Going back a 4th time

[Boerrancher]

About 9 months ago I purchased a Remington R-25 in 7mm-08. My plan was to use it on Mulies and Elk. After wasting several boxes of ammo and going through 2 mid grade scopes and not being able to get it zeroed I called Remington. They sent me a sticker and it went back to them. Fast forward 2 months: Now it is summer and I get my rifle back with a target proving they fixed it. It was a 3 shot group that measured almost 4 inches and they sent me a note with it telling me how great it shot at 100 yds and enclosed was one of the better groups.

I don't know about you folks but 4 inches for 3 shots is not good at 100 yards unless you are using a slingshot. I put the scope back on, grabbed some ammo and headed to the range. 6 to 12 inch groups at 100 yds every once in a great while I would get one around 4 inches for 3 shots. After the same results with different loads I call Remington back and it goes in again. A month and a half later it shows back up and I install a scope and head to the range. Same **** just a different day.

I go back home and call Remington again. The guy I'm talking to starts telling me how AR platforms are not accurate and usually don't shoot well. I then explained that I had several ARs in many different calibers and all of them shot MOA or better. Next he tried to tell me that the AR 10 platforms were what he meant was not accurate. Then I explained that I had a couple of AR 10s in different calibers and both of them shot Sub MOA for 5 shots not 3. Then I heard the most astounding thing I have ever heard from a firearms manufacturer. He said and I quote: "We don't guarantee any kind of accuracy out of our guns."

I flipped out. I told him that for what I paid for that Remington I could have bought 3 Savage Rifles or 2 Tikka Rifles and any of them would shoot Sub MOA right out of the box, so why the hell would anyone much less me want to buy a Remington if there is no guarantee of accuracy. I told him I could buy a Club or a fence post a hell of a lot cheaper than that R-25, and right now all I had was an expensive fence post or club. I got another sticker and it went back to Remington for the third time. I was gone for two months once more.

The rifle comes back supposedly fixed. I go through the same routeen again and find it is still not shooting any better. I do what I should have done in the first place and slug the bore. Starting at the chamber I began driving a slug down the bore, and when it gets about 3 inches from the muzzle it just falls out. I pick up the slug and mic it. 0.281 is its diameter. I take another slug and start at the muzzle and drive it in the bore about an inch and then push it back out. 0.285 in. Is what it measured. No wonder the dang thing won't shoot.

Having fully given up on Remington I start calling around for a new barrel. I was going to buy a new barrel and install it myself and be done with it, but not even Remington sells replacement barrels. They did offer to take it back once more though and look at it. I wrote a note and sent the two slugs I used taped to the note. Maybe they will be smart enough to figure it out, but I doubt it. I am so sick of Remington, I will never buy any of there products. When dealing with them it is buyer be ware.

Best wishes,

Joe

[IllinoisCoyoteHunter]

You are a lot more patient than I am...

[Littleton Shot Maker]

they should have sent you a NEW GUN after the 2 or 3 try WHY try to FIND the fix, replace the thing a scrap the junkie one...that sucks - hope it gets better

[Tackleberry41]

So how long will Remington remain a brand now? The group that owns them have gutted Marlin, yea their still made, but they should just call them Remingtons and get it over with. They gutted and destroyed H&R, a brand thats been around forever. But some already very rich people made a little more money off the deal so its cool. Has Remington come out with anything worth buying in a while? Their pistol was a flop. Their attempts at budget rifles soured alot of people. And now they can't even make an AR-15? Not sure why they think a near new AR type rifle can't be expected to shoot even close to decent. We had some worn out junk in the marines, and even with that M855 ammo and iron sites we could still do good groups out to 500yds.

So Remingtons new business plan is a race to the bottom? Try and sell junk, while the hedge fund in charge takes out loans on everything in the company, then one day just like H&R that will be it. They sucked it dry then take aim on the next company to bleed for all its worth. Apparently these are the unbridled free markets everybody raves about.

[Freightman]

4-6# at a 100 yards my old m66 second conversion Trapdoor in 50-70 does 1/2 that I would be livid, thanks for the report don't want anything made by Remington now.

