Redding taper or profile crimp die?

[hogstad7]

I am loading 357max with NOE 180sil seated close to lands in a Contender at 58,0mm. Casemouth ends at lower driving band. It fits in the chamber and fire without crimp. I am considering straightening out the flare or slightly tapercrimping to tweak the accuracy even more. Should I buy a Redding taper or profile crimp die? I have a Lee FCD, but it is out of the picture due to the postsizing and rollcrimp. I am also reloading 38/357mag for a revolver.

[jmort]

The Profile is a roll crimp. In your single shot a slight taper crimp would work fine.

[Char-Gar]

The Profile Crimp die put both a taper and roll crimp on the case mouth. It is a hybrid critter.

[hogstad7]

When the profile die is used as a taper with no rollcrimp, is it as good as a real taperdie?

[Jupiter7]

When the profile die is used as a taper with no rollcrimp, is it as good as a real taperdie?

yes, but different. It's the only die I use for 38/357/357max. It'll do a pretty serious taper before the roll crimp sets in, the roll is very gradual.

[hogstad7]

How is it different? When the profile die is adjusted for taper only, is the 38/357 die long enough for 357max in a dillon 550b or must I buy the 357mag version?

[jmort]

No, it is not a "hybrid", it is a roll crimp die, and the one I prefer. You should call Redding if you have any doubt. Redding sells taper crimps for revolvers cartridges and I like those as well. Believe the manufacturer as opposed to internet posts.

Profile Crimp Dies (http://www.redding-reloading.com/online-catalog/31-profile-crimp-dies)http://www.redding-reloading.com/images/stories/media/profilecrimpdie.jpg"These handgun cartridge crimp dies were designed for those who want the best possible crimp. Profile crimp dies provide a tighter, more uniform roll type crimp, and requires the bullet to be seated to the correct depth in a previous operation.

These dies are not for cartridges that headspace on the case mouth."

[hogstad7]

Well, then I will just buy a tapercrimp die. Any brand recomendations? Need one that don't swage the boolit.

[mdi]

While the Profile Crimp die may be "just" a roll crimp, it is of a much better, different design than a regular roll crimp die. The profile of the crimp is sorta a taper crimp morphing into a "roll", sorta. I've been using Redding dies for my .357 and .44 magnums for quite a while and basically I've forgotten where the roll crimp dies are for these rounds, I'm so satisfied. For your needs, I'd go with a taper crimp (should be called a "de-flaring die"), Redding makes some really good dies... http://www.redding-reloading.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&Itemid=15&id=30%3Ataper-crimp-dies

[NSB]

I've done some extensive testing with the 357max over the last two years using roll crimp dies, taper crimp dies, and a Profile crimp die. After shooting hundreds of groups with many different powders, bullets, and crimps, I'm convinced that crimping this caliber in a single shot firearm is a waste of time. I simply make sure that the expanded case mouth is brought back to straight again. I have yet to find a difference in either being better or worse based on crimp when measuring groups. Just my two cents worth.

[dudel]

For 357Max, you want a ROLL crimp. Even though you're shooting in a Contenter (no worries about recoil pullout or setback from a feeding ramp), the strong crimp will let pressure build in this round. That's what you need to improve accuracy. Without the crimp, you get early release, unburned powder, sooty cases and large ES in velocity. At least that's what I've seen. YMMV.


I run 357Max in a Contender and a Handi Rifle. Both shoot great.

This is the go to page for 357Max. http://www.bellmtcs.com/store/index.php?cid=121


CAST LEAD BULLETS:
Reduced loads are ok with most any weight and type of plain base or gas checked bullet.
Slower powders tend to minimize potential to lead the barrel.

Hunting bullets should be gas checked and have a WIDE FLAT NOSE design for best effect on game.
Stick with 180 gr. and heavier bullets for deer with the benefit of a potential velocity increase of 100 to as much as 150 fps over the same weight of jacketed bullet. With the throats I cut, .358" sized diameter should be best across the board, but would not dismiss .357" diameter.

