Lanolin for core swage lube question.

[Capt. Senile]

Does the lanolin for case or core swage lube have to be in paste form, or can lanolin oil be used?

Curious because I have several bottles of lanolin oil hanging around.

Thanks in advance.

[runfiverun]

I think you'll be fine.
I use the anhydrous lanolin and cut it in third with castor oil and add a smidge of neets-foot oil.
I'd try what you have out first by sizing a couple of pieces of brass with it and seeing how it works there.

[Bills Shed]

You can only try and see how it goes. Lanolin oil sounds very thin but you never know. Half the fun is finding out better methods to achieve good results. You do not need much lube and if you over do the lube it can be forced into a corner and cause the core not to form into a perfect cylinder. In my experience thinner lanolin/ castor oil lube for core swaging is better than to thick. When the temp drops the consistency of my lube changes as well so I sometimes use more castor oil: lanolin to thin it out a bit.Bill

[Utah Shooter]

Give it a try! I have no doubt it will work for core forming. When I first started and did not know any better I was using RCBS lube.

[MUSTANG]

Is this or a similar product what you are referring to?

Now Foods Liquid Lanolin Pure, 4 Ounce

http://www.amazon.com/Now-Foods-Liquid-Lanolin-Ounce/dp/B00028MLKC/ref=sr_1_4?ie=UTF8&qid=1430352452&sr=8-4&keywords=Lanolin


I use this product cut with 97% alchol to spray on an RCBS lube pad, then roll my jackets on the pad to get a very light coating before swaging. You add lanoloin until it no longer blends/dissolves, about 4oz to a 16 Oz alcohol bottle is about right. In temps less than 60 degrees; the lanolin will settle out so you need to warm it and shake should that happen.

You can also use pure Lanoline (paste form) from RandyRat on this forum (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/forumdisplay.php?158-RandyRat) mixed with 97% alcohol a little at a time until no more will dissolve.

I also use the same lanolin spray with brass cases for reloading .223 to .50BMG brass. Do not use an alcohol like 70% or so (or less) as there is too much water and it will not dissolve/blend with the liquid lanolin. As close to 100% alcohol as you can get is better. Go to Walmart, CVS, etc.. drug store areas to buy high % alcohol.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Castor oil and lanolin is the usual thing, and I believe the castor oil is necessary only to ensure evenness of application, so the alcohol and pad method ought to be fine, if you avoid using it until all the alcohol has evaporated.

The reason for using those components is that they don't "diesel" under the pressure of swaging. This isn't a danger to the swager, but it removes the lube and may cause dimples in the bullet. Lanolin oil, like many another thing reloaders find a new use for, is only guaranteed for whatever the intended use was, probably as a hand care. So I would guess that some manufacturers add something harmless to swaging, and some add something else.

Another useful property of castor oil is that it doesn't become more viscous at low temperatures as the simple mineral oil. They have been improved a lot since the early days of aviation, when they were used in the total-loss lubricating system of the early rotary engines. The spray caused pilots one of the less publicized perils of First World War aerial combat.

[onomrbil]

Swage cores using regular MOTOR OIL. 19 drops/1,000 .224 cores. Adjust accordingly for other diameters.

[hardcase54]

" DAWN" dishsoap works fine, less cleanup.

[BT Sniper]

So what is the BEST lube for core swage for utmost accuracy? I'm bleeding some 650 grain cores for my 50 BMG match bullets and I'm curious what lube is best for uniform weights and easy clean up????

I'm thinking a motor oil of some sort maybe??? the Dawn dish soap is an interesting idea????

BT

[clodhopper]

Dawn dish soap sounds like a good way to go slippery, cheap, washes off with water.
Unfortunately, it dries the skin on my fingers and causes them to crack.

Isn't good ole RCBS case lube lanoline? I have been swaging my latest batch of cores with the stuff.

[MUSTANG]

Dawn dish soap sounds like a good way to go slippery, cheap, washes off with water.
Unfortunately, it dries the skin on my fingers and causes them to crack.

Isn't good ole RCBS case lube lanoline? I have been swaging my latest batch of cores with the stuff.

Guess I'm behind the times. Last RCBS lube I used came with my first RCBS lube pad (~ 1975, came in a short and wide tube) and it looked and acted like STP, same viscosity. In fact, was common for many reloaders at that time to use STP as a cheaper alternative. So now it's not a petroleum based product?

I'm thinking about trying the Dawn dish washing detergent for core squirting as I need to do a few thousand cores later this month (for .224's). On the surface seems more streamlined (and more wife friendly) than my current process of boiling the cores in a large pan on the kitchen stove to remove the lanolin based swage/sizing lube I currently use for lubing cores while squirting to weight.

