What do you use to form 11.4 Danish RB ammo

[mazo kid]

I recently got a Danish RB , said to be 45-70 caliber. Not so, but I know that case has been used. I have read a couple different threads here about just what size that rifle is. Mine has a "step" at 2.2" in the chamber. On a whim, I tried a 43 Mauser case I had made and it seems to fit better than the 45-70 case, although a tad too long. What are some of your thoughts on making brass for this rifle?

[Wayne Smith]

Get some cerrosafe and make a chamber cast. Then you will know what you have. Don't think about brass until you know the chamber.

[GRUMPA]

This might help some....

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?138818-11-7x51R-HELP

[enfield]

A buddy has one that I trimmed down 45-70 brass about .050" ( or there abouts ) and took a little off the rim, and it works good. the bases swells a bit, but with black powder loads I don't think its an issue.

[salpal48]

The Danish rolling block You have . Traditional were Converted from Rimfire to Centerfire.. Most were converted to 11.7x51R. This cartridge is generally straight Taper . . some were changed to centerfire but left chambered in the rimfire caliber. Why i have no idea. an easy way to determine If yours was converter . to Model 1867/ 96 is To look @ the rear site. . Is the site tang very long or short. . If short . It may be in the rimfire caliber. . during That time many of these rifles were sent to colonial troops or to other countries.

[chevyiron420]

A chamber cast is really a must for this rifle. My understanding is that the guns were changed in country of origin by different smiths with no real standards and several slightly different chamber styles exist. Mine has a tapered chamber with no step in it. My groove dia. is .463, and I have a 405 lee mold lapped out for it. It will except 45/70 cases, with that boolit size, but is at its limit for brass length.
The chamber is big for a 45/70 and the cases expand on firing. After fire forming I neck size only and have no trouble as long as I use remington cases. Other brands split at about 50% rate.

[mazo kid]

I agree that a chamber cast is in order. I fire formed 5 RP 45-70 cases yesterday, after wrapping the bases with a thin strip of furnace tape to help center the case in the chamber. I am thinking now that I have a rifle in 11.7 X 41.5 caliber, by the marks left on the case. They would need to be shortened, but I will do the chamber cast to verify first. If that is the caliber, what powder (black powder or compatible smokeless) would be appropriate? I do know how to figure out the charge for black powder use.

[mazo kid]

I did a chamber cast and I believe I have the original 41.5R cartridge. From what info I found the cast is right on with the cartridge length.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v133/mazokid/002_zpssgnlu2zi.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/mazokid/media/002_zpssgnlu2zi.jpg.html)

[skeettx]

I shoot factory Green Box Remington 45-70 405 Grain NON-EXPRESS in my 11.7 Danish
and then I neck size the fired case to hold the bullet and it
forms kind of a bottle necked case.
It shoots quite well with factory 45-70 or reloads

http://www.ammo-sale.com/proddetail.asp?prod=SS_66234

Mike

[Freightman]

I have had one for years and use 45/70 brass and never a problem. Some of my starline brass is finally giving up after 10 years.

[Roundball]

If I recall these rifles were modified and the cartridge is 11.7x56R. I have formed cases from 45-70 and used the Lee mould for the hollow base bullet. My barrel was .464 and the Lee bullet worked very well. In my situation it was unnecessary to modify the mould. I understand this bullet was designed for Trapdoors. My last TD had a bore diameter of .462. I also used Starline brass to make my cases with no problem. Seems like most of these rifles came into the US in very good shape. They make good shooters.

[17nut]

If I recall these rifles were modified and the cartridge is 11.7x56R. I have formed cases from 45-70 and used the Lee mould for the hollow base bullet. My barrel was .464 and the Lee bullet worked very well. In my situation it was unnecessary to modify the mould. I understand this bullet was designed for Trapdoors. My last TD had a bore diameter of .462. I also used Starline brass to make my cases with no problem. Seems like most of these rifles came into the US in very good shape. They make good shooters.

Not so!


Here is a resume i wrote some time ago to adress the confusion about chamber length:

Danish Rolling Blocks and chamber length confusion

The original Danish RB round was 11.4x41.5R rimfire. Load was 52grains in 1867 and changed to 60 grains of BP behind a 385 grains boolit.
Denmark ordered 20000 rifles from Remington to be delivered within 6 months. That backfired for Remington because Sheffield could not deliver enough barrels.
The Danes got to make their own RB’s without paying royalty as a result.
5 production lines was set up and each of them had a master gunsmith which was in charge of quality. Each smith had to manufacture his own set of Go-No Go gauges and have them certified by the factories master controller. This becomes important later!
All is well and from 1867 to 1878 @78500 RB’s are manufactured.
In 1884 the Danes start to develop a replacement for the RB and at the same time they start to ponder a way to modernise the RB’s. In 1896 they were officially converted to: Smokeless, centerfire and jacketed bullets.
And now comes problems in heaps falling on the arsenal, Because of the 5 different Go-No Go tools it is clear that bores range from 11.25mm~.443” to 11.75mm~.463”. You can’t design a standard round with jacketed that will work within those ranges with any kind of accuracy and without huge variations in pressure. So a LARGE long throat is devised to size the bullets for the smaller bores.
That is why some Danes will chamber a 45-90 without problems and why the 11.4x56R thought exists.

In the development of the final cartridge choices in smokeless was dismal and experiments led to the 56mm cartridge. But that meant grinding down the hammer for chamber access and that was dismissed along with slower reloading of the rifle. Only @200 rifles were ever converted and they can be easily identified by the ground down hammer.

[John Boy]

I did a chamber cast and I believe I have the original 41.5R cartridge.
Typo?41.5R = 1 41/64 inches ... larger than a 12ga. If you meant 14.5 ... that was not a caliber for the rifle
Here's the calibers the Danish RB were in ...

58 Berdan
.50-70
.50-45 Carbine
12.7×45mmR Pontificio
12.17×42 mm RF
12.17×44mmR
.45-70
.43 Spanish
.43 Egyptian
10.15×61mmR
8×58mmR
8×50mmR
.303 British
7.65×53mm Argentine
.30-40 Krag
7.62×54mmR
.30 Remington
7×57mm Mauser
6.5mm Daudeteau No. 12
.236 Remington
11 mm Danish

[mazo kid]

41.5 is cartridge case length, not diameter.

[17nut]

41.5 is cartridge length, not diameter.

And that would be case length 41,5mm~1.63"

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm153/Chickenthief/Skydning/AMA%20bog/patron3_zpsplwmaj67.jpg (http://s295.photobucket.com/user/Chickenthief/media/Skydning/AMA%20bog/patron3_zpsplwmaj67.jpg.html)

[Wayne Smith]

A BP load is simply a full case of powder up to or just beyond the base of the boolit. Some compression is expected and if you are using Goex up to a quarter inch compression is normative. If none are available Accurate can make your mold or Dan's Mountain Molds program allows you to design hyoid own.