Designing a custom Dillon powder funnel- 9mm

[mjwcaster]

My 9mm dillon powder funnel does not expand enough for my cast loads, the seated boolits are sized down (I don't have the measurements in front of me, did the testing months ago).

I contacted Lathesmith and he said he was up to making a custom powder funnel/expander, but he needed drawings or the original to work off of.
I would need to make sure he is still willing.

My problem is I do not know what to even ask for?

How much larger should the expander diameter be?

How long should the expander be?
I think the stock dillon expander could use to be a little longer, but it would depend on the loaded length of the boolit in the case.

Are there other improvements that should be incorporated?

My goals are-

sufficient case tension (most important and an issue when using mixed brass, how much does spring back differ between different cases?

no resizing of .357 range scrap boolits

Any body have any ideas or better yet drawings of the perfect 9mm expander?

Everytime I research this, there are plenty of people with issues, some have made/sourced a custom expander, some bought from Mr Bulletfeeder and others from G&S.
But there is no dimensions available that I have found.

I would love to be able to have drawings for this so that others could benefit from it and source the part from Lathesmith if he is up to it or even other members.

Thanks for any help.

Matt

[retread]

Matt, I machine my own Dillon Powder Funnels. I size my 9mm to .358 so I made the funnel to that dimension (just the straight portion. the flare angle and every other dimension stays the same as the original Dillon funnel). There is enough spring back in the brass to give adequate neck tension. If you size to 356 or 357 specify that size for the straight portion of the funnel. Hope this helps.

Jay

[mjwcaster]

Thanks Jay, that sounds simple enough.

The case tension issue bothers me since I actually had my 550 for years but could never get 9mm loaded right.
After getting on here and learning a lot more I got it out of storage, cleaned it up and tried again.
With my newfound knowledge I deduced that the dillon resizing die didn't resize enough.
New Lee die and now the bullets were tensioned fine.
The strange issue was that before with the oversized dillon die some cases had decent tension and others didn't even if I used the same lot of once fired cases fro the same gun.

I never suspected the dies, since I bought it used and had loaded 9mm on it before.
Actually I just pulled the handle and didn't know what I was doing at the time, looking back I'm guessing that neither did the previous owner and the issue existed then, just never caused any trouble (luckily enough).

That issue drove me nuts, now I just feel like a fool about it, but as least I have learned a thing or two.

[wv109323]

PM sent

[wv109323]

I'll explain my situation. I bought a CZ-75 pistol and could not get my cast Boolits to work. Jacketed bullets at .355 were OK.
My bore slugged at .3555. There was almost no lede (freebore) in the chamber. Bullets at .356 hit the rifling. Anything larger started shaving lead off the bullet and the lead accumulated in the front of the chamber. After a few rounds the accumulation would not allow the slide to go into full battery(round to headspace on the case mouth).
The existing Dillon powder funnel/neck expander was not large enough to keep the boolits from being sized down when seated. My existing Dillon powder funnel is .354 IIRC,
I have not had Lathesmith to make my powder funnel yet. A powder funnel and having the chamber reamed should dolve my problem.

[DeputyDog25]

If you have one of these made, I would like to know who made it for you as I would like to purchase one also.

[mjwcaster]

I will DeputyDog.

It may still be a few weeks before I get around to this.

Matt

[mjwcaster]

If anyone else wants one, maybe we can put together a group buy type thing or at least a list so the maker can just do a run of these.

There seems to be a unfilled demand for this product.

[CGT80]

Has anyone checked out the powder funnel in 9mm from RAK Systems (Mr. Bulletfeeder)? My feeder setups came with a 9 and 40 S&W funnel that will expand the brass more to allow the bullets to seat easier. The 40 version seemed to work well with my PC'd boolits. I don't know the size of the funnel off hand, though.

[DocSavage]

I have my 650 set upwith Dillon 9 mm dies and powder and load for 5 different 9 mm pistol and only 1 is a problem a Sig 225. If you think that the Dillon dies are a problem call them about it if you haven't already.
I had a carbide die that was faulty and they replaced it no questions asked. The die set is the newer die set with the removable crimp and seater die.

[mjwcaster]

I haven't called Dillon, because this has been a documented issue with Dillon 9mm powder funnel and cast bullets for years.
A quick search will yield plenty of results.

Others have called Dillon, who refuses to acknowledge a problem.

They keep saying that there powder funnels works with everything.

And maybe if you barrel is on the small size, and your alloy hard enough it does.
Or maybe it is one of the reasons that so many people have issues with leading in the 9mm.

But as has been said here before, fit is king.
And when you have a case that is not expanded enough and is resizes a cast boolit down smaller than what is needed for your bore, you get leading.

Mine resizes down to ~.355 with my current range scrap alloy and depends on the case itself, some don't have as much springback as others, so it seems to vary a little bit,and I don't have my notes in front of me at the moment.

There really is no 'problem' with the Dillon powder funnel, it is just that some of us want to be able to load a cast boolit of larger diameter than jacketed, and have it stay the same diameter, not get resized by the brass.

Which requires a larger expander plug.

So there is nothing for Dillon to fix, but it would be nice if they acknowledged the issue and offer a custom solution.

[mjwcaster]

DocSavage,
A few questions, just looking for other data points.

What size are your cast boolits?

Have you ever pulled your cast boolits and remeasure them (with micrometers) after seating?

If so did they get resized at all?

What size is the expander on your funnel?

And what is your alloy?

There are production tolerances in everything, your expander may run a little on the large side, your alloy may be harder than mine and less prone to brass resizing it, your guns may be just fine with a smaller boolit.

IIRC, mine resized to ~.355, probably more like .3545-.3555, it varied. Too small to even bother trying.

Maybe your sig could benefit from a larger boolit, which may necessitate a larger expander.

[joatmon]

Can you not just send someone your old funnel for the pattern with instructions to increase the expanding portion (x) amount? Although I might be looking at it sideways.

Aaron

[mjwcaster]

Aaron, that is pretty much what I am planning on doing, although I wondered if the expander length should be adjusted along with the diameter.
I guess that would really be dependant on boolit style and seating depth.

I was just looking to see if any other improvements should be incorporated, and for any more input on exact size, especially with regards to brass spring back with misc brass.

I have gotten other input via PM, and I think I know what I am going to do, maybe.
This go around I will probably be shooting for .357 boolits with a .3565-.357 expander.
While I do not want to size the boolits down, I also want to maintain neck tension, especially if a slightly undersize boolit slips through the mix.

[garandsrus]

I have made several custom expanders for Dillon presses and they work great. They allow me to flare rifle cases that Dillon doesn't provide expanders for, in the powder drop station. Examples: .30 Carbine, 7 TCU, 25-06, 30-06, 32 Special, etc. The length is between the pistol expanders and the rifle powder funnels, to correspond with the case length.

[DocSavage]

I size my boolits to .356 and use MBC'S alloy that's equal to Lyman no 2 alloy. The 225 chamber seems a bit short as I have to seat my boolits to minimum oal. My other 9 mm pistols will feed boolits seated so they just fit in the magazines.

[mjwcaster]

Thanks DocSavage.