Contemplating Purchase of 45-70 - Recommend Best Rifle for the Round Please

[michiganmike]

I am considering the purchase of a used rifle chambered in 45-70. No particular rifle in mind. But I have no experience with the 45-70. I would like to know what rifle has worked well for my fellow casters.

I would cast and reload for the rifle. I do know, from reading posts on this forum and elsewhere that there are several lever guns chambered for the 45-70. I have hunted with a pre-64 Winchester 94 in 30-30 and liked it. So, I am familiar with the lever action.

Pithy pronouncements preferred. [smilie=l:

Thank you,

MichiganMike

[Smoke4320]

Marlin Model 1895 with Ballard Rifling .. and JM Barrel Stamp
There are several versions of this rifle.. 18" 22" and longer Blued, Stainless and laminated wood versions
stay away from the newer Remington produced Marlins .. unkindly known as Remlins .. too many issues with quality control

[historicfirearms]

My Marlin guide gun is one of my favorite rifles. The accuracy always surprises me and Ive never had any problems with it. It is a early 2000s JM stamped model.

[kungfustyle]

Looked at Henry ($644 Buds)
http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/79698/Henry+H010+45-70+Lever+45-70+Government+18.43%22+American+Waln

and Rossi ($700) etc. CVA has a single shot that is fantastic for $300 and its a shooter.
http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/76021
group from Alabama selling them new on Gunbroker free shipping. Got a gun/scope/die/brass/rings for under $500 cool gun and fun to shoot. CVA makes it in stainless too. Great gun.

[Screwbolts]

Siamese Mauser

Ken

[ammohead]

+1 for marlin 95. I have the cowboy model. It's longer 26" barrel makes recoil tolerable without a earsplitting recoil reducer, and the aesthetics are hard to argue with. It just looks right with the octagon bbl.

[starmac]

The best one is going to be the one you want or like. Personally I have marlins, but I'm not going to say they are the best. For my use they are fine, maybe perfect, for others use they wouldn't even be considered, but if a lever is what you are after, you wont be disappointed with one.

[smoked turkey]

When it comes right down to it the 45-70 is one of the most versatile cartridges we can own. I think your choosing that particular caliber is the right choice. I seem to prefer the Marlin, but in the end the choice must be yours. It would be great if you knew some shooting friends who had 45-70 levers for you to heft and even shoot. You will determine right a way which one you prefer. You will be happy with the 45-70 I know that much.

[Screwbolts]

OP, Do you plan on hunting with this mythical rifle?

[Ballistics in Scotland]

If you want a single shot, the variety is very wide, with a lot to be said for several of them. But for a repeating rifle I think the current Marlin 95 stands out above the others. It has a round bolt, and is internally different from the earlier 1895 which disappeared with the conversion to war work in the First World War.

The 95 is easier to scope than most lever-actions, and I wouldn't worry too much about the rifling type.

Their Micro-Groove rifling came in about 1957, and their Sako-actioned Model 322 in .222 Remington had a groove diameter only .002in. greater than that of the lands. Even this would probably spin a hard cast .457 bullet for a while. But in .222 the accuracy, while exemplary to begin with, was very rapidly destroyed by erosion. With the exception of the .22 rimfire it was modified to a deeper version in 1968. I don't know whether the New Model 1895, originating in 1972, ever had Micro-Groove rifling, but it wouldn't have been the extreme sort and should always had rifling which should handle cast bullets very well.

If you are likely to use powerful smokeless loads, you would probably find the shortest-barreled versions less comfortable to shoot.

[michiganmike]

OP, Do you plan on hunting with this mythical rifle?

Yes, this would be a hunting rifle. And thank you to each of you for sharing your experience and expertise with me.

Happy Easter!

[largom]

If you go with a Marlin don't worry about Micro-Groove barrel. I own several, in different calibers, including 45-70 and they all shoot cast extremely well.

Larry

[country gent]

There is such a madrid of rifle types available in this cartridge then throw in the history behind the diffrent types of rifles. The lever action has always held a sweet spot for american hunters and plinkers, The Sharps, Hepburns, Remington rolling blocks, High walls and Ballards all most always draw a crowd and harken back to an interesting era in American hunting. (Millions of buffalo couldnt be wrong) Hit the shops and gun shows see what feels and looks right to you, what you want and go from there. Also your budget is going to be a part of the decission. C Sharps or Shiloh can build whatever you heart desires Alnong with CPA ( Stevens 44 1/2 replicas). Marlins are solid rifles and reasonable money. Winchester are great but originals comand premium or collector prices. AN old winchester could be an interesting choice.

