Which is better, 32 or 36 caliber?

[koehlerrk]

Looking for a small bore muzzle loader to introduce kids to black powder, and for me to play with too.

So, between the 32 and 36 calibers, which is better?

This will be used for punching paper, shooting fun targets, and maybe for hunting woodchucks.

What are the plus/minus of each bore size? Anything I need to look out for?

Thanks in advance,

Rick

[OverMax]

I don't think there's a whole lot of difference between the two. But I've read Triditions makes a 32 cal Traditional model called the Crocket rifle. Specifically made for the purpose its smaller diameter barrel is helpful for the younger one's.

[waksupi]

The .32 will foul out a bit faster, and the ramrod can be delicate.

[mooman76]

Both calibers aren't seen allot and especially the 36. 32 is abit light and good to about 50 yards or so. 36 would carry a little farther but like said the 32 usually will foul a little quicker and a little harder to load being so small but nothing you couldn't get around. When it comes down to it either one would fit the bill so if you see a decent one for a good price pick it up. If I saw them side by side though I would get the 36. A 40 wouldn't be a bad choice either.

[William Yanda]

My wife's grandmother asked; "Which should a man choose, a violin, a wife or a pot?"
The answer is, it depends. How big/strong are the kids. How much lead will you conserve with a 32 rather than a 36? How difficult a target are the woodchucks?
Grandma's answer was it depends, too. Do you want to fiddle, diddle or piddle?

[koehlerrk]

Thanks everyone... so far you're telling me that what I thought I knew was true.

That the 32 will foul faster and that the ramrod can be fragile, and that it will only be useable for 50-75 yards, but it's easier to find a 32.

The 36 will go farther and hit harder and nearly everything about it will be more user friendly. I'm a little worried about kids bending ramrods so I'm leaning more towards the 36.

I guess the biggest thing I'm looking for is one smaller and lighter than my 50 cal Hawken.
A TC Seneca would be perfect... if I was a millionaire.
A Hopkins and Allen 36 underhammer might be perfect.

Keep those ideas coming folks!

[mooman76]

My 32 has an aluminum ramrod and my other I bought a synthetic rod so I don't worry about breaking. It took me awhile to find a 36. Don't know why I had to have one but I did. I had 3-32s already. I had several deals fall through for 36s but every time I would forget about it, one would pop up. I passed on a few because they wanted premium prices an I couldn't justify it in my mind just for punching paper. Good luck on finding what you want. A 45 with light charges for kids might not be out of the question either.

[ejcrist]

Personally I'd go with a 40. The ramrod is 3/8" which is a lot stronger than the 5/16" used in the 32 and 36. I have a 32 but prefer the 40 for most small game except the smallest edible game (cottontails and squirrels). Groundhogs are pretty tough and a 40 puts 'em down a lot better than a 32 or 36. Also the 40 will come in handy if you run into a coyote. In addition, the 40 is easy to load (doesn't foul easily) , economical to shoot, and extreeeemly accurate. If you are set on either a 32 or 36 for the kids though I believe I'd go with the 36. I absolutely love my Pedersoli 32 but I wouldn't recommend it to anyone that wasn't experienced with muzzleloaders. The 32 can be finicky and like others have said, can foul easily. I wipe between shots with all my flintlocks but it's especially critical with the 32.

[fouronesix]

Another thing to consider is overall weight of rifle and balance. All other things being equal, the smaller the bore the heavier and more muzzle heavy the gun will be. Two ways to compensate- shorter barrel and/or thinner barrel. Plus, in any reasonable sized or weighted rifle, the recoil of 40-45 or smaller caliber roundball load will be mild to very mild and can be adjusted further by charge.

[Old Scribe]

Most of my muzzle loading buddies concur that the. 40 caliber is the most accurate. I used to have a. 45 flintlock that was accurate, easy to load and light enough for a youngster. Good all around rifle too.

