Arbor Press? Dont get it.....

[sparky508]

So I had done a bit of reading about how arbor presses were the cat’s meow for proper bullet seating and inline dies and all. I found some decent prices at harbor Freight, but found this unit at Boeing Surplus for even cheaper. It takes up some room on my bench and is heavy though. I have been trying for some time to get it to work properly, but still for the life of me can’t figure out what all the fuss is. While there is a substantial mechanical advantage to this over my Summit and Lyman turret, I can’t see how this will make any better ammunition.


I guess I will just keep on trying…………

134147 134148134149

[ohland]

So I had done a bit of reading about how arbor presses were the cat’s meow for proper bullet seating and inline dies and all.

Yes they are. You MUST have 30mm in-line dies with a monster like that. That is the quintessential manly-man toy....

[country gent]

With the inline dies tighter tolerencces and the presses "straight " push everything lines up better. The presses reloaders use are mmuch smaller and portable. Mine is 12" tall or so and the base is 6" square. Simple rack and gear mechanisim. WHat you have is probably 5 tons or better.

[jcwit]

This is what you should be looking for.

https://www.google.com/search?q=sinclair+arbor+press&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=d0gHVdfwNsu_ggTvkILgBw&ved=0CDEQsAQ&biw=1366&bih=682

[bangerjim]

Arbor press = pressing arbors on and off gears & wheels.

Reloading press = reloading cartridges for firearms.

Each tool has it's use and should not be confused.

I have several of both and use then for their UNIQUE designated purposes.

Of course you can use the butt of you revolver for a hammer.
Your straight blade screwdriver for a chisel.
Your chisel for a screwdriver.

To each his own.

bnager-j

[c1skout]

:bigsmyl2:

[Hamish]

Too funny,,,,,,,

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Here's some links to help you along:

http://www.pmatool.com/harrells-precision-arbor-press/

http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloading-equipment/reloading-presses/single-stage-presses/sinclair-arbor-press-prod37764.aspx

http://www.kmshooting.com/catalog/arbor-press/arbor-press.html

[jcwit]

Arbor press = pressing arbors on and off gears & wheels.

Reloading press = reloading cartridges for firearms.

Each tool has it's use and should not be confused.

I have several of both and use then for their UNIQUE designated purposes.

Of course you can use the butt of you revolver for a hammer.
Your straight blade screwdriver for a chisel.
Your chisel for a screwdriver.

To each his own.

bnager-j

I guess Sinclair who is now owned by Brownells has no idea what to call their Arbor Press used with Wilson dies? LOL[smilie=s:

[badgeredd]

Arbor press = pressing arbors on and off gears & wheels.

Reloading press = reloading cartridges for firearms.

Each tool has it's use and should not be confused.

I have several of both and use then for their UNIQUE designated purposes.

Of course you can use the butt of you revolver for a hammer.
Your straight blade screwdriver for a chisel.
Your chisel for a screwdriver.

To each his own.

bnager-j

It must be quite the burden to have to be around all of us dummies.

Edd

[bangerjim]

It must be quite the burden to have to be around all of us dummies.

Edd


If the shoe fits, wear it.

[bangerjim]

Here's some links to help you along:

http://www.pmatool.com/harrells-precision-arbor-press/

http://www.sinclairintl.com/reloading-equipment/reloading-presses/single-stage-presses/sinclair-arbor-press-prod37764.aspx

http://www.kmshooting.com/catalog/arbor-press/arbor-press.html


All of those are toy-ish compaired to a REAL arbor press like the OP has. I have 1/2, 1 and 2 ton rack and pinion arbor presses in my workshops and use them for "pressing arbors". I could jury-rig one to seat boolits if I had time on my hands and did not have 3 commercial loading presses.

And also have some smaller light-weight arbor presses like the links above I use in my model train and clock-making hobbies.

Using a LARGE HEAVY arbor press, one could possibly rig up a swaging set-up if you had all the machine tools to make the dies and adaptors, etc. I, when I someday get into swaging boolits, will consider making a dedicated swaging press like excellent outlined in a thread on here.

banger-j

[jmort]

There are reloading arbor presses as noted. They are designed to compress dies like the Wilson dies and can be used for the Lee Loaders. They are useful and have a place.

[dragon813gt]

You do realize there are dies built to work on small arbor presses? They aren't regular dies and they won't thread into a reloading press.

The OP has one that is a little to big. But making gas checks w/ it should be a breeze :laugh:

[bangerjim]

You do realize there are dies built to work on small arbor presses? They aren't regular dies and they won't thread into a reloading press.

The OP has one that is a little to big. But making gas checks w/ it should be a breeze :laugh:


Yes I know that, but my question is ........WHY!?!?!?!?

Tons of excellent HEAVY loading presses out there built to accept standard Lee, RCBS, etc off-the-shelf dies. To me, it is kinda like re-inventing the wheel.