[dilly]

So how long will Remington remain a brand now? The group that owns them have gutted Marlin, yea their still made, but they should just call them Remingtons and get it over with. They gutted and destroyed H&R, a brand thats been around forever. But some already very rich people made a little more money off the deal so its cool. Has Remington come out with anything worth buying in a while? Their pistol was a flop. Their attempts at budget rifles soured alot of people. And now they can't even make an AR-15? Not sure why they think a near new AR type rifle can't be expected to shoot even close to decent. We had some worn out junk in the marines, and even with that M855 ammo and iron sites we could still do good groups out to 500yds.

So Remingtons new business plan is a race to the bottom? Try and sell junk, while the hedge fund in charge takes out loans on everything in the company, then one day just like H&R that will be it. They sucked it dry then take aim on the next company to bleed for all its worth. Apparently these are the unbridled free markets everybody raves about.

I think they're called the Freedom Group. They buy underperforming but reputable gun companies, lower their QC and customer service standards, ride the company's former reputation until their name's in the dirt, and use the quick profits to buy the next company at a discount. They are like locusts; a plague on the industry.

[Mica_Hiebert]

its a dpms pattern rifle any replacement barrel for those rifles will fit it. http://www.tacticalammunition.com/7mm-08-Rem-Black-Hole-Weaponry-Rifle-Barrel-TA88-0380-TA88-0380.htm

if remington still wont replace your barrel you have options.

[runfiverun]

I been done with Remington since the last century.
I only have 1 of their rifles [one of their classics in 8 mauser] a nice solid 1-1/2 to 2" rifle.
any of my Rugers will shoot circles inside it.

[Tackleberry41]

Yea its freedom group, but their just one of many. Another fund did it with Red Lobster, buy the chain, then start borrowing money with the business as collateral. Well of course the fund takes the cash, leaves the debt. Now an already under performing company has more bills to pay, a sure way to a brighter future. The hedge fund decided the way to fix that was to sell the buildings Red lobster owned, they took the cash, now Red Lobster has to pay bills on a building they used to own. Won't be long before their looking for some sucker to dump the corpse on. On Wall Street they call it capitalism, rest of us call them leaches. They obviously do not have a plan as eventually they will run out of places to pump and dump. Like sharks they will have to feed on each other and find some equalibrium with their environment. Tho by then they will have gutted this country. Maybe they plan to move to another planet after that.

I have never owned a Remington anything, I doubt the poorly made clothes, knives and such are made by them, but stamped on in some plant in China. I almost bought a Rem 700, had the cash wanted a long range rifle. Gun shop kept pushing me to buy what they had in the rack when I very clearly said if Im paying that much I want one in lefty. So I ended up with a Savage another shop was very willing to order for me. I tend to do research before buying anything, so already knew their budget rifles were junk, when I was looking for something cheaper in 223. Friend of mine is in love w Rem 700s. Guess he may change his tune if they start following Rossi/Taurus business model of selling lottery tickets with zero customer service.

Especially contrasted with a place like Ruger, can't say ever bought anything made by ruger I had a problem with where I even needed customer service. Hopefully Wall Street won't get ahold of them to.

[blademasterii]

If I had to send anything back that many times I would be furious as well. Tell them to keep it and send you a check. That being said I have a rem 700 sps aac that will shoot 1/2 '' at 100 with smk ammo. Shoots 1/2 '' at 50 with my 180g lee gc boolits.

[shdwlkr]

Joe
Remington is not the company that I bought a few of their rifles in the '60's and '70's. I don't think for the most part they can even make ammo anymore. Sorry you have had such **** luck with a once great company. Best of luck with a new barrel. Wonder what they used on your barrel?

