Reloading Boo-Boo

[Maineboy]

Yesterday I threw a few different loads together for my newly acquired Ruger American in 243. One load consisted of the Speer 100 gain BT and a compressed load of IMR7828 with CCI200 primers in R-P cases. Well, I thought I had done things right but when I went to shoot them this morning, the first eight rounds failed to fire. Nothing happened. My first reaction was that there was something wrong with the powder as it was a brand new bottle but when the last 2 rounds did go off I thought it could have been a primer problem. Back in my reloading room this afternoon, I pulled those bullets and discovered there was no powder in the cases and the primers did fire. Apparently I had shut off the powder measure after loading 2 rounds and didn't look into the cases before seating the bullets. I've had lots of screw ups over my many reloading years but that was the first time this has happened to me. From what I've learned, the primer should have driven the bullet into the bore where it would lodge halfway down the barrel and I would have a heck of a time removing it but that didn't happen ... eight times.

[sigep1764]

You need to go buy lottery tickets... seriously though, glad you and the new member of the family are all right.

[Shiloh]

In your case, see #8
http://www.rifle-accuracy-reports.com/Reloading_Steps.html

You are fortunate you didn't get a bullet stuck.

SHiloh

[bedbugbilly]

Glad it ended O.K. for you and you didn't have a slug in the bore when the loaded ones went off. I'm really surprised that the primer didn't drive the boolit out. I had an empty 38 special one time that I screwed up on (and it was "I" that messed up) and luckily I caught it when I fired and just got a primer "poof" - I was surprised how far a primer could drive a .359 WC into a barrel before it lodged.

Be safe . . . be careful . . . . and take it for what it is . . . a learning experience and a reminder to check each casing for a powder drop. :-)

[Maineboy]

There was no noise at all and the bullet didn't seem to move in the case.

[mongoose33]

The first EIGHT rounds failed to fire? One is a goof, two means you stop until you figure it out.

And yes, you're lucky you didn't stick a bullet in the barrel and then have a kaboom.

[SP5315]

Are you sure that the primers fired? After eight tries and no stuck bullet in the barrel I'll second it on buying the lottery tickets. I had a strange one yesterday myself and will be improving the lighting at my bench and inspecting closer at every step. I'm happy the everything worked out safely in your favor.

[Hannibal]

I had the same thing happen in the same caliber. Didn't know what the problem was until I pulled the bullet. Primer had obviously gone off, bullet did not appear to have moved at all. But I didn't fire the rounds I had left, I pulled them all down. I'd made the mistake only once, but I wasn't going to take that for granted.

[303Guy]

The OP examined each cartridge that didn't fire and found nothing amiss (other than that it did not fire).

I've had that with CCI primers. They didn't dislodge bullets. You might ask why I had powder-less cartridges - well, it was before I had a bullet lodge in the throat and tried to chamber another. That could have ended badly! Now I place the powdered cases in the case holder and shine a light into them and look before picking up and seating bullets/boolits. Federal primers do seem to dislodge a bullet with annealed necks but that could be from an over-annealed state, ie lack of neck tension.

[Maineboy]

The first EIGHT rounds failed to fire? One is a goof, two means you stop until you figure it out.

And yes, you're lucky you didn't stick a bullet in the barrel and then have a kaboom.

There wasn't any danger of having a kaboom. The way it went was I pulled the trigger and nothing happened. I waited about 30 seconds, removed and examined the cartridge. Seeing nothing unusual but a dented primer, I repeated the process 7 more times. By the ninth time I was basically just pointing the gun down range and pulling the trigger. When that round went off, I was quite surprised Same for the tenth.

[243winxb]

threw a few different loads together And this may happen http://www.photobucket.com/kabooom

[303Guy]

http://www.photobucket.com/kabooom

I'd say most of those cases couldn't be reloaded - nor would those guns ever fire again! Holy cow!

Not inspecting each case in the loading tray for correct powder level is risky. I suspect that many so called SEE's are actually double charges of an already near max load.

It can also happen that a bullet gets dislodged by the primer and one thinks he forgot to re-chamber a round after a previous shot and the next round gets it's bullet pushed back into the case by the one stuck in the throat. Then there would be a reduced powder space and a double bullet. That would end badly!

[MGnoob]

If you have no powder, your gun won't cycle.. so you'd have to rack it without inspecting for obstruction for a kaboom to happen.
Also IMO with a projectile sized .002 over a primer won't have the force to push the projectile far enough for another round to be chambered.Depending on your particular firearm. You could get bullet setback on the next cartage.this is why I like a reasonably firm crimp.
maybe some of the heavier slide handguns or heavier spring would be more susceptible to such a situation.

i rarely see this in my reloading.....what i have experienced lately when loading .223 is having a complete cartrage with a second projectile in the case..
This had me so freak-out i almost wanted to fire it to know how bad it would be...while the spare projectile concerns me do to it altering the case volume, my biggest concern was the 2nd projectile not leaving the barrel... i would probibly bet at 50,000+psi they'd both come out the barrel.. maybe not if it settle to the bottom of the case, but i would find that unlikely do to the case being completely stuffed full.

since i'm fully automated progressive loading it is my belief projectile where getting stuck in the seating/crimp die then forcing the next projectile into the next case and seating the stuck projectile on top.

when in doubt i give them the "shake test" but with mixed brass with varring case volume it's not a great method.. it would be hard to weight them to check for powder weight.but in my case it would be effective do to the weight of a spare projectile...

while i try to prevent these things i find it highly likely i've fired at-least one that way.

Be careful

[Doggonekid]

Glad you still got all 10 fingers. Every time I had a similar situation the primer would launch the boolit into the barrel.

