Mo. cop kicked out of Olive Garden because of duty gun

[M-Tecs]

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/mo-cop-kicked-out-of-olive-garden-because-of-duty-gun/ar-AAflpTR?li=AAa0dzB&OCID=msnHomepage

A uniformed Kansas City, Mo., cop hoping to celebrate his birthday with lunch at Olive Garden on Sunday was kicked out because of his duty firearm.A hostess caught sight of Officer Michael Holsworth’s holstered handgun as he waited for his family and asked the decorated officer to leave the restaurant at once, he ranted in a Facebook post Sunday afternoon.
“I never in my wildest thoughts would of thought this would happen in the Kansas City area. I see it happening all over the United States to other officers, but never thought it would of happened to me,” he wrote after leaving the restaurant.
It’s legal to openly carry handguns in Missouri, but the Olive Garden hostess told Holsworth guns were prohibited in the restaurant.
The restaurant’s refusal to serve Holsworth brought on a flurry of outrage spearheaded by the city’s Fraternal Order of Police, which promised to organize protests outside the southeast Kansas City restaurant.
The order’s president, Brad Lemon, and Kansas City Police Chief Darrl Forte came to Holsworth’s defense in public messages aimed at the chain’s national Twitter account.
“Facts are being gathered,” Forte wrote.
It’s not clear why the restaurant franchise took a stance against Holsworth’s gun. Olive Garden insists it was a misunderstanding.
“Law enforcement are always welcome to dine (with) us — we heart serving them and have great relationships,” an Olive Garden spokesman said.
The chain’s president, Dave George, has since called Holsworth to apologize, said Lemon, the order's liaison to Kansas police.
Lemon took a pointed stand against Holsworth’s treatment, demanding respect for all law enforcement officers.
“It's been an incredibly difficult day for our brother, and our entire family. All we ever ask is to be treated fairly and with the same respect to due anyone else. When we are treated poorly because of our chosen occupation, it hurts,” Lemon wrote in another statement to Facebook.
“It's not okay to treat law enforcement poorly. We deserve, and have earned, the same level of respect due to each and every member of society.”
Holsworth declined to speak of Sunday’s ordeal further after his public Facebook post went viral with more than 5,600 shares.
Holsworth earned his department’s Distinguished Service Medal in 2014 for being one of three police officers who shot and killed a burglar linked to a triple homicide, according to city records.

[salpal48]

with the current state of mind in this country. i can Understand This situation. I am a firm believer that it make People Uncomfortable. . Open carry Or Not. There is a place and time for everything. It not a Matter Of respect Or dis- respect. It is strictly a matter of Business.

[M-Tecs]

with the current state of mind in this country. i can Understand This situation. I am a firm believer that it make People Uncomfortable. . Open carry Or Not. There is a place and time for everything. It not a Matter Of respect Or dis- respect. It is strictly a matter of Business.

This was a Cop in his duty UNIFORM. It is a statement by anti-gun anti-LE employees. They need to be fired.

[starmac]

A MATTER OF BUSINESS. lol How about no cops show up when they are in diea need of one, would that be a matter of business, I mean why respond to a robbery of a business that doesn't want you.

I was in a country bar in Louisiana years ago when some bikers came and a huge fight broke out. The place was pretty trashed and the sherrif had been called. The bikers had left before the sherrifs dept showed up, but they had corralled them a few miles down the road. The bar owner wouldn't file charges, because he knew he would be burned out or worse, but the sherrif told him in no uncertain terms that if he didn't, that they would never respond to any emergency they had ever again.

[salpal48]

Don't get me wrong. This was not an off the cuff statement. my family Owned Bars and Restaurant In New York City for decades. It was unheard of The a Uniform Cop to come in , Sat down, eating and Or drinking. . The uniform denote He is on Duty. There were a lot Of Cops in My father Place , #34 Precinct . Maybe it happens where you Live But Not In the city . It show no respect for the badge and None for his co worker not that he can't. It lack of Common sense
He should have went Home and Changed

[sparky45]

with the current state of mind in this country. i can Understand This situation. I am a firm believer that it make People Uncomfortable. . Open carry Or Not. There is a place and time for everything. It not a Matter Of respect Or dis- respect. It is strictly a matter of Business.

Way off base with that one salpal. You almost sound like an apologist for Bloomberg or Cuomo. This officer was in UNIFORM and M-Tecs is spot on, in that the anti-LE employees NEED TO BE FIRED. Enough is enough!!

[starmac]

Now uniformed cops need to change out of uniform to have lunch or coffee. I guess I just don't get your line of thinking.

[Littleton Shot Maker]

What- he was treated just like any civie...they don't like that?? They want special treatment??

So the folks working there are armed and ready to repel bad guys if they come in?? They have my back?? NO, Just another place that would not get my money- move on - find a better Italian place that welcomes Law abiding folks armed or not Cop or not!!! No one is special - No one need extra rights - we are equal right?? By gender, race, religion UNLESS YOU OWN OR CARRY A GUN?? Pax taxes , work or want other to take up arms to protect them selves.