[shdwlkr]

the .36 is easier to load and clean than the .32 and I have both. They are both fun to shoot just that the .32 gets dirtier faster and thus harder to load
The .40 would be easier than either the .32 or .36 again size does matter in muzzle loading
The .32 and .36 caliber tend to be harder to find, I lucked out and ended up with 2 of each all TC models and I would buy more if I found them

[Squeeze]

your going to have to swab between shots with pretty much all of them. every 3rd shot at least. For just range fun, any will do. for squirreling, the .32 is king, loaded light it will spoil the least meat. A headshot is always desireable, but not always possible. .32 is pretty much a 20-40 yard gun, further shots are possible, but accuracy diminishes quickly. .36 Would be better if intended quarry is groundhog/varminting, with its longer range capabilities. (maybe 60 ish) this is with roundballs. conicals may give you a bit more range, but some guns will shoot them, some not so much, They are easier to load, and on average cut, or diminish the need for swabbing. Some tips for swabbing in a small bore: Use small patches, too large of a patch usually bunches up behind the jag a lot more and helps with the binding. Do NOT dry patch after a few shots. Moisten the first patch with something (windex, alcahol/water, spit, etc.) THEN a dry patch or 2 (I usually use both sides) a dry patch, especially an oversized one will almost always lodge stuck and can be a hard fought learning experience. I will usually use a .22 size or .~3/4 for .32 and maybe 1" for .36, (usually the smaller for both, round or square does not matter) I also think the usual 1-48 twist on both calibers is too slow, especially the .32. Really not so much an issue for roundball, as either are good shooters inside their range, once a load is developed (load size, ball size and patch thickness, and even preferred lube) But for conicals (TC style maxi ball, or buffalo ballet) its much harder to "dial in" and some (probably a majority in my experience) just dont shoot the conicals as well. But for the kids for range fun, at short range. a conical may be the way to go, as loading is probably easier, and swabbing much less of an issue. conicals usually benefit from the use of an over powder wad, but is not completely neccesary. EDIT: you will also want a range rod. Either brass or stainless steel You WILL eventually be pulling a dryball (bullet loaded without powder) and pretty much, it is all around better for at the range.

[40-82 hiker]

IMHO, any round ball .40 and below is going to have such little recoil that point is somewhat moot. Advice as to the weight of the rifle will be the more important issue. If the choice has to be between a .32 and a .36 I'd go with the .36. Don't short change a .40, even if you take some weight off of it. Round balls just don't weigh very much.

My wife is VERY recoil conscious. A Ruger 10/22 is her limit. :razz: Years ago I would have trouble getting my .45 Hawken back from her as long as she had powder, caps, and round balls in a box I kept them in. I had too much fun watching her to ask for it back!

As already mentioned, the .40 will be the better pill for the groundhogs. BTW, grew up eating those grass munchers, and they are really very good to eat.

[Gussy]

My partner and I once shot 13 ground hogs in 16 shots with my .32 TC. It just flat out kills them at ranges under 50 yds. Never had a problem with it. I also never had a problem with it getting dirty using round balls and a good lubed patch. It likes .310 size ball and wonder lube on the patch.

[Squeeze]

The TC is the exception to the rule, and the standard I judge my .32's on. its 1-30 twist has proven itself to me on every angle. Why nobody else picked up on that is a mystery. Ive been playing with a fast twist .36, my latest build. its still in load development

[BrianL]

I have both in barrels from Green mountain that fit my Hawken and find them both to be equally easy to shoot..alot. Contrary to some other replies, I have not had the fouling problem in either of them and have gone over 50 shots without wiping or cleaning when using olive oil as a lubricant. On the other hand, I also have only one barrel that has ever given me much trouble in this regard and that one was a 40 cal and was also a Green Mt barrel. Three shots and you can not pound a ball down the barrel.
When shooting at home I use a long short starter and a brass range rod.

Both are cheap to shoot with Ballistic Products selling 8 lb jugs of 1 1/2 buckshot at .310 for the 32 and Hornady making a .350 buckshot in five pound boxes for the 36

[swamp]

I have a 36 Seneca with a T/C 32 barrel that fits it. Quite happy with both. So far no problems for alot of years. Just alot of fun.
swamp

[Lead Fred]

A 40 is what we use, the smaller ones are great shooters, not forgiving loaders tho

[koehlerrk]

Thanks everyone... if I can find a 40 I'll grab it, but apparently those are made from unicorn tears by honest politicians.