[wddodge]

since i'm fully automated progressive loading it is my belief projectile where getting stuck in the seating/crimp die then forcing the next projectile into the next case and seating the stuck projectile on top.


Be careful

It this is what really happened, did you find the case that didn't have a projectile seated in it?? I use the Lee FCD on my .223's and it never touches the projectile, just the case.

I just re-read your post. I missed that you seat/crimp at the same time. I use separate dies for this.

Denny

[26Charlie]

I always look in every case before seating bullet - you can get these really bright flashlights at the hardware store for a few bucks. Run down each row in
the loading block to make sure the powder level in each case is the same before seating any bullets. Also. Count out your primers to match the number of cases -
if you are shy or over, investigate why.

[MGnoob]

It this is what really happened, did you find the case that didn't have a projectile seated in it?? I use the Lee FCD on my .223's and it never touches the projectile, just the case.

I just re-read your post. I missed that you seat/crimp at the same time. I use separate dies for this.

Denny

Yes, there where case(s) missing projectile; but, sometimes when the shelf plate indexes it will through the projectile from the case while traveling to the final seat/crimp position.While it is sum what rare for this to happen, usually I watch station 1 and station 7 the most (Dillion 1050) so when I find a single case without a projectile Spilling it's powder everywhere. I assume it's just missing which is usually the case..it turns out they have shown up inside a complete cartrage..
I've been inspecting brass for being over flared allowing an extra projectile to enter the case at station 6 (bullet dropper) I seem to have ruled this out and the only station left would be seeting/crimping. I haven't been able to reproduce it since it's only happened a few time in about 20k reloads that I know of.

[gpidaho]

I've had the empty case error a couple times over 25yrs. none ever exited the case, just made a small pop and I knew what happened. Just a black powder burn on the boolit base when pulled, never even jumped crimp on a 357. GP

[DrCaveman]

So, the primer was dented, and when you de-primed the case, you saw evidence that the primer had ignited, yet "nothing happened"? That seems odd, since a primer alone makes a nice crack when it ignites. Even if the boolit barely moves or does not move at all, you should feel or hear some evidence of ignition. Ive had plenty of light strikes which required a second hit from the firing pin or in some cases a switch to stronger hammer/pin spring, or different primer.

It kinda sounds like your primers were screwy too. Im having difficulty imagining the primers going off and neither making a sound nor moving the bullet.

Thankfully, you were spared any injury to your self or gun.

[scattershot]

Thanks for being man enough to admit it. Every one goofs once in awhile. Glad you weren't hurt, and possibly a newb will profit from your post.

[Hannibal]

So, the primer was dented, and when you de-primed the case, you saw evidence that the primer had ignited, yet "nothing happened"? That seems odd, since a primer alone makes a nice crack when it ignites. Even if the boolit barely moves or does not move at all, you should feel or hear some evidence of ignition. Ive had plenty of light strikes which required a second hit from the firing pin or in some cases a switch to stronger hammer/pin spring, or different primer.

It kinda sounds like your primers were screwy too. Im having difficulty imagining the primers going off and neither making a sound nor moving the bullet.

Thankfully, you were spared any injury to your self or gun.

I can vouch for his observation as the round I had that did not fire made no sound I could detect while wearing ear plugs, and had soot on the base of the bullet. The primer obviously went off, the bullet did not appear to have budged. Is this a bottle necked/.243 cartridge anomoly? That I CAN NOT vouch for.

[MGnoob]

I'm sure that there's a lot a variables but it seems to me a good crimp can allevite some trouble with a primer moving a projectile into the barrel. Or an obstruction in the barrel setting back a projectile.
I use to only crimp enough so when extracting an unfired round it won't pull the projectile from the case leaving you with an obstruction.
I crimp more than that now for the safety reasons.

I don't seem to have an issue with the crimp sizing the projectile.
Anyone who says they've never experienced these issue would be full of it. These thing you discover right when you start reloading.

[Hannibal]

I'm sure that there's a lot a variables but it seems to me a good crimp can allevite some trouble with a primer moving a projectile into the barrel. Or an obstruction in the barrel setting back a projectile.
I use to only crimp enough so when extracting an unfired round it won't pull the projectile from the case leaving you with an obstruction.
I crimp more than that now for the safety reasons.

I don't seem to have an issue with the crimp sizing the projectile.
Anyone who says they've never experienced these issue would be full of it. These thing you discover right when you start reloading.


I was just discussing the crimp issue with a friend earlier this evening. I find it annoying to say the least that there is no readily identifiable way to measure the amount of crimp on a bullet, and no ready means of identifying your die position. I presume this is because of all the potential brass/bullet variables, but it still annoys me. If anyone has a crimp measurement method developed, I'd sure like to hear it.

I'm not sure I understand your crimp preventing a barrel obstruction setting the bullet back theory?

[MGnoob]

I was just discussing the crimp issue with a friend earlier this evening. I find it annoying to say the least that there is no readily identifiable way to measure the amount of crimp on a bullet, and no ready means of identifying your die position. I presume this is because of all the potential brass/bullet variables, but it still annoys me. If anyone has a crimp measurement method developed, I'd sure like to hear it.

I deal with the brass variations by finding a happy medium. If a pulled projectile is being sized your over doing it. (This doesn't work well with .223)if your not crimping enough you'll know by extracting a cartage from the chamber and measuring oal..

After that I just inspect all jams/missfeeds for setback. I prefer when possible to be able to slam the action closed striping a cartrage and forcing it against a projectile in the throat of the barrel. (Ideally on an unprimed test cartrage)

Finnally once I get it where I want it, I have benefit of changing entire tool heads so I don't have to play with it again unless I notice a problem or need to load different weight, profile, sized projectile. (Not all my firearms like .002" over, like I prefer)