ohland
06-28-2015, 04:51 PM
It almost looks like primed 25 Stevens RF cases were available. Not sure they are today, but I'd wager not.
American Rifleman, vol 69, no. 8, Jan 1, 1922, page 7, 9
https://books.google.com/books?id=gJkwAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA115&dq=rifle+accuracy+lead+bullet&hl=en&sa=X&ei=dEOQVebWAdCoogTCl6XoDQ&ved=0CEcQ6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=rifle%20accuracy%20lead%20bullet&f=false
Improving the .25 Stevens Rimfire
by Dr. Malcom Dean Miller
IN September, 1920, an article entitled “Wanted—An accurate .25 Rim Fire,” appeared in the pages of one of the sporting magazines. Things move slowly in the experimental world, and it was not until last September that I was able, at Camp Perry, to submit my results to Major Whelen, Captain Wotkyns, and the other smallbore fiends who were limbering up at the small-bore range.
Major Whelen has for some years been interested in seeing the .25 Stevens improved in its accuracy to match its almost ideal killing qualities as a smallgame gun. Major John J. Dooley has also put in an immense amount of time and money on experiments; but I am not at liberty to divulge anything about his results, save the vague hint that he will some day bring out a new cartridge which will surprise the rifle-shooting fraternity. My own interest, however, has tended towards a redesigning of the present cartridge so that it could be used in extant rifles of the calibre.
The first step was to secure the arm. I was fortunate enough to pick up, through an ad. in ARMS AND THE MAN, a practically new Winchester Single Shot with a solid frame. It has a bad pull; but the barrel had had only 50 shots fired through it. A test with crimped factory cartridges showed that it would not keep inside the two-inch black at 25 yards shot from a rest.
Having secured Peters and U. S. primed shells and FFFG King's Semi-Smokeless powder, I took the gun to Messrs. Hart-Andrews, in Cleveland, and asked them to make me a suitable mold. Mr. Andrews recut a .22 mold to produce a cannellured bullet weighing 71 grains. This bullet is .256 at the base—this being the groove diameter of my barrel—-and tapers rather sharply towards the front band; but how much I am unable to state for want of a micrometer caliper.
Mr. Andrews fired a number of groups and settled on a load of 6.5 grains, seating the bullet two bands and two grooves out of the shell. Shooting prone, with telescope, he turned out a number of quarter-inch groups; and he found at the same distance, 25 yards, factory ammunition would not group much better than from an inch and a half to two inches.
One pleasant Sunday noon saw the writer, the rifle, and the entire family casting off the moorings in Cleveland and setting forth, under a full head of steam, for Camp Perry. There the Major kindly took a hand in the experiments, shooting a number of groups prone at 50 yards.
143101
The load advised by Mr. Andrews gave us inch-and-three quarter groups. We then tried 9 grains (bulk) and developed so much pressure that the shells swelled and one split. The U. S. shells proved much the better fit for the chamber; but the Peters shells, though powder-stained almost back to the rim, gave almost as uniform elevation.
Major Whelen expressed himself as much pleased with the improvement in priming which has occurred since he made extensive experiments with this cartridge some years ago. At that time he found a great tendency for the shots to string up and down, but now both makes tested have proved excellent.
A few shots were also fired at 100 and showed only a very slight tipping tendency, which is a marked contrast to the keyholing tendency of the old factory black-powder charges. The giving out of my supply of bullets brought our experiments to an abrupt end.
Major Whelen summarized the results somewhat as follows: First, that all ammunition of the old type, in which the bullet has to jump from the case into the throat, even when uncrimped, can not be counted on to give much better than 1 1/2 to 2 inch groups at 50 yards; secondly, that seating the bullet as far out of the shell as possible improves the accuracy by throating the bullet into the barrel; thirdly, that further improvement could be obtained by some form of heel bullet; fourthly, that the accuracy of my experimental charges was about double that to be expected of factory ammunition, but not great enough to be entirely satisfactory.
