ohland
05-20-2015, 06:22 PM
http://www.dillonprecision.com/3855_and_the_1050-98-12-2880.htm
What parts you need to set up your Dillon 1050 for use with 38-55 Winchester. The following is a cut n paste from Dillon Precision's website. Putting it here helps to insure that if Dillon's server has a bad day, this article will be here. v/r, Evil O
By Merrisasjc (http://www.dillonprecision.com/content/p/104/uid/76836)
Published on: 2014-09-13 at 6:30 PM
Replies: 0
Merrisa Bishop CEO of Bishop Ammunition Mfg.
This is to address the problems of setting up the Super 1050 for 38-55. Our press is now known as "La Perra Diablo Azul" I will leave you to translate it on your own but I think you get the idea.
The problems which we encountered in setting the Super 1050 for 38-55 were as follows:
1) what dies to use for cast bullets which are not gas checked;
2) Dillion does not offer a conversion kit for 38-55 for the Super 1050;
3) Dillion does not offer a case feed adapter for the 38-55;
4) what powder funnel is to be used for the Dillon Super 1050;
5) resolution of clinging powder to the powder drop tube due to static electricity;
6) resolution of erratic or no powder drop conditions due to both static electricity, bridging and cleaving of stick powders.
As I do not know how to post pictures I will do my best to describe what we have done to fix the problems. If I figure the picture issue out I will add them later.
First a little about the 38-55. This is the cartridge that gave birth to the 30-30. This is important as it dictates the very first step in setting up this press as a 30-30 press is available from Dillon in the Super 1050. The 30-30 is simply the 38-55 necked down to accept a .30 caliber bullet of .308 diameter.
The 38-55 is not an obsolete cartridge. Several manufacturers still offer the 38-55 in their rifles, both single shot and lever action. The 38-55 is also still considered the preferred thin skin game taking cartridge there is. Millions of rifles have been chambered in this cartridge and loaded properly is effective on brown and black bear.
The 38-55 was first developed by Winchester in 1876 by Ballard. The 38-55 was first used by Marlin in their lever action rifles and then by Winchester in their High Wall and lever action rifles.
The .38-55 is renowned for its exceptional accuracy at ranges up to 330 yd and properly loaded and developed by the loader can be accurate out to 1000 yards. The maximum CUP pressure for the 38-55 is 30,000 but will create a explosive combination in older turn of the century firearms made in the early 1900's and late 1800's as this was originally a black powder cartridge, 38 caliber under 55 grains of powder. It was originally intended as a true .380 dia. cartridge, however rifle manufacturers from the cartridge's inception still cannot get it right and grove diameters range from .375 to .382. Therefore you should always swag your barrel to determine what your grove diameter is before you choose a bullet. To solve this problem, yours truly included, in lead bullets we use a .379 bullet and limit our speed to a maximum of 1300 fps to prevent leading. With a gas check you can go safely to 1600 fps but gas checks are not allowed for Cowboy Action shooting in their side matches. Jacketed bullets can safely be loaded up to 1800 fps. There are no lead free/copper bullets for this cartridge. The Winchester 375 is a modern variant of this cartridge. NEVER EVER use .375 Winchester ammunition in ANY 38-55 EVER for any reason. If you do you may be making a trip to the hospital and most probably will by replacing your rifle. ALWAYS follow loading guides. Never exceed maximum recommended guidelines. Start low and work up to a load that is most accurate for you and your rifle.
Now to the problems......
What press to buy: If you are armed as you are now with the knowledge that the parent case for the 30-30 is the 38-55, this should be your first hint. You need to purchase a Super 1050 set up by Dillon for 30-30. This will provide you the right case feeder, the correct pins, a number 4, the correct swaging rod, and it will be set up for large primers. You will also immediately have a 30-30 press conversion as you can use that later to set the press up for 30-30 if you so choose. Use Dillon option number 21003. This will result in the delivery of a Super 1030 for 30-30. You will not be using the dies which will have been installed or the powder drop funnel. You will be using the case feed adapter and the locating pins.
