When do you know for sure you've been cheated?

[historicfirearms]

Last week on the 20th I made a trade deal with a low post count member. He received his goods on the 24th and sent me a PM stating so, and he asked if I got my goods. I PMd him back asking if he had a tracking number. He hasn't logged back in since the 25th and I haven't heard from him. I even tried to email him but haven't heard back.

I am beginning to believe that this guy never sent me my goods. Google helped me track his work phone number down. Should I give him a call there? He works at a Ford dealership.

This site used to be full of guys I could trust, but in the last few years some of my trade deals have really soured me on it.

[Garyshome]

Yes you should give him a call.

[paul h]

I'd give him a call, and mention if he doesn't sort it out you'll be talking to his manager.

My one trade deal on here a few years ago took awhile to get sorted out. It took me publicly shaming the guy on a thread about a new gun he'd bought and asking how he could afford a new gun if he couldn't afford to pay me for the rifle barrel he'd stiffed me on (50/50 lead/cash trade)

[s mac]

I agree, a phone call might wake him up. Don't blame it on the Ford dealership, I work in one also. And it wasn't me.

[Alexn20]

Give him a call and find out what the deal is. It may be something came up and he hasn't been able to log on. Sorry to hear about this. Its too bad some individuals ruin it for the rest of us.

[BrassMagnet]

I wouldn't expect the USPS to deliver the box in a week. I don't get excited for a couple of weeks and then I would just seek tracking info to start out.

[bedbugbilly]

historicfirearms . . . my initial response to your question . . "when do you know you've been cheated" would have been . . . "when you're dealing with the guv'ment." But that would be no help at all . . . :-)

I've been lucky. I've done a number of trades and fortunately, they've all worked out. I was taught that when you agree to something, you carry through and you carry through in a timely manner. Not all folks are taught that however.

You never know . . . things do happen that require your attention so I guess you have to give the benefit of the doubt. But if you asked for a tracking number . . . they should have followed through . . . and as I have always said and preached . . . "communications is the most important thing". I don't think you'd be out of line at all to give the guy a call at the dealership and inquire as to what is going on in a very cordial way. I don't know as though I'd threaten hm with speaking to his manager . . . it is "personal business" and not "work business". But if he doesn't carry through after talking with him and waiting a respectable amount of time, then I'd contact him again and remind him that "fraud" is a crime . . . and his county/jurisdiction does have a Prosecuting Attorney's office that will follow up on it. But that would be my "last resort".

Good luck and hopefully it will all work our for you and you'll get what's coming to you without a lot of hassle.

[richhodg66]

Don't judge too quickly, I sent a MO for some dies on here a while back, long time, no reply. Did some checking and the guy had passed away suddenly. A long time friend of his sorted through his affairs and did in fact make good on the deal, but it was a good month and a half.

Hopefully nothing that bad, but you never know what may have happenned in the guy's life.

[StolzerandSons]

A friend of mine passed away yesterday, age 54. In June my sister-in-law passed away, age 55, no warning.
I'm not saying this is what happened with your deal, I'm just using these two events as an example thta things happen in peoples lives that take precedent over everything else at least for a little while. When my sister-in-law passed away in June I spent two weeks away from home and my shop/business helping my brother. Thankfully I didn't have any pending deals that couldn't wait, I'm just saying things happen.

Patience is a virtue, embrace it if you can, often in a woman, seldom in a man. A phone call wouldn't be rude but I wouldn't start to worry just yet.

[williamwaco]

Last week on the 20th I made a trade deal with a low post count member. He received his goods on the 24th and sent me a PM stating so, and he asked if I got my goods. I PMd him back asking if he had a tracking number. He hasn't logged back in since the 25th and I haven't heard from him. I even tried to email him but haven't heard back.

I am beginning to believe that this guy never sent me my goods. Google helped me track his work phone number down. Should I give him a call there? He works at a Ford dealership.

This site used to be full of guys I could trust, but in the last few years some of my trade deals have really soured me on it.


You should never take a chance on a low post count new member.

Just because I am paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get me.

[waksupi]

Depending where he is, hunting season opened here on the 24th. That can put a person totally our of touch for a week easy. Considering how slow the mail can be, I wouldn't panic yet. Around here, over night mail takes four days to arrive.

[MaryB]

A phone call can't hurt, maybe he suddenly lost his job and is scrambling to find something and just forgot. Life can get in the way at times! This fall has really put a crimp in my getting things done!

[TXGunNut]

Yes, a phone call or another e-mail is called for here. Stuff does indeed happen but the combo of low post counts and infrequent visits here does raise a red flag. OTOH, some people, unlike me, have a LIFE and don't come here more days than not.
I hope it works out for you. I cannot confirm nor deny whether I work for a Ford dealership but can say that would be a point in his favor in my little world.