I can find a 36 cal a little easier than a 40, but not much.

LGS actually had a 32 cal on the shelf last time I was in there, which is what got me starting to think one of these small bore front stuffers would be fun.

Will try to get there Saturday and see if it's still available.

Thanks again!

[40-82 hiker]

Either brass or stainless steel You WILL eventually be pulling a dryball (bullet loaded without powder) and pretty much, it is all around better for at the range.

Off thread, but funny: I used to shoot a .58 Zouave in the 60s with my Dad. One day he loaded a minie ball w/o powder. We trickled powder down the nipple hole. He turned right around and loaded the next ball w/o powder! [smilie=b: I've done it myself, but never twice in a row. So, since I was around 14 at the time I thought it was the funniest thing I had ever seen when he started swearing. I was rolling on the ground with tears in my eyes I was laughing so hard! Think he could have done w/o my antics. We suddenly had to go home, after he cleared that ball. Think I might have had something to do with that! He got payback much later, however. Years later I invited him to go shoot my front loaders one day, so he met me at the range. I forgot the BP. I remember him rolling on the ground... [smilie=b:

[mooman76]

Even 32s are getting harder to find these days but easier than the latter two. Less companies making the traditional guns these days and even less making the small calibers. Seems to change from time to time. When there are lots of the smaller calibers everyone wants the bigger ones and visa versa.

[Blizzard63]

I bought a .36 muzzle loader and I get excellent accuracy with it. I also have 2 .32 squirrel rifles that i shoot targets with as well and as long as I run a patch thru the bore its fine but being a small caliber they will both foul easily. If I was buying one for kids I think I would go with a .40 or even a .45 because of the fouling issues and with the .40 or .45 you can load them with a charge that kids can handle and get good accuracy as well but for me I love the .32 cal rifles.

[Hanshi]

I don't know where/how this "faster fouling .32 & .36" myth got started but it is just that, a myth. I have two .32s and a .36. I have no trouble firing strings of 40 and 50 shots with the last load seating just as easily as the first. Fouling buildup is caused by some combination of wrong lube/wrong patch thickness. I used the same skinny wood rod for 13 years that came with my Crockett and it went with that fine rifle when I eventually sold it. My favorite small game rifles are a flint .32 longrifle and a .36 longrifle. They never fouled any worse than my .50.

For shooting long strings without swabbing all one needs is a tight fitting ball/patch and a good lube (not Crisco, Bore Butter or anything along that line). Among the best are: spit, Hoppes #9 Plus BP lube, Black Solve, windshield wiper fluid, etc. No greases to mix with fouling and create gunk. Each load cleans the bore so one never has more than one shots worth of fouling.

I've shot the .36 as far as 88 yards (20grns of 3F) for sub-squirrel groups. Haven't yet fired the .32 much beyond 50 yards. But I have fired both 40+ times without cleaning. I prefer to clean at home rather than in the woods or at the range.

[JeffinNZ]

I love both my .40's. Can run them on as little as 20gr.

[waksupi]

I don't know where/how this "faster fouling .32 & .36" myth got started but it is just that, a myth. I have two .32s and a .36. I have no trouble firing strings of 40 and 50 shots with the last load seating just as easily as the first. Fouling buildup is caused by some combination of wrong lube/wrong patch thickness. I used the same skinny wood rod for 13 years that came with my Crockett and it went with that fine rifle when I eventually sold it. My favorite small game rifles are a flint .32 longrifle and a .36 longrifle. They never fouled any worse than my .50.

For shooting long strings without swabbing all one needs is a tight fitting ball/patch and a good lube (not Crisco, Bore Butter or anything along that line). Among the best are: spit, Hoppes #9 Plus BP lube, Black Solve, windshield wiper fluid, etc. No greases to mix with fouling and create gunk. Each load cleans the bore so one never has more than one shots worth of fouling.

I've shot the .36 as far as 88 yards (20grns of 3F) for sub-squirrel groups. Haven't yet fired the .32 much beyond 50 yards. But I have fired both 40+ times without cleaning. I prefer to clean at home rather than in the woods or at the range.