What powder drop funnel to use: Dillon does offer a powder drop funnel. You will not find it under the accessories for the Super 1050. You will find it under the listing of individual powder drop funnels. You will use the one for the 650, (the powder drops are identical for the 650 and the 1050). The one made by Dillon is Powder Drop "V" for the .375 and 38-55. Simply remove the 30-30 funnel and drop the V funnel in its place then set up the powder drop as provided in the instructions. A word of note here, the use of stick powders is not recommended by Dillon. This does not mean that you cannot use powders like H4895, but you will encounter problems which I will address later. One part of the fix I will address here as you are setting the powder drop up at this point, buy some powdered graphite which is used for locks. Lubricate the powder drop slide and its channel with the graphite. I will explain later.
What case feed adapter to use: There is no case feed adapter for the 38-55. Dillon has no plans to produce one either. So what is the solution? Remember I had you buy the 30-30 press right? Well the case feed adapter for the 30-30, Dillon part number 13073. You will find the parts listing in the conversion charts at the back of the instruction manual, who keeps those....... Well its there under 30-30, as well as all the conversion part numbers you will need to convert a non-30-30 press to a 38-55/30-30 press which we are doing. Once you have the adapter from Dillon, you will need to slowly file away material from the top of the adapter's case slot. This is the slot that the case passes through as the case is being fed forward into the case plate. You only need to remove enough material, a little at a time, until the 38-55 case clears the top and does not tip over as it is being fed. Please keep in mind that the 38-55 cases come in two lengths, a normal and a long one. The ones we use are the shorter cases which are 2.076" - 2.082" from Starline. The other length is the longer case which is 2.122" - 2.130". This brass is marked by Starline as "- 2.125 - - 38-55 -" Be sure of what you are loading. Measure your brass first!
What dies to use: Starline does not provide the press with a set of 38-55 dies. You will have a really nice set of 30-30 dies though when you are done which you can sell or use to make 30-30 with later on. We use the Cowboy Action Die set from RCBS. We use this die as it comes with two neck expanders. This assures that the brass will be sufficiently expanded and just belled enough to accept lead bullets of the diameter you want to use without shaving off a bit of lead. You essentially replace the sizing and crimp die, the neck expander, and the bullet seat and crip die. While the die set from RCBS is a three die set and the seat and roll crimp are done in one step, we find that doing it in two steps by seating with the RCBS die and using a Lee Factory crimp die gives us the consistency we demand and the identical crimp round after round.
The next issue powder drop: As stated above, Dillon only recommends using ball type powders. There is a reason for this. Stick powder does NOT flow smoothly. Stick powder will at times case a no charge condition with a crushed or over belled case from time to time. There is a solution to this.
Inconsistent or zero powder drops: There are three steps we have used. First an explanation, which is that as the powder slide moves forward to pick up a powder charge not all of the stick powder is not laying level and is not distributed evenly due to the shape of the powder grains, being sticks, static electricity, and friction.
Step One is the removal of static electricity. Please ground your press there are various ways to do this. In dry environment such as summers in California or winters on the east coast static electricity will build up, especially on the acrylic of the powder hopper. If you doubt this, on a dry day, rub a felt cloth over the powder hopper, while empty of course, and then sprinkle a little bit of talcum powder on the outside. It will stick to the acrylic almost instantly. This is the attraction property of static electricity. To remove this ground the press to a copper pipe of the ground of your house or other structure your press is in.
Step Two is using a dry lubricant on the powder slide. The only dry lubricant you should use is powdered graphite. Not only will it slide like two pieces of glass with snot between them, but it will not contaminate the powder. ALL smokeless powder is coated with guess what.... graphite. I suggest using the powdered graphite you can get at any automotive parts house which is used for door locks. A little bit goes a long way and use latex gloves so you do not get it all over your hands and fingers which you will.
Step Three is more entertaining, using vibration to condense the powder more evenly in the hopper, eliminate clumping and bridging, as well as reducing or eliminating the condition which causes the locking the most, a single powder grain being caught between the slide and the hopper which gets cleaved in half on the down stroke. This is what actually crushes your cases or locks the press up with stick powders. So, what is the solution? We use a small air pump for an aquarium attached to the bottom of the powder hopper with two zip ties. Other solutions are more creative, including sex toys, use your imagination. Yes I have seen them used and strapped to a powder hopper, and yes it works.
Have fun making your 38-55.