[newcastter]

I know the question was about core lube which I use 50/50 lanolin castor oil mix, I wanted to throw out there that I use STP oil treatment for derimming and it works great, and a lil goes a looong way.

[aaronraad]

I tried Lanox MX4 (http://www.inoxmx.com/inox/mx4-lubricant/) but it diesel'd out a bit.

The MX6 Food Grade - Extreme pressure is probably better suited?

BT Sniper

How uniform are you aiming for with the 510 cal core weights? Percentage wise 1.0gr in a 650gr bullet mass is only a 0.15..% error, or the same as 0.0825gr mass error in a 55gr bullet mass.

Standard grade motor might be your best choice but most of it still comes down to trying to use the minimum quantity and the application method from what I've experienced. If you were getting pedantic you would even look at optimising the surface roughness and maybe profile of the cut/cast raw cores to suit the lubricant as this can have a significant affect on the amount of lubricant that adheres to the surface.

Controlling temperature would also be important for consistency over the batch.

Removal of the lubricant can be complicated because adhesion might actually be a desirable feature for that particular lubricant. Lubricants can also leave a thin residue on the surface if they don't get 'complexed' into the cleaning process especially when the temperature is raised for the cleaning solution allowing flash drying to take place in cold air or a cold water rinse. Lanolin is very 'waxy' and if not controlled during cleaning, flash dry can occur. Other lubricants that can be difficult are silicates, molybdenum disulphide (MSO2) and graphite...how hard is it to remove fingerprinting dust!

Hard tap water can introduce undesirable ions which can prevent or consume complexing agents or surface wetters.

Solvent cleaning isn't necessarily perfect if not completely rinsed off given they usually work on a flash drying method also, let alone the toxins prevalent in the very effective solvents. Some solvents/degreasers also leave a thin film of their own not necessarily containing any of the lubricant/soils you are trying to remove.

From an 'active' surface preparation of ferrous articles just prior to electroplating and thermo-set inorganic thin film paint background dyne test inks are a very useful repeatable check. This would be a useful check prior to your choice of etching or oxidising the cores in a consistent manner and better understanding how effective your particular surface cleaning system is.

You can buy the ink in a pen form such as - http://www.accudynetest.com/adtpen.html for example. A good starting point is a minimum surface activation measurement of 38 dynes/cm for pass/fail, which is a common industry standard of printing on plastics. The pens are simple to use and relatively inexpensive.

I know this isn't exactly a straight answer to your question, but there is an entire industry out there on lubricants and another one cleaning systems because if you do it often enough, one day the percentages will catch up with you. There is a lot to be said for knowing your system and where it's limits are.

I've had a quick look through this article by a chemical supplier and it seems like a reasonable summary even though it's aimed at electroplating http://newstar-chemicals.com/_pdf/Chemical%20Surface%20Preparation%20for%20Electropl ated%20and%20Metallic%20Coatings.pdf It is ironic to note that if you compared the processes used by hot dip galvanizers, electroplaters and even powder coaters for pretreating ferrous articles they would be significantly different, yet essentially all trying to achieve the same result in terms of surface activation/cleaning. Even those claiming to be achieve industry best practices and efficiency struggle to see the bigger picture at times while claiming to deliver the best value to their customers, let alone return to their shareholders.

[BT Sniper]

I don't know how precise I'll need to get yet with the 50 BMG cores but I just noticed a 5 grain swing (yes less then 1% of total weight but with the right lube applied I am sure it will do a LOT better) with a core that didn't have enough lube and the next one that I applied a thin coat of lanolin swage lube to.

I precisely trim the nose and any excess lead from the formed bullet before I seat the VLD ballistic tip so any slight variation in core weights will again have a chance to be trimmed and equaled out. I am just getting ready to bleed a few hundred cores, maybe up to 1,000 and was curious what everyone else is doing. I suppose my main concern is what lube will work best and be completely removed allowing for best adhesions of the core to jacket.

Thanks, Keep the ideas and tips coming.

Good shooting and swage on!

BT

[R.Ph. 380]

Have to let you young guys mess with the 50's. My old shoulders can't stand up to more than the 30-06 now, and that not very often.

Bill

[hardcase54]

I know that feeling. That is the reason my "big bore" is now my 7x57.

[Faret]

My 50 kicks less than the 06! :grin:

[BT Sniper]

Tried the Dawn liquid soap for core swage lube with what must have been about 500 cores. Seemed to work pretty good. It certainly cleaned off easy enough. Don't know if it was more or less accurate then any other lube for swaging cores.

BT