30-30 cast bullet hunting load

[younggunz67]

Recommend a good 30-30 160-180 grain cast bullet load good for deer, I already have imr 4198 for my other bullets so a load using this powder would be great. Anybody have a good powerful accurate load worked up?

[aspangler]

The load I use in my Ballard rifling Marlin 336 is 30.5 gr IMR 4064 with the Lee 170 fn boolit. 1.5 inch groups at 100 and about 2100 fps. I use 50/50 + a little tin for my boolits. Haven't tried the 4198. This one just worked too well for me to mess with it.

[Outpost75]

With 4198 in the .30-30 16 grains will get you 1400 fps, 18 grains 1600 fps, 20 grains 1700 and 22 grains 1800 fps with #31141 or similar.

[tdoyka]

165gr ranch dog, i'm using it in my 30-40 krag

[richhodg66]

The only deer I ever killed with cast in a .30-30 was the Ideal 31141 (now Lyman 311041) and used 25 grains of the now discontinued B-West BW-36 powder which burned real close to IMR3031, probably not far off from 4198. It worked well in my Savage 340.

[younggunz67]

i would like to push it around 2000-2200 for hunting so how much should i use when using a #31141

[Digital Dan]

Ya might want to check load date on the IMR site for bullets of that weight for starters. They suggest something like this:

IMR IMR 4198
.308"
2.550"

21.0
1,800
27,400 CUP

22.3
1,896
32,100 CUP

http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/data/rifle

[atr]

Lee C312 / 180 gr
with 28 gr of Win748
134054

[x101airborne]

My beater ranch rifle is a Winchester rebound hammer 30-30 with a Nikon Monarch Gold scope. If I can get it to actually fire, the load it likes is 31 grains 3031 and a 311041 sized to 310 cast of 50/50+2% water quenched with a strong crimp and Winchester large rifle primers. Kicks like a mule off a bench when low bagged and has killed everything from varmints at 250 yards to deer at a laser range finder measured 190 yards. At 100 yards, the first two shots of a 10 shot group cut each other. The last 8 usually open it up to 2 inches with my fair to poor benchrest skills. Good enough for government work for me. I usually don't fire more than 1 round with this load any way. Lube is 45/45/10 and a lot of it.

[pls1911]

In a 30-30, any 160-175 grain gas checked cast bullet, hardened to Lyman #2 or more BHN (14+), sized to fit YOUR bore, over 25-26 grains of Reloader 7... gives 1700-2000 fps sweet and easy.
Pig whompin' deer killin' round, easy on your shoulder, ears, and your gun.

[badbob454]

311041 NOE boolit and winchester 760 powder / 33 grains ....good , comfortable,& accurate

[HABCAN]

+1 Post #3.

[younggunz67]

I'm gunna start at 23 and work up one grain at a time till I max out on pressure signs then back it down 1 grain

[Pilgrim]

I'm gimpact. nna start at 23 and work up one grain at a time till I max out on pressure signs then back it down 1 grain

You might wanna consider boolit impact point in addition to your quest for the biggest bang load. It is sorta nice when hunting to have the boolits go where you point 'em. The difference between 1800/1900 and 2200 is range, not lethality.

[MBTcustom]

First of all, I feel you might be drastically underestimating the destructive potential a cast bullet is capable of (please read the thread in my signature line).
secondly, you have a 1-10 twist rate on that rifle, a short barrel, and microgroove rifling. If you want any semblance of repeatable accuracy from that rifle, you need to stay below 2000FPS, and you're probably going to get best results at around 1850fps.

Please read this thread for an explanation of twist rates vs. accuracy.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?208186-RPM-Threshold-barrel-twist-velocity-chart

And this one:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?245302-RPM-Threshold-A-Tale-of-Three-Twists-Chapter-II

And here are a couple of my own that will help you get the most out of your rifle:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?158805-Just-a-few-tips-for-new-rifle-casters
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?218414-FYI-This-is-how-I-do-a-pound-cast

[Screwbolts]

I'm gunna start at 23 and work up one grain at a time till I max out on pressure signs then back it down 1 grain

Other than Good luck, what can anyone else add, looks like you already had your mind made up.

