Firing An Antique For The First Time

[JWT]

I have an 1884 Springfield Trapdoor that I am going to start shooting. I have owned the gun for 20 years without firing it. It was purchased at auction from a large collection (1500+ guns) so I assume the previous owner never shot it. Given that this gun has not been fired for half a century, what should I be doing to make sure that the gun is safe to fire and that I am safe for that first trigger pull?

148844

I have checked the following:

No cracks in the stock that could fail
No visible cracks in the reciever
Thouroughly cleaned the bore
Dry fires on a snap cap leaving a firing pin mark


My plan so far:


Load will be the minimum from the Lyman reloading book of 26.0gr of 5744 under the Lee 405gr hollow base
Gun will be placed on sandbags
I am planning on the stock being pulled into my shoulder but no direct contact with the gun otherwise
I am thinking of using a string to pull the trigger
I will have hearing and eye protection of course


What am I planning that is unnecessary? What am I missing? What should I be looking for at the hinge and latch?
:Fire:

[Der Gebirgsjager]

Sounds to me like your pre-firing checks and inspection has been pretty thorough, and you're "good to go". Like you said, load to the minimum, as the trapdoor isn't a particularly strong action. Nice rifle!

[Battis]

I load only FFG black powder in my 50-70 Trapdoor. I've never tried smokeless powder. I'm guessing your 45-70 is in better shape than my 50-70, and mine was fine to shoot. The slight play in the hinge was part of the design (according to an old manual I have).

[Larry Gibson]

I wouldn't worry about shooting that M1884 using the technique described. The string will not be needed.

I suggest dropping the 5744 charge to 25 gr and adding a 3/4 - 1 gr Dacron filler. For use in my TDs I size my Lee 405HB M1873 bullets at .4615 and lube with a soft beeswax/olive oil lube or I shoot them as cast (.463 - .464 cast of 16:1 alloy). Doing so may result in accuracy as posted in the picture. That target was shot at 100 yards using a M1879 (Type III) rear sight and your M1884 rear sight should prove a bit better. The group is 1.45" CTC. Velocity of this load should run 1250 - 1300 fps out of your rifle and equals the original M1873 45-70 cartridge ballistics. If you have the instructions for using the M1873 45-70 ammunition with the M1884 rears sight this load should work quite well.

Larry Gibson

148871

[labradigger1]

Great advise listed above. Consider 2f bp as the pressure will be lower. Safety glasses a must!
Oh yea, it will prolly shoot about 5 feet high at 100 yds (I'm not kidding).
Trapdoors are a hoot to shoot, just don't overload them, as mentioned earlier, they don't have a strong action but they do have a perfectly adequate action for what they were designed for.

[rancher1913]

I've been using 4198 at 24 grains with a 500 grain lead boolit and it works great, not a lot of kick but plenty to send the boolit down range. I consulted several of the trapdoor gurus on here about using filler and was advised against it, even though there was a lot of empty space in the cartridge, and it worked fine.

[John Allen]

Use blackpowder. the other thing I would do is order a new latch spring from Wolf springs. they are know to be notoriously week from age and a really very cheap from wolf. The other thing to check is make sure there are no cracks in the wrist area and the where the side action bolt goes through. Also check out the lee mold for these they were great with an oversize bore.

[MtGun44]

Strong recommendation for Lee 405 HB, designed specifically for this rifle.
I have two, one does fine with normal cast, the other threw them all sideways.
Putting the 405 Lee in it with 12 gr of Unique instantly got me 4" groups at
100 yds, when it had been hard to keep on a washtub and hitting literally
sideways.

Bill

[JWT]

I have settled on 25gr of 5744 with 3/4gr of filler (thanks Larry). In the second picture I marked on the case the fill depth of the powder and the seating depth of the boolit. 3/4gr of the polyester (Dacron) filler fills the remainder of the case. Unfortunately the largest sizer I have is .459, so I'm not expecting stellar performance. The goal for this session is to prove to myself that the gun is safe.

149428149429

I'm hoping to take the gun out Friday. :Fire:

[Ballistics in Scotland]

The Trapdoor Springfield isn't a very strong action, but I haven't heard of individual specimens being much worse, due to manufacturing or material deficiencies. Hinge play doesn't matter, as it isn't the hinge that takes the strain. On the other hand one of the most useful pressure indications, permanent expansion of the case-head, just isn't there any more. All it can show you is the difference between a lot too much for the Springfield, and a very great lot too much.

This rifle may not have been shot recently but it has probably done a lot of shooting in its time. The main risk is that someone might have overstrained it with smokeless loads meant for stronger rifles, or composed by the light of nature. Otherwise it should be fine for black powder or equivalent loads, but I would remove the wood, clean the receiver as thoroughly as I could, and soak it in gasoline. Wipe it dry, and if there is a crack more will weep out. A counsel of perfection would be magnaflux testing, if you have someone locally who can do it. But it is hardly superior enough to the gasoline test, to be worth travelling or sending it.

All that leaves is whether that 5744 load really is black powder equivalent. It sounds like it is, but with luck actual users will come in with comparisons on the remaining pressure indicators, i.e. primer deformation, ease of extraction and velocity. Velocity alone tells you very little about the maximum pressure or the speed of buildup to it.


Testing with a piece of string and your intended service load, or one just a shade higher, is a good idea. Amateur testing with a much higher "proof load" isn't though. A rifle can apparently stand a gross overload once, and yet suffer unseen impairment which will show result in failure later.

[StrawHat]

JWT,

An 1884 will have been built with the best materials of the day and not from older musket parts. While not as strong as the Ruger #1, it is more than enough to handle common sense loads. Here is an older thread about the Trapdoor.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?61694-Trapdoor-Strength&highlight=trapdoor+strength

Kevin

[leadman]

Did you remove the action from the stock when you did the inspection? I recall a recent posting somewhere where the owner of an old gun found a hole drilled in the barrel or receiver in a place not visible when it was in the stock. Would not make for a good day!

I have a Leadsled so use it to hold the gun while I am behind it when pulling the trigger with my outstretched arm.

[MtGun44]

Yes, pull that action and look for drilled holes. The older brother of a friend of my
father went off to war and was killed. A few years later they took the old trapdoor out
and fortunately fired a .410 shotsell in it (they work fine). Blew out the stock - apparently
the dead brother had planned on making a lamp and had drilled a hole for the cord in
the bottom of the barrel.....

Slip the buttstock into a dismounted tire, resting the forend across on the tire.
Pull the trigger with a lanyard. Rubber will not mar the gun, had one new old
gun do a nasty trick, the fault was not easily discovered by a visual inspection.