Possible zinc in the ingot bars

[triggerhappy243]

I bought some muriatic acid yesterday to test zinc presence in my ingot bars. I tested 5 by pouring just a drizzle of the acid on the flat side. 3 of the bars had a reaction and the other 2 had none.

here is my question and it is directed to those who have done this test.

how aggressive of a reaction should there be with just a minute amount of zinc, as opposed to alot of zinc? should there be foaming like coke on a battery terminal or light fizzing?

[bruce381]

good question maybe someone with a ZN wheel wt can try it post a picture

[Chris24]

I tried it recently. I had some acid, and tested my ingots versus a zinc WW. The lead had zero bubbles, and turned a little black. The zinc fizzed a little, but not massively. It leaves a white foamy residue, though. No photo, sorry.

[jsizemore]

The muriatic acid I used was 2-5% hydrochloric acid. I scraped the surface to get to new alloy with no oxide layer. Like Chris, pure lead showed no reaction other then the surface blackened a little. A zinc wheel weight bubbled readily and more so as the solution strength went up. When the bubbles got larger they would pop when they got about 1/2" diameter. I checked some hard ingots that rang when dropped and later made excellent boolits. They produced a single string of bubbles at a slow rate regardless of the solution strength.

[LAGS]

If the acid is left to sit on the ingots and it eats a crater in the lead ingot at all, then there is too much Zinc.
First Identify all the ingots that have some kind of reaction.
Seperate them buy the type of reaction that they have.
Then Take the ones that reacted the most, and melt them all together and "Do Not Stir the Mix."
Do not Flux it either.
The scum / slag that comes to the top will be mostly Zinc, so spoon it off carefully.
Now ,Recast ingots out of that, and when cooled, Retest them and see if the reaction is less.
It is a pain in the patootie, but you can get the zinc levels down to a usable alloy.
But the biggest mistake people make is, the see slag and Flux it right back in the mix.
You will NEVER get all the zinc out buy this method, but it can be a way to partially salvage some contaminated lead.
I did get zinc out using Sulpher Powder.
But that was along drawn out process and toxic to breath the fumes.
The zinc melts at a higher temperature, so it along with the lead it is bonded to will float first, if you just let it sit, and keep the temperature down to the melting point of the lead.

[bangerjim]

A little sizzle is OK. Cast it! Don't worry about it. Removing Zn with sulfur or CuSO4 is a real PITA.

The stronger the reaction the more the Zn. 5% will have very little noticeable action. Over time you will see a result. Pb and Sn do nothing with HCl. Use 10-12% HCl. If a tiny bit of Zn, you will not see any reaction with the naked eye.

I have tested up to 5% Zn and all you need to do is add a bit more Sn to lower the surface tension and give good fill-out. And your boolits may be a tad lighter.

Or you can send it all to me for proper testing and disposal!

Don't get lost in the "Zinc ruined my 100# pot of lead" weeds.

bangerjim

[triggerhappy243]

ha ha ha , thank you jim for cheering me up. I am not stressing over it. I want to dig in deeper and learn more from experience. the fizzle is really small. smaller than the fizzle i got from spilling it on my concrete patio. the muriatic acid i got is 31 %. so i think with the bars I tested, I have no worries.

[triggerhappy243]

And no, i will not be doing the sulphur route with these either.

[LAGS]

When I did the Sulpher extraction for the Zinc.
I stamped those ingots with the letters ZFR- WTL
That stands for Zinc Free and Roy, White Tiger Lead
It still tests out as the hardness of COWW

[bangerjim]

31% is considered concentrated. (swimming pool acid) Dilute it ½ it water. Strangely HCl is more hydrogen ion active when diluted than when concentrated.

Remember "A comes before W" in the alphabet........ always add Acid to Water! NOT the other way around. Or you will get a potential visit from the Tensile Fairy's evil step-mother......Acid Queen.

And add it s-l-o-w-l-y.

But you should be OK.

banger

[triggerhappy243]

I applied it sparingly..... just to see if it fizzed. like maybe a teaspoon full.

[Retumbo]

Does anyone have actual pictures of what zinc contaminated ingots look like...I just cant seem to find any pictures. Al I found was FortuneCookie45LC video


www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zskn38Ggos

[therealhitman]

Them some ugly ingots in that vid.

[Retumbo]

From another site

Zinc

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_112831_zpswwxnhkfw.jpg

First small piece of zinc goes into 1lb of pure lead

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_113148_zpsd9k31yij.jpg

Took a lot of heat to melt it. NO OATMEAL For the longest time it looked like oil drop on water. Had to really work to get it into the lead. Even then there were still little zinc droplets on top of the lead

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_113326_zpsuk3s5exm.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_113825_zpsbza0uorw.jpg

On to using wheel weight ingots

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_114116_zpsew2agezs.jpg

Zinc

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_114120_zpsw66bvfxc.jpg

It too floats an like oil drop on water but takes less time to mix with lead

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_114333_zpsxpvsq78x.jpg

Oat meal

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_114510_zpsm6u9fneg.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_114827_zpsfi3jjlbd.jpg

[Retumbo]

Removed oatmeal and cast an ingot, looked normal. Threw back in pot time to add more zinc, two pieces

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_114959_zpsdauw9nxz.jpg

Lots of oatmeal

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_115046_zps6jnmp7sv.jpg

Bigger pile from double zinc

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_115448_zpsd3aa5gnh.jpg

Resultant ingot. Yes there are crystalline structures but if you look closely they are very porous.

http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_115342_zpske872wqj.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_115612_zpsaquhubpu.jpg

The two ingots side by side, 1 lb ingot is the pure mixture.
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_120252_zpsnr2rtf1v.jpg
http://i1061.photobucket.com/albums/t477/yomma4/IMG_20150828_120302_zpsr2dtvnol.jpg

[triggerhappy243]

excellent photos. wish I could have seen it all in its melted state.

[Retumbo]

I believe that the pictures labeled "oatmeal" IS the liquid form. Or should I say what forms on top of the melted lead/zinc

[Retumbo]

Just a total side note, the used to use zinc to flux(?) lead to purify it during the actual smelting process. IIRC that's how they get the silver out.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Does anyone have actual pictures of what zinc contaminated ingots look like...I just cant seem to find any pictures. Al I found was FortuneCookie45LC video


www.youtube.com/watch?v=1zskn38Ggos
I documented my COWW "Zinc contamination incident" with photos

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?155778-my-first-Zinc-contamination-in-WW-smelting&highlight=