COPS can't, wont be there to STOP most crimes just draw the chalk line and begin to start to look for the bad guys, if they have the resources or they are not in the NO GO ZONE run by radical libs and Islamist. Look at Chikago- tons of guns laws TONS more murders - rape and burglaries...But POTUS won't talk about that- he will talk about taking guns from folks that have not broken any laws as if that will make the world safer- Ask the Jews circa 36 Germany how that played out- Or Pol POT- Ho Chi Min- Castro- El Che- Stalin... they all got the guns to control the people and them KILL THEM>>>>

I was Bothered by other patron at (burger chain) , when said patron complained that I would not remove my Pistol (open carry Az) and it made them feel weird , the manager asked them where they where from?? answer: "NJ"!! He asked them A. "there's no crime in NJ??" yes, B. We have less crime here (Az) cause we have the right not to wait for a cop to show up well after the fact and can defend our selves. He then promptly told them maybe they'd feel better back at home IN NJ??? He thanked me, in front of them and they left....I go there allot now and never been an issue there with any one working there and 90% of the time the retirees give me a thumbs up and point out the 1911 I carry. Some will say I had one of those back in 44, 56 , 63, 70 ... or when ever they served...and stood up against those that would love to destroy our way of life, NOW we are doing it to ourselves - we got warned in 56?? at the UN council when Russian leader slammed table with shoe and told us they will take over the schools the colleges the govt, from within and have no need to invade us. Looks like he was telling the truth. ONE right at a time the Dike will crumble and no matter how many fingers you have you'll never plug all the holes up and it will fail...tree of freedom.... blood ...hang together or hang separate the KING will surely hang you none the less.

[Mumblypeg]

A police officer in uniform should be welcomed anywhere the public is. Period. We are there for everyone and it should matter not even if one is out of his/her jurisdiction. We are the same on the inside no matter where we go. I for one don't like Olive Garden and I think there food sucks but each to there own. That person should be fired, just my opinion of course. Should the police be able to pick and choose who we want to answer calls from? This cancer is spreading and the media and idiots are spreading it. They hate us.... until they need us....

[Col4570]

Due to his Job a Police Officer could be Targeted by undesirables,therefore is makes sense that he is armed at all times.It would be preferable for him to be in uniform rather than civis where he might be mistaken for an armed civilian. In this unpredictable World an armed Guardian of the Law gives out a message to the bad guys and may save lives due to his presence.

[hicard]

I, for one, will never step foot into an Olive Garden restaurant again. I can't believe that happened to an officer in uniform.

[Littleton Shot Maker]

safest place to eat?? the joint fill with uniformed cops!!! WHO in their right mind would do bad there?? OH... crazy people. OK shoot them don;t arrest them don;t waste my money learning about their mom and dad and their feelings and give them a place to live rent free for ever....shoot em like the dogs they are.

Col. shooter comes to mind- shoot that turd be done, truly crazy or not I don;t give rip- He killed people for NO good reason. Caught 'red' handed- drop him- OOPPS trigger finger slipped ..he reached for.... NO, let put cameras on cops and teach them to speak PC speak....and give the thugs more room to do bad. Joe citizen gets it from both sides.

and I learned to cook Italian food at home cuase that place DOES suck!! If you have a Cheese Cake Factory near you?? they do a great True Carbonara to die for...sorry got hungry...

NOW the bar across for the police station used to get robbed all the time- why??? Cops are not at the station much except shift change, so they'd ( thugs) would wait till then go rob the place...many times over and worst OWNER of bar could not legally have gun to protect him self 'in the bar' this was smaller town in N.C. about 75-81 time frame bad times there for sure.

[M-Tecs]

Don't get me wrong. This was not an off the cuff statement. my family Owned Bars and Restaurant In New York City for decades. It was unheard of The a Uniform Cop to come in , Sat down, eating and Or drinking. . The uniform denote He is on Duty. There were a lot Of Cops in My father Place , #34 Precinct . Maybe it happens where you Live But Not In the city . It show no respect for the badge and None for his co worker not that he can't. It lack of Common sense
He should have went Home and Changed

Each state regulates when and were on duty uniformed cops can take lunch breaks. In Minnesota and North Dakota uniformed LE are encouraged to take their lunch breaks in public areas. It is rare when I go out for lunch that I do not see uniformed LE having lunch.

If we lose the battle on uniformed LE not being able to carry their duty firearm we sure as h**l would not win on civilians carrying.

The battle is against the left wing loonies that believe all firearms are bad. The left and the PC crowd needs to be stopped!!!!!!!


As to
. It show no respect for the badge and None for his co worker not that he can't. It lack of Common sense
He should have went Home and Changed If this is a typical New Yorker attitude that explains a lot as to why New York is the way it is.

Some more:

http://www.policemag.com/channel/weapons/news/2013/03/27/va-cops-refused-service-at-buffalo-wild-wings.aspx

http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/Police-Chief-in-Uniform-Told-to-Leave-Gun-Outside-Ikea-266105531.html

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/10/03/arizona-police-officer-asked-not-to-wear-uniform-at-daughters-school/

http://www.guns.com/2014/09/16/texas-state-trooper-asked-to-leave-waffle-house-because-he-had-a-gun-video/

http://www.copblock.org/252/cop-in-uniform-asked-to-leave-cafe/

http://fox43.com/2015/10/06/cop-refused-service-at-dunkin-donuts-store-owner-meets-with-police-chief/

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Police-Officers-Say-They-Were-Refused-Service-at-Whataburger-327885051.html

Not just LE

http://pamelageller.com/2014/09/us-army-officer-denied-entry-daughters-school-uniform-might-offend-muslim-students.html/#!