[leeggen]

Send the guy a certified signature required letter requesting your product. I would give him a call at work then send the letter stating as per your conversation on the phone of the dealership so on and so forth. Keep a copy for your record as to a record of the time, number and how longthe phone call lasted. Then if no results contact the local police in his area to see if they can help. If not then go to the attorneys.
CD

[lead-1]

Friday the 23rd I mailed a package to Florida from Ohio and the tracking has been all screwed up. The package was just shown as "delayed in shipping" on the afternoon of the 29th, so it still hasn't shown it's face to the receiving address.
Give it a while to get thru the mail, there is at least three states that take my packages ten days or so to make their destination.

[Mike in TX]

I had a package shipped 10/13 Fed Ex. FE left it at the wrong post office. No phone calls from anyone. It was picked up by the addresse on 10/29 after an exhaustive search.

[toallmy]

I am a new member so don't hold that against me . But honest is honest if you would take a penny you would take a million. a lot of people can justify shade deals in their minds . So Just give him a call ( if he is a stand up guy he will get on it and make it right ) . I hope he is a stand up fella.

[Greg S]

On a few occassions it has taken me 4-7 days to get by the USP Office to get a MO and get it sent off and I've got a PO 3 miles from me that is open 24-7. Working 10-12 hrs a day in the trades leaves me very little motivation and energy at the end of the day.

Had a AA 50 Beowulf Upper take 28 days from TX to AK. As usual, sent USPSMO and got a PM Received. Nothing for two weeks, alittle nervous, week three unnerving, begining week 4 PM with no response so alittle detective work and find his place of employement and hold for 30 days. Day 28 it arrives postdated 2 days after MO arrived. Oh, no tracking on package, 4th class. In the future on major trades made a mental note to request tracking even if extra for piece of mind. Lesson learned.

I've only been hear about a year but find it refreshing to see folks trading and shipping freely. I would comply with the practice here but I'm generally a hoarder and not a seller. I would not be comfortable with the practice on other forums I frequent.

[Harter66]

I had a red label FedEx take 16 days from Arkansas to Nevada once .

I also had my post office fail to notify me of a package and as it turned out when I did get the package at the counter it was marked as received and posted 9 days prior .

[gray wolf]

My goodness!
if you think you waited long enough then a call is not out of order.

[jsizemore]

Folks get caught up in STUFF going on around home. Most good folks don't mind a gently reminder and the bad ones you don't mind poking with a stick. I got beat once on this site. I waited a few months because I figured the fella was on an emergency deployment because of his location. Ended up he was just a lowlife. I didn't get beat to bad and as near as I can tell he hasn't returned and the powers that be are keeping an eye out also, at least I hope they are. I'd hate to see him beat somebody else.

If he's scum, please, shout it from the rooftops. But, you got to give him a chance, or 3, to do the right thing. I've stuck my foot in my mouth too many times to get another one to fit.

[southpaw]

A few months back I had a deal go bad on my end. The usps destroyed my package and brought it back to me about a week after I sent it out. I pmed the the other person and they said to send their stuff back. I had to work the next few days so didn't get to the po immediately. I thought all was well till I received a pm from a mod asking about the deal. Communication could have better on both parties, me to let him know that it would be a few days before I could ship back and him to pm me and ask what is going on instead of going straight to the mods.

Point is things happen. I would give it atleast 2 weeks before getting worried. Not everybody lives on cb or likes spending lots of time on the computer. If after a couple weeks he has not signed on or responded to you I would then call his work.

If I am thinking of the right deal, he may have a low post count but has been on the site for many years.

Jerry Jr.

[Geraldo]

Call the guy if you want to, but USPS can really booger things up. I've had stuff I bought and stuff I shipped take two weeks by Priority Mail. I watched one package in tracking get booted around a USPS sort facility for three days. The zip code changed daily, but it was still in the same sort facility.

[SP5315]

USPS can really booger things up.

+1 on this.

I just received a package yesterday that was shipped out over three weeks ago. I too thought that I'd been had by a scammer. Turns out the guy shipped to me and then went on a two week vacation. The fine folks at the USPS returned the original shipment to the sender stating I had moved and left no forwarding address. I know this for a fact because he also sent the original packaging back to me with the yellow USPS return label On the second trip to me the tracking number has never showed as being accepted or delivered.

See if you can catch him at the work number you have to find out whats going on.

[historicfirearms]

Update - on 11-02-15 he responded via PM and said he would ship me another set of magazines on the following day because "they should have been there by now". As of today, no package has arrived and no tracking info was ever provided. I am not the kind of guy to just let things go and I hate a cheat so things will be settled between us in the end, one way or another.

[Lance Boyle]

Maybe it'll take a day or two longer but it is sounding pretty scammy at this point.

I've had decent luck here. Only time I was left scratching my head is when I bought some used speedloaders and the majority were so worn they were junk. At least I got my package.

