AR 15 problem

[Lever-man]

I have an AR 15 in 300 BLK stainless barrel. During the sight in process, about 15 rounds in it didn't fire. Upon inspection the round was not completely in battery and is stuck in the barrel. Any suggestions as to how to get this live round out? I used a slick sided upper on this build so there is no way to push the round into battery. I was shooting hand loads & normally check my cases with a Wilson case gauge I guess one slipped by me.

[wv109323]

I would put some light oil down the bore and let it soak around the stuck case. Separate the upper so there is no way for the hammer can strike the primer.
I would try a cleaning rod and try a few light taps. If the rod is aluminum I would put a jag on the end of the rod so the bullet point will not spread the threaded rod.

[Lever-man]

It is just far enough out of battery tat the upper will not come off.

[pretzelxx]

A cleaning rod with the upper removed from lower with carrier out. Don't have the rear on a hard surface, the extra oomph from the pounding may pop your primer. Safety first...

Oops. Miss read your last post... Ummm

Be very careful and tap very slowly til the bolt unlocks and you can either charge it or the cartridge is able to go back into battery?

[Lever-man]

The hammer is not in the cocked position.

[Lever-man]

Can I get the carrier out by removing stock? The carrier won't clear the lower to get it off

[pretzelxx]

Yes, if you can unscrew the nut holding your stock on it will allow you to pull it out of the rear... Just remember there's a little bit of spring pressure
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/10/18/6c6ad274ea429f8d1d9d56ef1ee7c9fe.jpg
Also, be cautious of the small spring holding your takedown pin in, it may get kinked when rotating the buffer off

[Lever-man]

Yes, I know, still not sure how that will help since I can't pull the charging handle back. Unless I can get the bolt to release it's hold on the case

[pretzelxx]

Less forward pressure on the carrier allowing you to tap out the cartridge slightly easier. But you need a dowel or cleaning rod to get this job done probably. I would not suggest hammering your carrier like I do with military equipment. Haha

[Lever-man]

I have a steel dowel wrapped with tape every 4 inches that I made up for slugging barrels just don't want that live round to go off while I'm hammering on it

[pretzelxx]

You should be safe even with the firing pin in. I would suggest gloves, eye protection and vice grips holding the dowel so your hand is off the muzzle

[Lever-man]

Ok I will be sure to do all of that! I do know that I'm trying all the ammo I have loaded in my Wilson gauge before I shoot any more! Will give it a try tomorrow. Thanks for the help.

[pretzelxx]

Hope all goes well and nothing is damaged!

[lefty o]

i dont like the idea of being on the wrong end of a live round. id take the rifle, place it muzzle down on something padded, hold it between your knees, now with both hands grab the charging handle. pull back sharply, repeat ( like a slide hammer). eventually it'll extract the rnd, rip the rim off or break the extractor. most likely it'll pop the rnd out. be glad you dont have a forward assist, all them do is make a jammed rnd stuck even worse!

[lead-1]

I had an empty round jammed up with a loaded round that had the rifle out of battery and stuck the carrier forward. I removed both takedown pins and removed the upper completely to clear the jam. Lift the upper slightly and slide it forward.

[osteodoc08]

Mortar it out. Very simple. Unlatch the charging handle and while pulling down on the charging handle smack the butt stock on a firm object while keeping the barrel pointed in a safe direction. Out it will come.

[1johnlb]

Mortar it out. Very simple. Unlatch the charging handle and while pulling down on the charging handle smack the butt stock on a firm object while keeping the barrel pointed in a safe direction. Out it will come.

+ 1 works everytime

As said, pull the charging handle while dropping the butt on a solid bench with muzzle pointed up. Out it comes

[1johnlb]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kzBdyubc0Uk&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[historicfirearms]

Mortar it out. Very simple. Unlatch the charging handle and while pulling down on the charging handle smack the butt stock on a firm object while keeping the barrel pointed in a safe direction. Out it will come.

+2 I have had to do this before. Be very careful to keep the muzzle pointed in a safe direction.

