First range report: New Vaquero

[dubber123]

I was unexpectedly gifted a 3-3/4" .45 Colt New Vaquero. Today I got to give it a quick spin.. First, I gave it a once over, and other than being bone dry, and the front sight listing a bit to the right, saw nothing out of the ordinary. The trigger was well into the "not good" range, but Rugers are pretty much free and easy to fix, so no worries.

I pushed a clean patch down the bore, and noticed it looked very smooth, a good start. A quickie measurement of the cylinder throats showed .452"+. Awesome! After the last older Ruger in .45 Colt I dealt with with .455"+ throats, that was a nice surprise. I tweaked the legs of the trigger return spring, and dry fired a few hundred times with thumb pressure on the hammer. This accelerates the break in process, and at least got me to a shootable trigger pull. Guesstimate is 4 pounds, but way too long. It will eventually get a real trigger job, and set to 2 pounds or so.

First cartridges were a 240 gr. HP 50/50 Pb-WW boolit from an Erik Ohlen converted mold, over 9.3 grains of Herco, a load Lloyd Smale has had great success with. I just shot at 20 yds. and I am well out of tune, but the first group was in the 1.5" wide X 2.5" tall range, a foot low, and left. I was actually happy with the low part, as it meant I could take off front sight to get elevation. The front sight came canted right, so drifting it back towards center should help with windage.

2nd go round was a 270 gr. WFN I had cut years ago, hoping the added boolit weight would help with elevation, which it did, but minimally. Group size was very similar, but still left, in line with group 1. At this point, I clamped it in a vice, and tweaked the front sight straight, and loaded 6 more rounds, this time with a 260 gr. 454190, over 9.5 grains of Herco. Point of impact shifted to the right, but not enough, and group size was maybe 2" round, most likely due to me warming up.

All in all, one of my more favorable first Ruger impressions. The bore is spotless, even where they normally have a choke point. A little trigger and sight tweaking, and this one may turn out ok.

[johnson1942]

long colts are fun. i have a ruger old army with a taylor conversion cylinder and man did i have fun with it to day. loaded a bunch and shot a bunch, very accurate.

[pworley1]

If you were able to fix every thing on the first trip you wouldn't have anything to do next time. Tweaking is the thing.

[Dirtdgger]

Sounds like you may have a winner there keep us posted on your results.

[DougGuy]

Not to look a gift horse in the mouth, but see if you can push the boolits through the throats from the front..

[dubber123]

If you were able to fix every thing on the first trip you wouldn't have anything to do next time. Tweaking is the thing.

Thats the best part of having it gifted to me, you don't mind spending a little on upgrades.. :) The grip frame has to go, and that will cost me a bit. The front sight will also get replaced by a screw on unit, which will give me a fatter blade to take up some of the gappiness, and allow me to correct the windage issue at the same time. Should be less than $20 for the sight shipped, plus a little mill time.

Once the trigger is tuned, and the other issues addressed, I can see this being a useful and fun gun. A short, fixed sight .45 Colt would be a handy woods bumming/camping gun for sure.

Looking at the cylinder size, it looks very similar to my S&W .45 Colts. I don't think I will feel uncomfortable running some warmer loads through this one. The frame is plenty beefy. I may try some hotter loads today and see how it does.

DougGuy, I will try to get a better handle on dimensions today, but it looks really good so far.

[dubber123]

Just tried 6 454190"s seated to 1.650" over 10.5 grains pf Power Pistol. This should be in the 20,000 Psi range. Primers look fine, and cases extract and rechamber easily, and I'm still getting a little soot on them, so I feel confident in upping the powder charge a bit.

When I tweaked the front sight, I could feel the solder bond breaking loose, but the sight was still firmly held. I knew if I pushed my luck with any more tweaking, it probably wouldn't end well, so of course that is what i did.. Yep, felt plenty loose, and a few light bumps with the hammer handle, and it fell off. I have heard of more than one that spontaneously exited these guns, so I wasn't surprised. I cleaned the slot well, and tapped it back in with a drop or two of super glue. On the plus side, it looks like if Ruger had installed it straight to begin with, it would have been perfectly zeroed.. :)

The sight was due for replacement anyways, and it was tight from the factory, so I can't complain. Maybe some hotter loads later today.

[DougGuy]

Keep in mind that you have a MEDIUM framed gun, -IF- it has a THREE digit prefix in the serial number, it IS NOT SAFE with the full house Ruger Only loads!

