Which molds are best and why plus what is with gas checks?

[shamgar]

I have been using lee 2 cavity bullet molds for .357/.38 spl, .45ACP and 9mm. They work fine, however it takes a long time to cast very many bullets with them.
I am thinking of upgrading. Is the lee six cavity worth the money or the NOE ones which cost considerably? Who are the manufacturers of the these things?
Are gas checks worth all the bother and if so why don't the gas check diameters match the common bullet diameters?
Thanks

[MT Chambers]

Lots of questions there.........Lee molds can work for you and the 6 cav. ones will produce more if they are trouble free, they are mass produced and use the cheapest of materials, usually soft aluminum and pot metal, so beware. NOE is one a few outfits that make much nicer molds, out of better materials and are usually trouble free. Aluminum is my least fav. material as I much prefer iron molds from Lyman, RCBS, and Saeco, and brass from some of the custom makers like NOE, Accurate. Gas checks are avail. in the common cals. but the mold must be cut for them, they are necessary for use when working at higher pressure and velocities.

[osteodoc08]

For mass production I like a 4-5c quality aluminum mold from NOE, Accurate, et al. Quick to heat and cool allowing for a quick tempo. Steel sprue plates can gall the aluminum if not cared for.......ie, too tight with no sprue plate lube, hammering on them, etc. I haven't had any major issues.

Ive really been stuck on brass for some time. They're a bit heavy for hours long casting sessions, but I've really had a great time using 2 brass molds together and swapping them out after 2-3 casts. They retain heat well and will allow me to use 2 at the same time with an average casting tempo. Major downside is weight.

Iron/Steel molds are also very good. Good combination of weight, heat retention and durability. They can rust if not cared for.

GC designs are more for higher velocity especially rifle and magnum pistol. I will personally use them when velocities approach 1300+. It helps curb leading but lube and fit are more important. I've had my best accuracy with GC designs, but that may be just me and not the actual GC.

If if you do a quick search, you could read for days.

Since it seems you're starting out, I'd also read Glen Fryxell's "From Ingot to Target" about 4-5x. I'm still learning from it. It's a free download, just search.

[Oreo]

The best reason I've heard for using gas checks is to prevent boolit base deformation just as the boolit exits the muzzle under high pressure. Ideally the bullet base is perfectly square and as it exits releases the pressure behind it around the entire circumference all at the same instant. If a weak spot on the boolit base gives way in that instant it acts the same as if the crown of the muzzle had an imperfection. Thus accuracy suffers. A gas check is much tougher then lead and strengthens the boolit base keeping it square even under very high pressures.

[country gent]

You might consider 2 of the lee 2 cavities in the same mold and cast with both together. Pre heat both fill one set aside on tray fill next cut sprue on first fill cut sprue on second fill running like this there is no waiting for sprues to cool and your casting with four cavities. Otherwise the 6 cavities from lee noe or accurate. Or a used lyman hensly and gibs or saeco if it can be found.

[Handloader109]

I would not gc pistol bullets, I've three Lee 2 cav and two NOE two cavity molds for 9 mm. Both cast about same time. I've a new 5 cavity NOE mold for 223, and it drops bullets quick! All depends upon which shape you want in my opinion.....

[dromia]

If you have the choice then i would get the NOE before the Lee.

NOE moulds do exactly what they say without the need for mould fettling, the materials used are of a far better quality, the machining is first class, their quality control is excellent as is their after sales service, comparing Lee and NOE is like comparing apples and oranges an excercise in futilty.

If you get a Lee mould that works and drops to specification then you will have a real bargain it is just a big if.

[kens]

My experience with LEE molds is the 6-cavity molds are better quality than 2-cavity items.
I have 2 6-cavity Lee molds and they work quite well.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I have been using lee 2 cavity bullet molds for .357/.38 spl, .45ACP and 9mm. They work fine, however it takes a long time to cast very many bullets with them.
I am thinking of upgrading. Is the lee six cavity worth the money or the NOE ones which cost considerably? Who are the manufacturers of the these things?
Are gas checks worth all the bother and if so why don't the gas check diameters match the common bullet diameters?
Thanks
shamgar,
as MT Chambers stated, you asked alot of questions...which is fine, Let me try to address the highlighted question about GCs.