[dkf]

That lead time for repair is very bad, too long. Remington is probably flooded with repairs from all the junk they are putting out. AR15 and AR10/SR25 rifles are plenty accurate and are easily capable of below sub MOA with a good quality barrel, assembled properly with in spec parts. A lower quality mass produced rifle like the Remington should be able to do 2MOA with decent ammo. I get better than that out of chrome lined barrels. I'd say the barrel and/or receiver is junk. Barrel probably fits nice and loose in the upper receiver bore also and the face probably isn't square. Last Remington rifle I bought was in 2000 and last Remington shotgun was around 2005. I saw the writing on the wall when the FG bought them and I decided to see how things panned out. Glad I did because they are junk.

[country gent]

I wouldnt be dealing with Remington anymore on this rifle. They had their chances to make it right, If I was building rifles and a su standard one got out when it went back it would be no questions needed that it was right the second time. On this rifle if I really wanted it and for it to be a shooter a Krieger, lilja, pac nor or brux barrel would be going on it. Along with the chamber / throat I wanted. If that wasnt the case it would get sold of and replaced. If the rebarrel was done before and after groups would be sent to remingtons customer service and explanation of what it took to "fix" a poor performer.

[Bad Water Bill]

Joe

When and if you send it back be sure you mention that there are over 38,000 folks not just here but around the world waiting to see just what Rem did to rectify THEIR problem.

Now you know why I have all of those Savage rifles,actions and a bunch of highly accurate bbls in my gun room.

Even their smokeless front stuffer gives 1" 100 yd groups with my cast boolits IF I do my part.

[Boerrancher]

Thanks for the support fellas. I sent it back a couple days ago. I told them I was done and will never buy another Remington product as well as make sure that all of my friends and every person I meet at the range or any gun shop doesn't buy one either. I also told them I went out and bought a Savage Axis in 7-08 to hunt with this year, and right out of the box it was shooting 1/2 inch groups with what ever I fed it, and it really does. I own lots of Savage rifles and none of them are bad shooters.

Now I am going to compare my recent experience with Savage. About a month and a half ago I bought a Savage 110 BA in a .338 Lapua. Mounted a very nice scope on it and headed to the range to zero it. Once Zeroed it was shooting nickel sized 5 shot groups at 100 yds. All was great. The next trip to the range the groups started opening up more and more. Third trip to the range and it continued to get worse. I called savage and they sent me a sticker, so back it went. Two weeks later I get a phone call from a customer service rep, apologizing because my rifle had slipped through their qc process with a bad barrel. They were going to rebarel it, and shoot it to make sure it would shoot MOA or better before they sent it back to me.

That at is the rifle I am waiting for, considering it is their custom shop that does the repair work. From what I gather it had a flaw in the steel that was just missed when they bored and rifled the billet. After a few firings that cavity collapsed and left a huge budge up near the muzzle. It was bad enough that the rounds were striking the muzzle break. No more Remington rifles for me even if the do make the R-25 right. It shouldn't take 4 trips back to the shop for them to fix a barrel that is 0.281 at the throat and 0.284 at the muzzle.

Best wishes

Joe

[Lance Boyle]

That sucks. I had the same quality customer service with a Model 700 Titanium in .308 win. Granted it was a fly weight mountain rifle in a Kevlar stock but for that coin I wanted better than 4 inches for a 3 shot group. I only sent it back once, they said they lapped the barrel and it was in spec. Sent me a test target with a 1.5+ moa target shot with their house brand 168 BTHP load. I shot it and got a 3.5 inch group with Sierra 150 Game Kings and 4" with Nosler 150 Ballistic tips. I ended up selling the rifle to a guy who was just looking for the action for a custom build. I made a little money not counting my lost shipping.


ETA- I wondered how many groups they shot to cherry pick one and put it in the box. I shoot a lot of rifles submoa off the bench with rests and bags. That rifle couldn't do it for 4 out of 5 two shot groups.

[Iowa Fox]

Sadly this all applies to just about everything and all products in the United States anymore. My wife and I have been trying to buy a refrigerator for a month. Lowes had two on hand when we went to buy so I thought no problem even though folks told me not to buy from them. The first one they tried to deliver was the wrong one and the second was all beat to heck. Tuesday they called to tell us maybe Thanksgiving. Wednesday I drove into town to get a refund and went to an appliance store. With Menards and Home Depot in town I'll never even buy a box of screws from them. I should have listened to all our old friends.