[MrWolf]

I sent myself a two day priority package with the USPS last week from SW Floriday to Southern NJ. Saw on tracking it went to Orlando and dissapeared for awhile. Finally showed up exactly one week later.

[jonp]

Guy at work had his internet go out and it took 3 weeks for the company to get it back up and running for his entire road. Not everyone has a smartphone to use in the meantime. You don't know at this point what is going on. I'd give him a couple of weeks before I got too bent out of shape on this.

[toallmy]

I am still have hope it will work out , I don't know how to ship using tracking info , but I could ask the post office people I'm shore. I really hope that this works out it would make me feel bad to see a member get ripped off by another member.

[oldred]

Last year I bought a brass buttplate from a guy on Ebay and waited 4 days after the due date to ask about it, he said he didn't have another one to send so immediately credited my Paypal account for every cent including shipping, can't complain about that. THEN eight weeks later I go to my mailbox and find a wet, dirty and mangled looking brown USPS envelope containing the buttplate and screws! He had packaged them tightly in foam wrapped in packing tape that took a sharp knife to dig them out so despite the mangled and torn package everything was there in undamaged condition. I Emailed him with this info and we arranged a refund of the refund and now all is well so sometimes it does indeed happen.

[brtelec]

I do not get too excited on most things until I hit the two week mark. Unless of course we are talking about hundreds of dollars or more. Then communication is key. I still do things based on forum reputation and post count. I recently sent out a firearm to a well respected member of this forum before payment was even sent. The combination of reputation and communication allowed me that luxury. In literally thousands of transactions online, some involving thousands of dollars, Swiss watch obsession, I have had only two people try to cheat me. It seems almost all my problems have stemmed from shipping problems and misunderstandings due to poor communications.

[Just Duke]

Last week on the 20th I made a trade deal with a low post count member. He received his goods on the 24th and sent me a PM stating so, and he asked if I got my goods. I PMd him back asking if he had a tracking number. He hasn't logged back in since the 25th and I haven't heard from him. I even tried to email him but haven't heard back.

I am beginning to believe that this guy never sent me my goods. Google helped me track his work phone number down. Should I give him a call there? He works at a Ford dealership.

This site used to be full of guys I could trust, but in the last few years some of my trade deals have really soured me on it.


The only problems I ever had is when the wife bought several thousand once fired 270 brass from different parties off here and half of it came as useless scrap.
I just sighed and told her the fella probably needed the money really bad so just throw it in the trash and we will move on.
That and several that wanted to haggle on shipping of 80 pound item that wouldn't fit in a flat rate box when it clearly stated buyer pays shipping.
I hate to hear about things like this. Let me get back on my feet financially and I'll help you out if you need it.
How much is he into you for?

[Just Duke]

Plan on 2 weeks USPS guys. It's hit or miss.
I sent off something to Alaknack Alaska and it arrived the next day from Las Vegas NV.
But of course all their mail is flown in directly.

[Harter66]

I had a Red label FedEx take almost 3 weeks and cross I 40 3x which is the shortest fastest route to get it here . I can't tell you how many hand written addresses went to NY and wandered around for a week or more trying to find Fallon NV ,there's not a Fallon in New York. ....... let alone a zip code starting in 89 .
Sometimes people just get jammed up . Sometimes a package gets overlooked, sometimes you find a check in your wallet that's 8 months old and you have to dig through a year of PMs on 3 forums to find the name . Or you find a box you know was shipped ......

[Ric-san]

Low post count...that's me. Most of the new folks have to find 100 or so easy posts just to be invited in to sell. That's the deal. We all can't be in the hundreads when you're just starting out. I would call the guys work...good luck.

[Greg S]

Duke, I know where that is. That gentleman needed to buy alot of lottery tickets that day he received the package. For it to get there that fast, unbelievable.

[historicfirearms]

I called the guy at work and he said the package was in his truck because he was busy at work. OK, that's fine but a little better communication would be nice. Fingers crossed that I will get the mags.
The money doesn't mean that much to me. I would be just as upset if it were $10 or $200. It's the principal of the deal. If someone says they are going to do something, then they should follow through. It's about honor and respect.

For me, I will not do anymore trading or buying from low post count members. I know its no guarantee that nothing bad will happen, but it can't hurt. If a guy hangs around here because he loves the self sufficiency and satisfaction of making boolits, then he is probably an OK guy.

[toallmy]

Understand, what you mean ....hope it ends well.....

[mozeppa]

ups wouldn't deliver a starline box of 1000 44 mags brass to my house ...instead they dropped it off at a "ups drop shop"

(some kind of business that specializes in all things that are "U.P.S.")
....yet they never left me a note on the door nor a contact of any kind
stating that it was ready to be picked up at said drop off point.

i waited 10 days...called starline asked them whats up .....they said let me check...call ya back.

called 10 min later and said its been waiting at a drop off point 2 blocks from my home for 6 days.

dammmmmm!

