Got an alloy dilema...Help!

[Preacher]

Well, I fired up the pot and ran a test run of about 10 lbs of the "lead" ingots (supposed to be lead ww's) I got the other day. A question was raised as to whether there may be zinc ww's melted in with them. I had no idea but bought about 100 lbs in 5 lb ingots. I used a Lyman 452424 LSWC mould that normally casts out at about 250 gr. with my previous stash of ww's. With this suspect alloy the bullets coming out of the mold cast just fine. Filled out and sharp edges. A little bit shinier then normal but as I was casting things looked good. Then I weighed the finish product...they're averaging a bit over 235 grs! Bummer. Can I assume that this is zinc infested lead and that zinc being harder etc. weighs less then true ww's. thus the difference? And can anyone give me an idea as to just what I may have and is it okay to use the bullets? Had a bad feeling when I bought them and think I've just reinforced that feeling. Can I alter the mix with real ww's or pure lead to bring it up to a proper weight and hardness? Any help you folk can give me on this would be much appreciated.

Preacher

[runfiverun]

if you had zinc you would know it from what it sounds like
you have some other mix 5/5 or lino a 15 gr lighter boolit would indicate
lino to me, drop a boolit on the cement floor a new one and a old one
one will prob tink, and the old one will go tud

[montana_charlie]

What factor caused the suspicion that the alloy may contain zink?

From what I remember reading, zink causes alloy to cast poorly...or makes bullets that fracture easily...or (perhaps) other problems that I have yet to imagine. Your bullets are 'kinda pretty much OK sounding'...only being lighter than you expected.
Are you able to test them for hardness?

It would be a real shame if (instead of zink) your alloy is heavily contaminated with that devil metal...TIN! If that's the case, you may be looking for volunteers to take it off your hands at the least possible expense to you.
CM

[mstarling]

+1

I think I'd take some and dilute it with lead and see what happens.

[Ricochet]

Could be babbitt. In any case, I think you've got good stuff.

[Preacher]

Appreciate all your quick replies. I was thinking zinc because when I mentioned that I didn't have direct contact with the fellow who made the ingots the idea was brought up that he might have melted zinc ww's along with lead ww's. I have no idea. However I did notice that the bars did tend to have a "ting" to them which sounded different then my other ingots. I just put one of the bullets on an anvil and hit it hard with a hammer to see what it would do. The bullet shattered into about 3-4 pcs. Looking at a cross section the metal looks good. ie no impurities. Maybe tin? That would be a good thing...but would tin cause a bullet to break? Again, thanks.

Preacher

[454PB]

More likely linotype. If you take a sledge to a pure linotype boolit, it reacts just as you describe. In addition, a mould that casts 255 gr. in WW alloy will cast about 15 to 20 grains lighter in linotype and have that very pretty, shiney appearance.

[Preacher]

Thanks again. As you can see I'm definitely on the learning curve here when it comes to casting and alloys. I may have gotten lucky after all with this stuff. Who knows? I'm going to try to track down the smelter and see what he was using to make the ingots. I guess the next thing to do is run another 10 lbs. using a 50/50 mix of range lead or lead and an ingot of this stuff. I'd like to get it back up to 250/255 grs./ bullet as that's the weight in my Ruger and Colt 45 Colts that I've standardized on. You folk have been a great help to this neophyte boolit caster. Can't tell you how much I appreciate your knowledge as well as your help.

Preacher

[HeavyMetal]

I agree with the other, it sound like you got a buy!

Zinc will leave boolits wrinkled and not filled out well!

This is another reason to have a hardness tester! With a tester that measures brinnell hardness you would be able to determine a bhn number and that would help you determine your next move.

If you have Lyman number 2 cast it up, if you have lino you can use it for rifle boolits or blend it with WW for a batch of #2, if you have any of the other type metals you should blend it because they'll contain to much antimony.

With out some way to determine a BHN your guessing! You can make great boolits but your still guessing. The sad part is when this batch of alloy is gone so is the oppertunity of making more of a better alloy.

[leftiye]

Bottom line is- it casts well! That probly don't happen when zinc is present. Get a hardness test on them boolits. Lino is about 22BHN (or sometimes a little better). Get a thermometer, Lino melts at a bit over 450 degrees. Add some pure lead about 3 to 1 to that lino (if you decide it's lino) and you have a very good all around alloy. Don't waste it if it seems to be Lino, that stuff's getting rare, and expensive (relatively). If the boolits are hard and well formed, and you want to shoot them, then shoot them. How they shoot is what really matters.

[44man]

You would know with the first boolit if you had any zinc. Boolits will not fill out and they look galvanized. It is terrible stuff and leaves no doubt when it is present.

[Bret4207]

You may well be better off saving this stuff as "enrichment alloy". 10-50% added to otherwise poor WW alloy will take care of a lot of fill out problems. Be happy, most of us would love to have this problem!

[Preacher]

Again I appreciate all your input folks. Looking at my old Lyman Casting book and with your information I'm just about convinced that it's linotype; at least the two ingots I cast. The others look the same so I think I lucked out. I'll be using Bret4207's advice and using it to sweeten my lead and ww's and see what happens. It sure does make nice sharp, shiny bullets though. Just out of curiosity I'm going to size and lube about a dozen and try them in my Rossi 92 45 Colt to see what happens. I am beginning to be happy.

Preacher

[lilguy1]

Where does one find clean alloy? I see on Ebay ingots sold in 50 lb lots. Is this a reliable source?
I had a unending supply of WW's at the dealer group before retirement but that connection is over. Thanks

[Junior1942]

Where does one find clean alloy?You smelt it yourself and use a thermometer.

PS to Preacher: you could trade that lino alloy 1:2 for wheelweight ingots.

[pjh421]

lilguy1,

Its amazing what a few 12 packs of soda, beer, cookies, doughnuts, etc. will do when scrounging WW. See if you can develop a friend here or there at a tire store who will let you keep a couple of buckets with your name & phone number on them for the crew to put used weights in. When they call you to come and pick up your weights, don't forget the loot.

Paul