[Artful]

Sad, I love my 30 year old Remington 700V - I will be looking for your final report but I don't hold much hope for a happy customer from the sounds of it.

[Tackleberry41]

More than likely your email will fall on deaf ears. They have ignored your concerns to this point, unlikely they will do any better. The people running Remington are only there to squeeze every penny they can out of the place. Fixing your rifle would cut into that profit. They made their money, and are ready to move one. They would probably tell you 12" groups were acceptable so they didn't have to fix it. All the back and forth, they probably could have dropped a barrel in it and been done with it, but that would cost them money.

I do not understand the thinking in major companies anymore. They are so short sighted, only concerned with the money they will make right now. Tomorrow doesn't even seem to exist to them. They can make $1 today, you say yes but you could make $100 over the next 30 days, they get that blank look on their face, and say 'we made $1 today'. Seen it over and over at places I worked. Mind boggling stupid decisions made. Worked at a place the owner would not fix the toilet, it would cost money for a plumber to come out. Yea but how much city water goes down the drain every month? Yes $100 today to fix it, and your done, or $100 in extra water bills over the next say 5 mo, and the dang thing is still friggin broke, then it in a year your out over $200. He would get that blank look 'you don't understand how to run a business'. Yea I guess not. Or the Mercedes dealer I worked at, our computer went down, the one we needed to look stuff up on the cars. It was down for like 2 mo, we simply had to turn cars away. 'Its $40 an hour to fix the computer' yea and the labor rate is $120, pretty sure you will make it up. So to save maybe $100, they threw away a couple grand, plus ticked off customers who went to another dealer and may not come back. But there was $100 that could go to the service managers bonus check, so wheres the problem.

There will come a day not far into the future, where we will read a news article where Remington is up for sale, or filing for bankruptcy. Some might even start in on how their union workers ran them into the ground, thats what they said about Colt here recently. When more likely its just poor decisions by management, or planned, the Freedom Group will make alot of money when Remington goes under.

[akajun]

Remington sports a rifle team for Highpower and Long Range Prone. Ken Roxborough runs the team, former USMC rifle team member, and Dwight (Tiny) Briggs ( former USMC armorer building m40's, nmM14's, nmar's, and Palma Guns) is the gunsmith in the custom shop that builds the rifles. I guarantee an email to either of them would not fall on deaf ears and would guarantee your gun fixed properly.
BTW I dont own an ar15/ar10 that shoots greater than 1" and several that are under .75 MOA. Include the name of the CS rep that you spoke to in the email, they would get a kick out of that.

[Rockydog]

I had a buddy that got a .223 Handi rifle from the Freedom Group. The chamber was so rough that we broke the extractor trying the get the first fired case out. Drove the case and a couple of others out with a cleaning rod. Chamber was so rough that you could see the reamer marks on the brass. Almost looked threaded. Sent it to an H&R service center. They finish reamed it but it still isn't 100% right. Pure unadulterated junk. RD

[Bad Water Bill]

I am quite sure he will not but if Boerrancher would send just some of his med records from his army time those jarheads would move his gun to the head of the line and not stop till it cut real clover leafs EVERY time at 300 yards.

[Love Life]

The same thing that happened to Colt with Sciens, is going to happen to Remington with the freedom group.

[MtGun44]

Didn't Rem buy out Savage recently?

[lefty o]

ATK owns savage, not remingturd!

[Boerrancher]

Well I got my Remington back today. They "chamfered the muzzle" and sent this target.

153046

This is an inch and a half group. I have no clue about load or distance fired. All I know is with 6 different loads that all shoot Sub MOA in my savage the best I was able to do was 2.5 inches. I am done with Remington and I hope that every one that reads this will think twice before buying one of their rifles. I paid over $1200 for this rifle, have spent several hundred dollars on ammo, and was told countless times By Remington that they don't guarantee any kind of accuracy out of their rifles. They might as well start tagging their rifles with a Buyer Be Ware, because they sure don't care about the quality of their product nor customer service.