[gtgeorge]

For what you will likely pay for the used JM stamped Marlin you can get a new which I have now handled many and all is well with the new Remlins in my book. Their transition period when they moved was supposed to be the issue but I know I am happy with my new one after getting tired of used ones going for more. It's only a few weeks old so far and only about 100 rounds but works smoother than my old Marlin in 30/30.

[pls1911]

It's all been said in the above posts...
For your first and maybe only 45-70, a JM marked Marlin 1895 in any configuration is tough to beat.
Along with various Marlins, I have Rolling Blocks, Sharps Replicas, Rugers, a Browning, Winchesters and Thompson centers....and they are all fun.
However, my go to 45-70 for hunting is a Marlin... any Marlin, and either a Ranch Dog 350 or RCBS 300 grain bullet at 1600 fps.

[725]

Lots of good .45-70's out there. H&R's are good utility rifles. Accurate, simple, and built like a tank. I like the Henry's as they are made in America and have a good reputation. If I win the lotto, you can bet I'll be looking for a Ruger #1 in .45-70. There is a book written about the .45-70 by Paul Matthews, "40 Years with the .45-70". You would enjoy it and learn much about the cartridge.

[longarm85]

I got the marlin, Didn't like it ,it was to heavy, so i bought a Encore barrel and love it, over the winter i started building a 45-70 on a 303 British action, have the barrel on it and feeding from the magazine , but now it's time to mow and fish so , it will have to wait...

[Jevyod]

I know I am going against popular opinion here but I absolutely love my new Marlin 1895. I got it new last summer, and I don't know if I got one of the better ones or what, but the fit and finish was actually pretty good. The lever wasn't as butter smooth as some of my other guns, but working the action 100 times a day for several days worked wonders! Mine is the SBL and while there is some weight there, with the 18.5 inch barrel it balances beautifully and snaps to the shoulder perfectly every time. Topped with a Leupold 1-4x20 shotgun scope, and pushing a 415 grain cast boolit at 1,600 fps, it is one serious hammer on deer in our thick PA woods!!!

[tdoyka]

tc encore in a MGM heavy factory barrel(your choice from 16 1/4" - 27" barrel)

i own a encore with a 23" mgm heavy factory barrel with the 444 marlin and it shoots lights out. besides, ya only need one!!!

[Lonegun1894]

I have an H&R Buffalo Classic and a "Remlin" 1895SBL. Both are great, with good fit and finish. Now I have personally seen a few junk Remlins, so when I bought mine, I inspected every inch very carefully before putting my money down, but mine is just as good as my JM Marlin 336 .30-30, or maybe even a bit better. Don't let the horror stories scare you away from a Marlin 1895, but do make sure you inspect carefully, just in case the one you're handling was made during the transition when they had troubles. Now I would also like to get a 1874 Sharps (or probably a replica due to cost) someday. but these two above rifles do everything I want a .45-70 for.

[EDK]

1895 MARLIN or a RUGER single shot or a SHILOH SHARPS. I bought an 1895 in 1973(?) when they came out. It was stolen; replaced it with a RUGER #1 and #3. Got tired of the single shots and traded for an 1895 LTD-II. Traded for a COWBOY RIFLE. Bought a JM GUIDE GUN in December...bad weather and buying the house and getting settled in have kept me from taking it out to the local range. Next one will either be another JM GUIDE GUN or a SHILOH SHARPS with all the bells and whistles.

The SHILOH is pretty closely priced to some of the imports. Adding options is where it gets pricey. Adding the MVA long range tang sight and windgauge front was over $800. The period MVA scope is $1000+/-.

[veeman]

Browning 1886 SRC or Rifle.

[thegatman]

I have Marlin a 45-70 with Ballard rifiling. Great gun.

[TXGunNut]

Hard to go wrong with an 1895, I have a Guide Gun (with muzzle brake) and would buy a rifle if funds are available when the right one comes along. Don't know about the Remlins but everyone I know that has a JM Guide Gun remarks about the accuracy. They truly are as accurate as most bolt guns, mine outshoots every levergun I own and a few of my bolt guns. Don't know why this little rifle is so accurate but it is the only rifle I own that goes on every big game hunting trip as a backup or primary rifle. When other rifles have mechanical issues or get finicky about loads that GG with a low-powered Leupold scope is rock solid and absolutely gets the job done.