[aap2]

If I was there I would have offered to buy the officer and his family dinner at a much better restaurant, thank him for his service and ask the waitress if she had experienced recent severe head trauma which might explain her cognitive dysfunction.

[Preacher Jim]

I have just crossed olive garden off my list of restaurants that I am going to eat at. I did go twice monthly. Never again will I spend money in one,

[Larry Gibson]

Actually it's not the states that regulate such. Each agency/department will have it's own regulations. I've never heard (I was in LE for 18 years) of any agency's regulation that a uniformed officer or one in civilian attire could not eat in a public restaurant. Actually we were encouraged to for numerous reasons. Many times patrol officers also ate in restaurants in uniform when "off duty", either before going on duty or after duty. This was especially the case when on assignment away from you're usual patrol or during a lengthy incident of investigation. In some locations LEO's bring their lunch and have a break room to eat in and in others they can eat in their patrol vehicle. If they're on foot patrol guess what? Also in some smaller jurisdictions the officers can go home for lunch or dinner.

To those who obviously have a dislike for LEO's I say simply remember they are a part of your community. They are there to serve you. If you have a heart burn with they way they act, function or operate then take it up with your elected representatives in your jurisdiction to effect a change. But could it be it's your own attitude toward LEOs and probably the law in general that is probably what earned your disdain for them. If you proffer that same attitude to your representatives you probably won't make a good or effective impression.

Larry Gibson

[Walkingwolf]

Cops don't get kicked out of non GFZ business, I have never heard of it. So patronize business that supports the second amendment.

[Littleton Shot Maker]

Don't just not spend money there!! go in there one day with 12-25 people armed- legally where permitted , ask if they have an issue "yes" then all walk out as a group...tell them "look" this $300-$750, table top just walked out because of "this" and tell them they are turds then never go back.

Let your local gun store know too, put out an add in paper telling folks esting there in UNsafe and "this: is why"...etc...tell them how you feel and see if they are all like that or just that one dumb####.
Our O.G. is about 4 blocks from a gun store and the County Sheriff's sub station- the world will get out and they have had few bad quarters lately any way , make a show of it...create drama call the local news station if friendly to cops and share the story...

[Walkingwolf]

I have never went to Olive Garden to eat, and I do not use Cracker Barrel either. But unless it is just our local area they have lines coming out the doors. I doubt that losing a small group will get their attention.

IMO I give my business to restaurants that are gun friendly, not just for LE. I would rather encourage, and reward good business practice instead of wasting my time with GFZ business.

Usually local restaurants are welcome to armed customers. Post the friendly restaurants on state local forums. Nationally IHOP, Denny's, are gun friendly. Nationally Olive Garden, and Cracker barrel are not. They just opened a new Buffalo Wild Wings here, but because of their national policy we will not ever go there. So far I have seen no posting on the doors.

In Sanford, NC the only place that has an anti gun policy is Cracker Barrel, seems all the other restaurants are on board.

ETA I don't have a lot of sympathy for cops that give their money to anti gun restaurants. They know before they go they are anti gun, so it should be no surprise.

[nekshot]

"when good men do nothing evil prevails" I don't know who said that but to simply say this is just the way it is there fore do nothing IS exactly what the left hopes to achieve. They are nothing more than bullies and I will not use this restaurent and gladly say why for the rest of my life when the name Olive Garden comes up. This nation has too much good just to throw away with loser thinking!

[popper]

Not surprised, O.G. want to think of itself as an 'upscale/snob' place. Met the wife there a few times for lunch & they always wanted to push booze sales. They don't get much 'worker' lunch traffic around here. Cracker Barrel started near Lebanon, Tn - guess their owned by N.J. execs now. Stop there near Toad Suck often, guess I'll look for another place. I see LEO in Chick-a-Filet all the time, no problem. Do note, the article said he was waiting for his family - i.e. getting off duty so NO don't go home and change.

[M-Tecs]

It was his lunch break. http://www.westernjournalism.com/cop-entered-olive-garden-for-birthday-lunch-what-happened-next-has-olive-garden-apologizing-profusely/

[Littleton Shot Maker]

Off topic but 97-01 WE could not wear our camies off base!!! IN 29 Palms the biggest Marine Base around?? Not sure if that still the case but hell I lived OFF base, then we would get in trouble if NOT in uniform while going in and out of the Front gate...I see Air force and Army around here all day long in Uniform , granted they look like slobs or over weight Civies trying pull off a costume thing, but I guess the don't have to Iron anything these days?? Or get hair cuts?? They don't look like WAR FIGHTER TO ME. AND COPS are just that war fighters against CRIME...

Police in uniform eating lunch in public does not bother me,

IT WHEN I SEE THE fat lard of beer gut dressed in A cop Uniform that makes me sick, No weight height standards they just look like well Pigs, these guys are so fat, how do they get in and out of a cruiser- Never mind , we just got a new fleet of suvs , FOR our urban areas, the cars did not have enough room for the new breed - I am not a hater of POLICE , just a hater of the new Standards that are deemed Good Enough...

[jcwit]

I have never went to Olive Garden to eat, and I do not use Cracker Barrel either. But unless it is just our local area they have lines coming out the doors. I doubt that losing a small group will get their attention.