Medium framed New Vaquero are safe to .45 ACP +P pressures of 23,000psi, they SHOULD NOT be subjected to the 30,000psi loadings one finds listed as "Ruger Only"

If yours has a TWO DIGIT prefix, it is the large framed Vaquero and is good to go with full house loads.

__________________________________________

That being said, the three fastest, and cheapest ways to accurize a Ruger SA, are sizing the cylinder throats accordingly, clean up and recut the forcing cone to 11° and pull one leg of the trigger return spring off the pin or simply swap in a Wolff 30oz. spring. There will be creep in the trigger still but it is light and very manageable. I do not remove this creep as it lessens the amount of hammer/sear engagement. I learn to live with it. My Vaquero creeps, then stops, then the next small bit of effort against the trigger fires it. It's just like a double-set trigger, a wonderful thing in the woods, it's perfect just like it is.

This is all the tweaking it takes to get the Ruger to shoot well. If it doesn't have any thread choke. The rest of the deal is in the shooter's hands and at the loading bench. You do your part with these two, the Ruger will respond in like kind..

[dubber123]

Well aware of what I have, and am loading accordingly. The caution is warrented for those who may not be aware of the differences though. My top loads haven't even managed to seal the cases to the chambers, so I don't feel I am in too much danger yet :)

I do not like the one leg off trick as it is not the cleanest way to achieve the goal of reduced trigger return power. Replacing, or simply re-bending it is preferable to me. I can often feel the loose leg dragging on the mainspring when it is just left flopping. Reducing the sear contact safely is easy, and free. A 2 pound, totally creep free trigger is easily attainable with all factory parts in a Ruger single action. If my $200 Tokarev can have no creep, my Rugers sure won't either :)

[Groo]

Groo here
If you contact Freedom arms , they have a front sight that is for roundtops.

Cut the correct dovetail and your ready to go.

[dubber123]

Groo here
If you contact Freedom arms , they have a front sight that is for roundtops.

Cut the correct dovetail and your ready to go.

Thanks for the tip. I have a Ruger front I picked up tonight to set on the bbl, and do some measuring from.

11 grains of Power Pistol with the 240 gr. 50/50 WW-Pb boolits shot around 4" at 50 yds. Nothing spectacular, but I am in an awful state of tune, and wasn't trying particularly hard. It still shoots a little left, and low. This load should be over 1,000 fps., and the bore still looks spotless. All 6 cases ejected and re chambered fine, and in fact still clack back and forth when the gun is shaken. Still idling as far as pressure is concerned in other words.

[dubber123]

I set the replacement front sight on the barrel, and it looks good as far as fitment. It is a little high, which is good, but surprisingly the width is perfect. I tried knocking the front sight off to set it where it needs to go, and I can't get the darn thing off. That super glue is some good stuff!

[dubber123]

Fooled a bit more after work today. First off my 50 yd. target guesstimate looked quite a bit short to me, and it was, it was 40 yds.. I looked at the last group from yesterday, the 11 grs. Power Pistol and the soft 240 cast HP, and it didn't look too bad. It measures 2.8 high X 1.5" wide, I'm sure my rusty inconsistent grip is to fault. Tried another group with the same load, this time got 2.2" and round. I also tried some 318 gr. GC boolits with 21 grs. of H-110. 3 shots and # 4 tied up the cylinder, (boolit pull). I finally got all fired, and while it raised the point of impact dramatically, the group was right around 4". I tried the soft HP's with 19 grs. of 2400, and they shot worst of all, maybe a 5" group. I figured they would be a little fast for the soft, 9 Bhn boolits, and the group agreed.

All cases ejected easily, and slid right back in, I'm confident this smaller framed gun is just fine with 25,000 Psi loads.

All in all, I'm not displeased. The sights still stink, as does the trigger, but it looks like it might shoot just fine with a bit more tinkering.

[Groo]

Groo here
My Mondago shoots well off hand but will not group from a rest .
Try it with a standing rest , camera tripod etc.

[dubber123]

Groo here
My Mondago shoots well off hand but will not group from a rest .
Try it with a standing rest , camera tripod etc.

My rest is the top of my car from the standing position. Not the steadiest, but not bad. I am woefully out of tune, I'm just trying to nail down a few promising loads before I fiddle with the sights too much.