[skeettx]

Winchester 1886

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=475565101

I have a number of 45-70s and like them all

Ruger Lyman #1 Centenial (two of these :) )
Ruger #1-B
Rem Rolling Block
P-14 Enfield
Winchester 1886

It your gun for shooting or hunting or both??

Mike

[GooseGestapo]

I'm partial to the Marlins. Got a ~'03 GuideGun. Had a '82 "rifle" w/microgroove barrel. Both were/are shooters. I've got a "Remlin" .338MX and its "keeper".
Learn to discriminate an example of "barrel droop" and you'll be ok!

[luvtn]

An good looking H&R 45/70 is for sale in the classifieds of rugerforum dot com if you are so inclined.
luvtn

[white eagle]

I own 2 rifles in 45-70 caliber
1 is a Remlin guide gun and in spite if all the disclaimers it is an accurate and fine specimen
the other is a Ruger #1
Honestly I prefer the Ruger but either will do

[seaboltm]

I have a Remlin Marlin 95. It's a good rifle. I have heard rumors of quality control problems, but my rifle is fine.

[ashhoe]

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=475729678
I can't stop looking at it, I'm mesmerized.

[EDK]

IF you decide on a MARLIN Guide Gun, the JM MARLINS come with ported or un-ported barrels. The porting allegedly helps with recoil, BUT will not endear you to the shooters next to you on the firing line at a gun range. IIRC, it is no longer a feature of the factory guns from Remington.

The newer guns are not drilled and tapped on the side of the receiver for the LYMAN or WILLIAMS peep sights. The new style WILLIAMS is mounted on top of the receiver, using the rear set of scope base holes. I've got one on my recently acquired Guide Gun.

Whatever you choose, casting and reloading give you a lot of flexibility. AND the price compared to factory loads is fantastic.

[TXGunNut]

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=475729678
I can't stop looking at it, I'm mesmerized.


What do you think it will go for?

[MT Chambers]

If interested in BP and weight is not a problem, A C. Sharps or Shiloh..otherwise a Ruger #1....if a single shot is a problem a Marlin '95 is a natural.

[longcruise]

I like any of the old style falling or rolling block single shots. They are very versatile as far as bullet selection goes and are good perfomers if you like to shoot black. I used a son in laws Rossi 45-70 and was not thrilled. Bullet choices are limited and accuracy was not very good at all.

Downside to the singles is, of course, one shot! Also, the weight. Mine runs right at 10# and is about all I want to carry.

[Ramjet-SS]

I have a new Encore stainless barrel. Shot that tonight with some 355 grain WFN over Unique outstanding accuracy and a very fine gun.

[RevGeo]

I retired last month and treated myself to one of the new Henry 45-70s. Lovin' it. Kinda heavy, but that helps with the recoil. Just worked up a new cast load that I will post about in the 'cast bullet' section of this forum. Can't say enough good things about the Henry. Good quality all around. Spring bear starts day after tomorrow here in Idaho and I'm taking the new gun - with cast bullet loads.

[alrighty]

So far my favorite is the 1895 Marlin just because it works so well.I also have a 23" Contender ,W.W. Greener Martini , and a 1873 Springfield.I must admit the Springfield is a blast to shoot with black powder.
I am still waiting for the time when I can add a Ruger #1, Shiloh Sharps , and a Siamese Mauser to the list!

[missionary5155]

Greetings
I have both the Marlin and a jap Winchester model 86 Light weight. If you can find a used Winchester 86 light weight they are very nice to carry. Very easy to cast for and have very good barrels on them. The Marlin would be my second choice. By the time you find a Ballrd rifled barrel your cost will be near the cost of the jap model 86.
There is nothing wrong with the micro groove Marlins if you use a fat cast bullet. They will shoot fine. This is the cheapest one out there for a levergun.
The bolt action Siamese Mausers are great . About $500 - $600. Easy to load for. Will hunt any critter on the planet. Easy to carry. Reliable Mauser unless bubba got his finges in thier. Gunbroker always has several for sale. A little harder to find but well worth the look if you want the vesitility and strength of a bolt action Mauser rifle.
Then the double rifle. Very clasic and stronge enough to take whatever you will put in it. Costly ! But if you ever hunt critters that will hunt you then it sure is assuring to have two seperate firing systems. Two instant chambered rounds is not bad either.
The last 45-70 that will leave me is my model 86 light weight. I am more lever gun orientated as my years go along. If that lever 45-70 will not do the job I will get out a caliber 50 lever action.
Mike in Peru

[cold1]

It doesnt matter which one you get to begin with, its a 45-70 and it will multiply.

