Is face-to-face giving cartridge gun to Californian legal?

[Naphtali]

A friend from San Diego County, California, will be visiting in Montana for a few weeks. May I give her a cartridge rifle and cartridge revolver, each with a few boxes of ammunition. May she legally return to California with guns and ammunition to use/have without any interference, regulation, registration - that is, with zero governmental interference?

[Springfield]

Absolutely not, not since about 1992.

[kristopher.wheeler]

A friend from San Diego County, California, will be visiting in Montana for a few weeks. May I give her a cartridge rifle and cartridge revolver, each with a few boxes of ammunition. May she legally return to California with guns and ammunition to use/have without any interference, regulation, registration - that is, with zero governmental interference?

It is illegal to transfer firearms across state lines without going through an FFL, except under very limited circumstances (inheritance, etc). I am not a lawyer and do not take what I say as being in any way advice r/e the legality of something, but I know that in many of the free states it is legal to loan a firearm to another person. https://www.atf.gov/content/firearms-frequently-asked-questions-unlicensed-persons Check the answer to question #1. I highly doubt that California is okay with that. Long and short answer: If you want her to have the firearms, you're probably going to have to go through a dealer.

[waksupi]

Lance, are you going to be an outlaw, or whistle Dixie? ;-) Knowing myself, I would go the outlaw trail.

[montana_charlie]

I am certain that I can legally give a firearm to another private individual in Montana ... without a background check or FFL holder being involved ... and he may legally keep and use it forever.

If that person travels to California, soon after the giving or at some later stage in his life, it will be his responsibility to determine if he can carry that firearm into the state.

CM

[Duckiller]

About 2000 I bought a shotgun in Michigan from a pawn shop/FFL. Shop wasn't sure what was legal so they called ATF. They were told that they could sell me the gun but it was my responsibility to clear with California authorities. Since the gun never left Michigan California authorities don't know I have it, they know about a bunch of other guns. Based on discussions I have had with FFLs and ATF you may not be able to deliver a gun to a California resident in another state. It may have to be sent to a California FFL who will do the necessary paper work for your friend to take possession of her guns. This is the most frustrating part of California gun law. Why should the state of California be able to control what I do in a different state?

[JSnover]

Based on discussions I have had with FFLs and ATF you may not be able to deliver a gun to a California resident in another state. It may have to be sent to a California FFL who will do the necessary paper work for your friend to take possession of her guns. This is the most frustrating part of California gun law. Why should the state of California be able to control what I do in a different state?
Massachusetts gun laws are almost as bad. They would consider it an "import" and all paperwork would have to be submitted. And make sure it's not on the list of guns banned by the state.

[starmac]

I am with Waksupi and the outlaw trail. lol
It would probably not be an issue in most states, but the way I understand it a person taking it to cali has to register it with the state (at least the hand gun) and it would have to be on the APPROVED list to even do that.

[runfiverun]

you could give it to me and I could have it here in Idaho.
then we don't gotta worry about no paperwork, living in a free state has some advantages.

I'm pretty sure California would love for the guns to be registered, but I ain't so clear on their laws and would pretty much just ignore them.
I'd sleep pretty good at night too.

[smokeywolf]

FineSwine, Brown and Kamala Harris spit on the Constitution every day. They think the State should have more rights than the people. They're not going to let little thing like the Constitution keep them from creating a database containing the names of every gun owner in the State and a record of every firearm they own. Besides, someday some disaster will strike, martial law will be declared and then they'll have their chance to steal all those guns. Just like what happened in New Orleans during the Katrina aftermath.

[Bzcraig]

As Duckiller mentioned the guns, buyer and seller must go to the CA FFL, show ID and the buyer wait the prerequisite 10 days to get the guns. The only good part is a private party can legally transfer to another private party guns not on the CA approved list.

[beroen]

As Duckiller mentioned the guns, buyer and seller must go to the CA FFL, show ID and the buyer wait the prerequisite 10 days to get the guns. The only good part is a private party can legally transfer to another private party guns not on the CA approved list.
Pretty sure That's not the case any longer. the only way it's legal to get off roster pistols now is if it is a parent/child or child/parent transfer or LEO can buy then sell once in CA...

