how hot of load for 200 yards?

[LAKEMASTER]

if you were to go after elk or deer, maybe even hog, what FPS would you shoot for if your using a ranchdog 165 gr bullet ? (30-06)

i know the drop on the ranch dogs make things a titch different but im just looking at examples.

200 yards is probably on the extreme end. i have a feeling the gun will be used for killing the bullet trap more then elk.

we may get hog tags soon in my area, if so, all of that will be close range .

[dh2]

I am getting about 2200 fps with cast out of my 7mm Mauser I see no reason why the 30-06 would not get that with no trouble or leading the barrel if the boolit is sized right for the barrel with a 165 Gr. boolit

[LAKEMASTER]

what kind of lube are you using ? or a different method of coating

[white eagle]

unfortunately there are no pat answers to your question.
Your rifle will tell you what it likes after alot of time at the press and casting bench.
If your in a hurry you may want to go with a jacketed bullet.

[LAKEMASTER]

My jacketed ammo shoots 2100. My friends ammo shoots at 1600.and he manages to make a penny hole at 100 yards when we hit the desert

[Vann]

I think would would need to keep the velocity up to at least 1200 fps at 200 yards. If your bullet is leaving the barrel at say around 2200 fps I think you should still have enough penteration to shoot through a deer or hog. I'm not sure about the elk. They're pretty big.

[Digital Dan]

As suggested by White Eagle, there are no pat answers. The biggest issue for killing game is placement. It trumps all. Terminal performance may well be next on the platter, some will argue that I suppose. Couple of pics will illustrate my point:

A CCI CB short bullet after recovery;

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/Guns/DSCN0520_zps7db471ca.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/Guns/DSCN0520_zps7db471ca.jpg.html)

From this;

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/pig%20pen/DSCN2968_zpse097a38d.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/pig%20pen/DSCN2968_zpse097a38d.jpg.html)

After dismembering this

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/pig%20pen/DSCN2958_zps7c69f49a.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/pig%20pen/DSCN2958_zps7c69f49a.jpg.html)

Higher velocity and a bigger bullet of pure lead did this. Bambi's mother did not survive.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/Guns/PaperPatchDeer009_zps3a52d58c.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/Guns/PaperPatchDeer009_zps3a52d58c.jpg.html)

The questions I'd put to anyone posing the question in the initial post is this: Do you have the patience to wait for the proper aspect of presentation before jerking the trigger? Is the combination of skill (yours) and precision (the gun and load) adequate to put the bullet where it needs to go, as opposed to where you want it to go? Do you know the anatomy of your quarry?

Answer those questions "yes" and you're good to go. Otherwise and you might just be guessing.

[LAKEMASTER]

As suggested by White Eagle, there are no pat answers. The biggest issue for killing game is placement. It trumps all. Terminal performance may well be next on the platter, some will argue that I suppose. Couple of pics will illustrate my point:

A CCI CB short bullet after recovery;

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/Guns/DSCN0520_zps7db471ca.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/Guns/DSCN0520_zps7db471ca.jpg.html)

From this;

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/pig%20pen/DSCN2968_zpse097a38d.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/pig%20pen/DSCN2968_zpse097a38d.jpg.html)

After dismembering this

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/pig%20pen/DSCN2958_zps7c69f49a.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/pig%20pen/DSCN2958_zps7c69f49a.jpg.html)

Higher velocity and a bigger bullet of pure lead did this. Bambi's mother did not survive.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/Guns/PaperPatchDeer009_zps3a52d58c.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/Guns/PaperPatchDeer009_zps3a52d58c.jpg.html)

The questions I'd put to anyone posing the question in the initial post is this: Do you have the patience to wait for the proper aspect of presentation before jerking the trigger? Is the combination of skill (yours) and precision (the gun and load) adequate to put the bullet where it needs to go, as opposed to where you want it to go? Do you know the anatomy of your quarry?

Answer those questions "yes" and you're good to go. Otherwise and you might just be guessing.