IMO I give my business to restaurants that are gun friendly, not just for LE. I would rather encourage, and reward good business practice instead of wasting my time with GFZ business.

Usually local restaurants are welcome to armed customers. Post the friendly restaurants on state local forums. Nationally IHOP, Denny's, are gun friendly. Nationally Olive Garden, and Cracker barrel are not. They just opened a new Buffalo Wild Wings here, but because of their national policy we will not ever go there. So far I have seen no posting on the doors.

In Sanford, NC the only place that has an anti gun policy is Cracker Barrel, seems all the other restaurants are on board.

ETA I don't have a lot of sympathy for cops that give their money to anti gun restaurants. They know before they go they are anti gun, so it should be no surprise.

Never had a problem with the Cracker Barrels in my area and I open carry most of the time.

[jumbeaux]

... The uniform denote He is on Duty.... It lack of Common sense
He should have went Home and Changed

Outrageous to suggest that a uniformed LEO should not be allowed to have a meal while on duty...ever heard of a coffee or meal break ? I live in rural East Texas but all of the restaurants locally offer LEO discounted meals, coffee and drinks (tea, cokes etc...). These men & women have a difficult enough job without all of this BS...

rick

[jcwit]

Don't get me wrong. This was not an off the cuff statement. my family Owned Bars and Restaurant In New York City for decades. It was unheard of The a Uniform Cop to come in , Sat down, eating and Or drinking. . The uniform denote He is on Duty. There were a lot Of Cops in My father Place , #34 Precinct . Maybe it happens where you Live But Not In the city . It show no respect for the badge and None for his co worker not that he can't. It lack of Common sense
He should have went Home and Changed

You sure seem to have a warped way of looking at things. But that's JMO.

[Walkingwolf]

Never had a problem with the Cracker Barrels in my area and I open carry most of the time.

It is company policy, some may ignore it. I will dig, and see if I can find the official statement. I don't care if one, or two allow, if it is company policy none get my business.
Cracker Barrel

Thank you for taking the time to share your comments with all of us here at Cracker Barrel Old Country Store. We're always pleased to hear from our guests.

Open Carry Policy
As we work to achieve our mission of Pleasing People, one of our top priorities is the safety and comfort of our guests, both external and internal. Because of this, and because it is our intent to provide our guests and employees with a relaxed, comfortable, family-oriented environment, we feel its important to review our open carry policy.

Simply stated, our policy is that we will not seat or serve patrons who are openly carrying or wearing firearms unless the patrons are law enforcement officers, security guards, or uniformed military personnel.

We look forward to seeing you in one of our locations again soon.

Sincerely,

Sandra Vance
Guest Relations Representative
Cracker Barrel Old Country Store, Inc

[trapper9260]

Fir how i see it is that if they have that much of someone that is there to protect and serve and like to stop to eat and they do not want them there for being dress for duty when needed, then i say that when OG need the police ,when some one want to clean them of the funds they have or other hold up, the police should not show up inside and let OG get there own security then .since they do not want any officers in there place.they do not need there bussiness for being there to eat and on duty then they will not need them when they really need help.Just like any other place that wants to be that way.

[Lonegun1894]

Don't get me wrong. This was not an off the cuff statement. my family Owned Bars and Restaurant In New York City for decades. It was unheard of The a Uniform Cop to come in , Sat down, eating and Or drinking. . The uniform denote He is on Duty. There were a lot Of Cops in My father Place , #34 Precinct . Maybe it happens where you Live But Not In the city . It show no respect for the badge and None for his co worker not that he can't. It lack of Common sense
He should have went Home and Changed

The last suicidal person I had to drive to a psych hospital to get them help was a 675 mile drive EACH WAY (and I had to leave 10 hours into a 12hr shift) because our local hospital said that they were unable to find an open bed in a psychiatric center any closer. Would you suggest that I take the suicidal person home with me next time this happens and make sandwiches to take for the road, or just wait til I get home? Now this is by no means a normal shift, but it happens now and then. So you can't expect us to go change before going to grab lunch if during a shift. For what it's worth though, if I have the option, I tend to change into off duty clothing and hide any hint of what I do for the sake of I just don't want anyone messing with my food, cause nowadays, it happens a lot. I am lucky that I work in a small town and we have the local communities support, so I try to stop off and have lunch in public, but I go out of my way to make sure I blend in with everyone else when going out anywhere outside of my town.

[Elkins45]

Wonder what they would have done if he had refused to leave? Called the cops?

[Littleton Shot Maker]

messing with your food!! Lame-
I worked food as a young man- we had a waitress have a bad experience with a jerk, YEAH he came around every morning but I think he'd been a jerk even if not in Uniform but it almost killed that guy and She was cuffed an stuffed the same day for Assault ?? I think it was, Won;t say what see did but I guess he did not make it far donw the road and got very sick, ran off road, almost took out some other driver that day.. etc...

This is so dumb I hate to hear about that... her claim was he was "grabby" "touchy" tried to get out on date?? What ever you don't screw with some ones food ever!!! AND if claim was real she could have just asked some other girl, we only had women servers, to serve him. AND reported him?? BUT he could have killed anyone around him while going down that Hi-way and him self for what??? Stupid people...

