308 to 35 Rem done my way

[GRUMPA]

Figured I would finally make a thread on how I do these. I'll say it again this is not something the average every day reloader is going to be able to do. There's equipment used that isn't something that folks can just afford to get when they want it, so keep that in mind.

I'm not done converting these either, I still have to finish up forming and reaming them but with clouds coming in I'm at a virtual stand-still since my power comes from the sun.

The very first thing I do is run them in the stainless steel media tumbler, these need to be clean inside and out but more on the outside.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=128218&d=1421886153

Once I get them cleaned and dried....I size them all in a 308 sizer die to more or less remove the primer and round up the necks. Once that's done I run them all through the Dillon super swager and remove the primer crimp.

Once done I take them to the lathe and machine the head only to .355 -.001 and there's a reason for this. If you don't what will happen is on the next forming operation the head will want to distort to the point that it will create a bowl, or curve the head to the point holding the gauge dimension is almost impossible to do correctly.

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I made a spud so that the primer pocket just fits into the little mandrel I made and I use a live center on the other end.

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I machine the head to the size I mentioned already and I put a chamfer on as well since I removed almost all of the factory chamfer.

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Notice when I have the case in the lathe the live center creates what I call a bell mouth, I want that to happen for easier feeding for the expander rod when I form the new neck.

Now that I have the first part machined it's time to bring them into the house and start forming, well......the first part of it anyway.

[GRUMPA]

Now that I have the head machined down it's time to reduce the body diameter, and here's what I use for that.

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All I use for the first swaging operation is a LEE push through .452 sizer die. Believe me when I say that it'll be ruined in short order, the process is going to open up that sizer die so plan on getting a replacement die in short order. I've brought up this point in the past.....brass can and will want to "SPRING BACK" when it's being formed, so if you think that the body diameter is going to be .452 when you swage it think again. When I swage them the first time (yes there's more than 1 swage operation) plan on the body diameter to be right about .458 or so. I had another push through die made by one of our members Goodsteel, he made 1 for me that is made from A2 and heat treated. let's say that not only the LEE push through sizer had spring back but so does the brass. If a person were to use a .451 LEE push through sizer the diameter of the body would be about .455 from spring back, both from the die itself expanding a bit and spring back from the case. So you have 2 things working against you due to expansion and contraction, so I had a custom die made just for this which I';ll add works better than I had hoped.

The die I had Goodsteel make for me is just under .451 but the case when run through it it measures .453 so there's still some spring back from the case which is something that just can't be avoided.

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Once I get them run through the swage press (both times) it's now time to do the preliminary sizing. That I use the RCBS RCII press for but I did have to make a custom expander for. When I form them the first time I want the new neck so that the taper (if any) is in the inside so that when I ream them I take most of it out. If I were to use a factory sized expander the moment the expander went through it when the case is lowered any taper would now be on the outside. Here's a picture of of a factory expander on the left and the 1 I made on the right.

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When I form the new gauge dimension I hold it to the very low of the tolerance, I do this because after I ream the necks and use the factory expander it will want to pull the neck and make the gauge dimension longer. Normally it will do that about .003 give or take, but whenever you do machining your the one that needs to be in control.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=128219&d=1421886430

This is a picture of a 358Win but it'll give you a real good idea of what I have to use to make sure things are where they're supposed to be. There is no guessing when you do something like this, so if you don't have proper equipment or tools I wouldn't advise attempting to do something like this.

The next procedure will be setting them up on my lathe and reaming the necks, I have my own way of doing that but like I mentioned I need the power which I don't have right now. We are supposed to have nothing but clouds for the next few days, so I'll get the last of the procedure up next week some time. But at least this will give folks an idea of what it involves when I do them..

[dragon813gt]

Very impressive and thanks for sharing. The use of a lathe precludes me from doing this conversion myself. It's on the list of tools I need ;)

[KLR]

Great explanation! I like that spud system and the way your live center starts the flair.

BTW, when you swage down the body, does it close the primer pocket any?

[GRUMPA]

Not a bit actually, but if you don't machine the head down plan on that happening..

[KLR]

Hmmm... I have a batch of brass that doesn't fit as tightly as I'd like with my Winchester primers. Maybe I could leave the rim .002 larger than the die and swage the primer pocket down slightly.

BTW, have you tried swaging in smaller steps?

[GRUMPA]

If I had what seemed like slightly larger primer pockets, I would just work with different brass. I'm not known for fussing with brass that's not considered Unobtainium so why bother.

For me when I swage the body down I don't want to make a career out of it. When a person pulls a handle 2k times a day it turns laborious real quick.

[W.R.Buchanan]

When a person pulls a handle 2k times a day it turns laborious real quick.

This is why they make grand children.:mrgreen:

Randy

[madsenshooter]

Just for the heck of it, I made a few 35 Rem from heavy GI 7.62x51mm. I simply used a swage die that CH4D made for me when I wanted to make 6.5 Japanese from the GI brass. Their swage die was 8x56MS die that you ran the brass into with a pusher and knocked back out with a hammer.

[GRUMPA]

After doing the preliminary case forming I took the cases to the lathe for the reaming operation. This goes quick but after indicating everything in to within .001 it's a simple matter of removing the material from the inside of the neck.

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After the reaming operation I bring them back into the house for there final forming. I just put the factory expander rod in the sizing die and run them up in the die which goes fairly quickly. After that it's back out to the shop to run them on the trimmer to bring them to 1.920-.020. Here's a before, during, and after trimming shot.

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[georgerkahn]

Thank you, GRUMPA, for posting this, as well as -- of course -- doing this. I AM impressed, and as soon as my scant supply of .35 Rem diminishes -- I do plan on ordering some from you!
Best!
georgerkahn

[GRUMPA]

Thank you, GRUMPA, for posting this, as well as -- of course -- doing this. I AM impressed, and as soon as my scant supply of .35 Rem diminishes -- I do plan on ordering some from you!
Best!
georgerkahn


I get asked all the time if I have any left, so think of it this way.

No matter what time of year it is, it'll always be there.

Think of it as a supply that never runs out.

[jrap]

Thank you for showing us the process. When i get a .35 I'll be sure to get some brass from you

[William Yanda]

I read on the internet-gotta be true, right-that 35 Remington brass is long lived because of the low pressures for the cartridge.
Do you have any feedback on the expected life of your converted brass.
Regards
Bill

[GRUMPA]

On something like that the only thing I can say is to get into the 35Rem thread in the VS section, or click the link in my signature and go from there. And by that... PM some of the members that have gotten some of them and ask them. Typically when folks receive it they remark on how well they look, and that's about it. Nobody has ever gotten back to me with an expired case yet, not ever.

[1hole]

I've long neck sized my .35 R cases in Lee's collet neck sizer, simply because that die does the least amount of work on the metal. Even tho I load to book max with IMR 4064 my cases last a looong time.