[Sweetpea]

Now that's just sad.

My only Remington, a 700 adl in 243, is an absolute tack driver.

Hopefully somebody that actually cares will buy them out.

But I won't hold my breath.

[crowbuster]

I have the same sad story with an xr 100. sad sad sad

[TXGunNut]

That's just wrong, Boerrancher. Went down that road with Winchester/Browning/FN a few years back but I finally got a rifle I could live with. It seems your hard-earned dollars mean little to Remington, I don't think they'll mind if you spend them elsewhere. They treated me ok in the 597 recall but it's pretty obvious they aren't too serious about barrels these days.

[TCLouis]

So I wonder how many of the "Wonder Boyz with their MBAs" have figured in the profit increase by creating a piece of junk that could have been fixed, but instead the experience an owner has had goes out across the web is KILLING enough sales to make that profit nil, in fact negative.

I still have my charter arms BSDog somewhere in the back of the safe where I THREW it the last time I carried it out. It only went back twice before I just ate the loss and quit.


That said, with all of them made, we are lucky that most of any brand (More so it seems with Savage) do well and yet there are bad individual products out there. The loss they will suffer from this posting alone will be more than they saved by continuing to return a ***.

I read long ago that when the bean counters start running the organization, it is then doomed to fail.
90 day wonderboyz reports reign over producing a decent product or replacing a bad product that gets through QA/QC.

Rant mode off

[Boerrancher]

Yesterday I also received my Savage rifle back that went out at about the same time. It wasn't shooting as well as I thought it should and sent it back to Savage. They replaced the barrel on it now will put three .338 dia bullets in one hole that can be completely covered with a .357 dia bullet. When I sent it back to them it was not shooting as bad as the Remington was but I knew Savage made better rifles than that. I have since bought another Savage Axis in .22-250. It seems that no matter what ammo I feed it if I do my part it tosses 5 in one ragged 30 cal hole at 100 yds. It is like my best friend told me yesterday while we were shooting on my range, "I will never buy another new rifle again that isn't a Savage. Over the last 3 years he has spent several thousand dollars on new Brownings, Winchesters, remingtons, and Weatherbys that won't shoot like they should. So now he is like me, and has decided to spend around $400 per gun and Buy something that shoots.

Best wishes,

Joe

[Bad Water Bill]

THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE SIR

Girty sez she nu dat Savage wood du betr wen U got er bak[smilie=s:

[Just Duke]

Well I got my Remington back today. They "chamfered the muzzle" and sent this target.

153046

This is an inch and a half group. I have no clue about load or distance fired. All I know is with 6 different loads that all shoot Sub MOA in my savage the best I was able to do was 2.5 inches. I am done with Remington and I hope that every one that reads this will think twice before buying one of their rifles. I paid over $1200 for this rifle, have spent several hundred dollars on ammo, and was told countless times By Remington that they don't guarantee any kind of accuracy out of their rifles. They might as well start tagging their rifles with a Buyer Be Ware, because they sure don't care about the quality of their product nor customer service.

I'm very glad to see your back. I wish would have had the opportunity to dissuaded you from the purchase of the Remington clone of the Armalite AR-10. I'd go with Armalite for your next purchase guys.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Well I got my Remington back today. They "chamfered the muzzle" and sent this target.

153046
This is an inch and a half group.

...snip
I don't know whether to laugh or cry at this target ?

cry: as in what has happened to this once very good rifle manufacturer.

Laugh: as in, a ripped up paper target with no info marked on it, indicates there probably was 7 more holes out of the perimeter, encircling that group of three.

[jmort]

Dealing with Remington customer service for two different rifles was not good for me. I found that if I called enough I would finally be able to find someone to kick the can a little further down the road.

[garym1a2]

This is a sad group for a high dollar rifle. I have put together AR's with the cheapest parts I can find that shoot better than this. Even my M&P sport (<$600 AR) shoots better. My recommendation is try to return it, sell it or put a good barrel on it.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry at this target ?

cry: as in what has happened to this once very good rifle manufacturer.