[dubber123]

I don't know if not many are interested in the smaller Vaquero, or if I just irritate people in general, (Known fact), but I'll continue my mostly one man circus.. :)

Last night I knocked off the front sight again, and used the high tech method of cellophane tape to secure a front sight from a 10-1/2" Ruger SBH to the barrel. I expected the front sight to be too wide, but it fits the rear groove perfectly. What a difference in sight picture.

The front sight is a good bit too tall, (A good thing), and it put me at the very bottom of my substantial target paper and backer board. I backed the car up a bit more, maybe 45 yds., and fired 3 rounds. None on paper. Hmmm. I stepped up to 25 yds. and fired the last 3 off hand. 1-5/8" right at the bottom of the paper. I then looked and saw the first 3 right at the bottom of the board in a stacked, 3/4" group. WELL! Off to the house to load more ammo. First group was with the 240 gr. HP's, so I switched to the 270 WFN's hoping to get it higher on the paper. 3 rounds at 45 yds. nothing. Not even on the backer. Back to 25 yds. 3 off hand, bottom of paper, in .910". The load was 9.5 grains of Herco for both.

The front sight makes an amazing difference. I think this gun may really shoot :) I hope I can get it screwed on where it needs to be. Ruger almost lost a customer years ago, but this one is making me pretty darn happy.

[frank505]

We used electrical tape to hold the ejector housing on my 500L. Worked for many shots.
I'm enjoying your trials. You're doing a good job making this sixgun perform to what YOU want.

[dubber123]

We used electrical tape to hold the ejector housing on my 500L. Worked for many shots.
I'm enjoying your trials. You're doing a good job making this sixgun perform to what YOU want.

Thank you, I'm having fun with my new peashooter. Recoil on this one is a bit less than a .500 Linebaugh :) The only issue with the tape is I had to go around the ejector rod, and can't use it for now. Luckily the brass just shakes free, so no big deal for testing.

Tolerances and cylinder throats seem right on with this gun, and honestly that isn't something I came to expect from Ruger .45's. I probably got lucky, but it sure is making me look at other models more seriously. The sight will get changed, hopefully the grip frame, and the trigger tuned, and I should have a great little gun.

[44man]

I stuck a Ruger ramp sight on mine with Steel Bed. I broke the original out too when my gunsmith friend said to tweak it. Don't work, silver solder will break loose.
To get epoxy or super glue loose, apply a little heat. Just heat the blade and it will come right out.
I heard the new Vaquero is MUCH stronger then a Colt ever was but it is sane to keep pressures lower then in the old ones. I have the old one that will take any load.

[JHeath]

I don't know if not many are interested in the smaller Vaquero, or if I just irritate people in general, (Known fact), but I'll continue my mostly one man circus.. :)



We're interested. Keep going.

[dubber123]

44man and JHeath, thanks, I wish I was better equipped to post some pics, I'll see if I can get any added. I know they caution to only keep this gun to +P 45 ACP pressures, which is about 23,000 Psi, and I can guarantee you that is safe. The cases loaded with 318 grain boolits I shot with 21 grs. of H-110 would have fallen out if the chambers were cleaner. I know it is not as strong as the full sized frame guns, but it appears and acts FAR from weak. Who would expect Ruger to build a weak anything anyways? :)

I have someone lined up to Tig weld in the front sight slot so I can D&T the front sight on. I really hope I get it in the right position..

[dubber123]

10.5 grs. of Herco and the 270 WFN went into 1.9" offhand at 25 yds. with 4 in 1.3" Not great, but considering the wobbling, not bad :) 11 grains of Herco with the 240 soft HP's was 2.5", but the wobblies had increased, so who knows.. If I get a less rushed evening, I'll pull the car (rest) back over and give it a fairer evaluation. This is the first gun the 270's have acted like they wanted to shoot in.

[44man]

I would not drill and tap mine, too thin for me to fool with. But bedding compound will hold anything and if you get it wrong, a little heat will take it loose so you can position it better. The front sight slot adds to hold with a good compound.
I replaced my blade once with bedding and it held fine but I never got the height right. Trying to make so many boolits hit close was my problem. I would file for one and the other was not right.
I don't think you can knock my sight off with a hammer.

[dubber123]

I would not drill and tap mine, too thin for me to fool with. But bedding compound will hold anything and if you get it wrong, a little heat will take it loose so you can position it better. The front sight slot adds to hold with a good compound.
I replaced my blade once with bedding and it held fine but I never got the height right. Trying to make so many boolits hit close was my problem. I would file for one and the other was not right.
I don't think you can knock my sight off with a hammer.