Judging by my self discipline, and my constant second guessing, I feel I know how to place my marks. I have a lot of experience shooting very small game with archery, so I know the importance of shot placement and anatomy

[JWFilips]

I shoot a Lee 205 grain sized .326" out of my GEW98 8 mm with 20 grains of 2400: I can hit a 12 "bull at 200yd with receiver sights 98% of the time
Don't know the speed but I know it would go thru 2 whitetails if they were standing together. It doesn't take a lot of speed with a heavy boolit to nail a critter at 200 yds Big slugs keep chugging away. They are pretty amazing! Just my 2 Cents

[Digital Dan]

Lakemaster, I was not trying to be flippant or superior. My point is fairly simple. If you know your gun, bullet and skill, the question has an obvious answer. Use what you need so far as velocity goes. Softer lead requires less steam, harder lead demands superior placement at longer ranges with the velocity fades. The splattered bullet in the photo above is one of the .44 paper patch loads retrieved from a deer. Range was about 75-80 yards. As stated in the other thread, it has a MV of 1600 fps and will perform suitably beyond 200 yards if I'm inclined to take the shot. I have another rifle that is a bit heavy for field work but the 300 grain bullet leaves the house at 1100 fps and I'd be perfectly comfortable using it on elk out beyond 200 yards. The only decision I'd have to make is which ear hole to shoot it in.

[LAKEMASTER]

a friend of mine shoots 180 gr out of his bolt gun. he said the same thing. but he hunts moose and practices with his moose loads

[LAKEMASTER]

Lakemaster, I was not trying to be flippant or superior. My point is fairly simple. If you know your gun, bullet and skill, the question has an obvious answer. Use what you need so far as velocity goes. Softer lead requires less steam, harder lead demands superior placement at longer ranges with the velocity fades. The splattered bullet in the photo above is one of the .44 paper patch loads retrieved from a deer. Range was about 75-80 yards. As stated in the other thread, it has a MV of 1600 fps and will perform suitably beyond 200 yards if I'm inclined to take the shot. I have another rifle that is a bit heavy for field work but the 300 grain bullet leaves the house at 1100 fps and I'd be perfectly comfortable using it on elk out beyond 200 yards. The only decision I'd have to make is which ear hole to shoot it in.
i must have come off defensive, didnt mean too!

i was agreeing with you, when i did archery, people were all about speed speed speed,and i was over here in the desert wasteland blowing through coyotes ( hard to bow hunt cause they react to string noise ) with heavy slow arrows at 40 yards cause i knew what my hands arms and equipment could do...

i dont however, know my gun that well.

i use to shoot my bow 60 minutes a daw, over 2k shots a month.

i get too look at the rifle all day, but that dont doo much.............................................. ...

[Digital Dan]

Start learnin' your rifle my friend.

Seems like yesterday I shot an arrow into the air. Straight up. It came straight down. I ran but it got me anyway on the back of my heel. Learnt something from that I did. :bigsmyl2:

[tdoyka]

if you were to go after elk or deer, maybe even hog, what FPS would you shoot for if your using a ranchdog 165 gr bullet ? (30-06)

i know the drop on the ranch dogs make things a titch different but im just looking at examples.

200 yards is probably on the extreme end. i have a feeling the gun will be used for killing the bullet trap more then elk.

we may get hog tags soon in my area, if so, all of that will be close range .

i have mine in 30-40 krag(165gr ranch dog) and it goes roughly 1700-1800fps(25.5gr of h4198). i plan to shoot deer at around 150 yards, actually 50-75yards.

[LAKEMASTER]

I was kinda curious what people did for hunting. 150 yards will probably be my range to... I may make some loads for shooting into a different zip code lol

[quilbilly]

if you were to go after elk or deer, maybe even hog, what FPS would you shoot for if your using a ranchdog 165 gr bullet ? (30-06)

i know the drop on the ranch dogs make things a titch different but im just looking at examples.

200 yards is probably on the extreme end. i have a feeling the gun will be used for killing the bullet trap more then elk.

we may get hog tags soon in my area, if so, all of that will be close range .
I look at the minimum terminal velocity to do the job with proper boolit placement. At 200 yards for deer, about 1150 FPS. For elk, about 1600 fps but that boolit better be in the right place. These numbers are from my terminal ballistic tests looking at penetration with a 30 caliber boolit of the same size fired into soaked, compressed phone books at 40 yards.