I'll keep this simple. YES ! GCs are worth the bother for Rifle boolits. Generally they are NOT needed for pistol boolits. (although there maybe a few rare applications where a GC will add the needed strength and base perfection to a pistol boolit for high pressure loads or long distance accuracy)

Now for the second part of that highlighted Question. Assuming the obvious of what you typed, The OD of the GC must be larger than the finished/sized boolit, so as it can get crimped onto the boolit's GC shank during the sizing process.

[wv109323]

The Lee six cavity molds are usable and you can cast a lot of bullets with them. The newer ones have better alignment pins. Their weakness is the cam handle can break and bolts(sprue plate) can become loose while casting.You already have Lee molds so you should know their quality.
If you move up to 4 or 6 cavity molds you need a 20 pound pot so that you can cast a while then replenish the lead in the pot. A hot plate is very nice to keep the mold hot while the added lead comes up to temp.
All the custom mold manufacturers are individually owned and quality is what keeps them in business. Large companies own Lee,RCBS, Lyman and Saeco.
Of the calibers you listed 9MM, .38 Spec./,357Mag. and .45 ACP, the only caliber where gas checks could help is .357 Mag. Then only if loading hot for the .357 Mag. A well cast well fitted boolit is all that is needed in the other applications.

[John Boy]

Which molds are best and why plus what is with gas checks?The OP posts on the 8th and then disappears! Better have an excuse because posters like this DON't deserve a reply

[Oreo]

This is a community John. Who are you to say whom the rest of us find worthy of a reply?

[bangerjim]

I own darn near ever 6 cavity mold Lee makes. And when I need a boolit that is on 2 cav, I buy that also. Have almost 12 of those 2 bangers.

Lee molds have performed well for me for years. I also have some MiHec and SAECO molds.

Personally, I feel any quality made mold will give you excellent results.

YOUR results will depend on YOUR expertise in casting!!!!! Do not blame the mold if you get bad drops.

banger

[ohland]

All the custom mold manufacturers are individually owned and quality is what keeps them in business. Large companies own Lee,RCBS, Lyman and Saeco.

Er, that probably didn't translate too well. It could be read as damning with faint praise RCBS. Own a few RCBS and they are well behaved and drop fine boolits.

BUT... they are two cavity molds... So for a pistol shooter wanting mucho trigger pulling, SAECO makes four cavity... some older SAECOs with eight cavities were (past tense) made. No longer...

You pays your money and you take your frame of reference... MP molds makes some seductively alluring metal.

[cajun shooter]

Lee molds are a hit and miss deal, those who give them praise are very lucky persons and may not have been casting long enough or buying plenty of molds. When I first became a member of this forum in 2008, the members had plenty of group buys on the Lee 6 banger molds. The wait was at least a year long and if your mold was good in all 6 holes, you were a lucky soul.
I'm sorry and mean no disrespect for those members who may not have the casting time of some of the older members who have nightmare stories about Lee products.
For the most part they are a market that was created for new entry level shooters who wanted to try something new out.
I started casting in 1970 and the molds used then were all of high quality, H&G, Lyman, Ideal and the private makers. Lyman molds of that time period were far different from those being made today.
I don't understand how someone who has been casting for a few years being able to throw accolades at Lee. For the most part, the products they sell are at the bottom of the quality list.
They do have a few products that are worthy, The Hand loading Press is great for decapping at the range and loading a few by the campfire. The Lee Classic Cast Press is probably what I would call a great buy. The powder measure is good for those loading a limited amount of ammo.
I don't care for any of the casting equipment, that is from experience and not from repeating what others have said. The mold handles are a good buy molds when given some touch up.
Lee promised that they were going to build a new building for turning out the 6 cavity molds and cut down on the order to delivery time. That did not happen. I received more than one 6 cav mold that had more than two cavities out of spec.
Wait until you have 20 pounds of hot lead pour out onto your casting bench as you fill a mold, see if that gives you a different opinion of Lee Products.
Again, this is my opinion and time with Lee and does not mean that it covers all the products.
If you are going to cast and make bullets that you want to work in your gun and give you the best accuracy, purchase a mold from a private maker. The average price is about $110 for them.
As I stated in my posting, Lee does make equipment that allows someone to try out the art of casting at a good price and therefore fill a needed void that would exist if they were not there. For that, I applaud them but if you have advanced to the next stages, you need to look at other options.
If you only cast 100 bullets a week, then the Lee will fill your needs.
Take care David

[Oreo]

The value of the independent mold makers is at its peak when considering hollow point molds. If you want to cast hollow points select an MP or NOE mold and don't waste your time with anyone else. Imagine that some people have paid hundredS of dollars to have Lee molds modified for cramer pins.