Making GC's with the correct set-up is a good idea and could be done with one of those little ones in the listing.

[RP]

I guess I been doing a lot of stuff wrong. I have used a treadmill to clean brass a hot plate to warm molds a coffee machine to melt wax a bent soap ladle to dip lead a car jack to extrude lead wire plastic shoe boxes to hold brass a cement mixer to recover lead a stove to bake PC on wait a minute they are for baking oh the list keeps going and going I have way to many things I use in ways they were not designed to be used. Is it ok if I use some pipe on my press handle to give me more leverage ?

[MT Chambers]

The in-line hand dies such as Sinclair/Wilson are the last word in precision and are used with a small arbor press, and most bench rest shooters use this kit, I believe. But nothing like that car frame bender like in your pics.

[NoAngel]

It must be quite the burden to have to be around all of us dummies.

Edd


Well, we can't all be of the genius it takes to reinvent the wheel.

[country gent]

Alot of benchrest shooters load on the range adjusting for conditions as needed. A small light press and wilson dies ( used to denote straight line dies) makes this a fairly simple set up on a strong table or bench, no mounted presses. Alot of these shooters use dies made to match thier chambers and bored reamed lapped to match thier bullets. Some long range shooters also use these types of seating dies to reduce runnout. A big find that makes a perfect ahrbor press for this is an old bottle capper. Plenty of force for seating bullets and light sizing if needed, small light wieght desighns and quick easy to set up. Ive seen alot of Bench rest kits with a set of straight line dies an aluminum arhbor press and a harrels or bruno powder measure in the set up. The old lee loaders work great with these presses rather than a hammer also.

[bangerjim]

Alot of benchrest shooters load on the range adjusting for conditions as needed. A small light press and wilson dies ( used to denote straight line dies) makes this a fairly simple set up on a strong table or bench, no mounted presses. Alot of these shooters use dies made to match thier chambers and bored reamed lapped to match thier bullets. Some long range shooters also use these types of seating dies to reduce runnout. A big find that makes a perfect ahrbor press for this is an old bottle capper. Plenty of force for seating bullets and light sizing if needed, small light wieght desighns and quick easy to set up. Ive seen alot of Bench rest kits with a set of straight line dies an aluminum arhbor press and a harrels or bruno powder measure in the set up. The old lee loaders work great with these presses rather than a hammer also.


Holy carp! I have 3 of those old capper presses in the shed. Had no idea what to do with them. I do not bottle beer or root beer!

That kind of loading & shooting is in a class all it's own. I know some that do it, but never have seen them actually LOAD at the range with a little press like that.

I just enjoy killing a lot of paper targets!

[dragon813gt]

Yes I know that, but my question is ........WHY!?!?!?!?


One word, accuracy. It shows up on target. If conventional presses and dies yielded the best accuracy the bench rest shooters would be using them regardless of how inconvenient they are to use at the range.

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Holy carp! I have 3 of those old capper presses in the shed. Had no idea what to do with them. I do not bottle beer or root beer!

That kind of loading & shooting is in a class all it's own. I know some that do it, but never have seen them actually LOAD at the range with a little press like that.

I just enjoy killing a lot of paper targets!

Try killing much, much smaller paper targets, at much, much longer ranges. It's not like bangering away at a lot of paper targets.:)

There are instances and classes of shooting where standard reloading presses DO NOT get it done. That's when you go to K&M Arbor presses, Wilson dies and a Harrel's powder measure. They excel because you load to meet the demands of the environment you're shooting in that particular day. Heavy weight presses like you have at home would be way too heavy to tote to the range and too big as well. Light weight, accuracy rule the day in those situations.

It's not reloading or shooting for the average Joe. It really is shooting for the expert shooter and reloader. What the oprah winfrey would call "Master Class."

Gotta have the eyes, the physical talent, the brains and the skills, both in shooting and reloading to just compete without being embarrassed. Winning, well, that's another story, as one is not competing against the average Joe.

[Bent Ramrod]

We had one of those behemoths outside the shop building in the area I used to work. As I recall, it didn't have the straight rack and pinion arrangement that the typical bench size arbor presses have; it had a dog arrangement with some kind of gearing so so the force was multiplied and the ram travel reduced. You had to pull the lever multiple times to run the ram down, while the ratchet clicked away. I tried using it to force some cases through a set of ring dies to swage the bases down and found the thing had a surprising lack of power for something that large and massive. Finished the job up at the Auto Shop at the local community college, where they had a big hydraulic press in an H frame. Now that was a press!

Dr. Mann had an illustration of a standard arbor press in his book that he allegedly formed cartridge cases and swaged bullets with. He must have hired the village blacksmith and his helper to pull that lever, as it was the straight rack and pinion version.