What I see with them, is the breech plug face fouling. Yes, I can shoot the small calibers all day with easy loading, but if fouling starts building on the breech face, it will deteriorate accuracy until scraped. It just happens quicker with small bores than large.
YMMV.

[koehlerrk]

Thank you folks, I freely admit I don't know much about the smallbore frontstuffers. Keep the info/insights/opinions coming, I'm more than willing to learn what works for other people.

[Hanshi]

I can't say that I've ever had a decrease in accuracy when nearing the end of a string. One of the smallest groups I ever fired with the .36 was fired near the end of the session. A lot of shooters don't care for or use scrapers; I am not one of them. I have scrapers for each caliber and use them as a part of the cleaning process. Normally I use a scraper on the breech face before packing up and leaving the range. On the rare occasion that I notice a crud ring forming, I will use the scraper even though I am not finished shooting. For any cleaning during a string I prefer a nylon bore brush and save the moistened patches for final cleanup.

[mooman76]

I don't know where/how this "faster fouling .32 & .36" myth got started but it is just that, a myth. I have two .32s and a .36. I have no trouble firing strings of 40 and 50 shots with the last load seating just as easily as the first. Fouling buildup is caused by some combination of wrong lube/wrong patch thickness. I used the same skinny wood rod for 13 years that came with my Crockett and it went with that fine rifle when I eventually sold it. My favorite small game rifles are a flint .32 longrifle and a .36 longrifle. They never fouled any worse than my .50.

For shooting long strings without swabbing all one needs is a tight fitting ball/patch and a good lube (not Crisco, Bore Butter or anything along that line). Among the best are: spit, Hoppes #9 Plus BP lube, Black Solve, windshield wiper fluid, etc. No greases to mix with fouling and create gunk. Each load cleans the bore so one never has more than one shots worth of fouling.

I've shot the .36 as far as 88 yards (20grns of 3F) for sub-squirrel groups. Haven't yet fired the .32 much beyond 50 yards. But I have fired both 40+ times without cleaning. I prefer to clean at home rather than in the woods or at the range.

Must be something to it because many people have problems with it including myself. Some don't do I'm thinking it is probably something to do with load technique. I don't have that problem with any of my other guns in larger calibers. If I don't swab at least every 3rd load, accuracy drops off quick.

[waksupi]

I think a lot of it has to do with ambient climate conditions in each persons location. Heat, humidity, elevation.
For instance, very dry here, and I daresay Hanshi most likely has much higher humidity than here.

[birddog]

I absolutely love my Cherokee 32cal, loaded w/10grs 3F topped off with a round ball and that is your short/cb load for squirrels.
Charlie

[BrianL]

Like Hanshi, I have never had a problem with fouling in either a 32 or 36 cal if the barrel was smooth to begin with. Mine are all Green mountain and Rayl barrels and I can shoot 50 plus through them without patching. As I noted, my worst is also a GM barrel in 40 cal and it was rough to begin with and is still a PIA after 300 balls. I may fire-lap it next..............

[Hanshi]

As I suggested previously, a tight prb and the right lube should at least make loading easier and help reduce fouling. Yes, I've always lived in humid states which may or may not help. I do know that on dry days is when things such as crud rings and breech face fouling tend to form and they are crusty. But I've shot extensively in oppressive humidity and had fouling (in my .40) ranging from soupy to gunky; this was before I went to a .024" patch. So it can happen in all conditions. I've discovered that greasy lubes most always form gunk after 1 or 2 shots that makes it impossible to reload. The main thing is that my small bores foul no worse and no more quickly than my large bores. The .45 was mentioned earlier and I must say it is an outstanding caliber and the best all around bore size. I've killed most of my deer with that caliber. You have to reduce your charge when you go after squirrels and take head shots, only.

For hunting, I load my gun with a prb lubed with Bore Butter or something similar. If I fire it even once, all reloads are lubed with Hoppes #9 Plus BP Lube. If it's fired it has to be cleaned; if it doesn't get fired it can stay loaded without fear of rust. This goes for all bore sizes.