[Petrol & Powder]

Mortar it out. Very simple. Unlatch the charging handle and while pulling down on the charging handle smack the butt stock on a firm object while keeping the barrel pointed in a safe direction. Out it will come.

This is the safest method and the quickest. Just don't get your head over the muzzle. The inertia of the carrier does the work for you.

[Boolit_Head]

Mortating can break a carbine stock if the pin is locked into a hole on the buffer tube. Make sire the pin is not in a hole so it does not take all the force.

[osteodoc08]

Correct. Collapse the stock first. It was illustrated well in the video provided above.

OP, have you had resolution of your issue?

[Lever-man]

No just having my morning coffe. I'm going to give the mortating a try after breakfast. I like that idea better than sticking a rod down the barrel and pounding on a live round!

Boy do I feel like a Dummy after Lead-o pointed out that there are two pins holding the upper on, remove both and slide forward. Duh!

[Lever-man]

Ok, guys I got it out, mortaring did the trick! I collapsed the stock, made sure the charging handle latch was un-latched, got a good grip on the rifle and slammed the butt on my work bench and the stuck round just fell out just like the video! I want to thank everyone for their suggestions and comments. I think this site is the greatest, I spend hours on here just reading on the subjects that peak my interest, and have learned volumes!!! Thanks again!

[osteodoc08]

Rock on man! Glad you were able to get it out without fanfare. This site is hands down the best forum I've ever been a member of.

[pretzelxx]

Good to hear all ended well! We all make mistakes, it's these funny ones that you learn the most!

[Lever-man]

I checked the round that was stuck in the chamber with my Wilson case gauge and it falls in and out of the case gauge. It seems perfect in every way. I also check all the rest of my loaded ammo, same way but I cannot get a round to chamber, they all get stuck just before it goes into full battery. Any ideas on what is going on? It worked perfect for 15 rounds, no problems at all, now it will not chamber a round. My loaded ammo works fine in another 300 Blk that I have. I got disgusted and pulled the new barrel off and put the old one back on. It's a cmmg with a 1:7 twist my ammo works fine in it also. Did I get a bad barrel? It's a no-name SS barrel with a 1:8 twist that I got off of Fleabay. I'm afraid I've got an expensive paper weight!!

[GRUMPA]

I checked the round that was stuck in the chamber with my Wilson case gauge and it falls in and out of the case gauge. It seems perfect in every way. I also check all the rest of my loaded ammo, same way but I cannot get a round to chamber, they all get stuck just before it goes into full battery. Any ideas on what is going on? It worked perfect for 15 rounds, no problems at all, now it will not chamber a round. My loaded ammo works fine in another 300 Blk that I have. I got disgusted and pulled the new barrel off and put the old one back on. It's a cmmg with a 1:7 twist my ammo works fine in it also. Did I get a bad barrel? It's a no-name SS barrel with a 1:8 twist that I got off of Fleabay. I'm afraid I've got an expensive paper weight!!

My impression is it's a poorly reamed chamber, everything seems to point in that direction..

[Lever-man]

Can it be fixed? And who could do it if it can be fixed?

[badge176]

Any chance you left a case Body in the chamber? A tore off case head can leave the case body in the chamber allowing a second cartridge to partially chamber but obviously not all the way. Had it happen with steel-cased 5.45x39 in my AK-74 (once we got it out we found the headspace to be too large so my smith buddy pulled the barrel and reset it with an oversized pin.

[Lever-man]

No I have all the fired cases & they are complete. I took a very bright light & shined it in the chamber once I had the barrel off, don't see anything out of the ordinary.

[M-Tecs]

I checked the round that was stuck in the chamber with my Wilson case gauge and it falls in and out of the case gauge............................ It worked perfect for 15 rounds, no problems at all, now it will not chamber a round.

The working 15 rounds is the strange part.

First I would check for high primers. Next check case runout. If bad enough with will give chambering issues. After that check neck size and throat length. Since you pulled the barrel take a black marker and color the case and bullet. Do a plunk test and see where the contact is.