The Sinclair type arbor press is very light, but the dies only size the neck of the cartridge case slightly and seat the bullet. Hardly any force is needed at all.

[Alan in Vermont]

If the shoe fits, wear it.

Do you enjoy coming across as a pompous jerk or are you unable to help yourself?

[bangerjim]

Do you enjoy coming across as a pompous jerk or are you unable to help yourself?


The only jerk here is you......interpreting what I say as "pompus". People on here sure are thin-skinned when it comes to a few satirical comments! OMG! I have never seen anything like it. Lighten up people.......do not take every word written as serious gospel.

You are just another addition to my ever-growing ignore list.

[EDG]

Unless you try the Wilson type dies you will never understand why. Why use a big heavy press with the little arbor press will fit in a cigar box. The bench rest shooters do most of their loading at the range.

The original dies were for arbor presses. Remember the Ideal and Lyman Fl dies. They were around long before this other stuff. The 7/8-14 press and die set is a relative new comer.


Yes I know that, but my question is ........WHY!?!?!?!?

Tons of excellent HEAVY loading presses out there built to accept standard Lee, RCBS, etc off-the-shelf dies. To me, it is kinda like re-inventing the wheel.

Making GC's with the correct set-up is a good idea and could be done with one of those little ones in the listing.

[dudel]

A bigger hammer is not always the right hammer.

[dragon813gt]

A bigger hammer is not always the right hammer.

Are you saying you've never installed trim w/ a 28oz waffle head framing hammer :laugh:

[w5pv]

I guess I been doing a lot of stuff wrong. I have used a treadmill to clean brass a hot plate to warm molds a coffee machine to melt wax a bent soap ladle to dip lead a car jack to extrude lead wire plastic shoe boxes to hold brass a cement mixer to recover lead a stove to bake PC on wait a minute they are for baking oh the list keeps going and going I have way to many things I use in ways they were not designed to be used. Is it ok if I use some pipe on my press handle to give me more leverage ?

Don't use a pipe but get a buddy to hold downard pressure on what ever you pressing and you get a 8 to 12 lb sledge hammer to give it the needed presure.usually a few taps will suffice,I have saw locknuts and bearings taken off this way and you didn't have to waste time unscfrewing the lock nut.lol this happened when two trainees were given the job of rebuilding a Durco Pump,they were given time off for not wearing safty glasses and a face shield while hammering.

[EddieNFL]

Try killing much, much smaller paper targets, at much, much longer ranges. It's not like bangering away at a lot of paper targets.:)

There are instances and classes of shooting where standard reloading presses DO NOT get it done. That's when you go to K&M Arbor presses, Wilson dies and a Harrel's powder measure. They excel because you load to meet the demands of the environment you're shooting in that particular day. Heavy weight presses like you have at home would be way too heavy to tote to the range and too big as well. Light weight, accuracy rule the day in those situations.

It's not reloading or shooting for the average Joe. It really is shooting for the expert shooter and reloader. What the oprah winfrey would call "Master Class."

Gotta have the eyes, the physical talent, the brains and the skills, both in shooting and reloading to just compete without being embarrassed. Winning, well, that's another story, as one is not competing against the average Joe.

The difference between reloading and hand loading.

[SSGOldfart]

It must be quite the burden to have to be around all of us dummies.

Edd
Sometimes grasshopper:bigsmyl2:[smilie=l:

[sparky508]

Wow, I guess I should have let y'all know I wasn't really trying to load with that pig................

I reckon there's a special place in Hell for people like me.

That being said, can anyone recommend a starting load for this?

134214

[mdi]

I think it isn't so much the arbor press that is used for accuracy, it's the dies used with the arbor press (high quality straight, in-line type seating dies). I use my arbor press with my Lee Loaders...

[Green Frog]

Back when I thought I might have time and inclination to learn the fine art of metal machining, one of the projects we did was to make a small arbor press... good for pressing in small bearings and mostly for cracking walnuts at Christmas. I got permission from the instructor to expand the throw of mine to a more useful 3" and use it with the old push through Ideal FL sizing dies. I can use it at the range when brass swells too much on firing to just neck size it. Sometimes it's OK to simply stuff ammo, other times it's worth your while to do a more precise job of it. JMHO, YMMV.

Froggie

[sparky45]

If you ever shot Bench Rest Competition you'd know the value in using a Arbor Press with, as an example, wilson Seating Dies.



Yes I know that, but my question is ........WHY!?!?!?!?

Tons of excellent HEAVY loading presses out there built to accept standard Lee, RCBS, etc off-the-shelf dies. To me, it is kinda like re-inventing the wheel.

Making GC's with the correct set-up is a good idea and could be done with one of those little ones in the listing.

[bangerjim]

If you ever shot Bench Rest Competition you'd know the value in using a Arbor Press with, as an example, wilson Seating Dies.