The giver could if the pistol was on roster or roster exempt (most wheelguns) ship the fire arms to a FFL and then they could be transferred without the giver being present.

Commieforina

[Bzcraig]

Pretty sure That's not the case any longer. the only way it's legal to get off roster pistols now is if it is a parent/child or child/parent transfer or LEO can buy then sell once in CA...

The giver could if the pistol was on roster or roster exempt (most wheelguns) ship the fire arms to a FFL and then they could be transferred without the giver being present.

Commieforina

Handguns transferred through PPT are exempt from the Roster. (Penal Code 12132(a))
PPT= private party transfer.
although I read, which I didn't know, buyer and seller must be CA residents.

[Whiterabbit]

A friend from San Diego County, California, will be visiting in Montana for a few weeks. May I give her a cartridge rifle and cartridge revolver, each with a few boxes of ammunition. May she legally return to California with guns and ammunition to use/have without any interference, regulation, registration - that is, with zero governmental interference?

If she can get her hands on a Montana state driver's license, surrendering her CA state drivers license, she is officially a Montana state resident. You can transfer like any other in-state transfer. If she happens to move to CA later, she can take her property with her. The revolver might need to be declared, but not brought in through a dealer. the long gun is a done deal.

Of course, I don't think that's likely for a 3-week residency. I think she has to be there for 50.1% of the year?

[mtnman31]

I wouldn't even ask the question. If it is someone I trust and am willing to give a firearm to, I am just going to do it. I assume she can legally own firearms.

[beroen]

Handguns transferred through PPT are exempt from the Roster. (Penal Code 12132(a))
PPT= private party transfer.
although I read, which I didn't know, buyer and seller must be CA residents.
Eggsackly if they are here they are here. The question is now how do we get them here. We where shot down in court they deemed the roster constitutional they must have low reading comprehension skills.

[kristopher.wheeler]

If she can get her hands on a Montana state driver's license, surrendering her CA state drivers license, she is officially a Montana state resident. You can transfer like any other in-state transfer. If she happens to move to CA later, she can take her property with her. The revolver might need to be declared, but not brought in through a dealer. the long gun is a done deal.

Of course, I don't think that's likely for a 3-week residency. I think she has to be there for 50.1% of the year?
ATF doesn't require you to be in a state for any real length of time to be a resident. You just have to be there with the *intention* of being a resident. That does not mean that you can zip over to a free state, rent a room at a Motel 6 and be a resident for a day. It's more aimed at people who own vacation homes in other states. As an example, if you lived in Massachusetts and had a vacation home in Florida that you spent two weeks at every summer, during those two weeks that you are a Florida resident, you would legally be able to purchase any firearms you want. You could then bring those firearms back to Massachusetts, providing that they meet the crazy AWB laws. Again, IANAL and do not take what I say as being legal advice.

There is no legal way to give your friend the firearms out of state without going through an FFL.

[Duckiller]

For those that care California now maintains a list of long guns and who owns them. This started in early 2014. I may have to vote for Ms. Harris for Senator to get a new Attorney General. She will be replacing another idiot and crook, remember the house bank, so the country would be no worse off. Private party sales are exempt from the handgun drop list.

[Blacksmith]

I live within spitting distance of two different state lines and am a resident of one of the most restrictive gun law states in the country. I have a number of interstate transfers under my belt. If in doubt check my answers with an FFL, attorney or the ATF because if you don't do it right you could loose your right to own firearms forever.

If both are resident of the same state state law applies. If residents of different states Interstate Commerce Laws from the Federal Government applies.

Federal Law says:
Short answer for a long gun is if buyer and seller are from different states and the transfer is legal in both states then it must go through an FFL who can be in either state.
Short answer for a handgun is if buyer and seller are from different states and the transfer is legal in both states the transfer must be made through an FFL in the receiving party's state.

ATF Frequently Asked Questions
https://www.atf.gov/content/Firearms/firearms-industry/FAQ-firearms

These are just a few of the FAQ's. Others may apply in your particular circumstances so do your own due diligence.


What record-keeping procedures should be followed when two private individuals want to engage in a firearms transaction?

