Need to Know About 45 Win Mag.

[Hickory]

Picked up a 10" T/C Contender barrel yesterday in 45 Winchester magnum with 100 pieces of new starline brass.
Need to know several things to get me started down the right road.
1) Does this cartridge head space on the mouth like a 45 acp?
2) What would be a good boolit/powder combination to get started?
3) Will the pressures/velocities be such as to require a gas check?

[pietro]

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The Winchester .45 Magnum cartridge is externally a lengthened .45 ACP (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.45_ACP), with a thicker web to withstand higher operating pressures - so, being rimless, would headspace on the case mouth.

The pressure/velocity, and the need for a gas check, would depend upon what your handloads develop - factory ammo SAAMI pressure is 40,000 cup, as compared to the .45ACP's SAAMI pressure of 18,000 cup.

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[taco650]

My old reloading manuals list loads that look almost identical to the 44mag. That's the ball park the 45 Win Mag operates in.

[DougGuy]

It does headspace off the case mouth, it needs a taper crimp NOT a roll crimp, it doesn't have to have the COA carefully adhered to for feeding from a magazine for a TC but ammo assembled for it does have to pass the "plunk" test just like any other caliber that headspaces off the case mouth.

It is also likely to be too tight in the throat to use the Lee 300gr RF boolit @ .452" without throating the barrel. I have already been sent one of these barrels by a member who wanted to seat the Lee C452-300-RF to his chosen COA so it would work. You may be able to seat however long you want to by sizing to .451" (or .4515" if it will plunk) which should work fine in that barrel.

This boolit works well for me using the gas check.

Edit: Run the new brass through a sizer before you load it, you won't have much neck tension if you skip this step.

[Clay M]

I had a LAR Grizzly 1911 style pistol chambered for the round..
It is an interesting round that really never caught on.

I usually got around 1200fps with the 250 gr bullets from a 6.5" barrel.
I don't think you will need a gas check.

Looking back at my old loading records I used Blue Dot ,IMR 4227,Unique,and 296

It is another gun I probably should have kept,..but there was something else I wanted more..

[Hickory]

Thanks guys, this will be an interesting round for me to play with.

[Clay M]

The nice thing is ,you can use your .45ACP dies to load it.

[Bongo Boy]

I've been loading quite a bit f 4227 in it, and more recently have been getting good results with 300MP, which has been available in quantity for a few months now (Midsouth).

My recent chrono results:

http://i182.photobucket.com/albums/x150/Bongo_Boy/LAR%20Grizzly%20Win%20Mag/45%20Win%20Mag%2001_zpsmz23nxut.jpg (http://s182.photobucket.com/user/Bongo_Boy/media/LAR%20Grizzly%20Win%20Mag/45%20Win%20Mag%2001_zpsmz23nxut.jpg.html)

For loads that are not published, I just take 44 Mag published loads and start there, as they leave quite a margin of safety even starting out at the high end, IMO.

I LOVE this round...it provides a substantial performance improvement over anything else I have, leaves 10mm Auto in the dust without destroying the brass, and of course, it's an auto pistol round and I like auto pistols. The list goes on, but the fact you can actually buy the brass and it's not horrendously expensive like a lot of other big boy brass is (compare to 50 AE for example), and 4227 and 300MP both give you a nice case fill so you don't feel you're wasting space. I like that. Bullet choices abound, cast or otherwise. It's a fantastic cartridge.

[Plastikosmd]

I like it also, shoot it out of a revolver

[taco650]

I like it also, shoot it out of a revolver

Which one???

[Plastikosmd]

FA model 83

[cainttype]

Headspaces on the mouth...good powders for 44 Mag will be fine. Since you're using it in a single shot, light loads using data similar to 45 Colt will also be good.
On the gas-check... If you like using them with high-intensity 44 Mags, you will probably like them with the 45 WM when pushing it.

I shoot it through a couple Grizzly autos, and love it.
I always thought Ruger should have chambered it in the Mini-14 with a regular magazine instead of the 44 Mag that proved less than the market success they had hoped. I'd own one, or more, of those today if they had.

Now if anyone made a light, handy, semi-auto carbine chambered in the 45 WM, with an action sized accordingly... cast friendly, with good accuracy...WOW!...Dream come true.

[RP3543]

It does headspace off the case mouth, it needs a taper crimp NOT a roll crimp, it doesn't have to have the COA carefully adhered to for feeding from a magazine for a TC but ammo assembled for it does have to pass the "plunk" test just like any other caliber that headspaces off the case mouth.

It is also likely to be too tight in the throat to use the Lee 300gr RF boolit @ .452" without throating the barrel. I have already been sent one of these barrels by a member who wanted to seat the Lee C452-300-RF to his chosen COA so it would work. You may be able to seat however long you want to by sizing to .451" (or .4515" if it will plunk) which should work fine in that barrel.

This boolit works well for me using the gas check.

Edit: Run the new brass through a sizer before you load it, you won't have much neck tension if you skip this step.

I had DougGuy re-throat my 10" 45 Win. Mag Contender barrel this past spring. Couldn't be happier with the outcome! The Lee C452-300-RF now shoots from this barrel like it was designed for it. Shoots just over an inch at 50 yards with both W296 and AA-9, 1260-1310 FPS. I use a gas check and seat to the first crimp groove. Should be a great Deer gun.

If you want to try this bullet in your Contender, have DougGuy work on your barrel.

[Bongo Boy]

Yes, on paper at least, 296 looks like a great powder for this round--but man, I've been patiently waiting for W296 to come available and it never seems to. but I'm curious, was the procedure on your Contender just to lengthen the leade a bit..any other reason to modify?

[taco650]

Yes, on paper at least, 296 looks like a great powder for this round--but man, I've been patiently waiting for W296 to come available and it never seems to. but I'm curious, was the procedure on your Contender just to lengthen the leade a bit..any other reason to modify?

H-110 is the same powder by all reports and load data for both is usually identical.

[RP3543]

Yes, on paper at least, 296 looks like a great powder for this round--but man, I've been patiently waiting for W296 to come available and it never seems to. but I'm curious, was the procedure on your Contender just to lengthen the leade a bit..any other reason to modify?

BB,
I wanted to use the Lee C452-300-RF and the throat was too shallow. According to SAAMI specs, the leade in the 45 Win. Mag is the same as the 45 ACP. The standard .45 caliber 230 gr RN profile fit just fine in the barrel as it was. DougGuy lengthened the existing leade and (I think) changed the taper angle slightly.
Now it shoots everything well.
Also, like taco650 said, H-110 is an adequate substitute for W-296.
Other usable powders are H-4227, HP-38, AA-5, AA-7, AA-9, VV-N110...pretty versatile cartridge, very forgiving on seating depth.

[AllanD]

Headspaces on the mouth...good powders for 44 Mag will be fine. Since you're using it in a single shot, light loads using data similar to 45 Colt will also be good.
On the gas-check... If you like using them with high-intensity 44 Mags, you will probably like them with the 45 WM when pushing it.

I shoot it through a couple Grizzly autos, and love it.
I always thought Ruger should have chambered it in the Mini-14 with a regular magazine instead of the 44 Mag that proved less than the market success they had hoped. I'd own one, or more, of those today if they had.

Now if anyone made a light, handy, semi-auto carbine chambered in the 45 WM, with an action sized accordingly... cast friendly, with good accuracy...WOW!...Dream come true.


A gun dealer local to me is selling an M1 carbine chambered in 45WinMag... though he wants $850 for it...

I was thinking it would make for a neat truck gun if someone bought it planning on swapping it into
an M1A1 folding stock...

SOB would likely kick like an 1895 Marlin...