[alamogunr]

with the current state of mind in this country. i can Understand This situation. I am a firm believer that it make People Uncomfortable. . Open carry Or Not. There is a place and time for everything. It not a Matter Of respect Or dis- respect. It is strictly a matter of Business.

I would have to dispute your location of "Any Town, USA". Most Towns USA would not have businesses that treated a police officer in uniform in this way.

The wife and I were in New York for a few days about 3 weeks ago. It was the first time we had been there and stayed more than hours. We ate a couple of times at a sort of neighborhood(if Times Square area can be called a neighborhood) restaurant. Both times we were there what was apparently a special squad of police officers came in for lunch. They were all in uniform and armed. I have to say they were treated at least as well as any other customer and I felt very safe. I don't mean to leave the impression that we didn't feel safe otherwise. I never felt unsafe at any time.

[Plate plinker]

smart for leo people to buy food where they can see it being prepared.

[Littleton Shot Maker]

Plate Plinker - Not just for Police- I like when I can see the cooks, how they work, what the stations looks like- I cooked for More than a couple years while getting through school before getting deep into making lead. I like to see if they look like they are doing it right!! When food comes out of a door from some where else in the building I don;t want to eat there much. I caught a cook in a sleeveless shirt cooking my food , nothing holding in his beard in or long hair and those flake where not pepper , he was back there smoking.

DID not pay, did not eat , never went back. told the Mgt. what and why-- 3 months later it was closed down for good...thank the lord- give food service folks a bad rep all around...

[jcwit]

It is company policy, some may ignore it. I will dig, and see if I can find the official statement. I don't care if one, or two allow, if it is company policy none get my business.
Cracker Barrel

Thank you for taking the time to share your comments with all of us here at Cracker Barrel Old Country Store. We're always pleased to hear from our guests.

Open Carry Policy
As we work to achieve our mission of Pleasing People, one of our top priorities is the safety and comfort of our guests, both external and internal. Because of this, and because it is our intent to provide our guests and employees with a relaxed, comfortable, family-oriented environment, we feel its important to review our open carry policy.

Simply stated, our policy is that we will not seat or serve patrons who are openly carrying or wearing firearms unless the patrons are law enforcement officers, security guards, or uniformed military personnel.

We look forward to seeing you in one of our locations again soon.

Sincerely,

Sandra Vance
Guest Relations Representative
Cracker Barrel Old Country Store, Inc

Guess you'd have a hard time at our club then as well. No open carry by range officers at sanctioned NRA matches while policing the line.

Don't ask me why.

As far as Cracker Barrel, I like their food and have no problem with them.

Ever eat anything from Quaker Oats?

[jcwit]

Plate Plinker - Not just for Police- I like when I can see the cooks, how they work, what the stations looks like- I cooked for More than a couple years while getting through school before getting deep into making lead. I like to see if they look like they are doing it right!! When food comes out of a door from some where else in the building I don;t want to eat there much. I caught a cook in a sleeveless shirt cooking my food , nothing holding in his beard in or long hair and those flake where not pepper , he was back there smoking.

DID not pay, did not eat , never went back. told the Mgt. what and why-- 3 months later it was closed down for good...thank the lord- give food service folks a bad rep all around...

Don't eat in many fancy, expensive resturants do you? You know, the kind you spend $75 to $500 a plate.

[retread]

The wackos are pushing us farther to the sidelines. Make a statement that businesses understand, take your money elsewhere. If enough people take a stand things will change. If we keep accommodating the people that push their agendas on us, we deserve the results.

[jcwit]

The wackos are pushing us farther to the sidelines. Make a statement that businesses understand, take your money elsewhere. If enough people take a stand things will change. If we keep accommodating the people that push their agendas on us, we deserve the results.

The reality of it is it's similar to not buying ANYTHING made in china.

[smokeywolf]

35+ years ago, every department I knew of required their officers to carry while off duty and away from home. Get caught by supervisory personnel out without you duty or off duty gun and it was 4 days off without pay (4 on, 2 off schedule).

[jcwit]

We have some Officers in one of the clubs I belong to, I concur that they are required to carry even when off duty.

[starmac]

The reality of it is it's similar to not buying ANYTHING made in china.

Some of us try real hard to not buy ANYTHING made in China. It is everybodys personal choice to be part of the problem or part of the solution.

[Littleton Shot Maker]

NO I don;t eat at those places- don't own nice enough clothes to get int the door.
I cook instead, and my girls will ask DAD to cook long before they ask to eat out...
Those years in the back of the steak house/ rib joint or the family owned Italian place paid off I guess , not so much with cash, we where making $3.25 an hour - LIVING LARGE, HA,
But I now can cook better food than I can buy in most places and it saves me time and money and gas and I don;t have to fight with wife as to WHY I won;t go here or there -- I just point out the GFZ sticker and we all turn around, no words need be said EVER.
Even My 8 year old gets it and wants to know why don;t ALL FOLKS carry...I joke a tell her , "we are in Az - assume they are carrying and be polite and respectful at all times." kids get it- why adults don;t?? boggles my mind....

[Walkingwolf]

Guess you'd have a hard time at our club then as well. No open carry by range officers at sanctioned NRA matches while policing the line.

Don't ask me why.

As far as Cracker Barrel, I like their food and have no problem with them.

Ever eat anything from Quaker Oats?