Laugh: as in, a ripped up paper target with no info marked on it, indicates there probably was 7 more holes out of the perimeter, encircling that group of three.

[Just Duke]

Also note the Remington 700 receiver is a just a threaded piece of pipe. The Winchester actions are forged. ;) Just saying

[Hannibal]

To the OP, sorry to hear of your troubles. I had a Savage Model 10 in .308 with EXACTLY the same problem. Contacted them, and sent it in per their instructions. Came back 2 months later with a "matte" finish barrel that slugged EXACTLY the same as the first barrel, though they claimed they changed it. The receiver was the traditional hot blued finish. Shot the same 4+" group at the range, too.
Called Savage again and explained my complaints again. Rifle went back to Savage again. 2 months later and it came back with a matching finish once again, but still shot 4"+ on the range. Slugged the bore and, yep. Same tapered bore problem.
Contacted Savage AGAIN and THIS time I got the "Meets our accuracy requirements" letter. I never received a test target of any kind. Needless to say, I feel the same toward Savage that you do toward Remington. I'm NOT defending Remington. All I'm saying is it can happen with any manufacturer.

I've yet to buy a sub-MOA out of the box rifle. Many have said I'm in the minority. Perhaps. All I can speak of is my experience.

[captaint]

I have always considered Rem 700's (the real 700's - made about 20 years ago and older) the most accurate stock rifle one could buy. Mine always shot great. A shame what can be done to a good company.

[Ric-san]

Sounds like a 'Buyer Beware' story...

[Boerrancher]

This is a sad group for a high dollar rifle. I have put together AR's with the cheapest parts I can find that shoot better than this. Even my M&P sport (<$600 AR) shoots better. My recommendation is try to return it, sell it or put a good barrel on it.

I am already looking at a couple of custom barrel makers. I have that savage 7-08 that shoots excellent so I have been thinking about having one made that is chambered in 284 Win. I have already checked the OAL and everything will fit, and I have checked with my 6mm-284 and they will feed out of the Mags. I think that would be the ultimate elk rifle. A 284 Win on an AR 10 platform with a 22 or 24 inch barrel. I've been hooked on that 284 Win since I owned my first one in a Savage Mod 99F.

Best wishes,

Joe

[Boerrancher]

Well I ordered a barrel to replace the junk that Remington refuses to replace. I decided to go back with a 7-08 barrel. I think it is pathetic that I spend $1200+ on a rifle, and then have to spend another $350+ to purchase another barrel because Remington seems to think that a barrel that measures 0.281 at the throat and 0.284 at the muzzle as well as shoots 4 inch groups at 100 yds is acceptable. Although with that being said, what should be expected from a company that tells me, "well, we don't guarantee any kind of accuracy from our rifles."

Best wishes,

Joe

[DerekP Houston]

HA, thanks man this reaffirms my savage 223 choice =). Sorry to hear about the poor customer service and luck with Remington it seems to be a trend though...


I am confused though and tbh I have never seen a barrel made. How is it possible, if using a straight drill bit or whatever to get a hole larger at the end than the start?! Tool worn out and wobbling maybe? Seems to me it should measure the same at the start of the bore and at the end...

[Artful]

I am confused though and tbh I have never seen a barrel made. How is it possible, if using a straight drill bit or whatever to get a hole larger at the end than the start?! Tool worn out and wobbling maybe? Seems to me it should measure the same at the start of the bore and at the end...

A correctly made barrel will be the same the full length. Barrels can be made in several ways, you can hammer the barrel around a mandrel (hammer forged barrels), or pull a plug thru a hole while turning it to impress the rifling into the steel, or cut the steel away from the barrel (cut rifling).

[DerekP Houston]

Thanks Artful! Very interesting and confirms what I thought.

[Hickok]

Boerrancher that really sucks.

I have an Arsenal Inc. SGL-31 (AK-74 Russian receiver and parts, reassembled in Las Vegas) 5.45 x 39 scoped up that will shoot shoot 2 to 2.5 MOA with Wolf, Tula and Russian Green spam can military ammo.

