 100 yards with a rest. The load is fairly mild, and burns really clean. I'm loading with a Dillon 550 B and the powder meters very consistent through the Dillon powder measure.
I have not run any of these loads over a chronograph yet. I have some loads with both the BR5 and Unique at 9.5 grains loaded up for that purpose. I have a feeling the BR-5 loads will be somewhat slower than the Unique. Will post the results here after I get a chance to get the Chronograph out.....

[RoyEllis]

Guess I just don't see why some get excited about this unique replacement that is a 100 bucks for 6lbs when you can get brand new unique on midway for 150 bucks for 8lbs and when its gone be able to buy another keg that is the same powder. When his br5 runs out your going to have to start load development all over again for any gun you use it in if you have to switch back to real unique. If he was back to even 10 bucks a lb I might consider it but not at the prices hes asking for it now.
Totally agree with Lloyd here...$100 for 6lbs=$16.67/lb, Powder Valley and Recob's Target Shop both have Unique @ $132.95 for 8lbs=$16.62/lb. No brainer for me at least.....