IMHO, Magnumitus at its best,

Ken

[Dan Cash]

170 grain 31141 over 31 grains of Reloader 15. 2200 FPS and accuracy equal to jacketed from a Marlin 336.

[Distant Thunder]

I used a 180 grain FN GC bullet (11 BHN) over 28.5 grains of Varget @ apx. 1800 fps out of my 336W and it worked very well on a small buck, dropped him where he stood at about 50 yards. The bullet went through both shoulders. No need to go faster. Accuracy was my goal, the fps happened to be what they were. I would have been just as happy with 1650 fps.

[reloader28]

I'm gunna start at 23 and work up one grain at a time till I max out on pressure signs then back it down 1 grain


Sounds like a rookie. You had your mind made up before you posted. No offense, I was the same way. These boys know what their doing. Some have been doing it a looong time.

You dont need that speed unless it makes you feel better. A cast boolit dont have to go that fast to make it work good.
When I started I loaded 180gr cast to 2100fps and now I am much happier with a 160gr cast at 1850fps.
I say keep it at or under 2000fps and you'll probly be very surprised with the performance and handling. Some guys like the max loads, but if I want a max rifle load, I go with a jacketed bullet, though I only use jacketed for past 300yds anymore.
Just my 2 cents.

[GabbyM]

I'm gunna start at 23 and work up one grain at a time till I max out on pressure signs then back it down 1 grain

30-30 is a low pressure round. You will not see pressure signs until it's way over SAMI limits. Use published load data and do not exceed it. No magic to be had with canister powders.

[tdoyka]

First of all, I feel you might be drastically underestimating the destructive potential a cast bullet is capable of (please read the thread in my signature line).
secondly, you have a 1-10 twist rate on that rifle, a short barrel, and microgroove rifling. If you want any semblance of repeatable accuracy from that rifle, you need to stay below 2000FPS, and you're probably going to get best results at around 1850fps.

Please read this thread for an explanation of twist rates vs. accuracy.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?208186-RPM-Threshold-barrel-twist-velocity-chart

And this one:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?245302-RPM-Threshold-A-Tale-of-Three-Twists-Chapter-II

And here are a couple of my own that will help you get the most out of your rifle:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?158805-Just-a-few-tips-for-new-rifle-casters
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?218414-FYI-This-is-how-I-do-a-pound-cast


what goodsteel said. i am new to cast boolits and yet i have 20+ years handloading the j-bullets. this is a great post and i have alot to learn.

[younggunz67]

I'm gunna go with my gut and say you guys have me beat, your right speed isn't key accuracy is just thought it would have more killing power at long range, so if I keep it around 1850 what should I expect out of it with imr 4198, from what everyone's saying around 22 grains to get that speed

[MBTcustom]

I'm gunna go with my gut and say you guys have me beat, your right speed isn't key accuracy is just thought it would have more killing power at long range, so if I keep it around 1850 what should I expect out of it with imr 4198, from what everyone's saying around 22 grains to get that speed

If you want to shoot past 150 yards, you're using the wrong gun, and honestly, I would keep it 100 yards and closer.
If you want to chunk cast further, go up in bullet diameter and mass.
Speed is as speed does, it neither kills, nor helps you hit the animal with cast. What you really need is a very reliable hunting load, and the balance will be skill as a huntsman, a rifleman and your woodsmanship.

A. know your rifle and load, and what it's advantages and limitations are. This includes an intimate knowledge of bullet drop and destructive potential at range, with a particular alloy at a particular hardness, in a particular load.