Reply:
Posted by: Capt_C (http://www.dillonprecision.com/content/p/104/uid/245168)
Posted on: 2015-04-21 at 02:57:49 PM
Great post, and excellent explanation... I'm curious if you've tried the "Magnum" version powder measure -- I haven't tried it (yet) but supposedly it was designed to meter extruded "stick" powders. Capt_C
What parts you need to set up your Dillon 1050 for use with 38-55 Winchester. The following is a cut n paste from Dillon Precision's website. Putting it here helps to insure that if Dillon's server has a bad day, this article will be here. v/r, Evil O
By Merrisasjc (http://www.dillonprecision.com/content/p/104/uid/76836)
Published on: 2014-09-13 at 6:30 PM
Replies: 0
Merrisa Bishop CEO of Bishop Ammunition Mfg.
This is to address the problems of setting up the Super 1050 for 38-55. Our press is now known as "La Perra Diablo Azul" I will leave you to translate it on your own but I think you get the idea.
The problems which we encountered in setting the Super 1050 for 38-55 were as follows:
1) what dies to use for cast bullets which are not gas checked;
2) Dillion does not offer a conversion kit for 38-55 for the Super 1050;
3) Dillion does not offer a case feed adapter for the 38-55;
4) what powder funnel is to be used for the Dillon Super 1050;
5) resolution of clinging powder to the powder drop tube due to static electricity;
6) resolution of erratic or no powder drop conditions due to both static electricity, bridging and cleaving of stick powders.
As I do not know how to post pictures I will do my best to describe what we have done to fix the problems. If I figure the picture issue out I will add them later.
First a little about the 38-55. This is the cartridge that gave birth to the 30-30. This is important as it dictates the very first step in setting up this press as a 30-30 press is available from Dillon in the Super 1050. The 30-30 is simply the 38-55 necked down to accept a .30 caliber bullet of .308 diameter.
The 38-55 is not an obsolete cartridge. Several manufacturers still offer the 38-55 in their rifles, both single shot and lever action. The 38-55 is also still considered the preferred thin skin game taking cartridge there is. Millions of rifles have been chambered in this cartridge and loaded properly is effective on brown and black bear.
The 38-55 was first developed by Winchester in 1876 by Ballard. The 38-55 was first used by Marlin in their lever action rifles and then by Winchester in their High Wall and lever action rifles.
The .38-55 is renowned for its exceptional accuracy at ranges up to 330 yd and properly loaded and developed by the loader can be accurate out to 1000 yards. The maximum CUP pressure for the 38-55 is 30,000 but will create a explosive combination in older turn of the century firearms made in the early 1900's and late 1800's as this was originally a black powder cartridge, 38 caliber under 55 grains of powder. It was originally intended as a true .380 dia. cartridge, however rifle manufacturers from the cartridge's inception still cannot get it right and grove diameters range from .375 to .382. Therefore you should always swag your barrel to determine what your grove diameter is before you choose a bullet. To solve this problem, yours truly included, in lead bullets we use a .379 bullet and limit our speed to a maximum of 1300 fps to prevent leading. With a gas check you can go safely to 1600 fps but gas checks are not allowed for Cowboy Action shooting in their side matches. Jacketed bullets can safely be loaded up to 1800 fps. There are no lead free/copper bullets for this cartridge. The Winchester 375 is a modern variant of this cartridge. NEVER EVER use .375 Winchester ammunition in ANY 38-55 EVER for any reason. If you do you may be making a trip to the hospital and most probably will by replacing your rifle. ALWAYS follow loading guides. Never exceed maximum recommended guidelines. Start low and work up to a load that is most accurate for you and your rifle.
Now to the problems......
What press to buy: If you are armed as you are now with the knowledge that the parent case for the 30-30 is the 38-55, this should be your first hint. You need to purchase a Super 1050 set up by Dillon for 30-30. This will provide you the right case feeder, the correct pins, a number 4, the correct swaging rod, and it will be set up for large primers. You will also immediately have a 30-30 press conversion as you can use that later to set the press up for 30-30 if you so choose. Use Dillon option number 21003. This will result in the delivery of a Super 1030 for 30-30. You will not be using the dies which will have been installed or the powder drop funnel. You will be using the case feed adapter and the locating pins.
What powder drop funnel to use: Dillon does offer a powder drop funnel. You will not find it under the accessories for the Super 1050. You will find it under the listing of individual powder drop funnels. You will use the one for the 650, (the powder drops are identical for the 650 and the 1050). The one made by Dillon is Powder Drop "V" for the .375 and 38-55. Simply remove the 30-30 funnel and drop the V funnel in its place then set up the powder drop as provided in the instructions. A word of note here, the use of stick powders is not recommended by Dillon. This does not mean that you cannot use powders like H4895, but you will encounter problems which I will address later. One part of the fix I will address here as you are setting the powder drop up at this point, buy some powdered graphite which is used for locks. Lubricate the powder drop slide and its channel with the graphite. I will explain later.