Surely Remington could be a AR 15/ AR 10 platform that would out shoot a Russian mil-spec AK-74.

But look what they did to the Marlin lever actions when they first bought out that company.

[daniel lawecki]

Investment groups like Cerberus Capitol Management Group they don't care about products they care about dividends.

[Boerrancher]

Well folks,After months of waiting, I am proud to introduce the new R-25. I finally got my custom barrel from Black Hole Weaponry, and installed it. Once the scope was rezeroed, I shot a five shot group at 100 yds that meauured 0.536 from the outside of the two widest points, and that was with a load for my Savage Axis, not one worked up for that rifle. It sure beats the 3 and 4 inch groups I was getting with that Remington barrel. I don't understand why Remington would not replace that barrel for me. I know for a fact that it cost them the sale of at least 2 more rifles, because had they made it right I was going to buy an R-25 in both 308 and 243. Now as it stands I will never by another Remington firearm again, and will do everything I can to dissuade others from purchasing them as well. Here is the rejuvenated R-25http://i279.photobucket.com/albums/kk155/Boerrancher/image_zps3pp0fqcb.jpeg (http://s279.photobucket.com/user/Boerrancher/media/image_zps3pp0fqcb.jpeg.html)

[725]

Penny wise and pound foolish has never been a plan for long term success. They had a chance to get free advertising and multiple recommendations but instead they got a bad reputation and multiple lost sales.

[Rick Hodges]

I have owned 4 Remington centerfire rifles...all from before 1977. A Model 700V in .222Rem. was competitive in local benchrest competitions....It was extremely accurate, bone stock out of the box. (less than .3 moa with a 53gr. Hornady and 4198. I still have the other 3, 2 Model 788's and a LH700 in 7mm mag. All shoot considerably better than MOA. Tis a pity what has happened to a truly great company.

[HB0708]

Your new setup looks sweet and shoots even better than it looks! Sorry it took so long and so much frustration to get there.

[Lance Boyle]

I wonder if your old factory barrel could be cut back to better bore specs. Not that you should have to, I'm just speculating. I like reasonably long barrels and don't like anything too short for muzzle blast reasons.

ETA- yea most of the guns I buy these days are old school guns or CZ's.

Lately it's been vintage S&W revolvers. Pre mim, pre lock, nice polish and bluing.

[leadman]

Glad you were able to repair the Remington to work as it should. Shameful that they did not at least put another barrel on it. Seems more and more companies are going down the same path.
Thompson Center is also being gutted by S&W and producing low quality ****. I sent the last 2 new T/C barrels back to them, one for a return, one for replacement that had a groove in the chamber at the neck that caused brass to flow into it. Haven't shot the replacement yet.

I have one rifle that shoots about the equal of your Rem with original barrel, maybe better. I am not going to complain though since it is a 71 Mauser made in 1877 and shoots a 340gr cast boolit and is a single shot. I have 1891 Argentine Mausers that will under an 1 1/2" at 100 yards and one will do that at 200 yards.

[MT Gianni]

That is a nice looking gun, glad that it is shooting as well as it is. My last Remington was a long time back.

[fixit]

HA, thanks man this reaffirms my savage 223 choice =). Sorry to hear about the poor customer service and luck with Remington it seems to be a trend though...


I am confused though and tbh I have never seen a barrel made. How is it possible, if using a straight drill bit or whatever to get a hole larger at the end than the start?! Tool worn out and wobbling maybe? Seems to me it should measure the same at the start of the bore and at the end...

unfortunately, the rifling operation is probably not the culprit. machining operations to the barrel can 'stress' the metal in ways that cause it to move unless it is 'destressed' at about 350 degrees...I wouldn't be surprised if this barrel missed one or more destressing operation!