When a transaction takes place between private (unlicensed) persons who reside in the same State, the Gun Control Act (GCA) does not require any record keeping. A private person may sell a firearm to another private individual in his or her State of residence and, similarly, a private individual may buy a firearm from another private person who resides in the same State. It is not necessary under Federal law for a Federal firearms licensee (FFL) to assist in the sale or transfer when the buyer and seller are “same-State” residents. Of course, the transferor/seller may not knowingly transfer a firearm to someone who falls within any of the categories of prohibited persons contained in the GCA. See 18 U.S.C. §§ 922(g) and (n). However, as stated above, there are no GCA-required records to be completed by either party to the transfer.

There may be State or local laws or regulations that govern this type of transaction. Contact State Police units or the office of your State Attorney General for information on any such requirements.
Please note that if a private person wants to obtain a firearm from a private person who resides in another State, the firearm will have to be shipped to an FFL in the buyer’s State. The FFL will be responsible for record keeping. See also Question B3.



What constitutes residency in a State?

The State of residence is the State in which an individual is present; the individual also must have an intention of making a home in that State. A member of the Armed Forces on active duty is a resident of the State in which his or her permanent duty station is located. If a member of the Armed Forces maintains a home in one State and the member’s permanent duty station is in a nearby State to which he or she commutes each day, then the member has two States of residence and may purchase a firearm in either the State where the duty station is located or the State where the home is maintained. An alien who is legally in the United States is considered to be a resident of a State only if the alien is residing in that State and has resided in that State continuously for a period of at least 90 days prior to the date of sale of the firearm. See also Item 5, “Sales to Aliens in the United States,” in the General Information section of this publication.

[18 U.S.C. 921(b), 922(a) (3), and 922(b)(3), 27 CFR 478.11]



May an unlicensed person obtain a firearm from an out-of-State source if the person arranges to obtain the firearm through a licensed dealer in the purchaser's own State?

A person not licensed under the GCA and not prohibited from acquiring firearms may purchase a firearm from an out-of-State source and obtain the firearm if an arrangement is made with a licensed dealer in the purchaser’s State of residence for the purchaser to obtain the firearm from the dealer.
[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(3) and 922(b)(3)]


From whom may an unlicensed person acquire a firearm under the GCA?

A person may only acquire a firearm within the person’s own State, except that he or she may purchase or otherwise acquire a rifle or shotgun, in person, at a licensee’s premises in any State, provided the sale complies with State laws applicable in the State of sale and the State where the purchaser resides. A person may borrow or rent a firearm in any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes.
[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(3) and (5), 922(b)(3), 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30]


To whom may an unlicensed person transfer firearms under the GCA?

A person may sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his State, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may loan or rent a firearm to a resident of any State for temporary use for lawful sporting purposes, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law. A person may sell or transfer a firearm to a licensee in any State. However, a firearm other than a curio or relic may not be transferred interstate to a licensed collector.
[18 U.S.C. 922(a)(3) and (5), 922(d), 27 CFR 478.29 and 478.30]

[starmac]

Got to love a free country where you have to pay to GIVE something away legally. lol
I have never been asked, and never lived in a state where private sales required anything, but if I happenned to buy one out of state, as far as anybody else would be concerned, I would have owned it and brought it with me. lol

[Whiterabbit]

Got to love a free country

Problem is, when you can pick between Freedom in one hand, and a Freebie in the other hand, some people..........

[w5pv]

Shoot,silencesilence,silence,etc above all silence

[Whiterabbit]

Lots of big words from folks here. Here's the reality:

Noone, from this website particularly, is going to proceed in any manner that is not consistent with law, up to and including not gifting to begin with if avoiding petty governmental meddling is deemed more important than making the gift happen. Why?

Because, as we Gun Owners (capitalized for a reason) overwhelmingly tend to be, are law abiding citizens. And conduct ourselves as such, even when the laws are unjust or ridiculous or worse.

[shooterg]

And if the gun(s) were originally purchased before 1968, pre 4473 forms with no paper trail, who's to say it wasn't always theirs.

[Blacksmith]

All you have to do if something goes wrong is swear to it in court. I don't perjure myself.