Basic choices, not all inclusive, based on price.
Low end: H&R, CVA
Middle: Marlin, Henry, Rossi
Upper: Ruger, Sharps, Rolling Block

Choose one, buy it, shoot it, rinse, repeat.

[dh2]

I am another one for the Marlin, I have had my best luck with 405gr. boolits and j-words, pushed by IMR4198.

[JimP.]

i have 3. H & R 45-70, 1873 Springfield Saddle Ring carbine and the 1873 Springfield Infantry model.

[brasshog]

Although I haven't fired it yet I'm really liking my 1885 High Wall Traditional Hunter. The heft just feels right at about nine pounds and I love an octagon barrel. I do love a good rolling block and lever action also. You can't go wrong with the caliber and you'll probably end up with more than one rifle in the end lol.

[white eagle]

"You can't go wrong with the caliber and you'll probably end up with more than one rifle in the end lol."
amen to that
said earlier a lever for the fast up close and personal work and the single shot for the more relaxed type of hunting
its probably one of the best for cast IMHO

[Grendel99]

I think a Marlin 1895 Cowboy would be awesome. I got my first lever action last year, a Marlin 336C in 35 Remington. Like most I heard the horror stories of the quality since Remington took over but I couldn't find a used one for a decent price. So I bought a new one and have been extremely impressed. I haven't shot any cast yet (I will shortly, I bought a RCBS 35-200 FN mold) but it has been amazingly accurate. I've shot several sub-moa groups. I wouldn't hesitate to get a new Marlin 45-70.

I'm new to the Marlin nomenclature, can someone explain the JM barrel marking and why it's preferred?

[Lonegun1894]

The JM marking just means it was built when Marlin still ran things at the Marlin factory, it's just a proof/inspection mark. Yours, and my SBL, should have the REM stamp. Mine is great too, BTW. A lot of people prefer the JM stamped guns because the assumption is that the old stamp mean it was made back when people cared, and is a way for people to avoid the bad guns that Remington turned out when they first took over. Most forget that every company lets out a bad product now and then--even if the "Remlin" complaints were well deserved for a while til Remington got their act straight.

[Four Fingers of Death]

I use a H&R Little Big Horn Saddle Ring Carbine which I have had Pedersoli open sights fitted. I use a group buy 330Gn Gould HP mould over as much 2fg as I can squeeze in.

[MBTcustom]

The 1895 is a working man's gun. Good for shooting a lot and practical hunting and self defense. It's the ultimate levergun in my opinion, and one of the top three do-it-all firearms in my personal opinion.

The Ruger#1 is classy, might be fairly accurate (seen too many that werent), is totally dependable, and holds it's value very well. It's an excellent hunting single shot and can take anything you throw at it.

The Sharps is a class act, but I think of it more as a gentleman's rifle. It revels in history and cool factor, is typically capable of superb accuracy, and is often taken straight to the grave with the original owner. LOL!
Personally, when I finally hang up my files and retire, I plan to buy one of the percussion Sharps rifles that shoot paper cartridges and see how many kegs of powder I can burn before I croak.

[rockrat]

I have the stainless Marlin XLR and a Pedersoli Sharps and a Trapdoor, all in 45-70. I will say the XLR is the most accurate of the bunch. When I can shoot a 1.25" group @100yds and open sights, its a keeper. The Pedersoli is close behind and my 1884 TD isn't far behind the Sharps clone.

That said, I think the greatest fun factor is in the Pedersoli.

[Wasalmonslayer]

Hello
For what its worth I have a remlin 1895 guide and it shoots well loaded hot and just plinking with trailboss.
I have shot 300-450grn bullets and 350 & 450 grn boolits. It chews em up fine and accuracy is good with all of em.
It is probable one of the least picky guns I own!
Just do your do diligence and inspect the gun closely before purchase and you should have no worries.

Slayer

[JesterGrin_1]

Sorry to jump on this bandwagon lol. But I also have and heavily use a JM Marlin 1895GS in 45-70 Government. Out of the other hunting rifles I have available to me along with other calibers the Marlin 45-70 became my favorite in very short order for so many reasons I think it would take this entire thread to show them.