[TXGunNut]

Short answers: Lee is good, NOE is better. For most pistol shooting GC's are not necessary. JMHO, of course.

[DougGuy]

Gas checks allow you to use a softer alloy which may obturate and seal the bore better in a pistol than a harder alloy, and they allow use of a softer alloy which may expand better/perform better on game. I find the gas checks to work wonderfully in .45 Colt and .44 Magnum with the Lee heavyweight RF boolits.

[Artful]

Short answers: Lee is good, NOE is better. For most pistol shooting GC's are not necessary. JMHO, of course.

Well stated! I concure - I own molds from a most common makers - NOE takes a back seat to no one. If given a choice between NOE and LEE I'd take the NOE.

Gas Checks can be a necessary evil for some guns, but for the most part I can usually find a plain base load that will work with the firearm - thou not always at the guns full potential.

[TXGunNut]

Thanks, Artful. Gas checks appear to be simple little bits of copper or some other material but that's deceptive. For some rifles they may be necessary but only one of my hunting pistol boolits wears a GC. I think they make a few pistol boolits in high-performance applications a bit better but for the most part a pistol boolit doesn't need them. Volumes have been written about GC's here and elsewhere and there's no shortage of disagreement on what they do, don't do and how they do whatever they do. Been reading about them for years, even used a few thousand of them and most of my rifle moulds are a GC design. Every boolit I've used to put a critter in the freezer has worn them but I'm just beginning to understand them.

[DocSavage]

I've been reloading and casting for the better part of 45 years and the only blocks I had problems with Lee and Lyman. I have molds from RCBS,LBT,NOE,Mihai and Saeco. Gas checks are most useful on rifle boolits but there is a need for them on certain pistol calibers driven at higher velocities,heavy boolit 44mag,45 Colt and 454 Casull come to mind.

[Dragonheart]

When you ask a question in a forum you are going to get as many answers as there are responses. I guess some questions for you are do you shoot a lot and need quantity, are you concerned about the quality of of the bullets, are you into casting over the long haul so you want products that last?

If you answer is Yes to these questions then I personally would stay away from Lee casting products completely. I have some Lee casting products and I have not been impressed, the only saving grace is they didn't cost a lot. Lee bullet sizing die are fine. But if you want molds that will last a lifetime buy steel molds. They cost more than Lee aluminium molds, but make quality bullets and the bullet cavities are consistent, which is important if you want quantity. Look for Steel mold deals on this site, Ebay and Gunbroker as they turn up quite often.

The best way to turn out a lot of bullets is to use 2 identical molds simultaneously. One is cooling while one is being poured. I started casting back in the mid 60's and I own or have owned/used a number of steel molds. Out of steel molds my favorite is Saeco Molds although present quality is not as good as the old molds in my opinion, but they are a lot lighter than Lyman molds. Additionally, Saeco has a lot of the old H&G profiles like the #68 and are very consistent between the mold cavities. Saeco makes 4 cavity molds and running two will turn out a lot of bullets.

I understand NOE makes quality products, but at the present I own none so I cannot comment.

You mentioned handgun cartridges, for those you don't need the expense of gas checks unless you are going to run some hot loads in the .357, but I would imagine for that you would just use plated bullets, I know I would. Since I tumble powder coat a gas check on a handgun bullet serves no purpose as the powder coat remains intact on the base of the bullet and there is no erosion, at least none that I have found at 1200+ FPS.

[dromia]

There are good quality aluminium moulds out there that will last as long as steel, NOE, LBT and Accurate are just three.

Their products are far superior to the the Lee offering in materials, workmanship, quality control and after purchase service that there is no real comparison.

So don't be put off by the mould material just buy from a reputable maker and you will have an investment for life, moulds seem to be one of the few things left in life where you actually get what you pay for.

[MT Chambers]

If the op or anyone else doubts the usefulness of gas checks (esp. on rifles) look at the CBA match results, where all top competitors using "fixed" ammo use gas checks.