Major Whelen suggested a bullet with a middle band made enough larger than the rest to act as a stop to prevent the bullet’s being pushed back into the shell. In mulling over the matter, however, I finally decided to make an uncannellured heel to fit the shell friction tight and have the greater part of the bullet seating directly into the throat. The accompanying diagram, redimensioned at the Major's suggestion, is as far as I have gotten. To be sure, months ago I asked the gunsmiths to undertake the making of a mold; but as the Major has not yet founded his Correspondence School for Gunsmiths (to teach them to answer letters), no action has, so far as I know, yet been taken.
The features of this bullet, from base to point, are noteworthy. It was necessary to make the major portion of the heel full groove diameter in order to insure that the bullet should stick in the shell instead of falling out easily. The extreme rear of the cylindrical portion, however, is made bore diameter so that the lead pressed back by the rifling should not project beyond the base. This idea I cribbed from the Ideal gascheck bullets. The tendency would be to steady the butt of the bullet during its passage through the rifling. The hollow in the base is intended to insure full expansion and at the same time compensate for the undue weight at the base, in as much as all authorities agree that the weight of a bullet should be carried as far forward as possible.‘
The next point is the tapered band for the chamfered muzzle of the shell. This I at first intended to make .261; but Major Whelen thought it altogether too large and ordered a reduction to .259. From this point, I carried a taper to bore diameter through 1 1/2 diameters of the bullet's length. I then laid off this length into six equal parts for grooves and bands—-over dimensioning again, with further orders to reduce, as everybody who saw the blueprints considered that the bullet could not be throated if it remained so far over barrel dimensions. The point was made blunt in order to carry weight forward, for the velocity obtainable with about 7 grains of Semi is not great enough to demand a spitzer point. It will be noted that the bullet point, as re-dimensioned, is .248, which allows for a film of grease and yet will cause it to center up pretty accurately in the bore. The first band will act as a dirt-scraper for the bore diameter. Each succeeding band will scrape a little deeper into the rifling, until finally the last band reaches the full groove diameter of .257. I ought to add that the flat tip is the mould cutoff, and would not be needed in a factory-made bullet.
Now, it may be that I shall have to get the barrel throated in order to seat this bullet successfully; but even then it would not be a great handicap, because such a bullet is absolutely sure to show increased accuracy, and I should never wish to use any factory loads, anyhow.
Later in the fall, using the rifle with a Lyman Ivory Hunting front and Marble Flexible rear, I took part in a chicken shoot at 25 yards outdoors. The conditions called for three shots from a rest for the best center. Owing to the coarseness of the rear-sight adjustment, I failed to get into the center for a chicken ;but curiously, every one of my three-shot groups consisted of one hole about a quarter-inch in diameter nicely displayed on the 10-ring at 12 or at 6. I just couldn't get the adjustment on the sight, and I couldn't make the allowance correctly by holding the ivory into the black. Subsequently, Johnson, one of the best shots in our club, put on an aperture front and shot a number of 10-shot groups at 25 yards, rest, all of them being from three-eighths to a half-inch. The best I could do with the ivory sight was a half inch, but that is more than four times as accurate as factory ammunition.
The squirrel season in Ohio comes too early and is too short for the rifleman. They actually murder them here with shotguns! I got out on the opening morning and did not see anything but reds and chipmunks. A bead shot on a red killed instantly without appreciable tearing, using the Andrews bullet with its originally .22 flat point, the body only having been recut. Johnson also shot a woodchuck, killing instantly with a shoulder shot without any tearing at about 65 yards. His 100-yard groups show a marked falling off' in accuracy in proportion to distance. The charge will group in about a four-inch group under the best weather conditions. We hope to get into 2 1/2 to 3 inches at 100 with the new bullet, when the mold finally gets made. Or perhaps during the winter, the only really progressive ammunition company we have—everyone is entitled to one guess! - may make a batch of bullets from my design and if they prove good, let me have some for trial. At any rate, the ball has started to roll, and some day I hope to report that the results are so good that the manufacturers alluded to have decided to bring out what I want to have called the “.25 Squirrel R. F.” to denote that it is really accurate enough for squirrel shooting.