The NRA is anti carry? Your kidding right? They actually restrict people from lawful carry at matches?
It is your right to eat where ever you wish. I do not eat there, or give money to any business, or organization that has any anti carry policy.

[Littleton Shot Maker]

is this for real??
Have not been to NRA shoot since 83-84 . SO I am curious how they can, would do that . that is just plain dumb, BUT they are 'smarter' than me , maybe there IS a GOOD reason..can't think of one but whatever ....
so this is only the range officers??
Because even when I shoot rifle the handgun is still strapped on...SO DOES THIS apply to the shooter in the event too?? Just asking a dumb question I am sure....it must??

[M-Tecs]

Not an NRA policy. Could be a local club policy.

[montana_charlie]

Don't get me wrong. This was not an off the cuff statement.
Off the cuff was not the phrase that was in my mind when classifying your statement.

[jcwit]

Not an NRA policy. Could be a local club policy.

Some of the competitors asked for it and we complied! What can I say.

But when you're dealing with a line of 60 to 80 shooters and have had judges come in from out of state, you going to shut the match down?

[TXGunNut]

Haven't been to Olive Garden for awhile but the ones I went to would have likely comp'd his meal if they found out it was his birthday. When I had a badge and was required to carry a gun we were encouraged to eat at restaurants in our district. It was a PR and common sense policy but both terms have taken on a new meaning lately. There's something very wrong about this story.
I'm pretty sure this was an isolated incident where an employee was either misinformed or had a personal anti-LE agenda. The group Olive Garden belongs to (Darden, along with Red Lobster and a few others, I think) is having financial issues so this comes at a very bad time for them. The local one doesn't appear to be a GFZ, haven't seen that sign at Cracker Barrel either.
I enjoyed our local OG, hope they're not truly going down this road.

[AZ-JIM]

I haven't been to OG for a while, never noticed the signage before. I like others of you would rather eat at home, and for the same reasons. Havent been to Cracker Barrel in many years either. One Outback Steakhouse I go to has signage, one other one does not. We have another small Italian chain called Oregano's, they have a small sticker in the window that looks like a ray gun from a cartoon with a red circle and line through it. That one I figure doesn't apply to me since my carry gun does not look like the one pictured. If they aren't going to take it seriously then I'm not going to follow it. Concealed carry is a beautiful thing. ( Taken from a friend ) if it was spotted and I was asked to leave, I would mention to the manager how strange it was that my sidearm had manged to not jump out of its holster and just start shooting people and that this would be my last visit to the establishment. I do my best to avoid GFZ establishments but it is not always possible when out of town or for family gatherings. Some of you won't agree with eating at these places period, some of you won't agree with the choice to carry in them anyway. As far as I am concerned, my Constitutional rights trump a silly food chains choice to violate those rights, after all it is the supreme law of the land right?

az-jim

[jcwit]

Heck, our local rails to bikes has signage, no firearms allowed, and yes I use it as I'm required to walk a min. Of 20 minutes a day. Beats dodging the folks & traffic walking in town.

[popper]

Waffle House released a statement reaffirming their gun-free policy

[jcwit]

Some of us try real hard to not buy ANYTHING made in China. It is everybodys personal choice to be part of the problem or part of the solution.

The key word there is "try". Now back to the reality, start checking the items in your house.

The reality is for many, many items there is no choice!

[jcwit]

The NRA is anti carry? Your kidding right?


Where did I say that?

[starmac]

The key word there is "try". Now back to the reality, start checking the items in your house.

The reality is for many, many items there is no choice!

For sure there are some chinese made things here, but not as many as a guy wants to think. It is still possible to buy most things American. If more folks would make the effort it would be a lot easier. If more would made the effort years ago, it would be easy.
I will admit, we may be past the point of no return, luckily (for me) I have most of what I need to last for the rest of my time.

[Littleton Shot Maker]

need to look again but there is a web site that lists good made ONLY in the USA.
At one point they sent me an email, I wonder if that is still active? AND maybe it may be worth it to join up even take a good look and see just how much we can get from home grown co.'s??

[M-Tecs]

I like to purchase US but some things are no longer made in the US. TV's are the best example. Same for a lot of the other electronics.

Some more examples http://madeinusanews.com/2010/11/07/19-iconic-products-that-america-doesnt-make-anymore-read-more/

[smokeywolf]

The object is to give it your best effort not to:



patronize a business that publicly objects to customers who don't wish to be "sitting ducks" in a "gun free zone"
purchase products produced in China.


We bought a new rice cooker the other day. The two most popular brands bought by Japanese consumers (my wife) are Tiger and Zojirushi. Mrs. smokeywolf did her research and found out that the Tiger brand rice cookers are made in China. We bought the Zojirushi; made in Japan.

Much of the time I shave with a straight razor. Was in the market last week for a new razor and was advised that a brand made in China was pretty good. I bought two mid to early 1900s German (Solingen) made razors on the online flea market instead. I will polish and re-hone them.
Currently shopping for a couple of double edge razors. Will probably buy NOS Gillettes (made in U.S.A.).

[Littleton Shot Maker]

OH heck- Smokey take a look at Esty- there is guy there making hard core straight razors, hand made gold High Carbon , will last your life time and 3-5 more generations . serious shank I want one bad but $150 ?? I guess if I do the math how many junk ones will that be, it may be a good way to go....