If need you can rent a reamer and headspace gauge and hand ream. You would be only be opening the neck and or throat or maybe a .001 or .002 from the headspace. You will not need to remove the barrel extension.

http://4-dproducts.com/

http://www.reamerrentals.com/default.asp

If it is only a headspace issue you can also size the brass a couple of thou. more. I have never seen galling on an AR extension but worth checking.

[1johnlb]

If your fired cases look normal. I'd bet you've got some trash in the chamber, either a flattened piece of lead, hard lube, or something to that nature. Take a brass brush that fits the neck area and clean it good and do the same to the chamber area and at worse case you may have to use a pick or think screwdriver. This happened to mine with a small piece of lead shaving.

[country gent]

Possibly carbon build up in throat neck area. First off do the color and plunk test to see where the resistance is at, then look very hard in that area. This is where a bore scope becomes very handy. Also measure loaded neck dia and compare to rounds that worked. A chamber cast will give actual chamber length to judge if overall caselength is correct, sinclairs also sell a little plug for this but you sacrifice a case to it. I would suspect one of several things tight neck dia in chamber, slightly short chamber, slightly long rounds for this chambers throat, and last but not unnussual is a chamber cut slightly short to have headspace set to your bolt and extension. A go and no go gage would be real handy here. Pull bolt from the carrier and use it to lock in the cartridges when plunk testing also. You can feel the resistance of the bolt locking and judge cartridge fit.

[M-Tecs]

If your fired cases look normal. I'd bet you've got some trash in the chamber, either a flattened piece of lead, hard lube, or something to that nature. Take a brass brush that fits the neck area and clean it good and do the same to the chamber area and at worse case you may have to use a pick or think screwdriver. This happened to mine with a small piece of lead shaving.

Good point. I totally over looked the simplest and most likely issue. I use an AR15 chamber brush every cleaning http://www.amazon.com/s?ie=UTF8&page=1&rh=i%3Aaps%2Ck%3Aar15%20chamber%20brush

I prefer the Nylon Iosso Chamber Brush http://www.midwayusa.com/product/2049216465/iosso-eliminator-brush-kit-rifle-thread-nylon

http://www.iosso.com/MivaStore/merchant.mvc?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=A&Category_Code=GunCleaning

[Lever-man]

Ok I can do the plunk test, but I'm going to have to study up on the rest because I have never done those tests. Time to learn new things. If by high primers you mean pushed out they are still seated all the way. My loads are 125 gr spire point sp flat base bullets over 19.2 grs Lil' Gun the max load listed is 20 grs so it should not be over pressure.

[Lever-man]

I cleaned the barrel before I took it off it had next to nothing in it only 5 patches and it was clean. I do not have a chamber brush though, will have to get one there may be something in the chamber just don't see anything with the tools I have, don't have a bore scope.

[M-Tecs]

Primers should be .003 to .005 below flush. If the unfired case rocks on a piece of glass you have a high primer.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?179633-Plunk-Test

http://m14forum.com/ammunition/120164-failing-plunk-test.html

[seagiant]

Hi,
You need to use a factory round not your handloads.

Also your brass that you have resized I bet is still oversize at thebottom near the base.

You want the base of the resized brass to go down below flush in your case guage.

I don't know what press you are using but you want the press to "roll over" on the linkage so it pushes the case up into the die as far as it should.

On semi auto rifles it does not take much to make problems!

These are just my thoughts, good luck!

[Lever-man]

I don't have any factory rounds at the moment, but you may have something there. All my 300 BLK brass started life as military 5.56 that I reworked into 300 BLK. What I'm seeing is a bright ring right above the base. On the cases that get stuck.

[Lever-man]

I'm using Lee dies and press.

[M-Tecs]

All my 300 BLK brass started life as military 5.56 that I reworked into 300 BLK. What I'm seeing is a bright ring right above the base. On the cases that get stuck.

That would be your problem. For that chamber you will need small base dies. 223 small base will work but it is an extra step.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/261325/rcbs-ar-series-small-base-2-die-set-with-taper-crimp-300-aac-blackout

[Lever-man]

Seems funny that the cmmg barrel will run them just fine. The barrel I'm having problems with must be tighter.