Other niche aspects of our hobby are most interesting. I personally will never go there. My only competition is with myself, just like playing golf. I do not compete with anyone except my own personal aptitude and skill sets. I do not keep my targets or take pictures of them for bragging rights to my buddies. I just have fun casting, loading, and shooting LOTS of boolits and killing LOTS of paper targets.

Hats off to those that do that kind of uber-accurate loading and shooting!

I will continue to use my BIG arbor presses in my machine shops as they were designed to be used....pressing arbors & bearings on and off gears and wheels.

We are really talking apples and oranges in reference to these totally different sizes and styles of presses.

Thanks for the info! The day we quit learning.......is the day they nail the lid on the coffin.

banger-j

[LuckyDog]

I guess I will just keep on trying…………



You need to adjust the seeatting depth bedder! :bigsmyl2:

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I really like using this little arbor press for making GCs
I got this press from a Metals salvage yard.

http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/assembled.jpg (http://s640.photobucket.com/user/JonB_in_Glencoe/media/assembled.jpg.html)

[firebrick43]

I really like using this little arbor press for making GCs
I got this press from a Metals salvage yard.

http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/assembled.jpg (http://s640.photobucket.com/user/JonB_in_Glencoe/media/assembled.jpg.html)

Do you have plans for the die? I have a matching dake and that could utilize it some more

[Char-Gar]

So I had done a bit of reading about how arbor presses were the cat’s meow for proper bullet seating and inline dies and all. I found some decent prices at harbor Freight, but found this unit at Boeing Surplus for even cheaper. It takes up some room on my bench and is heavy though. I have been trying for some time to get it to work properly, but still for the life of me can’t figure out what all the fuss is. While there is a substantial mechanical advantage to this over my Summit and Lyman turret, I can’t see how this will make any better ammunition.


I guess I will just keep on trying…………

134147 134148134149

Sparky, that is a very nice ratchet arbor press. It looks to be about a 5 ton press. It should clean up just fine. If you got it cheaper than HF you got a deal. If you ever went to sell or trade it, let me know and I will see what we can do.

Whether or not an arbor press have any utility in your shop depends on what you want to do. For 99% of reloading, it offers no advantage over a traditional reloading press.

However there some reloading operations where you can't catch the case in a shell holder or screw the die into a press. For those kinds of things, an arbor press is needed.

I use my arbor press to;

1. Full length size cases using Wilson or Lyman hand dies.
2. To neck size cases using Wilson bushing hand dies.
3. To seat bullets using Wilson and Belding and Mull hand dies
4. To press cases in and out of case holder for use with my Wilson case trimmer.

Whether or not using hand dies offers any advantage over press mounted dies depends on what you are trying to do. Accuracy nuts like to try every dodge and gimmick to squeeze that last little bit of accuracy out of their loads. They will go to great length to do so and an arbor press is a good tool for them.

Like many tools, other uses will evolve as the tool hangs out in your shop. Arbor presses can be quite useful if you need one.

[sparky508]

It was just sitting out in shops our yard, getting ready to go to a new home, I was amused by the prospect of smashing a piece of brass with it. A fabricator we work with wanted it pretty bad, and we've been sitting on it for 5 years buried in a conex.

[sparky45]

That one pound can full of Red Dot would be a pretty good place to start. Everybody and everything survive, try it again.:bigsmyl2:

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Wow, I guess I should have let y'all know I wasn't really trying to load with that pig................

I reckon there's a special place in Hell for people like me.

That being said, can anyone recommend a starting load for this?

134214

Before we can recommend a starting load, we need to know the caliber. You would probably be safest starting off with straight black powder and going from there.:)

[TheDoctor]

Something slow, like say, two pounds of charcoal?

[Hamish]

Wow, I guess I should have let y'all know I wasn't really trying to load with that pig................

I reckon there's a special place in Hell for people like me.

That being said, can anyone recommend a starting load for this?

134214


Dont worry Sparky, some of us got it after the first split second of thinking "what is this doofus doing?", then figgering it out,,,,,,,,

[gunoil]

The only jerk here is you......interpreting what I say as "pompus". People on here sure are thin-skinned when it comes to a few satirical comments! OMG! I have never seen anything like it. Lighten up people.......do not take every word written as serious gospel.

You are just another addition to my ever-growing ignore list.

Ditto:

l want my arbor, GC's , case base swaging brass.

http://i1113.photobucket.com/albums/k511/putt2012/3570FE7D-14E9-4ED4-B55D-EB92ED930F2A_zpsghqpejkv.jpg (http://s1113.photobucket.com/user/putt2012/media/3570FE7D-14E9-4ED4-B55D-EB92ED930F2A_zpsghqpejkv.jpg.html)


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brevity&misspelling rampant

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Do you have plans for the die? I have a matching dake and that could utilize it some more
It's a Free Chex III