We did same , my Wife and I killed so many ricer cookers, cheap ones, expensive ones etc..Wife being Korean and ME spending time there, Grand Dad was 'there' too I have a soft spot for Korean made anything. we looked to see if any of the cookers where from Korea 1st, then Japan, 3rd Taiwan long ago Hong Kong...no more

[jcwit]

So it benefits the American worker to buy Korean, Japanese, Taiwan, but heaven forbid Chinese.

Guys, look at the back of your computer, telephone "cell or hard line", check out where your dress shirts come from, or your socks, the list is endless. TV's are only a start.

And as I mentioned earlier, ever buy Quaker Oats? Better look up their stand on firearms in general.

Next time you're in any restaurant check out where the eating ware is from.

There's no getting away from it at this time.

And remember why your 401K is making money.

[jcwit]

Never realized rice cookers is a hot selling item. LOL

[smokeywolf]

OH heck- Smokey take a look at Esty- there is guy there making hard core straight razors, hand made gold High Carbon , will last your life time and 3-5 more generations . serious shank I want one bad but $150 ?? I guess if I do the math how many junk ones will that be, it may be a good way to go....


We did same , my Wife and I killed so many ricer cookers, cheap ones, expensive ones etc..Wife being Korean and ME spending time there, Grand Dad was 'there' too I have a soft spot for Korean made anything. we looked to see if any of the cookers where from Korea 1st, then Japan, 3rd Taiwan long ago Hong Kong...no more

Alan, one of the straight razors I use, originally belonged to my great, great, grandfather and was manufactured in Sheffield England between 1836 and 1843. To the best of my knowledge, through 5 generations, my father is the only one that did not use this razor.

[smokeywolf]

So it benefits the American worker to buy Korean, Japanese, Taiwan, but heaven forbid Chinese.

Guys, look at the back of your computer, telephone "cell or hard line", check out where your dress shirts come from, or your socks, the list is endless. TV's are only a start.

And as I mentioned earlier, ever buy Quaker Oats? Better look up their stand on firearms in general.

Next time you're in any restaurant check out where the eating ware is from.

There's no getting away from it at this time.

And remember why your 401K is making money.

jcwit, we all know it is neither practical nor possible to eliminate China made products from our lives. The point is to minimize the purchase of "Made in China" products wherever practical and possible.

Why are you so critical of those who choose not to be ardently supportive of the Chinese government?

[jcwit]

jcwit, we all know it is neither practical nor possible to eliminate China made products from our lives. The point is to minimize the purchase of "Made in China" products wherever practical and possible.

Why are you so critical of those who choose not to be ardently supportive of the Chinese government?

Nowhere did I say I was supportive of the Chinese or their government, or for their products. You sure have a way of spinning things.

Nor am I critical of those who chose to buy US made products. What I am is a realist.

I too try to buy U.S. products, but in fact now at my age I really buy very little. I do buy double edge razor blades made in Russia, made by the Palmolive Co.

Kindly read my posts and not try to read other meanings into them!

[starmac]

So it benefits the American worker to buy Korean, Japanese, Taiwan, but heaven forbid Chinese.

Guys, look at the back of your computer, telephone "cell or hard line", check out where your dress shirts come from, or your socks, the list is endless. TV's are only a start.

And as I mentioned earlier, ever buy Quaker Oats? Better look up their stand on firearms in general.

Next time you're in any restaurant check out where the eating ware is from.

There's no getting away from it at this time.

And remember why your 401K is making money.

Well what benifits me is quality. Japan generally has better quality than china which as far as consumer goods is throw away at best.
I personally would also (if American is unattainable) would rather buy from Japan, they are at least an ally of ours.
Restaurant silverware is by nature a throw away item, to start with.
There are many things and as many countries to choose from that offer and always has quality. Some countries have all my life been known for their knife steel, some for their quality optics, what is it that China has offered that is quality above other countries. I am not saying that China does not have the capability of matching quality of the US or other countries, but the bulk of consumer grade items from China varies from throw away and replace next year to take out of the package and throw away as soon as you try to use it.

There are more reasons than quality too, just as I try to deal with companies that at least outwardly has some of the same values as I do, why I have to ask what is so admirable about China that you choose to invest in that country, over any other.

[jcwit]

why I have to ask what is so admirable about China that you choose to invest in that country, over any other.

When did that happen?

Just more spin, or ignorance as to what I invest in.

Here is some more reality.

http://www.gorillawire.com/?p=6078

[starmac]

Well I invest in China when I have too, pretty hard to belive as much as you take up for them that you don't.

[smokeywolf]

jcwit, in many, if not most cases, I am in agreement with your opinions. It seems from what I got from your post #64, that I misconstrued your feelings about those who try to avoid the "Made in China" label.

I stand corrected and it seems once again, we agree.

[jcwit]

Well I invest in China when I have too, pretty hard to belive as much as you take up for them that you don't.

starmac, I'm 72, going to 73 Lord willing, I buy very little, don't need much, have most everything. Being a realist, I look at what I need and the time I have left to use the "whatever".

I'll use a hammer as an example, again I'm 72, never was much for construction, left the labor for others. Now say I need to drive say 20 nails, should I buy a 20/30 dollar hammer? Should I buy a 2 dollar hammer at Menards or Harbor Freight? Or should I stumble all over the flea market searching for something I may never find and spend most of the following day laid up with joints so sore I stay in bed all day?