[M-Tecs]

Could be they just ran the reamer to long or you have some M249 brass.

[1johnlb]

If the first 15 went off without a hitch and now none of the rounds chamber, the problem is highly likely in the chamber, but still could be a stuck ejector or bolt head. But you said you swapped barrels, using the same bolt and carrier (?) and all was we'll, if so that leaves chamber. Good luck

Just my 2crap

[M-Tecs]

The "bright ring right above the base. On the cases that get stuck." is very telling.

[Lever-man]

Yes I used the same bolt & carrier. I think I will just use the cmmg barrel for now it works. I was hoping a 1:8 twist would tighten my groups since I don't do subsonic. When I can get the tools I need I will check the chamber out to see exactly what I have and go from there.

[Lever-man]

Thanks every one for the help I couldn't have done it without you!

[M-Tecs]

Actually you have all the tools you need. You have cases with the rub ring so you can compare them factory case or case/chamber print if you have a mic or a caliper. Accurately measuring tapers not at an end point is challenging for a layperson.

Case/Chamber print here http://www.saami.org/PubResources/CC_Drawings/Rifle/300%20AAC%20Blackout.pdf

[Mica_Hiebert]

Mortar it out. Very simple. Unlatch the charging handle and while pulling down on the charging handle smack the butt stock on a firm object while keeping the barrel pointed in a safe direction. Out it will come.

This! have had to do this with ruptured 5.56 since yours is a live round keep muzzle pointed in safe direction and wear ear plugs... :-D just in case.

[Lever-man]

M-Tecs, the cases with the bright ring mics .379 if I'm look at the specs right max should be .3769

[Lever-man]

Checking some of my other loaded rounds I do have some that mic .375 in the ring area.

[Lever-man]

That might explain how the first 15 run ok.

[M-Tecs]

M-Tecs, the cases with the bright ring mics .379 if I'm look at the specs right max should be .3769

That is min. on the chamber. The max on the cartridge is .3759. That is .200 above the base so depending on were the ring is you might need to do some trig.

The next question is it the dies or was some of the brass fired in an M249? I have about 10K of M249 brass that a small base die did wonders for.

If the oversize cases fit in the cmmg barrel that has an oversize chamber.

[Lever-man]

Actually I was looking at the head stamp & I had forgotten I bought 500 rounds of factory brass. That except for about 50 rounds have only been fired once in the cmmg barrel. Those 50 rounds that were not, were fired in a new Ruger American resized & reloaded. I didn't like the Ruger and sold it. So it may be my sizing dies?

[Lever-man]

Already got it out by mortating Mica working on why it stuck now. Thanks

[seagiant]

Hi,
If that is one of those aluminum lees take it to the scrape pile where it belongs and get a real cast iron press.

I can bet a dollar to a donut your problem is your set up with the die and press!

Your case guage WILL tell the tale but you have to learn how to use it correctly and this is no sin as we were all there at one time.

It is actually good that you want to know what the hec is going on, as that is how you learn and what makes this "hobby" so interesting!!!

[Tackleberry41]

Some say small base dies are not needed, but may be in this case. Depending on the chamber may get away with using a regular die, but a tight one you can't.

[Omega]

When you set your sizing die, did you raise the ram, screw down the die until it touched the shell holder then turned it at least 1/2 turn more? With the Lee dies you have to follow that procedure as it needs that extra amount of pressure to size correctly. If that still does not do it, then you may want to take a bit off the top the case holder or bottom of the die (I suggest the shell holder). Another thing I do to the stubborn ones is to size, turn the shell, size again; holding a bit before lowering the ram; these are usually ones fired from an auto like the M249 which seem to expand the shell a bit more probably due to the cyclic rate.

I avoid small base dies, it works the brass too much. And having an extra die just for the handful of cases that don't size correctly just doesn't appeal to me. I form my own 300Blk cases with Lee dies, which they are not made for, so had to learn by trial an error what works to form and size properly.