CRIMP OR NOT TO CRIMP:
I've always said it is not necessary to crimp the Max, BUT all those nice groups David White has posted here were with crimped loads, crimped in the factory cannelure, meaning a largish jump to the rifling and raising doubts about the common wisdom of seating bullets to the lands for best accuracy.

TIP REGARDING CRIMPING:
I have not done anything with or given much credence to the Lee Factory Crimp Die, BUT, recent reports are that with the thin jackets of handgun bullets especially, the Lee Factory Crimp Die will effectively make its own cannelure groove in the bullet.
Try it with bullets seated out where no cannelure/crimp groove exists.

[Char-Gar]

I don't have any Contenders, but I do have quite a number of single shot, lever action and bolt action rifles with a few pumps thrown in for good measure. All shot with cast bullets.

As far as I am concern the only purpose of the crimp it to keep the bullet where it is supposed to be. Therefore;

1. I use a roll crimp on rifle ammo to be fired in a tubular magazine which places pressure on the nose of the bullets in the magazine. I also roll crimp sixgun ammo to keep the bullet from jumping the crimp under recoil and binding the cylinder.

2. I use a taper crimp on ammo fired in auto loading pistols that headspace on the front of the case and nowhere else.

3. For single shot and bolt action rifles, I use no crimp, but will straight out the bell on the case mouth.

As I said, I don't have a Contender, but if I did, I would treat it as a single shot rifle. The bullet would be seated out to engage the rifling and still close the action.

[youngmman]

I use a Redding Profile Crimp Die for cast bullets and a taper crimp for jacketed for both the .357 & 38 sp and 44mag/44 sp

[Char-Gar]

I use a Redding Profile Crimp Die for cast bullets and a taper crimp for jacketed for both the .357 & 38 sp and 44mag/44 sp

When the Redding Profile Crimp die came on the market I bought one in every sixgun round I loaded. That would be 38/357, 44 Mag/Special, 45 Colt and 45 Auto Rim. After a few years of use, I can't say there are any better or worse than the roll crimp dies that come in the seating die, so I have pretty much discontinued their use.

I still use the 45 Auto Rim die to load 45 Cowboy Special cases for my 45 ACP cylinder in single action handguns. A straight roll crimp will put enough bulge at the crimp to give difficulties chambering. The Profile Crimp die with it's gentle taper crimp before the transition to a roll crimp allow a lighter roll, but still gives a good grip on the bullet to fight the recoil.

The bottom line, is I don't see any additional benefit to warrant the additional cost of a new die. However when it comes to crimping triming the cases to a uniform length with square mouths will pay dividends and is worth the effort.

[azrednek]

I had some problems with 45 Auto Rim jumping forward in the cylinder from recoil. I previously used a C-H 45ACP taper crimp and with the Lee FCD shot to shot accuracy declined. I can only assume the FCD carbide ring reduced the over all size of the lead bullet. Jacketed were not affected.

The Redding Profile Crimp die fixed the problem of the slugs jumping forward from recoil. Despite claims of improved accuracy with the RPCD, I didn't see any improvement or decline. I'll edit in some photos in a few minutes.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y17/dnisbet/crimp-1.gif (http://s2.photobucket.com/user/dnisbet/media/crimp-1.gif.html)

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y17/dnisbet/crimp-2.gif (http://s2.photobucket.com/user/dnisbet/media/crimp-2.gif.html)

Looking at the close-up, especially top right. Your guess is as good as mine. Is it a taper, roll, both or whatchamacallit crimp??

Just in case you're curious. The 45AR die also works with 45 Colt.

[bobthenailer]

For my single shot pistols in 357 mag & 30/20 using 200 & 165 gr cast boolets ,I had good success with a taper crimp die just straighting up the flair on the case & no or a very slight crimp . accuracy was as good as jacketed bullets out to at least 100 yards.

I use the Redding profile crimp die for 3/4 & full power loads in the 357 & 44 mag in revolvers & rifles.