What you want to bet I'm going to op for the one at Menards.

I have purchased an Anschutz match target air rifle within the last 2 months. I've also purchased a RWS "German" Md 48 air rifle within the last 2 months. A Beeman P3 German made air pistol, a Webley English air pistol, no it wasn't the one made in Turkey, and a Hatsan made in Turkey air rifle. All in the last few months, none made in China. Many tins of pellets made in the USA, England, & Germany, and a few made in China. So far the most accurate are the German pellets then the USA pellets.

The rest of our purchases are from here and there. Oh Ya, I purchased 2 dress hats from China, both likely will outlast me and cost less that $6.00 shipped to my front door. Course I could have gone to JC Penney's and paid $20.00 for their brand made in china.

Understand where I'm coming from? My time here is growing short!

[jcwit]

jcwit, in many, if not most cases, I am in agreement with your opinions. It seems from what I got from your post #64, that I misconstrued your feelings about those who try to avoid the "Made in China" label.

I stand corrected and it seems once again, we agree.

Thanks for understanding.

[Littleton Shot Maker]

ever tried to find a rice cooker made in the US??? I tried trust me I tried .
SO I can't help the US GDP then who else ?

Well Isreal don't make Rice Cookers. I looked-
Next the UK same thing,
OK let's see, do we have ANY friends I'd support their GDP or Self Defense funds???
Yes- Japan, Korea!!
Or back their form of life style? Do they want to take us down or crush our economy??? DO THEY Support other coutries that want to send rockets into the Holy land and US too when they can???....
No

and they are suppose to be on OUR side, no matter how you slice it China is not on OUR side sooo HELL yeah I will spend my money On A Korean made or Japanese rice cooker and when given choice and as many other items as I am force to purchase to line in the 21st Cen. I don;t have a TV any more- been 2 months- love it

Needed some new Pot/ pan set. THE new set it from Italy, the coffee machine too, the toaster was german, my coffee form Colombia Santader area.. yeah uummm,, electric blender German, Car I drive today German built in Mexico with a **** load of China made stuff sure.
but if I can;t get US made I try very hard to support a Country I want to do well. AND DON"T hate us totally yet.
I don't get much French stuff not sure they make anything there?? That makes it here any way.
SO if you feel as if you don't have any other option that's fine, but I do feel there is a way to make a choice, I just have to look at the box or label and see where it comes from and decide with those above factors- ONE day I'll get a tv don;t worry bout me.

Quaker what?? No clue... they don;t like guns?? what else do they own I won't buy the as well ..... don't Buy Tyson Chicken and asked Chicfila if they used Tyson , the said no...? who knows

401k ?? no idea what that is. I work for my self and have nothing saved - it all goes to bills and feed kids...I guess it's never to late, let me see if I have any extra to stash...
AND I don;t expect to see any of my SS ever.....

You do see why and how I choose those listed counties above, YOU ALWAYS have a choice. it's up to you to find your own path SIR.
I have forged mine and will strive to do better when I can and expect to be called out if I step out of line too . BUT those are my standards on who/ where I will buy goods from.

[Littleton Shot Maker]

YOU BUY ***** from RUSSIA- WHAT??? DO YOU SEE THE UKRAIN ?? wow ... I talk some to Finns they still worry about Russia, now they drop bombs on our US back rebels and you buy stuff from them DUDE really?? YOU said that out loud here??? I won't sell to or ship to that place any more!!! there you go...choices

[jcwit]

YOU BUY ***** from RUSSIA- WHAT??? DO YOU SEE THE UKRAIN ?? wow ... I talk some to Finns they still worry about Russia, now they drop bombs on our US back rebels and you buy stuff from them DUDE really?? YOU said that out loud here??? I won't sell to or ship to that place any more!!! there you go...choices

LOL, That I do, made in Russia by a US company.

How many here use primers made there.

Why are we supporting anyone there?

[starmac]

So far to the best of my knowledge, I have never used any Russian primers or ammo, but who knows where all winchester,remington,federal or cci is made. How much money can a guy actually save buying rissian primers.
I have used lots of different powder, possibly some might be made in Russia, and or china.

[jcwit]

So far to the best of my knowledge, I have never used any Russian primers or ammo, but who knows where all winchester,remington,federal or cci is made. How much money can a guy actually save buying rissian primers.
I have used lots of different powder, possibly some might be made in Russia, and or china.

How much can be saved? Don't know as I have never purchased any nor have I compared the prices as the primers I'm using I purchased years ago for less than $40 a sleeve of 5,000, that's less than $8 a thousand. Not going to jump up and do an inventory, but I believe I still have 10 to 15 sleeves.

Your millage likely will vary.

[alamogunr]

The reality is that most Chinese made products are branded by US companies and produced to their standards. Who do you blame??

(Don't misread this. The pronoun "their" refers to "US companies")

[jcwit]

The reality is that most Chinese made products are branded by US companies and produced to their standards. Who do you blame??

(Don't misread this. The pronoun "their" refers to "US companies")

Precisely, and this is why I made reference to 401K's.

[starmac]

Who do I blame, the American public or whatever you want to call the end user. We gave them permission, actually told them to have everything made in a foreign country years ago, in the name of saving a few pennies. We saved a few cents, but paid dollars to do it.
I really do not know why any company continues to make anything here.