American Rifleman, vol 69, no. 8, Jan 1, 1922, page 7, 9
https://books.google.com/books?id=gJkwAQAAMAAJ&pg=PA115&dq=rifle+accuracy+lead+bullet&hl=en&sa=X&ei=dEOQVebWAdCoogTCl6XoDQ&ved=0CEcQ6AEwBg#v=onepage&q=rifle%20accuracy%20lead%20bullet&f=false
Improving the .25 Stevens Rimfire
by Dr. Malcom Dean Miller
IN September, 1920, an article entitled “Wanted—An accurate .25 Rim Fire,” appeared in the pages of one of the sporting magazines. Things move slowly in the experimental world, and it was not until last September that I was able, at Camp Perry, to submit my results to Major Whelen, Captain Wotkyns, and the other smallbore fiends who were limbering up at the small-bore range.
Major Whelen has for some years been interested in seeing the .25 Stevens improved in its accuracy to match its almost ideal killing qualities as a smallgame gun. Major John J. Dooley has also put in an immense amount of time and money on experiments; but I am not at liberty to divulge anything about his results, save the vague hint that he will some day bring out a new cartridge which will surprise the rifle-shooting fraternity. My own interest, however, has tended towards a redesigning of the present cartridge so that it could be used in extant rifles of the calibre.
The first step was to secure the arm. I was fortunate enough to pick up, through an ad. in ARMS AND THE MAN, a practically new Winchester Single Shot with a solid frame. It has a bad pull; but the barrel had had only 50 shots fired through it. A test with crimped factory cartridges showed that it would not keep inside the two-inch black at 25 yards shot from a rest.
Having secured Peters and U. S. primed shells and FFFG King's Semi-Smokeless powder, I took the gun to Messrs. Hart-Andrews, in Cleveland, and asked them to make me a suitable mold. Mr. Andrews recut a .22 mold to produce a cannellured bullet weighing 71 grains. This bullet is .256 at the base—this being the groove diameter of my barrel—-and tapers rather sharply towards the front band; but how much I am unable to state for want of a micrometer caliper.
Mr. Andrews fired a number of groups and settled on a load of 6.5 grains, seating the bullet two bands and two grooves out of the shell. Shooting prone, with telescope, he turned out a number of quarter-inch groups; and he found at the same distance, 25 yards, factory ammunition would not group much better than from an inch and a half to two inches.
One pleasant Sunday noon saw the writer, the rifle, and the entire family casting off the moorings in Cleveland and setting forth, under a full head of steam, for Camp Perry. There the Major kindly took a hand in the experiments, shooting a number of groups prone at 50 yards.
143101
The load advised by Mr. Andrews gave us inch-and-three quarter groups. We then tried 9 grains (bulk) and developed so much pressure that the shells swelled and one split. The U. S. shells proved much the better fit for the chamber; but the Peters shells, though powder-stained almost back to the rim, gave almost as uniform elevation.
Major Whelen expressed himself as much pleased with the improvement in priming which has occurred since he made extensive experiments with this cartridge some years ago. At that time he found a great tendency for the shots to string up and down, but now both makes tested have proved excellent.
A few shots were also fired at 100 and showed only a very slight tipping tendency, which is a marked contrast to the keyholing tendency of the old factory black-powder charges. The giving out of my supply of bullets brought our experiments to an abrupt end.
Major Whelen summarized the results somewhat as follows: First, that all ammunition of the old type, in which the bullet has to jump from the case into the throat, even when uncrimped, can not be counted on to give much better than 1 1/2 to 2 inch groups at 50 yards; secondly, that seating the bullet as far out of the shell as possible improves the accuracy by throating the bullet into the barrel; thirdly, that further improvement could be obtained by some form of heel bullet; fourthly, that the accuracy of my experimental charges was about double that to be expected of factory ammunition, but not great enough to be entirely satisfactory.