[M-Tecs]

When you are setting your sizing die you want about .002" under the chamber headspace. If the base is not sized properly you need a different die. Small base dies have their place.

[Lever-man]

Omega, yes I follow that procedure every time I set up for a different cartridge. I re - read the instructions for the case gauge I just don't understand how the case gauge will show that the cartage is OK but it will not go into battery. Even the ones that fired and cycled are still in spec using the case gauge. I'm getting "go & no go head spacing gauge ASAP!

[1johnlb]

Omega, yes I follow that procedure every time I set up for a different cartridge. I re - read the instructions for the case gauge I just don't understand how the case gauge will show that the cartage is OK but it will not go into battery. Even the ones that fired and cycled are still in spec using the case gauge. I'm getting "go & no go head spacing gauge ASAP!

Will any of the 15 that chambered and fired, freely chamber again? The cases that have already been fired, even without sizing them should still chamber.

Are you using the roll crimp in the Lee 2 die set or lee's factory crimp die? Reason I ask, if you have the Lee 2 die set and the die all the way down its putting a roll crimp on it. The bulge from the roll crimp can keep the round from chambering. Especially if your using 311 size boolits. Just food for thought.

[Lever-man]

I'm using lees factory crimp & j words.

[M-Tecs]

The instructions that are included with all dies are generic methods that work well for most situations but they are from optimal for the best case life, chamber fit and accuracy.

For best case life, chamber fit and accuracy the following methods work well.
http://www.sinclairintl.com/GunTech/Setting-up-a-Full-Length-Sizing-Die-/detail.htm?lid=16134

[M-Tecs]

I re - read the instructions for the case gauge I just don't understand how the case gauge will show that the cartage is OK but it will not go into battery. Even the ones that fired and cycled are still in spec using the case gauge. I'm getting "go & no go head spacing gauge ASAP!

http://www.lewilson.com/casegage.html

One piece gage that will check overall length to indicate the need for trimming, datum to head length to assure correct headspace and to prevent over sizing. Available for most popular rimless cases.

Note: Does not measure body diameters. This gage is intended to be used with fired cases to determine a basis for full length sizing and trimming.

The issue is your cmmg barrel has a large chamber that your current Lee dies are not able to correct for use in your new barrel. My solution would be to use dies that properly size the base and maintain a .002 shoulder bump.

[Lever-man]

1johnlb, yes the 7 cases that I fired on the day I started this thread will chamber.

[M-Tecs]

Measuring headspace

http://redding-reloading.com/tech-line-a-tips-faqs/145-dealing-with-headspace

http://thecmp.org/training-tech/armorers-corner/headspace/

http://www.rifleshootermag.com/gunsmithing/gunsmithing_headspace_0612/

http://www.brownells.com/.aspx/lid=12555/GunTechdetail/Headspace-Gauges-And-How-To-Use-Them-Part-I

[Lever-man]

M-Tecs, you are probably right if I decide to put the 1:8 barrel back on I will have to make sure the base is sized properly for the tight chamber.

[1johnlb]

Mtec, is leading you correctly. That barrel just has a tight chamber. It maybe that that barrel was reamed with a reamer for a bolt gun, where the Cmmg was designed for ar's since that's all they make. All chambers aren't created equally.

[TCLouis]

Open the action by removing the front pivot pin first.

Support the ear of the lower as you tap it out.

Don't as how I got fairly proficient at this!

[Lever-man]

I'm learning that the hard way!

[seagiant]

Hi,
I've built a few rifles, one is a STG 58 with a Imbel reciever.

It will eat anything just like my PolyTech/USGI M-14.

However my DPMS 308 will not!

It does not like LC Brass and the commercial brass has to be perfectly sized, speced to a case guage or the bolt will not go into battery!

It will however feed any type of new commercial or military 308!

Just sayin!

[Lever-man]

Seagiant, this is my 5th build & the first to give me any trouble. Even the 6.5 Grendel runs like a top, I figured it would give me trouble but it didn't. This is the first time I've used a no name barrel too!