I hunt in deep South TEXAS so the Marlin GS is short and handy around the brush of which is not really just brush as all of it has long THORNS lol. Not to mention those little pesky 6' or so rattle snakes.

Back to the Marlin. As mentioned since it is the Guide Gun length it is very handy. It is easy to carry but not really lite I think due mainly to how thick the barrel is. But due to how thick the barrel is may be the reason for there great accuracy. But I could be wrong. They are also very easy to take down for a simple normal cleaning or a complete tear down for a detail cleaning. Due to there design they are easy to mount a scope to without any problems in either a standard mounted scope or my preferred scope mount of which is the scout scope set up.

(FYI On Scout Scope) The reason for the Scout Scope is I had a standard mounted scope of which proved to be very accurate due to the increased magnification power. But with heavy loads and a short lapse of judgement of eye placement at night Hog hunting can and will give you a nasty bloody scope eye lol. So goes the reason for the scout scope. :) )

As for the 45-70 Cartridge one should definitely hand load for it as factory ammunition is good but has become very expensive in my view. As from what I have seen regular factory 45-70 Government ammo is running in the range of $35.00 and up for a box of 20. And like the potato chip you can not shoot just one lol.

They can be loaded easy and the cases will seem like they will last forever. Bullet weights and styles in both cast or jacketed are abound from companies. Not to mention the molds that are available for the 45-70 Government come in a huge array of designs and weights as well from less than 300Gr to over 500Gr. Though I have found the Marlin in 45-70 Government to really like the 350Gr to 425Gr cast bullets very well as far as accuracy is concerned.

As for powders I am not sure if there is a powder that the 45-70 Government does not like. But I have had great luck with H-322 for high end loads in both the Ranch Dog 350Gr RNFP/GC and the Hornady 350Gr Round Nose in the tune of 3/4" and less groups at 100 yards with a scope.

I have recently tried Unique with the Ranch Dog 350Gr RNFP/GC with good accuracy but as of yet to hunt with it. :(

Another upside is as mentioned there are many good bullet designs out there to home cast for the 45-70 Government. The downside is the amount of lead you may use to cast them and how fun they are to shoot lol.

Alas as mentioned pick a 45-70 Government firearm that you like and have fun as the 45-70 Government if used within there hunting range is never a bad decision on all of the above levels and I am sure many many more.

Happy Hunting

[Geezer in NH]

A fire arm chambered for the 45-70, kind of like a need a MV, 2 wheel, 4 wheel or what.

What do you want from it???????

[Ramjet-SS]

I am a huge advocate for the scout scope I use them on several rifles of mine

[gwpercle]

Uberti 1874 Sharps Rifle, I lean towards the Down Under model. Ever see the Quigely Down Under Movie?
Now that's a 45-70 Rifle!

[Geezer in NH]

Anyone saying Remlin is a newbie IMHO.
:kidding:

[JesterGrin_1]

Uberti 1874 Sharps Rifle, I lean towards the Down Under model. Ever see the Quigely Down Under Movie?
Now that's a 45-70 Rifle!

I had a BEAUTIFUL Quigely one custom built by Pedersoli but sold it. I should have never sold it since it was so darn nice. But because of the stock it would flat beat you to submission. As the original reason I purchased said rifle was for BPCR. But my caller bone could not take the abuse. But I will say that they make a darn accurate rifle. As I would put a Pedersoli BPCR rifle against many hand built rifles as they can and have held there ground as far as accuracy goes.

[badbob454]

quigly rifle was a 45-110 a longer version of the 45/70.. but back to the original question ,... i reccomend a marlin guide gun in 45/70 i just got one and it is quite impressive , built good ... have yet to shoot it as of yet

[JesterGrin_1]

quigly rifle was a 45-110 a longer version of the 45/70.. but back to the original question ,... i reccomend a marlin guide gun in 45/70 i just got one and it is quite impressive , built good ... have yet to shoot it as of yet


As I have said before you will not be displeased with the Marlin 45-70 Government as I have the JM Marlin 1895 GS in 45-70 Government. You should be amazed with the accuracy as well with others at the range. More than a few times people with bolt guns have come up to inquire about the custom lever gun that shoots so well. And the look on there faces when I tell them it is all factory is to funny but still most do not believe me lol.