What case feed adapter to use: There is no case feed adapter for the 38-55. Dillon has no plans to produce one either. So what is the solution? Remember I had you buy the 30-30 press right? Well the case feed adapter for the 30-30, Dillon part number 13073. You will find the parts listing in the conversion charts at the back of the instruction manual, who keeps those....... Well its there under 30-30, as well as all the conversion part numbers you will need to convert a non-30-30 press to a 38-55/30-30 press which we are doing. Once you have the adapter from Dillon, you will need to slowly file away material from the top of the adapter's case slot. This is the slot that the case passes through as the case is being fed forward into the case plate. You only need to remove enough material, a little at a time, until the 38-55 case clears the top and does not tip over as it is being fed. Please keep in mind that the 38-55 cases come in two lengths, a normal and a long one. The ones we use are the shorter cases which are 2.076" - 2.082" from Starline. The other length is the longer case which is 2.122" - 2.130". This brass is marked by Starline as "- 2.125 - - 38-55 -" Be sure of what you are loading. Measure your brass first!
What dies to use: Starline does not provide the press with a set of 38-55 dies. You will have a really nice set of 30-30 dies though when you are done which you can sell or use to make 30-30 with later on. We use the Cowboy Action Die set from RCBS. We use this die as it comes with two neck expanders. This assures that the brass will be sufficiently expanded and just belled enough to accept lead bullets of the diameter you want to use without shaving off a bit of lead. You essentially replace the sizing and crimp die, the neck expander, and the bullet seat and crip die. While the die set from RCBS is a three die set and the seat and roll crimp are done in one step, we find that doing it in two steps by seating with the RCBS die and using a Lee Factory crimp die gives us the consistency we demand and the identical crimp round after round.
The next issue powder drop: As stated above, Dillon only recommends using ball type powders. There is a reason for this. Stick powder does NOT flow smoothly. Stick powder will at times case a no charge condition with a crushed or over belled case from time to time. There is a solution to this.
Inconsistent or zero powder drops: There are three steps we have used. First an explanation, which is that as the powder slide moves forward to pick up a powder charge not all of the stick powder is not laying level and is not distributed evenly due to the shape of the powder grains, being sticks, static electricity, and friction.
Step One is the removal of static electricity. Please ground your press there are various ways to do this. In dry environment such as summers in California or winters on the east coast static electricity will build up, especially on the acrylic of the powder hopper. If you doubt this, on a dry day, rub a felt cloth over the powder hopper, while empty of course, and then sprinkle a little bit of talcum powder on the outside. It will stick to the acrylic almost instantly. This is the attraction property of static electricity. To remove this ground the press to a copper pipe of the ground of your house or other structure your press is in.
Step Two is using a dry lubricant on the powder slide. The only dry lubricant you should use is powdered graphite. Not only will it slide like two pieces of glass with snot between them, but it will not contaminate the powder. ALL smokeless powder is coated with guess what.... graphite. I suggest using the powdered graphite you can get at any automotive parts house which is used for door locks. A little bit goes a long way and use latex gloves so you do not get it all over your hands and fingers which you will.
Step Three is more entertaining, using vibration to condense the powder more evenly in the hopper, eliminate clumping and bridging, as well as reducing or eliminating the condition which causes the locking the most, a single powder grain being caught between the slide and the hopper which gets cleaved in half on the down stroke. This is what actually crushes your cases or locks the press up with stick powders. So, what is the solution? We use a small air pump for an aquarium attached to the bottom of the powder hopper with two zip ties. Other solutions are more creative, including sex toys, use your imagination. Yes I have seen them used and strapped to a powder hopper, and yes it works.
Have fun making your 38-55.
Reply:
Posted by: Capt_C (http://www.dillonprecision.com/content/p/104/uid/245168)
Posted on: 2015-04-21 at 02:57:49 PM
Great post, and excellent explanation... I'm curious if you've tried the "Magnum" version powder measure -- I haven't tried it (yet) but supposedly it was designed to meter extruded "stick" powders. Capt_C