Major Whelen suggested a bullet with a middle band made enough larger than the rest to act as a stop to prevent the bullet’s being pushed back into the shell. In mulling over the matter, however, I finally decided to make an uncannellured heel to fit the shell friction tight and have the greater part of the bullet seating directly into the throat. The accompanying diagram, redimensioned at the Major's suggestion, is as far as I have gotten. To be sure, months ago I asked the gunsmiths to undertake the making of a mold; but as the Major has not yet founded his Correspondence School for Gunsmiths (to teach them to answer letters), no action has, so far as I know, yet been taken.
The features of this bullet, from base to point, are noteworthy. It was necessary to make the major portion of the heel full groove diameter in order to insure that the bullet should stick in the shell instead of falling out easily. The extreme rear of the cylindrical portion, however, is made bore diameter so that the lead pressed back by the rifling should not project beyond the base. This idea I cribbed from the Ideal gascheck bullets. The tendency would be to steady the butt of the bullet during its passage through the rifling. The hollow in the base is intended to insure full expansion and at the same time compensate for the undue weight at the base, in as much as all authorities agree that the weight of a bullet should be carried as far forward as possible.‘
The next point is the tapered band for the chamfered muzzle of the shell. This I at first intended to make .261; but Major Whelen thought it altogether too large and ordered a reduction to .259. From this point, I carried a taper to bore diameter through 1 1/2 diameters of the bullet's length. I then laid off this length into six equal parts for grooves and bands—-over dimensioning again, with further orders to reduce, as everybody who saw the blueprints considered that the bullet could not be throated if it remained so far over barrel dimensions. The point was made blunt in order to carry weight forward, for the velocity obtainable with about 7 grains of Semi is not great enough to demand a spitzer point. It will be noted that the bullet point, as re-dimensioned, is .248, which allows for a film of grease and yet will cause it to center up pretty accurately in the bore. The first band will act as a dirt-scraper for the bore diameter. Each succeeding band will scrape a little deeper into the rifling, until finally the last band reaches the full groove diameter of .257. I ought to add that the flat tip is the mould cutoff, and would not be needed in a factory-made bullet.
Now, it may be that I shall have to get the barrel throated in order to seat this bullet successfully; but even then it would not be a great handicap, because such a bullet is absolutely sure to show increased accuracy, and I should never wish to use any factory loads, anyhow.
Later in the fall, using the rifle with a Lyman Ivory Hunting front and Marble Flexible rear, I took part in a chicken shoot at 25 yards outdoors. The conditions called for three shots from a rest for the best center. Owing to the coarseness of the rear-sight adjustment, I failed to get into the center for a chicken ;but curiously, every one of my three-shot groups consisted of one hole about a quarter-inch in diameter nicely displayed on the 10-ring at 12 or at 6. I just couldn't get the adjustment on the sight, and I couldn't make the allowance correctly by holding the ivory into the black. Subsequently, Johnson, one of the best shots in our club, put on an aperture front and shot a number of 10-shot groups at 25 yards, rest, all of them being from three-eighths to a half-inch. The best I could do with the ivory sight was a half inch, but that is more than four times as accurate as factory ammunition.
The squirrel season in Ohio comes too early and is too short for the rifleman. They actually murder them here with shotguns! I got out on the opening morning and did not see anything but reds and chipmunks. A bead shot on a red killed instantly without appreciable tearing, using the Andrews bullet with its originally .22 flat point, the body only having been recut. Johnson also shot a woodchuck, killing instantly with a shoulder shot without any tearing at about 65 yards. His 100-yard groups show a marked falling off' in accuracy in proportion to distance. The charge will group in about a four-inch group under the best weather conditions. We hope to get into 2 1/2 to 3 inches at 100 with the new bullet, when the mold finally gets made. Or perhaps during the winter, the only really progressive ammunition company we have—everyone is entitled to one guess! - may make a batch of bullets from my design and if they prove good, let me have some for trial. At any rate, the ball has started to roll, and some day I hope to report that the results are so good that the manufacturers alluded to have decided to bring out what I want to have called the “.25 Squirrel R. F.” to denote that it is really accurate enough for squirrel shooting.