What 1894 is this?

[kens]

I located a Win 94 at a pawn shop please tell me what it is. Cal 30-30, highly figured grain in checkered buttstock, crescent butt plate, no S/N can be found, looks like patina or browned finish, what might this be?

[bob208]

well from all the info I would guess a 94 win. in .30-30. barrel length ? barrel type? rifle or carbine? any pictures ? sorry but to get a better answer I need more info. and pictures.

[kens]

With no s/n does that indicate a very early make?

[Outpost75]

It has an SN on it somewhere.

Pictures of the tang markings, proof stamp and barrel rollmark would help.

[timspawn]

SN will be on the bottom of the receiver where the it meets the forearm.

[W.R.Buchanan]

I think Bob got it right. It is a Winchester Model 1894 in .30-30 caliber. [smilie=s:

Randy

[pietro]

With no s/n does that indicate a very early make?









FWIW, Winchester 94's have had SN's since 1894, and the serial number, is usually found on the action bottom.



http://cdn2.armslist.com/sites/armslist/uploads/posts/2013/01/04/792700_01_3030_winchester_model_94_pre_6_640.jpg

http://picturearchive.gunauction.com/7049184453/9897823/94%20410%20006.jpg_thumbnail1.jpg


.

[woody1]

I located a Win 94 at a pawn shop please tell me what it is. Cal 30-30, highly figured grain in checkered buttstock, crescent butt plate, no S/N can be found, looks like patina or browned finish, what might this be?

If it's indeed a Win. 94 and there's no serial number at the front bottom of the receiver, you have a Win. 94 with the serial number removed. Regards, Woody

[pietro]

If it's indeed a Win. 94 and there's no serial number at the front bottom of the receiver, you have a Win. 94 with the serial number removed. Regards, Woody


Yep - Against US federal Law to even possess, much less buy/sell. (Google: "legality of a firearm with a defaced SN")


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[starmac]

Not sure when they changed the markings, but the early ones were marked 30 wcf instead of 30/30.

[JHeath]

What pawnshop/FFL receives and logs a firearm on which "no S/N can be found"?

[starmac]

What pawnshop/FFL receives and logs a firearm on which "no S/N can be found"?

Any of them, though not a 94. The law didn't require serial numbers on rifles untill 68 and some never had one to start with.

[M-Tecs]

Any of them, though not a 94. The law didn't require serial numbers on rifles untill 68 and some never had one to start with.

Starmac is 100% correct. No serial numbers required on anything manufactured before the gun control act of 1968.

https://www.atf.gov/sites/default/files/assets/pdf-files/atf-ruling-2013-3-adopting-identification-on-firearms.pdf

[JHeath]

So how is the gun identified on the ATF paperwork? They all have to be logged, no?

[starmac]

I don't know how they can log them with atf, I do know that you have to give the serial numbers to US customs and Canadian when transporting them through Canada, but I have brought several through Canada and filled out the paperwork with no serial number, they just look at and say have a good trip.

[kens]

Yep - Against US federal Law to even possess, much less buy/sell. (Google: "legality of a firearm with a defaced SN")


.

Now this helps me a lot. I knew there was a time frame for BATF to require a s/n (1968), but I didn't know that winchester had 'always' put a s/n the '94.
So, this is a '94 marked 30/30, when was the last one marked 30wcf?
This has a exquisite flame grain checkered buttstock, with straight grip with checkering
it has a crescent buttplate

[woody1]

So, this is a '94 marked 30/30, when was the last one marked 30wcf?

Somewhere around 1951 and/or serial number 1.9 million. You can be sure there will be plenty of overlap using up old(er) marked barrels on new(er) receivers.

That said, what's to keep someone from putting a newer barrel on an older rifle? Maybe one that wasn't even originally a 30-30 or 30WCF. Regards, Woody

[VA Jim]

Could be a restock or possibly a custom ordered gun, but it should have a serial number.

I was at a gun show a few years ago and found a decent 93 marlin 38-55 and the price was within my budget. Was looking it over and about ready to make an offer when I saw that the serial number had been ground off. I let the dealer know he could be sending some time in the Federal Pen. and he promptly removed it from his table. I have a feeling it got parted out afterwards.

[kens]

oK,,, I went back to the store and re-examined it under the patina I found s/n 2916182. The s/n is faint but there under patina. It has an emblem in the buttstock classic collector series, whitetail deer,
now what can we tell about this?

[kristopher.wheeler]

oK,,, I went back to the store and re-examined it under the patina I found s/n 2916182. The s/n is faint but there under patina. It has an emblem in the buttstock classic collector series, whitetail deer,
now what can we tell about this?
Looks like it was probably made in 1965 or 66.

[timspawn]

I believe that coin is some kind of NRA issued deal. Google "classic collector series whitetail deer" and see if it's the same coin that is in the stock.

[M-Tecs]

So how is the gun identified on the ATF paperwork? They all have to be logged, no?

With a description and with the annotation “N/A pre 1968 none serial numbered item”

[pietro]

With a description and with the annotation “N/A pre 1968 none serial numbered item”


That only pertains to firearms that were originally issued from the factory WITHOUT a serial number.

Any firearm the was originally issued WITH a serial number, that has been removed and/or defaced, is against Federal Law for ANYBODY to possess, even an FFL-holder.

Any FFL that would like to keep it (the FFL), would need to be crazy to accept any such serial number defaced/deleted firearm - ignorance of the law is no legal excuse; and BATF expects an FFL-holder, as someone in the gun business, to know what firearms were originally serial numbered, and which were not.

Un-believers need only ask BATF about it.



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[M-Tecs]

pietro is correct. I should have been clearer. Guns post 1968 firearms must have with serial numbers. Before 1968 there was no requirement for serial number, HOWEVER, according to the Fed's, if it was manufactured with a serial number regardless of date of manufacture it must retain that serial number. If it has been removed, no matter the date, it is long longer legal.

The home builder and sole owner is not required to serial number even today.

http://www.hoffmang.com/firearms/BATFE-AMD-65-Manufacture-Marking-2004-11-09.pdf

...a non-licensee may make a semiautomatic rifle for his or her own personal use. As long as the rifle remains in the custody of the person who manufactured it, the firearm need not be marked with a serial number or name and location of the manufacturer. However, if the firearm is transferred to another party at some point in the future, the firearm must be marked in accordance with the provisions set forth in 27 CFR 478.92 (formerly 178.92).

[John Taylor]

There was something about Sears having a problem with Winchester in the 20s or 30s and removed the s/n on a bunch of shotguns. Don't know if they did any 94s. I had an 1897 that looked like it never had a number.