[Just Duke]

ups wouldn't deliver a starline box of 1000 44 mags brass to my house ...instead they dropped it off at a "ups drop shop"

(some kind of business that specializes in all things that are "U.P.S.")
....yet they never left me a note on the door nor a contact of any kind
stating that it was ready to be picked up at said drop off point.

i waited 10 days...called starline asked them whats up .....they said let me check...call ya back.

called 10 min later and said its been waiting at a drop off point 2 blocks from my home for 6 days.

dammmmmm!

Most times I watch them and they are to lazy to leave a note. USPS is notorious for not leaving a note.
A few years ago on another forum we sent a package to a fella and he said it never arrived.
Tracking said it did arrive.
He from what I saw, and I have seen this before, had me send it to his business so his wife wouldn't find out I assume.
USPS tried to deliver it to his business on a Saturday which was a closed doctors office.
The package disappeared on his end.
He did some research and USPS said it was sent back to me.
I went to the post office and they said they never received anything back for me.
This went back and fourth for several days and the fella called me out in open forum.
So then the wife said she sent the package out in her name, went to the post office and they had it.
Then the fella I sent the package too wanted me to pay for shipping again. It was not my fault that the the package was shipped to an ABSENTEE!!! recipient!
Anyway we sent the package back and posted the tracking numbers for all to see and all did a daily muse of "up to date" tracking updates on open forum.
Moral of the story.
If you order something, make sure your there to receive it and it's not coming to a business that is closed on the weekends. They might just leave it at the door and for the whole week end and thieves will walk off with it.

[Just Duke]

I called the guy at work and he said the package was in his truck because he was busy at work. OK, that's fine but a little better communication would be nice. Fingers crossed that I will get the mags.
The money doesn't mean that much to me. I would be just as upset if it were $10 or $200. It's the principal of the deal. If someone says they are going to do something, then they should follow through. It's about honor and respect.

For me, I will not do anymore trading or buying from low post count members. I know its no guarantee that nothing bad will happen, but it can't hurt. If a guy hangs around here because he loves the self sufficiency and satisfaction of making boolits, then he is probably an OK guy.

Respectfully sir, and I do mean that, if you order something from Brownells and worst case scenario "Grafs" (which had no clue how to run a business when they started out of their barn. I still have the smudged 2 page flyer folded in half and stapled. <eyes rolling>, they will not give you tracking up dates or even tracking numbers and lets not talk about how long it takes to receive the item once you order it.
Buffalo Arms is notorious for slow shipping and never gave tracking. We ordered a couple 1873's a few years ago and they took 1 whole month to arrive. This is a another business that prides themselves out of boasting they started out of a closet. Surely a success story but at least try and attempt to get some schooling on how a business is actually run and not just do it on the fly or by the seat of your pants.

Back to shipping;
It takes 7 to 10 working days when you order an item from a some what large company just to process the item.
Also don't expect next day shipping from an item purchased in swap and shop. lol
It gets there, when it gets there.......... :)

[Just Duke]

Duke, I know where that is. That gentleman needed to buy alot of lottery tickets that day he received the package. For it to get there that fast, unbelievable.

From what I'm told they land and don't even shut the engines off and it's on the way to another destination.
It's an Eskimo village as I gather. How cool is that!

[starmac]

There is no such thing as overnight air coming to, or leaving the cities in Alaska. They are glad to charge you for it, but tell you up front that it will be at least two days.

[Just Duke]

There is no such thing as overnight air coming to, or leaving the cities in Alaska. They are glad to charge you for it, but tell you up front that it will be at least two days.
It must of been good timing then.

[ncbearman]

For me, I will not do anymore trading or buying from low post count members.

Post count doesn't matter when a guy decided to do wrong. Be glad it wasn't $300 like it was for lancem and I.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?285226-DEADBEAT-uniquedot

[historicfirearms]

Guys, I finally got the magazines in the mail yesterday. They were mailed on the tenth of November, twenty days after I sent my goods to him. Communication is the key to these trade deals. It's sad how I let this deal eat at me while I wondered if I would ever get my mags. Like I said before, it wasn't about the money. Feeling cheated is what bothered me. Anyway, thanks for all the advice and glad it worked out for me. For everyone else that has been wronged, I feel for you.

[s mac]

Glad it worked out. Yes, a pm or 2 can go a long way as far as how smoothly a deal works out. I think most are satisfied if they know whats going on.

[jsizemore]

I'm glad your deal worked out. I'm still waiting on mine from May last year. Last email I got said "Should mail money tomorrow". I've done a bunch of deals before and since and they have all gone great regardless of post count. Of course I wait for payment from low or no post count folks before I ship.