Mine will likely get both, I think I can sneak in 3-4 threads, and it will probably get a blob of Acraglas after I see if I goofed on the windage. I'll be happy with a load or two that shoots to POA.

[44man]

Acra-glass is wonderful stuff.
I learned to repair broken stocks with it and threaded, hidden brass rods. I wrap with tight inner tube bands and you can't see the repair at all. I have never seen that stuff break.
I like Steel Bed too and to see it hold a blade sight in a slot as strong as silver solder means I will never be without some.

[dubber123]

The only 270's I had cast were of 50/50 WW_Pb, and really didn't seem to like the same loads. Groups doubled. The only WW boolits I have left are some 454190's, so that is what I will make do with for now. It's a great design for accuracy, just not much of a meplat to make a game boolit in my opinion. It still looks like this gun will shoot pretty well, and it still looks like I am way out of practice :)

[DougGuy]

I'd let them TiG the front sight on! Forget about an ugly dovetail on a single action...

Btw, 10.5gr Herco is stepping on out there, you are well in excess of 23,000psi by then..

P.S. Make SURE they purge the inside of that barrel with argon. Purple or blue color on the inside won't hurt nothing but if it gets hot enough, and no purge, it will sugar the DAYLIGHTS out of the inside of the bore and it will be uglier than a bouquet of chapped a$$holes...

[dubber123]

I'd let them TiG the front sight on! Forget about an ugly dovetail on a single action...

Btw, 10.5gr Herco is stepping on out there, you are well in excess of 23,000psi by then..

P.S. Make SURE they purge the inside of that barrel with argon. Purple or blue color on the inside won't hurt nothing but if it gets hot enough, and no purge, it will sugar the DAYLIGHTS out of the inside of the bore and it will be uglier than a bouquet of chapped a$$holes...

10 grains of Power Pistol is listed as 23,000 Psi with a 280 cast. Herco is a little slower, and my boolit is 10 grains lighter. I'm 1/2 grain up... I bet I'm right in the neighborhood. Cases fall out with a shake, I'm not concerned.

As far as I know this gun is saddled with the 23,000 Psi limit due to that being what .45 ACP is set at. Ruger never says anything other than "Safe with SAAMI spec ammo" for any of their guns. I don't intend to deliberately abuse this one, but from what I have seen, 23K sure won't hurt it, nor does it appear a little higher than that will either.

Doug, no intent to dovetail, just a single screw. Welding on would be nice, but if I goof on the placement, it will be a lot easier to fill the screw hole in and try again than removing a welded on one. I'll be careful of the bore, Ruger put a very good looking barrel on this one, I'd rather not screw it up :)

[dubber123]

Thanks to new member Swamper, who made a very well executed swap with me, the Birds head grip is long gone, and replaced with a new, regular production grip frame from a .327 Single Six. I like the standard frame much better. A little fitting, and it looks much better to me.

Next on the hit list was a trigger job. I tweaked the return spring, and polished and reduced the sear contact on the hammer. I was really hoping for a 2 pound pull, and the very first try got me a totally crisp, 1 pound, 13 ounce trigger using all factory parts including a full power main spring. It won't push off no matter what, and is repeatable within an ounce or so. Being lucky doesn't hurt some times.

Next up will be to dial in some loads, then permanently affix the new front sight, and I will call this one done.

[dubber123]

Best tonight after cutting the new front sight down twice was a 1.7" cluster offhand at 25 yds. 11 grs of Power Pistol and the 9 Bhn 240 HP's. Lots of wobbling, I am in awful shooting form. It is still a foot low, but I may just leave it until it is permanently attached to do the final dial in. I did try some 270's at 40 yds. and they were still 8+ inches low. The new trigger is nice :)

[dubber123]

I had to chuckle when I dug up my last post for an update.. It appears the 9Bhn HP's may be the winner, and tonights 25 yd. offhand group was... 1.7", with 4 in 1.1" Same as last time. I still am wobbling like crazy, but I guess this is the best I can do. I did a small tweak to my Scotch taped on front sight, and I will shoot a few more groups to make sure it is centered, mark it and attach permanently. I then need a lot more practice. :)

I will chrono some soon, I am hoping for 1,100 fps. Maybe..