B. Marksmanship. You practice enough with one rifle to where you can drop the bullet into a baseball sized target at any range you plan to take a deer at (and demonstrate this to yourself regularly. None of this "I shoot a 1" two shot group at 50 yards, so that means I can shoot a 4" group at 200 yards any time I want" that doesn't cut the mustard.)

C. Woodsmanship. Learn to stalk your prey, and be smart about where and when you take your shot. Think about the drag you will be committing yourself to, and where the deer is likely to run when hit. Use the woods to your advantage, and instead of leaning on long distance shots as a crutch, learn to use everything you have at your disposal to put you in a position where the shot will always be an easy one that will be a DRT hit, or close to it.

Hunting with cast is a different philosophy. I used to hunt with a 300 Win Mag, and thought "If I can see it I can put it in the freezer! Any range, any size critter, they will all succumb to my marksmanship! Yeah, well I found out that my rifle only worked the way I really wanted it to at 300 yards or so. Close shots were lackluster, and I couldn't practice past 300 yards, so I didn't hunt further than that.
I found out that for 100 yards and closer, a slow cast bullet was better at putting the deer down fast and clean than my Win Mag was. 150-200 yards with a 358 Winchester is perfect.
I'm still learning what works at what distance, but I have found out that the gentlemen on this site are very wise about hunting with cast and what they recommend (as I have here) has much logic backing it up.

As to 4198, I never had good luck with it in anything I've tried it in with cast. That's not to say you won't. Each shooter is different. But for me, I'm still searching for a way to burn what I have with a cast bullet load. I never tried it in 30-30. My go to load was 10 grains of Unique.

[rking22]

Goodsteel, you summed it up perfectly, especially points, B and C !
to the OP, I like 4198 in the 3030, not as well as Reloader 7 but it works at the 1800 to 1900 fps range with 311041s for me. Give it a try if you have some and see if your rifle likes it, I had a 788 that did not like it, it liked 3031 better.
Shoot lots of 1 shot groups (on the same target) from various field positions to test yourself. Bench is for load workup (testing the gun), check zero from your most used field position and shoot a lot at varing distances and field positions to build hunting confidence(tests you and the gun as a system). Nothing like looking at a target with a 3 inch 10 shot group shot from 50 yards offhand to 150yards prone, visual proof you can put the bullet where it needs to be. If you look at the target and it looks like a "12 ga Mod choke", you know you need to adjust the nut behind the trigger some more:)

[Ramjet-SS]

I have outstanding results with Leverrevolution

[Centaur 1]

I shoot a lot of cast in my 30-30's using IMR4198, H4198 and Reloader 7. All three work equally as well as the other, and best accuracy happens in the 22 grain range. If you want to push them faster you'll probably need a different powder and a hard alloy. I've had very good luck using 33.0 grains of BL-C(2) and 34.0 grains of LEVERevolution.

[Hardcast416taylor]

Winchester brass, Winchester Large Rifle primers, Lyman (old mould) #311041 boolet and shoved out the barrel with 31 Gr. IMR-3031.Robert

[lobogunleather]

This is the load I have been using for over 30 years in Winchester Model 94 .30-30 carbines. My sons and grandkids send home their brass every year for reloading, don't think they know any other way to shoot their Winchesters! Dozens and dozens of deer taken with this load.

Standard large rifle primer, 30 grains H335, Lee C309-170 round nose flat point. (For a few years during the powder shortages I have used BLC-2, same charge weight, no noticeable difference in performance, no changes to sight settings).

Cases full length sized, case necks expanded using the Lyman M-die. Bullets cast of 50/50 blend wheelweights and linotype metal (162 grains as dropped from the mold), Hornady gas checks crimped on in the lubri-sizer, NRA formula Alox lube, .309 sizer die.

I have used the same bullet in .30-06, .308, .30-40, .300 Savage, probably a couple of others along the way. It is excellent. I usually cast 500-plus in each casting session (I have a bunch of grandkids, and they all got their .30-30's from Grampa).

[redbullitt]

Good success with the 165 ranch dog here too!