[Boerrancher]

Yes I have a whole safe full of old school Remingtons and love every one of them because they will shoot MOA or better. When Remington told me on the phone, "We do not guarantee any kind of accuracy from our rifles.", I was done. There are too many good rifles out there to waste my time and money on Junk. All my Axsis rifles will shoot Sub MOA. My Axsis 22-250 will shoot 5 in one little hole at 100 that you can cover with a cigarette butt. Heck I have an old Marlin 1895, in a 45-70 that will shoot 3/4 inch groups at 100 yds with my cast Boolits. It is a pretty sad day when an old rellic will out shoot a new modern rifle. Best wishes, Joe

[TXGunNut]

Glad to see you finally have a rifle that meets your standards, Joe. It's a shame that Remington is so short-sighted as to put you thru all that nonsense. Sad truth is that most folks don't shoot nearly as well as you do and they would have been satisfied. Never been a Remington fan and my 597 recall experience didn't change that. Your experience shared here has cost them many, many times over the cost of a replacement barrel but beancounters and suits only see hard numbers, not intangibles like customer satisfaction. You were more than fair with them, you gave them multiple chances to get it right and they knew what your expectations were. They obviously weren't interested in your satisfaction and that will someday be their downfall.

[Artful]

Congratulations on making a great shooting and great looking Rifle - I applaud you for sticking too it.

I have an older Remington 700V that groups well
- I thought I'd upgrade from the original wood stock to a modern plastic stock (more stable and all that).

Well, I bought a take off Remington Factory SPS stock - to be honest
it made the gun shoot way worse than the old wood and me being German Stubborn I worked that plastic over used enough rods and epoxy to stiffen it up
but I wouldn't buy a new Remington Rifle especially if it came in one of those
stocks.

Darn Shame what corporate greed has done to American Firearms Market.

[MUSTANG]

Yes I have a whole safe full of old school Remingtons and love every one of them because they will shoot MOA or better. When Remington told me on the phone, "We do not guarantee any kind of accuracy from our rifles.", I was done. There are too many good rifles out there to waste my time and money on Junk. All my Axis rifles will shoot Sub MOA. My Axsis 22-250 will shoot 5 in one little hole at 100 that you can cover with a cigarette butt. Heck I have an old Marlin 1895, in a 45-70 that will shoot 3/4 inch groups at 100 yds with my cast Boolits. It is a pretty sad day when an old rellic will out shoot a new modern rifle. Best wishes, Joe


Joe:

As far as accuracy goes, I have similar MOA and less results with my Savage Axis in .223. Since I put a Boyd's stock on it I like it even more.

Question: Do you have any Magazine related feed problems with your Savage? I've resorted to single feed or accepting feed problems in the Axis .223, simply because it shoots and I don't want to spend ~$50.00 on a magazine that may or may not correct the problem.

[Boerrancher]

I have never had any feed issues with any of my Axis rifles. Try to figure out what it is doing, not raising the round high enough, or what? Maybe I can tell you how to fix it, if I know what it is doing. I have fixed several mags over the years, sometimes it is a simple problem, other times you just need a new mag.

[Bad Water Bill]

Go here http://www.savageshooters.com/forum.php

Almost every problem has been discussed there and the solutions are posted there as well.

[popper]

Sure hope that one is lighter than my 24" DPMS - purchased before they were bought out.

[KCSO]

IF its a cut rifled barrel it was installed backwards! The cut rifled barrels are always slightly tapered inside as the cutter compresses as it is pulled through the bore that is why a GOOD barrel is marked front and rear. I have found this problem several times and so far no factory will admit to a mistake.

[shdwlkr]

I used to like Remington when I lived close enough I could drive to the factory, but that was decades ago and back then they cared, since NYs has dumped a lot of funds into the company to keep it in NY things have gone down hill. I remember being able to drive to Redding when I needed a new set of reloading dies, bet they don't do that anymore either.
Business folks have lost pride in their product and only push as much out the door as they can as fast as they can and screw the buyer. Glad you got a firearm that works now.
Most of what I look at now is old stuff kind of lets me remember older times when things weren't so screwed up. I am working on getting a .225 winchester put together on a mauser action. Will have to figure out feeding issues but heck that is part of the fun these days.

[sparky45]

Beautiful looking rifle Joe, glad things worked out.
BTW, where'd you get the Dope sheet?