Core swage lube

[clodhopper]

Another thread here, http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?271672-BNH-of-cores Was hijacked to talk a bit about core swage lube.

Houndog's comment about water soluble cutting oil just make so much sense, I did not want to go beg some expensive oil from a machine shop.

When manually mixing some water soluble oil recently it looked and mixed like so much like Murphy oil soap.

Today I swaged cores lubed with murphy. No squeak. I plan to wash it of with dawn.

[R.Ph. 380]

Contain any water? Wife uses Murphy's on the furniture. Interesting idea.

Bill

[clodhopper]

I did not add water to the oil soap.

[clodhopper]

Using the Murphy oil soap, I put several drops with cores in a ziplock bag. Kneaded them around for a while to coat all surfaces.
The core sizing went well, no squeaks or other signs of poor lube.
Washing the lube off, I put the cores in plastic jar fill it 3/4 with hot water and rolled them around for while. The water turned milky, but given some shaking was not sudsy.
Then, I washed them in dawn, and rinsed until the suds was gone.
Strained the excess water, rolled them around in an old bath towel, let them dry overnight on the floor underneath the woodstove.
Friday evening they will have set 4 1/2 days for some oxidation.

[clodhopper]

Today my cores have changed color, a little darker. Hopefully that is a sign of oxidation in progress.
Compared to cores I did three weeks ago, swaged with two stroke motor oil then washed in acetone that still look shiny.

Sure would appreciate comments on this.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I suspect the ingredient in murphy's oil soap, that is oxidizing your cores is "potassium hydroxide: lye.".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Potassium_hydroxide

=========================================
According to Francy in a thread titled, "Can anyone tell me the ingredients in Murphy's Oil Soap?".


so, i called colgate/palmolive to figure this out. here are the ingredients (with some explanations to follow): water, potassium tall oil soap, amine oxide, citrus fragrance, potassium hydroxide, HEDTA.


soap: Sodium or potassium salts of long chain fatty acids. These detergent substances are obtained by boiling natural oils or fats with caustic alkali. Sodium soaps are harder and are used as topical anti-infectives and vehicles in pills and liniments; potassium soaps are soft, used as vehicles for ointments and also as topical antimicrobials.

tall oil: An oil derived from wood pulp and used in making soaps or lubricants; A by-product of the sulphate pulping of resinous woods, consisting mainly of resin acids and fatty acids, with smaller amounts of neutral substances. (doesn't it seem like a stretch to call this a natural vegetable oil? maybe by strict definition, but it conjures images in my mind of the "gloppity glop" waste that is produced in theLorax.))

amine oxide is a thickner, foam booster, and a chelating agent (something to do with binding to minerals).

potassium hydroxide: lye. not sure about this one. lye is used to make soap, but i was under the impression that the lye was used up in the chemical reaction, and thus isn't an ingredient in the finished (e.g. bar) soap. it is a strong alkali.

citrus fragrance: supposedly a "natural oil," but i didn't ask what. but who knows where it comes from. perhaps it too is a byproduct of some factory process)

HEDTA: one of those absurdly long named preservatives.

not nearly as "natural" as the label would have us believe, is it? ack.

WHY WHY don't cleaners have to have the ingredients on the labels?? grrrr.


http://www.mothering.com/forum/11-natural-body-care/323585-update-got-em-can-anyone-tell-me-ingredients-murphy-s-oil-soap.html#post3581282

[clodhopper]

Wow! Thanks for the input Jon, I better get cleaning my core swage die.

[hardcase54]

I've used "Dawn" dish soap for cores since the 80's. Lanolin for seating and point forming.

[pertnear]

I'm definitely a newbie when it comes to swaging but I got my process from the a precision shooters forum & it has been working for me. I "lightly" spray silicon lube on a rag & run it over the lead wire before I rough cut it. From there it goes to the squirt die. I clean the finished cores with a rubbing alcohol bath. While a water soluble bath does makes a lot of sense the alcohol is easy & cheap & thorough.

FWIW

[Utah Shooter]

Today my cores have changed color, a little darker. Hopefully that is a sign of oxidation in progress.
Compared to cores I did three weeks ago, swaged with two stroke motor oil then washed in acetone that still look shiny.

Sure would appreciate comments on this.
When mine oxidize they actually get a bit lighter in color. Just like other things that oxidize white.

I'm definitely a newbie when it comes to swaging but I got my process from the a precision shooters forum & it has been working for me. I "lightly" spray silicon lube on a rag & run it over the lead wire before I rough cut it. From there it goes to the squirt die. I clean the finished cores with a rubbing alcohol bath. While a water soluble bath does makes a lot of sense the alcohol is easy & cheap & thorough.

FWIW

Funny I know a gent who swears by this but have had die makers say to stay away from this. Apparently silicon does not come off and causes slip between the jacket and lead after seating.

[B R Shooter]

I use RCBS water soluble Case Lube II. Once I cut the wire into rough core length, I put a little of this lube in a jar with the lead and tumble for a while. They squirt just fine and the cleanup is very easy. Hot water and dish washing soap, then I rinse them, then into boiling water with TSP for a bit. The TSP will etch the core. I let the cores dry over night.

[clodhopper]

I use RCBS water soluble Case Lube II. Once I cut the wire into rough core length, I put a little of this lube in a jar with the lead and tumble for a while. They squirt just fine and the cleanup is very easy. Hot water and dish washing soap, then I rinse them, then into boiling water with TSP for a bit. The TSP will etch the core. I let the cores dry over night.
Thanks, but what is TSP?

[alfloyd]

TSP = Tri Sodium Phosphate

Lafaun