[tdoyka]

Good success with the 165 ranch dog here too!

the ranch dogs will work, but the 190gr rn "might" work in the 30-30. i'm going to try these in my 30-40 krag.

http://www.airtacticsaz.com/legacy-lbt-premium-hunting-bullets.html

[Screwbolts]

I have had good luck with the RD 165 also, My mold is a 5 cav lube grove, from NOE, has 2 cav PB and 3 GC. 3 NYS deer have fallen to the PB version WD WWs, sized .310, motivated with a light charge of IMR SR4759, only 15 gr, Cronied 1500 FPS out of my Stevens 325. Simple lube, no leading, no problem ringing 200 yard gong with hold over, when sighted DO @100. Makes a resounding whack when it collides with a deer's rib cage. 2 deer fell at the shot and the other went in a 15 yard circle expiring close to point of actual shot. All complete pass threw.

Ken

[quilbilly]

The terminal ballistics tests I did with a 160 gr boolit showed that at a muzzle velocity of 1600 fps, the 30/30 will do just fine on deer out to 150 yards and farther if you are careful. The 30/30 is a lot more fun to shoot at an MV of 1600 than at 2300 fps and you will be a whole lot more accurate. Why punish yourself. There are no degrees of dead.

[GooseGestapo]

The .30/30 isn't particular about good hunting boolits. Just get the Lee .309" 150gr FNGC and some Hornady gas checks, and lube of your choice. (I've used NRA 50/50 and SPG with 100% satisfaction).
The Lee bullet seats to base of neck when crimped to crimp groove, and is perfect for the .30/30.

Most any powder can be made to work in the .30/30 w/cast boolits.

I like the extruded powders. Anything from burning speed of RL7 to IMR4350 works well.My favorite are RL15 and IMR3031.

most important is sizing. Use .311". Works well in both my Marlin and Winchester (all my .30-.31cal rifles).

You can use j-bullet data with this boolit. I see best accuracy between 1900 and 2,200fps. About 5-7% under published max.
I've got both single and double versions. The single dates to 1977 and was my first mold; it casts to 160gr. My double is 10yrs old or so and throws to 158gr.

Kills deer all out of expectations. Can't remember loosing or shooting one more than once.
Trajectories match j-bullets, too.

[Budzilla 19]

200 grn cast RNFP ,Hi-Tek coated,GCed,sized to .309",light charge of SR-4759, I don't think you would need anything else! Just my .02 cents.

[pappy4]

Can I use the lee 90368 with the 311041 load data? I also would like to use this boolit in my 06. Most of my kills are under 200 yrds in my back yard and its a lot of brush (blackberry bushes ) mixed in with the trees. I load 210 rn for deer in the 06 mostly,not cast,just started with the casting. Might get 200grn mold as well but not just now.

[younggunz67]

30-30 is a low pressure round. You will not see pressure signs until it's way over SAMI limits. Use published load data and do not exceed it. No magic to be had with canister powders.


This is the load I have been using for over 30 years in Winchester Model 94 .30-30 carbines. My sons and grandkids send home their brass every year for reloading, don't think they know any other way to shoot their Winchesters! Dozens and dozens of deer taken with this load.

Standard large rifle primer, 30 grains H335, Lee C309-170 round nose flat point. (For a few years during the powder shortages I have used BLC-2, same charge weight, no noticeable difference in performance, no changes to sight settings).

Cases full length sized, case necks expanded using the Lyman M-die. Bullets cast of 50/50 blend wheelweights and linotype metal (162 grains as dropped from the mold), Hornady gas checks crimped on in the lubri-sizer, NRA formula Alox lube, .309 sizer die.

I have used the same bullet in .30-06, .308, .30-40, .300 Savage, probably a couple of others along the way. It is excellent. I usually cast 500-plus in each casting session (I have a bunch of grandkids, and they all got their .30-30's from Grampa).


simple and proven, may just go with this load