[dubber123]

11 grains of Power Pistol and a 240 gr, 9 Bhn cast HP from the 3-3/4" barrel: 1,018, 1,018, 1,017, 1,017, 997 fps. The 997 really bummed me out.. :) Average is 1,013 fps. Missed my 1,100 fps goal, but no big deal, it seems to shoot well, and I keep a drop for my .38's set to 5.5 grains, so it's easy to switch.

[44MAG#1]

I'll say this if you can consistently shoot groups like that offhand unsupported at 25 yards you must be some pistol shot.
High Master class bullseye shooters look out a new shooter on the block.

[dubber123]

I'll say this if you can consistently shoot groups like that offhand unsupported at 25 yards you must be some pistol shot.
High Master class bullseye shooters look out a new shooter on the block.

2" at 25 yds. is pretty decent for most revolvers from a rest. A tweaked accurate one, well, not so much. Can I do it every time? probably not right now. I suspect this is a 1" or less gun, but I sure can't prove it. I like to see 2" on average at 50 yds. from a rest, and I sure can't make that happen with this one. Some may be the gun and load, I suspect most is me. In fact, I guarantee it is my shooting that is to fault.

[44MAG#1]

All I am say is if you can consistently shoot groups likemthatmoffhand at 25 years you are in the absolute top of the cream of the crop.
You are talking about,shooting better offhand than most high master class bullseye shooters.
When I say constantly I mean 80 to 90 percent of the time.
Now if you are sloppy pooling them in well that is another thing.

[dubber123]

All I am say is if you can consistently shoot groups likemthatmoffhand at 25 years you are in the absolute top of the cream of the crop.
You are talking about,shooting better offhand than most high master class bullseye shooters.
When I say constantly I mean 80 to 90 percent of the time.
Now if you are sloppy pooling them in well that is another thing.

I didn't realize 2" offhand at 25 was that great. And no, I certainly can't do it every time. Years past, maybe, but not right now.

I seem to do as well offhand with this one as from a rest. I have had problem guns before that were very particular about how they were gripped/rested, and I think this may be one. From a rest, I really like to see the majority of my groups right around 1" at 25 yds. before I go to 50 yds. I'm not quite there with this one, it may never make it.

[dubber123]

Tried 15 grains of Blue Dot and the 240 HP's in a quest for a little more oomph. Judging by the leading in the barrel, I found it.. :) 3 touching at 25 yds. (got kinda excited), the other 3 scattered around in a roughly 2" group, (didn't measure). Easy extraction, but too fast for the soft boolits. 6 rounds of the 11 grains Power Pistol load cleaned 99% of the lead out.

I have elevation about perfect, still struggling with windage so I can mark the barrel and permanently place the front sight.

[dubber123]

9.3 grains of Herco and a 454190 makes enough recoil that if you get your fat hand between the rest and the gun butt, it will take a nice 5/16" notch out of your palm. :) The front sight is Accra glassed on, I'll try to shoot it tomorrow to see if I goofed on placement or not.

[44man]

9.3 grains of Herco and a 454190 makes enough recoil that if you get your fat hand between the rest and the gun butt, it will take a nice 5/16" notch out of your palm. :) The front sight is Accra glassed on, I'll try to shoot it tomorrow to see if I goofed on placement or not.
Get any part of your hand under a .500 or .475 once! I never did but I can see red happening!

[dubber123]

Woo Hoo! It looks like the sight is dead on for windage. I got a little carried away milling for elevation and it's maybe an inch high, but I can deal with that. I had myself convinced it was canted a little to the left, but it was right on my mark, and it seems to print right on.

I have noticed with the 3-3/4" barrel, it is VERY easy to push a shot to the left. Just thinking about it seems to do it, it really requires a lot of concentration to keep the front sight centered. Now I need a good holster for it, and a lot more practice. :)

[TXGunNut]

Good job! And yes, practice is always good.

[dubber123]

Thank you, I'm glad it seems to be pointed in the right direction. On a whim tonight, I tried some 230 gr RF's designed for the .45 ACP.. This is the "BD 45" mold one of our own members designed. Mine casts close to 240 grs from WW's. I seated it to 1.615" OAL and taper crimped it as it has no crimp groove. I didn't expect much, but I think they may shoot really well, and very close to the sights. If it does, I will be tickled, as I have this mold in a LEE 6 cavity, and the 240 HP boolit it seemed to prefer is in a single cavity. Practicing just got a lot easier :)