310 tong tools?

[shooter93]

I'm looking for information on the Ideal/lyman 310 tools....history...types...markings etc. Any books on the subject? Thanks.

[floodgate]

shooter93:

There's a brief introduction to the older, pre-Lyman tong tools in Chamberlain & Quigley's "Cartridge Reloading Tools of the Past", available fromTom Quigley at <tlqmlq@q.com>; and there is a little out-of-print "Field Guide to Identifying the Ideal Tong Tools" by George McCluny; the 310 tools - formed by a "merger" of the older #3 (rimmed cases) and #10 (rimless) tools - are well covered by John W. Rockefeller in "Lyman's Classic 310 Tool", pp. 128 - 136 in the 14th Edition (1995) of "Handloaders Digest"; an excellent source for old and new 310s (and a few of the earlier ones), and many individual dies and accessories, is Randy Davis' "The 310 Shop" at <www.the310shop.com>. I have three or four dozen of the older and newer versions, and may be able to help with identifications or techniques for using them, as can several other posters here. PM me if you'd like to follow up.

floodgate

[KCSO]

I have an instruction sheet that came with the 310 and can copy it for you if you want.

[ktw]

The older Lyman loading manuals typically have a couple of pages dedicated to using each of the Lyman loading tools, including the 310 tools. e.g. my copy of Lyman 42 has some decent 310 tool instructions. The more recent Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook has a couple of pages on the history of Lyman hand tools.

I have some article reprints and reference lists on file, many of them courtesy of Floodgate. If you have a specific question (i.e. shell holders, top punch, seater punch, die set codes, I would be willing to scan something up and send it to you.

-ktw

[shooter93]

Thanks guys...I ordered a reprint of the directions and die lists. I may already have the Handloaders Digest if not it will be easy to get. The other book however...is going to take some searching but I'll find it. Are there separate tools for rimmed and Rimless rounds? Will the newer tools accecpt both? I'm assuming the older steel tools are more desirable? I'm going to pick up a few things and want to know what I'm doing before I start buying. Thanks again.

[ktw]

There are currently only two base tools: long nozzle (rifle) and short nozzle (handgun).
- They use a replaceable, cartridge specific adapter ring (each ring is usable across a range of similar cartridges based on head diameter, like shellholders).
- They have adjustable extractors and replaceable wear plates at the knuckle

The old steel tools are more collectable, but are heavier and can't be changed out to a new cartridge using the adapter rings. The current tools are more functional.

-ktw

[KCSO]

Generaly speaking the long tool will do most rifle rounds and the short tool will do pistol rounds both rimmed and rimless. The extractor hook can be adjusted for each ctg and rim type. You want it to snap over the rims or into the rim and drop free as the shell pulls out of the die. The new tools while somewhat more functional are not as sturdy as the old steel tools and for rough service I prefer the steel. The Steel tool handles regardless of markings will each handle a number of calibers, for example the 30-06 marked handle I have does very well with 7.65 Arg, 308 ect any rifle shell with a nominal .473 base diameter. Samo samo the smalls and a 38 handle will do 357, 38 s and W 9mm ect.

[floodgate]

shooter93:

The little "Field Guide..." is nearly impossible to find, but if you will PM me your PO address, I have a copy I can spare; the Chamberlain & Quigley book is still available from Tom, and is a great general guide to a whole range of 19th Century American reloading tools. The older, nickeled (and a few late, blued) tong tools used separate sysems for rimmed and rimless cases, due to the way the cartridge cases were held in place in the handle for the priming operation; the 310 simplified this by using a separate, screw-in priming die, machined to fit the specific rimmed or rimless case head. BUT, the 310's are made with two lengths to the inside 5/8" (actually, 19/32") x 30 tpi threaded "nozzle" that takes the dies, one for short, pistol-sized cases and the other for longer rifle-type ones - but there is some overlap; normally a - say - .30-30 die set can be used in either type (a very few steel- and aluminum-handled 310's - and a number of the older tools - used a special over-size die thread for "fat" cases like the .50-70, 8mm Lebel and .348; and a very few, very early tong tools used a smaller die thread for smaller cases like the .22 Maynard, .22-15-60, .22 WCF etc.) .

The nickeled and plum-blued handles are handsomer, but the aluminum-handled ones are lighter, and have an added hardened "wear plate" that pushes on the case head; older steel tools often show considerable abrasion at this point (a few steel tools with the wear plate, a screw-in case-head adapter, and an adjustable extractor hook, were made to check out this system, before the switch to the alloy ones about 1957). Also, most of the steel tools were caliber-specific and would not accept cases of different head diameter from the cartridge they were made for (as stamped on the tool handle).

Steel tools for "pretty". Alloy ones for practical use and interchangeability.

floodgate

EDIT/PS: Looks like I overlapped with KCSO and ktw while typing this out; all good info! Fg

[Tracy]

I know this is an old thread, but I just bought a steel one, stamped "IDEAL Middlefield Conn USA" on one handle, "L" on the other, and it has the wear plate, adjustable hook, and adapter recess. No mention of Lyman, but looks just like a later alloy tool except for being steel. The L, of course, denotes long nozzle just like the later ones.
I prefer steel for durability. The thing that really bothers be about the aluminum (or is it zinc alloy/pot metal?) version is the possibility of fatigue eventually causing a handle to snap.

[Green Frog]

Tracy,

You just found the "holy grail" of 310 tools!! :mrgreen:

When Randy Davis still ran the 310 Shop (it has since been sold to someone else, whose name escapes me at the moment) he divulged that for about one year there were transitional handles made in both large and small sizes, using the old steel (or cast iron) handles, but having the interchangeable inserts to make them caliber specific. He charged a big premium for them as they were (and apparently are) hard to find, but I got lucky and found the small here in VA in Richmond and the large in Roanoke gun shows at "aluminum"prices! [smilie=w:[smilie=w: They, along with the older caliber specific handles for the calibers I use most, are my go-to handles.

Congratulations!! :drinks:

[Tim357]

The only problems I ever had were the hook tearing the rims from 45 Colt brass, and a hook actually broke. My dad and I made a new hook from decent steel, and I'm still using it to this day. I have both steel and potmetal 310s; I much prefer the steel..
Tim sends

[Sixgun Symphony]

The older Lyman loading manuals typically have a couple of pages dedicated to using each of the Lyman loading tools, including the 310 tools. e.g. my copy of Lyman 42 has some decent 310 tool instructions. The more recent Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook has a couple of pages on the history of Lyman hand tools.

I have some article reprints and reference lists on file, many of them courtesy of Floodgate. If you have a specific question (i.e. shell holders, top punch, seater punch, die set codes, I would be willing to scan something up and send it to you.

-ktw

I just purchased a vintage Lyman reloading manual off of ABE.com for instructions to using the 310 tool.

[Cherokee]

I started reloading in the 50's with the 310 for 30/06, still got it and several more.