[leadman]

At 200 yards on elk I would avoid a shot into the front leg bone. Slip in in when the leg is forward and try to hit the heart, for sure the lungs.
I would want a group size of no more than 6" at 200 yards and smaller would be better. I have shot lots of elk and helped gut many more and even with a lung shot they can go quite a distance. Heart shots normally don't go more than 25 yards at the most if the elk was not alarmed first.
I may try a 30 cal. boolit in October on my cow elk hunt. I will have my 43 Mauser and 40-65 RB along also and switch off.

[pls1911]

If you're a successful archery hunter, you'll have no issues hunting with cast bullets...placement is paramount to success.
As stated in earlier posts, your rifle will tell you what to shoot...accuracy is often better at 1600-1900 fps than higher velocities
and heavy bullets carry momentum very nicely.
Shoot well...shoot once.

[LAKEMASTER]

I was thinking about buying a mold that produces 200+gr bullets just to see how they do on flesh. And our push them slow and use for coyote lol

[OnHoPr]

The average .30 cal a Lee 170 C309-170F – BC .268 - 10 mph crosswinds of a Nov. nice day

Mz vel 1800 @ 100yd vel is 1549 with 906 ftlbs and 2.4” wind drift @ 200 yds 1333 vel with 671 ftlb and 9.8” wind drift

The average .44 cal a Lee 240 C429-240-SWC – BC .124 – 10 mph crosswinds of a Nov. nice day

Mz vel 1800 @ 100yd vel is 1302 fps with 903 ftlbs and 5.4” wind drift @ 200 yds 1018 fps with 553 ftlbs and 22.6” wind drift

The average .45 cal a Lee 340 457-340-F – BC .211 – 10 mph crosswinds of a Nov. nice day

Mz vel 1800 @ 100yd vel is 1487 fps with 1668 ftlbs and 3” wind drift @ 200 yds 1235 fps with 1151 ftlbs and 12.8” wind drift

The average or good .375 cal a lyman 375449 – BC .315 – mph crosswinds of a Nov. nice day

Mz vel 1800 @ 100yds vel is 1585 with 1472 ftlbs and 1.95” wind drift @ 200 yds 1411 vel and 1166 ftlbs with 7.95” wind drift

Darn I couldn’t find a BC for a good or average 35 cal something in the 230 to 250 gr range

Now how about a pretty decent .30 cal the Lyman 311299 – BC .377 – 10 mph crosswinds of a Nov. day

Mz vel 2200 fps @ 100 yds vel is 1991 with 1761 ftlbs and 1.23” wind drift @ 200 yds vel is 1795 and 1430 ftlbs with 5.16” of wind drift.

So, my point is not necessarily the energy of most even though that is part of the equation of harvesting game. Look at the wind drifts, they range for the 100 yds from 1.23” to 5.4” and for the 200 yd range from 5.16” to 22.6”. When boolit placement is a main concern these factors can come into play. Now, if you are sitting on the feed pile 50 yds away or hunt thicker woods some of these ballistics 99% of the time would not come into play. But, if you hunted the hardwood ridges and a 100 yd shots were the most common and 200 yd shots could happen quite often then the ballistics would really come into play, especially with deer on the move during the first few days of season or the first weekend. This was only 10 mph winds for your consideration. Lyman portrays a Point Blank Range scenario which is very good IMO, but it really doesn’t address the windage as much. I have seen trees hit starting at that 100 yd range instead of deer when they were on the move. When you only clip an inch of tree and you had 4” of windage that calculation has to come in a microsecond on deer moving through the woods like a snap shot. I know the windage isn’t as bad as a 12 ga foster slug but there is windage, same with the PBR and the conicals. Even with factory loads in these fine whitetail woods calibers there is wind drift. IMO if you are considering 200 yd shots or if they are very possible, find a boolit with the higher BC and push it as fast as the weapon will allow for accuracy.

I wonder how those .32, .338. .358, and .366 cals BCs could be being long with still a decent metplat for longer range shooting or fighting the wind on those types of shots pass a 100 yd.